General Discussion Triathlon Talk » Clincher vs. Tubular Wheel set weight Rss Feed  
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2010-03-22 9:16 AM

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Champion
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Subject: Clincher vs. Tubular Wheel set weight
So I was a bit bored and had a new ExcelSports bike catalogue on my desk...I wanted to compare a complete set of clincher wheels against a complete set of tubular wheels and their difference in total weight.

Clincher's-
ZIPP 404's- 1615g
Conti GP 4000 tires- 450g
Tube's- 236g
1 spare tube- 118g
Total Clincher race set w/ spare tube- 2419g

Tubular's-
ZIPP 404's- 1136g
Conti GP 4000 tires- 540g
1 Spare Conti Tire- 270g
Total Tubular race set w/spare tire- 1946g

So you save 473g with tubulars vs. a comparable set of clinchers including the spare. That's just a tad over 1lb. Am I missing anything additional? I found it interesting.


2010-03-22 9:23 AM
in reply to: #2739796

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Elite
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Subject: RE: Clincher vs. Tubular Wheel set weight
Not that it matters much, but unless I looked in the wrong place, the Continental GP 4000s are about 200g. 

Info 

For a competitive athlete, a extra pound is a bit of weight, though.

Good analysis. 
2010-03-22 9:25 AM
in reply to: #2739796

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over a barrier
Subject: RE: Clincher vs. Tubular Wheel set weight
What about the glue for the tubulars?
2010-03-22 9:25 AM
in reply to: #2739821

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Subject: RE: Clincher vs. Tubular Wheel set weight
tri_d00d - 2010-03-22 10:23 AM

Not that it matters much, but unless I looked in the wrong place, the Continental GP 4000s are about 200g. 

Info 

For a competitive athlete, a extra pound is a bit of weight, though.

Good analysis. 


That's single tire and he's talking about a pair.
2010-03-22 9:27 AM
in reply to: #2739825

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Champion
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Subject: RE: Clincher vs. Tubular Wheel set weight
running2far - 2010-03-22 8:25 AM

What about the glue for the tubulars?


Yes, I'm not sure how to solve for that, though. I pulled the tire weight from the Excel catalogue which lists Conti GP4000 clinchers as 225g and tubular as 270g.
2010-03-22 9:34 AM
in reply to: #2739796

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Resident Curmudgeon
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Subject: RE: Clincher vs. Tubular Wheel set weight

That's all good, but to what end? I've always heard that weight is practically irrelevant in nearly all triathlons....



2010-03-22 9:36 AM
in reply to: #2739831

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Champion
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Subject: RE: Clincher vs. Tubular Wheel set weight
bryancd - 2010-03-22 10:27 AM
running2far - 2010-03-22 8:25 AM What about the glue for the tubulars?
Yes, I'm not sure how to solve for that, though. I pulled the tire weight from the Excel catalogue which lists Conti GP4000 clinchers as 225g and tubular as 270g.


Glue can't be much as it is wet in the tube and dries out so weighs less than what the tube weighs.

Work a little slow Bryan?

2010-03-22 9:39 AM
in reply to: #2739843

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Champion
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Subject: RE: Clincher vs. Tubular Wheel set weight
the bear - 2010-03-22 8:34 AM

That's all good, but to what end? I've always heard that weight is practically irrelevant in nearly all triathlons....



Just thought it was interesting, to me at least. Aerodynamics trump weight, however if the aerodynamics are comparable, less weight is better.
2010-03-22 9:40 AM
in reply to: #2739796

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Subject: RE: Clincher vs. Tubular Wheel set weight
Tire levers - 31g


Not having to worry about your unglued tubular rolling off the rim during a race - priceless
2010-03-22 9:43 AM
in reply to: #2739860

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Champion
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Subject: RE: Clincher vs. Tubular Wheel set weight
nhunter344 - 2010-03-22 8:40 AM

Tire levers - 31g


Not having to worry about your unglued tubular rolling off the rim during a race - priceless


I figure both sets require one tire lever, one MicroInflate, and one CO2, so that's a push. Unless you are racing a crit, you aren't likely going to roll off a properly inflated tubular, just take the corners a bit easier.
2010-03-22 9:44 AM
in reply to: #2739854

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Subject: RE: Clincher vs. Tubular Wheel set weight
bryancd - 2010-03-22 9:39 AM
the bear - 2010-03-22 8:34 AM

That's all good, but to what end? I've always heard that weight is practically irrelevant in nearly all triathlons....

Just thought it was interesting, to me at least. Aerodynamics trump weight, however if the aerodynamics are comparable, less weight is better.


Maybe if those were the only two variables to consider. If weight is practically irrelevant, then other considerations like cost, convenience, practicality, may figure more into your selection process.

You also have to figure on carrying an extra tire with the tubular versus a patch kit or a tube for the clinchers.

Edited by the bear 2010-03-22 9:45 AM


2010-03-22 9:45 AM
in reply to: #2739864

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Subject: RE: Clincher vs. Tubular Wheel set weight
bryancd - 2010-03-22 10:43 AM
nhunter344 - 2010-03-22 8:40 AM Tire levers - 31g


Not having to worry about your unglued tubular rolling off the rim during a race - priceless
I figure both sets require one tire lever, one MicroInflate, and one CO2, so that's a push. Unless you are racing a crit, you aren't likely going to roll off a properly inflated tubular, just take the corners a bit easier.


Damn. You tell me this just as I thought I had my mind set on clinchers!
2010-03-22 9:46 AM
in reply to: #2739867

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Champion
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Subject: RE: Clincher vs. Tubular Wheel set weight
the bear - 2010-03-22 8:44 AM
Maybe if those were the only two variables to consider. If weight is practically irrelevant, then other considerations like cost, convenience, practicality, may figure more into your selection process.

You also have to figure on carrying an extra tire with the tubular versus a patch kit or a tube for the clinchers.


I'm not editorializing or making a recomendation, I'm just having fun with bike geek math.

...I miss Daremo, he would have loved a thread like this...
2010-03-22 9:52 AM
in reply to: #2739796

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Champion
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Subject: RE: Clincher vs. Tubular Wheel set weight
Here's a spreadsheet to play around with that allows you to change different variables.

The difference of one pound over the rolling course in the spreadsheet is 2 seconds over a 10.12 mile TT course (with the default parameters).

Shane
2010-03-22 9:54 AM
in reply to: #2739796

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Subject: RE: Clincher vs. Tubular Wheel set weight
Rim tape or veloplugs for the clinchers?
2010-03-22 9:55 AM
in reply to: #2739796

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Champion
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Fountain Hills, AZ
Subject: RE: Clincher vs. Tubular Wheel set weight
Sweet! I can save 22 seconds over 112 miles over my virtual, clinching riding clone!


2010-03-22 10:03 AM
in reply to: #2739908

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Champion
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Subject: RE: Clincher vs. Tubular Wheel set weight
bryancd - 2010-03-22 11:55 AM

Sweet! I can save 22 seconds over 112 miles over my virtual, clinching riding clone!


It would be interesting to put in a 112 mile course and a more reasonable power estimate (since the default for the 10.12 mile TT is 337W).

I also just noticed that this was at 7000'; at sea level the difference changes to 1 second for the 1lbs difference. 

Shane
2010-03-22 10:19 AM
in reply to: #2739908

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Subject: RE: Clincher vs. Tubular Wheel set weight
bryancd - 2010-03-22 10:55 AM Sweet! I can save 22 seconds over 112 miles over my virtual, clinching riding clone!


HAHA, I almost spit my sandwich out on my computer.  Then I thought....there are some people where 22 seconds really does matter.

For me, I will probably rent some clinchers for my HIMs this year, because I've never changed a tubular and I don't give a rat's about 11 seconds over that distance.  The race doesn't even start until 8 miles into the run anyway. Surprised
2010-03-22 10:27 AM
in reply to: #2739796

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Coach
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Subject: RE: Clincher vs. Tubular Wheel set weight
The difference is probably less since you also have to consider some weight for the glue for tubulars (specially if you want to have a lower Crr) and those 'in the know' racing with clinchers would use latex tubes and certainly not conti tires and weights on other brands can be lower (~200 gr x tire) while Crr much better. I think the difference would be more like 250-300 gr (~0.65 pound).
2010-03-22 11:12 AM
in reply to: #2739796

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Not a Coach
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Subject: RE: Clincher vs. Tubular Wheel set weight
Jorge nailed it in that weight & aero aren't the only two factors to consider here.  The Crr is likely more important than either in this case.

If you are truly looking to "max out", then you probably end up with a set of high-end tubulars very strongly glued.  Although, if you flat, you may look like Norman on the side of the Queen K a few years ago.  So, you may want to add a razor blade to your tubular kit.  Or just drop the spare and go for broke. 
2010-03-22 11:23 AM
in reply to: #2739908

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Veteran
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Subject: RE: Clincher vs. Tubular Wheel set weight
You can get lightweight tubes that weigh as little as 75g, so that would take about 130g off the clincher weight. Then again you can probably get tubies that weigh as little as 200g.

I'll stick to trying to take 400g off my waist, unless I need the quicker spin up time.


2010-03-22 11:24 AM
in reply to: #2739796

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Pro
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Subject: RE: Clincher vs. Tubular Wheel set weight
I've never used tubulars.  Is there a difference in the time it takes to switch out a flat?
2010-03-22 11:49 AM
in reply to: #2739796

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Champion
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Fountain Hills, AZ
Subject: RE: Clincher vs. Tubular Wheel set weight
Yeah, I wasn't cherry picking the lightest in each category, I ride GP 4000 so it was just easy to use. And I always carry a razor blade, but they defy the laws of physics and are weightless.
2010-03-22 12:09 PM
in reply to: #2739796

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Master
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Subject: RE: Clincher vs. Tubular Wheel set weight
I'm a weight weenie... I ride tubulars.
2010-03-22 12:11 PM
in reply to: #2740192

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Subject: RE: Clincher vs. Tubular Wheel set weight
TriMyBest - 2010-03-22 12:24 PM

I've never used tubulars.  Is there a difference in the time it takes to switch out a flat?


Yeah, tubulars are slightly faster to change out.

Now ask if there's a price difference for replacing parts when you flat
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