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2004-02-23 6:14 PM


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Subject: Base Training
Asked this on another thread but might as well ask here - is base training the way to go to improve performance? I'm not even a beginner yet, just marathoner so far but am planning to get into triathalons asap and have been reading a lot about base training but I hate the idea of running or riding slow plus when I mtn bike I can't really maintain a consistent low heart rate anyway and I read that once you start base training you should keep consistenlty working at it and not allow yourself to deviate from the low bpm. If this is true, can you still do speed work, tempo runs or threshold runs et al?


2004-02-23 7:21 PM
in reply to: #8982

, Alabama
Subject: RE: Base Training

The aerobic base is very important!  I'm basically a distance person and have relied on an 18 week training program that Mark Allen wrote up in a magazine.  In the accompanying article he stressed the importance of getting the aerobic capacity up to before worrying about speed.  He also mentioned that athletes are VERY impatient and it's hard for them to just go slow!  The first time I tried the program I had done quite a few sprint tri's and had just completed my first oly.  I figured my aerobic base was fine.  WRONG!  According to the article, I had to keep my HR at 145 or lower for 9 WEEKS!  UGH!  On the first week, that meant running > 11 minute miles.  I thought I was going to DIE!  I usually trained at 9-9 1/2 minute miles.  Biking was even worse.  By the end of the 9 weeks I was keeping my HR at 145 and running 9 1/2 minute miles.   (That 9 weeks was over in August of that year.  In south Fla, it's hard to keep the HR down at that time of year).  Then I started adding intervals and other stuff for the next 9 weeks.  I really think it was worth it.

Sharon

2004-02-23 7:29 PM
in reply to: #8982

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SF East Bay
Subject: RE: Base Training
In the March 2004 Triathlete, Mark Allen has another article on the importance of base training, called "Building Blocks". It made me slow down. The heart beat monitor really helps me stay in the right zone. He wasn't kidding when he says you may have to walk up some hills. My heart rate was way too high.
2004-02-23 7:41 PM
in reply to: #8982

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Master
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Kingston Ontario
Subject: RE: Base Training
I wish I knew this last year when I wrecked myself. It is sound advice that should be taught to all beginners
Jen
2004-02-23 7:54 PM
in reply to: #8982


12

Subject: RE: Base Training
Thanks all! I feel like I found the group therapy I never thought I needed. I just read the same Mark Allen article - or most recent in Triathalete something or other. Sound advice and if it works I am going to do it... but after the LA marathon. I really do hate the going slow bit but I trust you guys and I want to improve my time. And this base training goes for biking as well? I am an avid Mtn biker and I am already going slow up monumental inclines... this is just going to suck.

Oh, now that I got your attention. I am running the RNR in June as well and I am wondering if I should start experimenting with base training or just wait till afterward. I am afraid that I am going to lose some of my current speed etc if I start taking things down a notch. Do you think it would inhibit my performance in June... sabotage it if you will?
2004-02-23 7:55 PM
in reply to: #8982


12

Subject: RE: Base Training
Oh, and snikpos is it? Where can I get that 18 week traning schedule that Mark Allen wrote?


2004-02-23 10:01 PM
in reply to: #9019

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Kingston Ontario
Subject: RE: Base Training
Sharon, I am interested in this article too!
Thanks!
Jen
2004-02-24 2:31 AM
in reply to: #8982

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, Zurich
Subject: RE: Base Training
I'm not sure which article you're looking for but Allen wrote an excellent general fitness piece for Outside magazine a few years ago...

http://outside.away.com/magazine/0298/9802mark.html

Enjoy,
Scott
2004-02-24 3:26 AM
in reply to: #8982

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Pittsburgh, PA
Subject: RE: Base Training

This is great advice & just what I needed to hear!  I'm totally new to multisport & any kind of endurance aerobics. I get impatient with myself because I'm as slow as molasses in winter time!!!

2004-02-24 6:51 AM
in reply to: #8982

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Subject: RE: Base Training

FWIW been keeping my HR below 150 for my runs over the last 5 weeks and my time has decreased by 50 seconds per kilometer, about 1:15 per mile. Still running very slow though. But this has to be good.

JD

2004-02-24 11:50 AM
in reply to: #8982


12

Subject: RE: Base Training
Good morning. Thanks for the article - reading it now. Great way to blow off work, eh? From what people have wrote here, I am feeling very enthusiastic about this. Haven't finished the article but aside from the article in Triathalete, does anyone know of a more precise way to identify your base? According to the article I read - 180 - age + or - five depending on level of activity. Is that the best way to measure base?


2004-02-24 5:12 PM
in reply to: #8982

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NW Suburbs of Chicago
Subject: RE: Base Training
Here is my .02.....

For my base training I got my max heart rate first. It was a little painful but I heard if it hurt - I was doing it right.
I had a friend hold and view the watch part of my heart rate monitor as I ran on the treadmill with the HRM strap on.
I tend to get wacky when I see numbers so it was best we did this 'blind'. . . .

After I warmed up for a few minutes and got into my comfy pace, I decided I was "ready". My friend put the speed up by 0.3 about every 2 mins or he would increase the incline by 0.5 every 3 mins. We continued this until I felt really "maxed out" and just couldn't go anymore. I guessed that my max would be somewhere in the 185ish range based on the formulas. I wasn't.
I maxed at about 174bpm.

So I consider my "base" or "aerobic range" for running @ 105-140bpm which is 60-80% of my max heart rate. This is about 2min per mile SLOWER than what I can typically run, but I am getting use to the range and am seeing the times start to drop after about 5 weeks of this type of base training.

What I have also read is that you can drop the range 10bpm for the bike base training; and drop an additional 5bpm for the swim base training ranges. Since these 2 sports are not my strong suits I don't have any trouble with these ranges.

Hope that helps.

2004-02-24 6:02 PM
in reply to: #9019

, Alabama
Subject: RE: Base Training

robot fury - 2004-02-23 7:55 PM Oh, and snikpos is it? Where can I get that 18 week traning schedule that Mark Allen wrote?

I would love to tell you.  Unfortunately, I can't find the magazine.  I have several friends asking me for it.  The workouts were on 3 separate pages so I did hand-type them onto a chart for myself that I still have.  It isn't on Word, though, it's on Word Perfect.  I don't know if I can send it.  My e-mail also isn't working at the moment, so I know I can't send it right now.

Sharon

2004-02-24 6:04 PM
in reply to: #8982

, Alabama
Subject: RE: Base Training

Oh, BTW the magazine was called Ironman Magazine.  I got it at an oly race in April of 2002.  (Don't remember the mag's issue date though)  Maybe you can find it on the web somewhere.

Sharon

2004-04-15 6:15 PM
in reply to: #9165

New user
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Laguna Niguel, CA
Subject: RE: Base Training
I'm following the 16-week program from this site to prepare for my 1st tri in July. My goal at this point is to just complete it. I'm in the second week of the training and it is challenging for me. I was scanning the forums for tips when I came across this thread and I just have to ask... Should I be paying attention to my heart rate and building this base from the beginning or not worry about it for now and just get through my first sprint race?

thanks,
Erich
2004-04-15 10:56 PM
in reply to: #18705

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Subject: RE: Base Training

r u doing the sprint or oly?

if u can maintain a conversational pace during the bike and run then i wouldnt worry about heart-rate and such for your first year.  BUT if u go to fast, get winded easily, gasping for air during the run, then it may be a good idea so you can JUST regulate your pace.  also, to get your hr back down if u feel that your overdoing it is to put in well planned walk breaks during the run BEFORE u get winded...maybe about 2min breaks...i still do this and it helps me maintain and stay away from high heartrates and exhaustion.

hr will nevertheless be great for your following years if you want to get better and possibly competitive...OR you can go by 'feel' and use the RPE (real percieved exertion' method...i am sure u caught the hr articles on the main site in the left sidebar.

my two cents...im kinda low tech though.  but there r certainly great benifits for hr training that many have experienced...but also on the flipside, many elite runners wont even waste thier time with them (so i have heard).  its all preferance and need.



2004-04-16 11:09 PM
in reply to: #8982

Member
18

Portland, Oregon
Subject: RE: Base Training
Robot Fury,

Check out the 2 articles on the left side of the home page HRM Training section and application. Physically finding your Max hR can be painful, but at least you can fine tune your training. I just did this last month and came up with a MHR of 185 and Resting HR of 52. Using the formula from the article:

Heart Rate % of Usable Maximum = ((MHR – RHR) * P ) + RHR

where P is the desired percentage of maximum (1, .9, .8, .7, etc..)

((185-52)*.75)+52 =~152

Here is another excerpt from the other article that puts these numbers in perspective:

I. Long Slow = 50-70%

II. Endurance = 70-75%

III. Steady State = 75-80%

IV. Tempo/Threshold = 80-90%

V. Interval = 90-95%

VI. Sprint/Power = 95-100%

Good luck with your training.

David
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