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2010-02-01 2:21 PM
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Subject: RE: The medical tent in an Ironman...
alexthesuspect - 2010-02-01 2:16 PM
as for "acquiring" from the hospital, i have no problem with it.


Why put up a euphemism for it?  Just call it what it is.  Stealing. 

Harder to say "I'm ok with stealing from the hospital."


2010-02-01 4:06 PM
in reply to: #2648070

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Subject: RE: The medical tent in an Ironman...
DerekL - 2010-02-01 2:21 PM
alexthesuspect - 2010-02-01 2:16 PM
as for "acquiring" from the hospital, i have no problem with it.


Why put up a euphemism for it?  Just call it what it is.  Stealing. 

Harder to say "I'm ok with stealing from the hospital."



Isn't that called Medicare? hahahahaha

ok ok, I don't want any political/COJ thing started, it was just set up so nicely..
2010-02-01 4:11 PM
in reply to: #2648353

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Subject: RE: The medical tent in an Ironman...
tjfry - 2010-02-01 5:06 PM
DerekL - 2010-02-01 2:21 PM
alexthesuspect - 2010-02-01 2:16 PM
as for "acquiring" from the hospital, i have no problem with it.


Why put up a euphemism for it?  Just call it what it is.  Stealing. 

Harder to say "I'm ok with stealing from the hospital."



Isn't that called Medicare? hahahahaha

ok ok, I don't want any political/COJ thing started, it was just set up so nicely..


Oh........OK.......then I guess I will not complain about the state of my Canadian healthcare. 
 
2010-02-01 4:14 PM
in reply to: #2648365

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Subject: RE: The medical tent in an Ironman...
aquagirl - 2010-02-01 4:11 PM
tjfry - 2010-02-01 5:06 PM
DerekL - 2010-02-01 2:21 PM
alexthesuspect - 2010-02-01 2:16 PM
as for "acquiring" from the hospital, i have no problem with it.


Why put up a euphemism for it?  Just call it what it is.  Stealing. 

Harder to say "I'm ok with stealing from the hospital."



Isn't that called Medicare? hahahahaha

ok ok, I don't want any political/COJ thing started, it was just set up so nicely..


Oh........OK.......then I guess I will not complain about the state of my Canadian healthcare. 
 


Helen, stop trying to hijack my your thread.
2010-02-01 4:15 PM
in reply to: #2648373

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Subject: RE: The medical tent in an Ironman...

DerekL - 2010-02-01 4:14 PM
aquagirl - 2010-02-01 4:11 PM
tjfry - 2010-02-01 5:06 PM
DerekL - 2010-02-01 2:21 PM
alexthesuspect - 2010-02-01 2:16 PM
as for "acquiring" from the hospital, i have no problem with it.


Why put up a euphemism for it?  Just call it what it is.  Stealing. 

Harder to say "I'm ok with stealing from the hospital."



Isn't that called Medicare? hahahahaha

ok ok, I don't want any political/COJ thing started, it was just set up so nicely..


Oh........OK.......then I guess I will not complain about the state of my Canadian healthcare. 
 


Helen, stop trying to hijack my your thread.

Why would you NOT have those abs appear?  DUDE!

2010-02-01 4:19 PM
in reply to: #2648373

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Subject: RE: The medical tent in an Ironman...
DerekL - 2010-02-01 5:14 PM
aquagirl - 2010-02-01 4:11 PM
tjfry - 2010-02-01 5:06 PM
DerekL - 2010-02-01 2:21 PM
alexthesuspect - 2010-02-01 2:16 PM
as for "acquiring" from the hospital, i have no problem with it.


Why put up a euphemism for it?  Just call it what it is.  Stealing. 

Harder to say "I'm ok with stealing from the hospital."



Isn't that called Medicare? hahahahaha

ok ok, I don't want any political/COJ thing started, it was just set up so nicely..


Oh........OK.......then I guess I will not complain about the state of my Canadian healthcare. 
 


Helen, stop trying to hijack my your thread.




LMAO!!
Is this gonna be a nurse VS doctor thing ?? 


2010-02-03 1:06 AM
in reply to: #2641818

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Subject: RE: The medical tent in an Ironman...

Interesting thread.  I thought I'd add my .02 cents here, even though it's going to be a bit of a hijack from the OP (like that hasn't already happened!). 

I've been a volunteer in the medical tent at IMCDA every year since it started there, with the exception of the years I've competed in the race and I've also been on the staff at IM Canada.  This year I'm co-captain of the entire medical team at IMCDA.  It's been interesting to watch the evolving way we treat athletes after the races.  The first year, 2003, saw temps in the mid-90's so there were a lot of people who were dehydrated.  EVERYBODY who showed up at the tent got an IV (or two) and we had bodies laying everywhere.  Since then, there's been quite a lot of research into the actual fluid replacement needs of endurance athletes and as a result our treatment in the medical tent has changed significantly. 

We have an experienced cadre of triage nurses who meet every single person entering the medical tent area and, after asking a couple questions and giving the athlete a quick look-over, determine the need to even enter the tent.  Basically, if you are walking under your own power, know who you are and what you've just done, and aren't throwing up on their shoes, you go to a lounge chair and put your feet up for awhile.  Very few athletes are even considered for treatment in the medical tent anymore.  Like others have said on this thread, if you're able to drink fluids and keep them down, you don't need IV fluids and will NOT receive them, even if you ask for them.  If you have been throwing up for the last 10 miles of the run, are incoherent, severely cramping, or having any number of other symptoms, you'll be taken into the tent and evaluated by a physician, probably have some lab work run, and likely receive IV rehydration.  And don't try to fake it either...our triage nurses (yours truly included) are good BS detectors!  Once you've reclined in a lounge chair for a few minutes and had something to drink, it's amazing how much better you feel than in the first couple minutes after crossing the finish line.  I know, I've been there.

If all that seems a little on the narrow minded side, please remember that we have 2300+ athletes to keep up with on race day.  You can rest assured that if you truly need excellent medical care during or after the race, you'll get it.

One other little side note:  one poster said they felt entitled to an IV bag since they had paid $550+ for their entry fee.  I may have felt somewhat like that before I got involved at the level I am with preparing for an IM race but no more.  I'll not ever again complain about race fees for IM races.  We've already been holding planning meetings and are actively involved in preparing for your race next June.  It is unbelievable the amount of planning, buying supplies, permit applications,  volunteer sign-ups, contract signing, more planning, more buying, etc that goes into one of these races.  And that's not to mention the legal/liabilty garbage that has to be covered.  That's a whole other bag of worms in and of itself that most of us don't even think about. 

OK...hijack off!  Just thought I'd put in a word from the medical team at IMCDA so you'll know a little bit of what to expect from our end of things.  Good luck to all of you in your training and racing this year! 

2010-02-03 3:22 AM
in reply to: #2651550

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Subject: RE: The medical tent in an Ironman...
Flyboy - 2010-02-02 9:06 PM

We have an experienced cadre of triage nurses who meet every single person entering the medical tent area and, after asking a couple questions and giving the athlete a quick look-over, determine the need to even enter the tent.  Basically, if you are walking under your own power, know who you are and what you've just done, and aren't throwing up on their shoes, you go to a lounge chair and put your feet up for awhile.  Very few athletes are even considered for treatment in the medical tent anymore.  Like others have said on this thread, if you're able to drink fluids and keep them down, you don't need IV fluids and will NOT receive them, even if you ask for them.  If you have been throwing up for the last 10 miles of the run, are incoherent, severely cramping, or having any number of other symptoms, you'll be taken into the tent and evaluated by a physician, probably have some lab work run, and likely receive IV rehydration.  And don't try to fake it either...our triage nurses (yours truly included) are good BS detectors!  Once you've reclined in a lounge chair for a few minutes and had something to drink, it's amazing how much better you feel than in the first couple minutes after crossing the finish line.  I know, I've been there.



I read through the thread...which was quite entertaining...but this is why I have no problem with the guy requesting IV's.  He clearly stated he wanted an IV and probably didn't need to have one...and the medical tent gave it to him anyway.  He didn't try to fake anything or deceive anyone.  So as long as the medical tent agrees, I see no problem with it.  If he was at IM Canada and got refused...I assume he would have been fine with that too. 

It's really no different than a man who wants to buy a bike at an already discounted price, but then asks the LBS for a deal or discount on top of that to help make their decision...when they really know they are going to buy it even if it were selling at retail price.  It never hurts to ask.  And if the LBS agrees to the additional discount...does that now make this man unethical?  Did he somehow break a rule?
2010-02-03 6:16 AM
in reply to: #2641818

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Subject: RE: The medical tent in an Ironman...
OMG, I nearly missed this thread thinking it was actually about medical tents .

I just kept laughing 

I think this thread should be made sticky or something like that. Easily the most fun thread since I joined the board
2010-02-03 8:36 AM
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Subject: RE: The medical tent in an Ironman...
I can work with our Asian Factories to come up with something like this.  Just need to know if it's legal.

http://home.insightbb.com/~batlou/photos/IVCyclist.jpg
2010-02-03 8:52 AM
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Subject: RE: The medical tent in an Ironman...
Flyboy - 2010-02-03 2:06 AM

Interesting thread.  I thought I'd add my .02 cents here, even though it's going to be a bit of a hijack from the OP (like that hasn't already happened!). 

...snip...

OK...hijack off!  Just thought I'd put in a word from the medical team at IMCDA so you'll know a little bit of what to expect from our end of things.  Good luck to all of you in your training and racing this year! 



First of all, thanks for being a volunteer.  Your work is much appreciated.

Second, great post.

Third, I'm not sure why you called this a hijack, unless you meant that you hijacked the hijacked hijack and thereby put the thread back on the rails.



2010-02-03 8:59 AM
in reply to: #2643470

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Subject: RE: The medical tent in an Ironman...
LSUfan4444 - 2010-01-29 4:40 PM

What would happen to races if every athlete took what they thought they "deserved" for their entry fee? I mean, I pay $75 for a sprint... shoud I be able to tally up $75 worth of goodie bag items, gels, powerbars, Gatorade and hey why not some medical supplies while I'm at it? I deserve it for the entry fee I paid, right?

I'm not taking $575 worth of medical supplies, but for $575 I am entitled to an IV if I want one..same for a HIM


No. Those supplies are there for people who *need* them. It's not a free for all.

you show me one place race that says "medical tents are reserved for those who deem their services necessary" and I will stay out.  but YOUR opinion that they are necessary doesn't make it fact

its a freaking bag of saline..do you also get mad at people who take a couple extra gu's on the run? or someone who takes an powerbar "just in case"? 

they probably cost more

what about someone who takes the water from a water stop to only splash it on their face, are they not taking that water from someone who "needs" it?

seems like your biases are clouding your judgement of my actions a little bit
 



I didn't get to re-visit this thread until today. But to answer your questions/statements...
I do not believe you are "entitled" to an IV if you want one. If you NEED one, OK. But you have demonstrated that you are not in NEED of one. I want a piggy back ride back to my car... do I get one just because I want one and there is a volunteer standing there?

Yes I notice and/or get upset when people stuff their pockets full of gels when they clearly don't need 5 in the next mile where the next aid station is. That's a waste of the resources and ultilmately is a disservice to the other athletes and race director.

Not sure what "bias" you're referring to... I just think it's rude to hog the race resources un-neccesarily. No wonder race entry costs have sky-rocketed.
 

 
2010-02-03 9:13 AM
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Subject: RE: The medical tent in an Ironman...
Batlou - 2010-02-03 9:36 AM I can work with our Asian Factories to come up with something like this.  Just need to know if it's legal.

http://home.insightbb.com/~batlou/photos/IVCyclist.jpg



Make sure they do it in Carbon with an aero shape. I would expect it to sell.
2010-02-03 12:06 PM
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Subject: RE: The medical tent in an Ironman...
tri808 - 2010-02-03 4:22 AM
Flyboy - 2010-02-02 9:06 PM

We have an experienced cadre of triage nurses who meet every single person entering the medical tent area and, after asking a couple questions and giving the athlete a quick look-over, determine the need to even enter the tent.  Basically, if you are walking under your own power, know who you are and what you've just done, and aren't throwing up on their shoes, you go to a lounge chair and put your feet up for awhile.  Very few athletes are even considered for treatment in the medical tent anymore.  Like others have said on this thread, if you're able to drink fluids and keep them down, you don't need IV fluids and will NOT receive them, even if you ask for them.  If you have been throwing up for the last 10 miles of the run, are incoherent, severely cramping, or having any number of other symptoms, you'll be taken into the tent and evaluated by a physician, probably have some lab work run, and likely receive IV rehydration.  And don't try to fake it either...our triage nurses (yours truly included) are good BS detectors!  Once you've reclined in a lounge chair for a few minutes and had something to drink, it's amazing how much better you feel than in the first couple minutes after crossing the finish line.  I know, I've been there.



I read through the thread...which was quite entertaining...but this is why I have no problem with the guy requesting IV's.  He clearly stated he wanted an IV and probably didn't need to have one...and the medical tent gave it to him anyway.  He didn't try to fake anything or deceive anyone.  So as long as the medical tent agrees, I see no problem with it.  If he was at IM Canada and got refused...I assume he would have been fine with that too. 

It's really no different than a man who wants to buy a bike at an already discounted price, but then asks the LBS for a deal or discount on top of that to help make their decision...when they really know they are going to buy it even if it were selling at retail price.  It never hurts to ask.  And if the LBS agrees to the additional discount...does that now make this man unethical?  Did he somehow break a rule?


Really? I think it's completely different. Do other people have an actual medical need for the bike that he is trying to get at a better price?
2010-02-03 3:11 PM
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Subject: RE: The medical tent in an Ironman...
Flyboy - 2010-02-03 12:06 AM

Interesting thread.  I thought I'd add my .02 cents here, even though it's going to be a bit of a hijack from the OP (like that hasn't already happened!).  



Best post of this thread. Glad to see someone who has experience is adding their opinion.

Mike

Edited by Rollin' Thunder 2010-02-03 3:12 PM
2010-02-03 3:33 PM
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Subject: RE: The medical tent in an Ironman...
aquagirl - 2010-01-29 7:48 PM Ofergodssakes what happened to my little thread??

First time I have EVER heard of somebody requesting an "elective" IV.
Going to withhold further comment on that one.......{insert eye roll here}


This does remind me of a funny story though. Years ago when I worked in a pediatric ER, on Friday and Saturday nights the drunken kids would be brought in  unconscious from excessive alcohol intake. We would start IV's to rehydrate them and then they  would  be monitored until morning.

There was one wonderful curmudgeonly old Doctor I worked with who insisted we take the IV's out a few hours early. He wanted them rehydrated back to safe levels obviously, but by taking the IVs out a bit early the kids would STILL experience a wicked hangover the next day! 



I refuse to hydrate drunks!  They need to suffer like I did when I was young and stupid.  I am only 38(ish).  Does this make me old and curmudgeonly?

As to elective IV's.  HTFU! 

Edited by davidson3 2010-02-03 3:35 PM


2010-02-03 5:32 PM
in reply to: #2651550

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Subject: RE: The medical tent in an Ironman...
Flyboy - 2010-02-03 2:06 AM

Interesting thread.  I thought I'd add my .02 cents here, even though it's going to be a bit of a hijack from the OP (like that hasn't already happened!). 

I've been a volunteer in the medical tent at IMCDA every year since it started there, with the exception of the years I've competed in the race and I've also been on the staff at IM Canada.  This year I'm co-captain of the entire medical team at IMCDA.  It's been interesting to watch the evolving way we treat athletes after the races.  The first year, 2003, saw temps in the mid-90's so there were a lot of people who were dehydrated.  EVERYBODY who showed up at the tent got an IV (or two) and we had bodies laying everywhere.  Since then, there's been quite a lot of research into the actual fluid replacement needs of endurance athletes and as a result our treatment in the medical tent has changed significantly. 

We have an experienced cadre of triage nurses who meet every single person entering the medical tent area and, after asking a couple questions and giving the athlete a quick look-over, determine the need to even enter the tent.  Basically, if you are walking under your own power, know who you are and what you've just done, and aren't throwing up on their shoes, you go to a lounge chair and put your feet up for awhile.  Very few athletes are even considered for treatment in the medical tent anymore.  Like others have said on this thread, if you're able to drink fluids and keep them down, you don't need IV fluids and will NOT receive them, even if you ask for them.  If you have been throwing up for the last 10 miles of the run, are incoherent, severely cramping, or having any number of other symptoms, you'll be taken into the tent and evaluated by a physician, probably have some lab work run, and likely receive IV rehydration.  And don't try to fake it either...our triage nurses (yours truly included) are good BS detectors!  Once you've reclined in a lounge chair for a few minutes and had something to drink, it's amazing how much better you feel than in the first couple minutes after crossing the finish line.  I know, I've been there.

If all that seems a little on the narrow minded side, please remember that we have 2300+ athletes to keep up with on race day.  You can rest assured that if you truly need excellent medical care during or after the race, you'll get it.

One other little side note:  one poster said they felt entitled to an IV bag since they had paid $550+ for their entry fee.  I may have felt somewhat like that before I got involved at the level I am with preparing for an IM race but no more.  I'll not ever again complain about race fees for IM races.  We've already been holding planning meetings and are actively involved in preparing for your race next June.  It is unbelievable the amount of planning, buying supplies, permit applications,  volunteer sign-ups, contract signing, more planning, more buying, etc that goes into one of these races.  And that's not to mention the legal/liabilty garbage that has to be covered.  That's a whole other bag of worms in and of itself that most of us don't even think about. 

OK...hijack off!  Just thought I'd put in a word from the medical team at IMCDA so you'll know a little bit of what to expect from our end of things.  Good luck to all of you in your training and racing this year! 



This was most certainly NOT a hijack! Thanks for giving me a peek in the tent!
I am looking forward to the experience. It will be a little odd to look after such LARGE patients though....I am an NICU nurse.
2010-02-03 5:33 PM
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Subject: RE: The medical tent in an Ironman...
davidson3 - 2010-02-03 4:33 PM
aquagirl - 2010-01-29 7:48 PM Ofergodssakes what happened to my little thread??

First time I have EVER heard of somebody requesting an "elective" IV.
Going to withhold further comment on that one.......{insert eye roll here}


This does remind me of a funny story though. Years ago when I worked in a pediatric ER, on Friday and Saturday nights the drunken kids would be brought in  unconscious from excessive alcohol intake. We would start IV's to rehydrate them and then they  would  be monitored until morning.

There was one wonderful curmudgeonly old Doctor I worked with who insisted we take the IV's out a few hours early. He wanted them rehydrated back to safe levels obviously, but by taking the IVs out a bit early the kids would STILL experience a wicked hangover the next day! 



I refuse to hydrate drunks!  They need to suffer like I did when I was young and stupid.  I am only 38(ish).  Does this make me old and curmudgeonly?

As to elective IV's.  HTFU! 



Yes Rob....you are old and curmudgeonly!!  
2010-02-04 10:06 AM
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