General Discussion Triathlon Talk » Once you go long, you can't go fast Rss Feed  
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2008-10-27 12:25 AM

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Subject: Once you go long, you can't go fast

Teehee

Ok now that my mind is out of the gutter...

I have been thinking of signing up for Ironman Canada 2010 for quite some time.  I train with my University's Triathlon Club, as well as being on the Exec. council.  I train with some successful triathletes/cyclists and upon mentioning my intentions, I get strange looks and criticism. 

Now, I am young in comparison to most of the exec. (they are 25+, I'm 22), and they criticise my goal on the basis that I'm a) Too young and b)I have to train for speed, before I train for distance.  I argue with them, that I can do both, since it's almost 2 years until the race, but they claim that "in order to be truly successful in Ironman, you need a few years experience with Pro/ITU racing". 

I think that is absolutely preposterous, especially with my goal being Sub-10 hours, not Sub-9 in the elite category.

My passion is distance racing, in any sport (Swimming, and now Running, Triathlon) and my goal is to do Ironman at 24, and do well.

What are your thoughts on age and racing in Ironman?  As well, in your opinion, in order to actually compete, is any experience with Elite/Pro fields necessary?



2008-10-27 1:27 AM
in reply to: #1767146

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Subject: RE: Once you go long, you can't go fast

What are your thoughts on age and racing in Ironman? 

***I think that Mark Allen and Scott Molina started pretty young -- both of those guys had successful careers.  Luke Bell and Kieran Doe are examples of a younger generation.  Kieran was a short course AG world champ.

As well, in your opinion, in order to actually compete, is any experience with Elite/Pro fields necessary? 

***As you note, to compete in IM implies getting down around 8:30, or so, at IMC.  There is a 'speed' component in that sort of performance but not in a single-sport, or common usage, sense.  While the mid-2:40s is blazing fast off the bike, it isn't very quick in a marathon sense.  Same deal with a 50-min swim or low 4:40s bike -- solid in IM, not fast for a single-sport elite.

***So I don't think that ITU success is a pre-requisite for IM success.  ITU racing is a very different event than IM racing.  That said, many of the top IMers are able to put together a solid short course race.  Within my own racing, my best IM performances linked quite well to my best short course performances -- see Lydiard, Running the Lydiard Way for a good explanation of the reason why stamina plays a critical role in endurance.  The difference being that I used my fitness to optimize for an IM, not a shorter event.  That said, long course athletes with my profile might be able to have a bit of success going long, but would never be able to compete with guys like Greg Bennett & Simon Whitfield.

There's no right answers here, your body will prove suited to a certain style of training and a certain distance of racing -- when inherent ability meets motivation/opportunity -- you get big results.  My best advice would be to focus on what you enjoy -- either way -- it is going to take thousands of hours to determine your potential -- might as well enjoy it.

Hope this helps,

g

2008-10-27 1:46 AM
in reply to: #1767146

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Subject: RE: Once you go long, you can't go fast

Can't claim to have Gordo's knowledge or experience but it seems pretty obvious to me that if you love distance racing then go with it. Why would you do chase something you don't have the passion for just because someone else says it's the way to go?

Gerrard

2008-10-27 2:07 AM
in reply to: #1767146

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Subject: RE: Once you go long, you can't go fast
screw it just do it

if you care about what other people say you get no where
2008-10-27 6:40 AM
in reply to: #1767146

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Subject: RE: Once you go long, you can't go fast

i am in a similar boat -- i am looking at doing my first IM in 2010.  my rational on it, was that i wanted a couple seasons under my belt to do the natural tri progression - sprint, oly, HIM, IM and  i want to have good performances from bottom to top, so i want to be ready when i decide to do IM.  For example, my goal for OLY was under 2:20, which i met this year, and my goal from a HIM in 2009 is sub 5.  i like to set my goals ridiculous (for me) and that helps me to reach and beat them.  BTW, i'm 22. 

With regards to what others said about your IM thoughts: i would listen to those around us on BT who have lots of knowledge and experiance.  Have any of those guys on your team been successful racing an IM or have they even done one?  my thoughts have always been to listen to those w/experiance and those who talk a big game, but haven't done it, well, take it with a grain of salt.

that being said, i have no IM experiance  

2008-10-27 7:54 AM
in reply to: #1767146

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Subject: RE: Once you go long, you can't go fast

Derek,

Gordo pretty much hit the nail on the head.  At some point in your training you are going to hit certain plateaus.  The difference between a 12 hour Ironman and a 10 hour Ironman is based on a person's ability to push through those plateaus and hit limits they never thought they could reach.  I'm about a year older than you and my goal is to do IMFL in 2010 in under 12 hours.  I don't think I will do it, I KNOW I will do it. 

The key is it's YOUR goal and YOURS alone.  Don't ever let anyone smash your dreams with smug grins and sarcastic responses. 

There is a hot thread over on slowtwitch with a similar discussion going on.  A 20 year old college student (with some solid race times) is talking about after he graduations this year he wants to spend a few years focussing on training and maybe one day become an elite.  I wanted to slap some of the men who responded with sarcastic, negative remarks about how "He better have a sub 1:50 Oly before he wants to try and go pro" or "You don't have a chance at making money so why bother".  I mean, are these people for real?  Telling a 20 year old with a solid base that his dreams are a joke and he should go ahead and start working full time and forget about following his dream?

Train hard, train patiently, train consistantly and you'll get there.  If for any reason you don't follow through, make it on your own terms, not someone elses.  Good luck!



2008-10-27 10:30 AM
in reply to: #1767295

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Subject: RE: Once you go long, you can't go fast
Recent Nike "Elite" marathon women were finishing in the 3 hour nieghborhood. So, uh, no need to have a pro time to give those ranks a try.
2008-10-27 11:30 AM
in reply to: #1767146

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Subject: RE: Once you go long, you can't go fast

Thanks for all of the replies!

Firstly, I would NEVER let someone else dictate my possibilities of acheiving my dreams.  Everytime the subject comes up, I argue and argue and argue that for my intents and purposes, for my First Ironman to be Sub-10, that it is most DEFINITELY possible.

Secondly, I think that some of the guys on slowtwitch should have their accounts revoked, and get a SWAT style visit from the A$$hole police.  Yes, people like me ask for advice, but to be BERATED on an internet forum when your intentions are seeking CONSTRUCTIVE advice, it's just a waste of time.

Thank you for all the awesome replies!  Gordo, I can understand what you mean about short course racing with IM training, and I will more then likely dabble with much shorter races during my IM phases of training.  Scotty/Ultrahip: I definitely intend on ignoring all of my friends and doing what I want!

I'm doing 4 HIM next summer and probably a few Olympics if I can squeeze it in, so we'll see how my body holds up to that kind of pounding!

2008-10-27 11:56 AM
in reply to: #1767744

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Subject: RE: Once you go long, you can't go fast
DerekWL - 2008-10-27 12:30 PM

Secondly, I think that some of the guys on slowtwitch should have their accounts revoked, and get a SWAT style visit from the A$$hole police. 

Oh man... I'm so tempted to make this my signature on slowtwitch... 

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