General Discussion Triathlon Talk » I suck at swimming.........Help Rss Feed  
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2011-04-13 6:20 PM

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Subject: I suck at swimming.........Help
I have been lurking around this forum for months now but this is my first post.   I decided to do a tri to get back in shape. I have already lost 25lbs and am around 210 right now.  Looking to get to 185.   I have been running 2 to 3 miles at around a 10 min/mi.  pace three times a week and riding 12 to 14 miles on some pretty hard mountain bike trails and 30 mile road ride with the LBS three times a week.  I only have one problem right now.  I CANT SWIM!!!! I have been going to the YMCA and can still only make it about 100 meters continiously before i am dying.  I can only do 200 meters with rest in between each 25 meter leg total.  I had the coach at the Y take a look and he basically said I suck and am working really hard to go nowhere.  Thanks for all the help coach!  Please tell me that this is common and that I will get better.  I think I will try TI.  What do you think?


2011-04-13 6:29 PM
in reply to: #3445290

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Master
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Subject: RE: I suck at swimming.........Help

First off, is there anyway possible you can get us a video?

Secondly, the answer is probably that you're going to hard and you're beating the water into submission - except it's winning.

For starters, think LONG & SMOOTH.

In your reach: focus on high elbows. focus on looking down at the bottom of the pool. focus on getting your hand in the water, the high elbow, and pulling with your lats all the way through the stroke. 

In your breathing: lead with your hips. roll your body. Exhale some of your air as you stroke, get a good solid breath. AND DON'T LOOK FORWARD AND UP. 

In your kick: your feet should not break the water. Just barely to the surface. Don't thrash your feet, keep your legs straight. Kick from your hips. 

Remember to RELAX. In swimming, slow is smooth and smooth is fast. If you're wildly slapping the water, looking up and kicking like a mad man, you're going to lose. 

2011-04-13 6:35 PM
in reply to: #3445290

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Master
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Subject: RE: I suck at swimming.........Help
While people will give you decent advice here, get a coach.  You can read all this stuff and think you are doing the right thing, but it could be completely off.   The only real way to be sure if have a coach help you with your form.
2011-04-13 6:40 PM
in reply to: #3445290

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Master
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Subject: RE: I suck at swimming.........Help

Congrats on your new fitness and weight loss! That is great.

Sounds like your running and biking are coming along great.

As for the swim.....deep breath now...try to go easy.

This advice is just for getting some comfort in the water...if you really want to improve your stroke, get a coach, or at least take some video and compare it to some of the example video out there.

When I was teaching my daughter to swim, I told her to practice playing in the pool. I know that sounds weird, but you need a feel for the water. One thing I like to do when it has been a while is to just dive and float. Stand in the water and dive forward and try to see how far you can get. Put your feet down and do it again.

Dive to the bottom and then aim back up. Doing a little of this can give you a better feel for the position of your body in the water. 

It also gets you used to rythmic breathing, which can take some serious getting used to.

Good Luck!

2011-04-13 6:43 PM
in reply to: #3445290

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Subject: RE: I suck at swimming.........Help

I would be happy to get a coach if I could find one around here.  I do not like the guy at the YMCA.  The only other guy is at the college but has not returned my calls for two weeks.  I think I am on my own.  I could travel about an hour away to Clermont Florida to see a TI couch.  Might be worth the trip.  I am a plan kind of guy and I think wrong practice is not good practice.  Why imprint the wrong muscle memory.  Anybody try to teach themselves TI?  P.S. - No tri club around here either.

2011-04-13 6:46 PM
in reply to: #3445302

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Subject: RE: I suck at swimming.........Help
LostSheep - 2011-04-13 6:29 PM

First off, is there anyway possible you can get us a video?

Secondly, the answer is probably that you're going to hard and you're beating the water into submission - except it's winning.

For starters, think LONG & SMOOTH.

In your reach: focus on high elbows. focus on looking down at the bottom of the pool. focus on getting your hand in the water, the high elbow, and pulling with your lats all the way through the stroke. 

In your breathing: lead with your hips. roll your body. Exhale some of your air as you stroke, get a good solid breath. AND DON'T LOOK FORWARD AND UP. 

In your kick: your feet should not break the water. Just barely to the surface. Don't thrash your feet, keep your legs straight. Kick from your hips. 

Remember to RELAX. In swimming, slow is smooth and smooth is fast. If you're wildly slapping the water, looking up and kicking like a mad man, you're going to lose. 

You are RIGHT ON with the need to relax.  I can do it for about 50 meters then I start to break down because my form is bad.  Then my breathing goes.  Then i go into survival mode. 


2011-04-13 6:55 PM
in reply to: #3445290

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Master
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Subject: RE: I suck at swimming.........Help

There is a TI instructor down here in Ft. Lauderdale area that will do a 3 hour clinic including video. You should look for something like that up your way.

Although I would generally agree that your don't want to "learn" bad habits, you can certainly do some of the TI drills on your own to get a baseline for the body position ideas.

2011-04-13 7:08 PM
in reply to: #3445290

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Champion
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Subject: RE: I suck at swimming.........Help

The Finding Freestyle (findingfreestlye.com) program may work for you.

It's reasonable, on line program with videos, lots of information, and more. I've worked with 4 different swim coaches and learned more from the on line program, asking questions and posting videos of various drills on the forum. Robert and Dave are excellent at answering questions and helping folks.



Edited by KathyG 2011-04-13 7:09 PM
2011-04-13 7:24 PM
in reply to: #3445356

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Subject: RE: I suck at swimming.........Help
KathyG - 2011-04-13 7:08 PM

The Finding Freestyle (findingfreestlye.com) program may work for you.

It's reasonable, on line program with videos, lots of information, and more. I've worked with 4 different swim coaches and learned more from the on line program, asking questions and posting videos of various drills on the forum. Robert and Dave are excellent at answering questions and helping folks.

Thanks for the infor.  I am going to their website right now.  Has anybody successfully taught themselves or am I pi***** up a rope?  Also, is this normal to be in pretty good shape on the bike and run but to be a total embarrassment in the pool.  There is a guy at the Y that weighs 300 pounds that can swim 800 meters without stopping.  I am very frustated and thinking that maybe I shoud be a DUO athlete and not a  TRI athlete. 

Edited by CoachMitch 2011-04-13 7:25 PM
2011-04-13 7:26 PM
in reply to: #3445376

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Subject: RE: I suck at swimming.........Help
CoachMitch - 2011-04-13 8:24 PM
KathyG - 2011-04-13 7:08 PM

The Finding Freestyle (findingfreestlye.com) program may work for you.

It's reasonable, on line program with videos, lots of information, and more. I've worked with 4 different swim coaches and learned more from the on line program, asking questions and posting videos of various drills on the forum. Robert and Dave are excellent at answering questions and helping folks.

Thanks for the infor.  I am going to their website right now.  Has anybody successfully taught themselves or am I up a rope?  Also, is this normal to be in pretty good shape on the bike and run but to be a total embarrassment in the pool.  There is a guy at the Y that weighs 300 pounds that can swim 800 meters without stopping.  I am very frustated and thinking that maybe I shoud be a DUO athlete and not a  TRI athlete. 

Very common issue...swimming is often not fitness but technique. If swimming was easy, triathlons would be crowded like 5Ks to Marys.

Many if not the majority of us, didn't know how to swim when we started to swim.

2011-04-13 7:34 PM
in reply to: #3445290

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Subject: RE: I suck at swimming.........Help

So there is hope.  I know I can do it if I just have a path to follow and see progress.  The finding freestyle sight is awsome.  Seriously considering it.



2011-04-13 8:10 PM
in reply to: #3445290

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Master
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Subject: RE: I suck at swimming.........Help

Swimming is 90% technique. If the technique (form) sucks, you won't go anywhere. 

If you're having issues relaxing, i recommend some of the tips that were given earlier. Go play in the water. Float. Push off the wall and glide (work on staying tight). Try to swim on your side. 

Swim slower. 

And not to be a butt, but if you'd use your logs, you'd probably get a bit more help.

2011-04-13 8:18 PM
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Master
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Subject: RE: I suck at swimming.........Help

See if you can have somebody take a simple video of you swimming (digital camera, phone ... nothing fancy), and even better if there's a way to take a video of you from underwater. You can learn a whole lot from that, even if you can't find a good coach. After reading a few of the "critique my swim video" threads that show up here every week or two, you can get a fairly good idea of what a good stroke *should* look like. And chances are when you then look at your own, you'll immediately see some things that could be improved. I know that I did when I first saw video of me swimming. 

I know that many around here frown on the use of swim toys, but I found it very informative when I first swam with a pull buoy. I suddenly felt like "wow - so that's how it's supposed to feel like when your legs's aren't dragging in the water", and I was able to pay attention to my breathing form in a way that I struggled to do when putting it all together. Since I hadn't known what better form felt like, it gave me something to aim for.

Stick with it - you will get better. 

2011-04-13 8:22 PM
in reply to: #3445455

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Subject: RE: I suck at swimming.........Help
LostSheep - 2011-04-13 8:10 PM

Swimming is 90% technique. If the technique (form) sucks, you won't go anywhere. 

If you're having issues relaxing, i recommend some of the tips that were given earlier. Go play in the water. Float. Push off the wall and glide (work on staying tight). Try to swim on your side. 

Swim slower. 

And not to be a butt, but if you'd use your logs, you'd probably get a bit more help.

Thanks everyone for your advice.  I have learned soooo much from all of your posts all over this forum.  I really appreciate everyone sharing their experience on bikes, running, and everything tri.  This is a great site.  If you are talking about the excercise logs on the site i will try and use them?  I did not know it was that important.  I am using MyPlate for my food log and I log all my workouts in my journal.  
2011-04-13 8:22 PM
in reply to: #3445290

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Elite
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Subject: RE: I suck at swimming.........Help
Tough to give you stroke advice but be certain your breathing technique is good because if it is not no matter what your form Is you will be out of breath. 6 months ago I was sucking wind after 25-100 yds and I am x very fit runner etc..,, once I got my breathing down I can now go 3000m non stop.,,,so be sure you are constantly exhaling underwater and just before you come up for air give a little stronger exhale and then take a heathly breath then as head hits water start exhaling ..,, once you feel comfortable working on your stroke will be easier. Good luck
2011-04-13 8:28 PM
in reply to: #3445472

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Subject: RE: I suck at swimming.........Help
colinphillips - 2011-04-13 8:18 PM

See if you can have somebody take a simple video of you swimming (digital camera, phone ... nothing fancy), and even better if there's a way to take a video of you from underwater. You can learn a whole lot from that, even if you can't find a good coach. After reading a few of the "critique my swim video" threads that show up here every week or two, you can get a fairly good idea of what a good stroke *should* look like. And chances are when you then look at your own, you'll immediately see some things that could be improved. I know that I did when I first saw video of me swimming. 

I know that many around here frown on the use of swim toys, but I found it very informative when I first swam with a pull buoy. I suddenly felt like "wow - so that's how it's supposed to feel like when your legs's aren't dragging in the water", and I was able to pay attention to my breathing form in a way that I struggled to do when putting it all together. Since I hadn't known what better form felt like, it gave me something to aim for.

Stick with it - you will get better. 

Good advice. I will try and get a video and upload it.  Thanks.


2011-04-14 3:42 AM
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Subject: RE: I suck at swimming.........Help
im a self taught swimmer. but what really helped me was swimming more. i was stuck just like you until i started going everyother day sometime 2 days in a row and my distance increased to 100 yrds to 1000 yrds without stopping. first i started doing sets. 100m with 2 minutes rest. then shortend the rest time. slowly but surley i was able to increase the distance and shorten the rest time. im not sure if i got better or just more condition, but something worked. good luck
2011-04-14 6:37 AM
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Subject: RE: I suck at swimming.........Help

I won't repeat all the great suggestions that have already been said...

But I taught myself to swim using the TI book and long days in the pool. Its hard work and you will hit some snags...but you can do it adn it will get better!

2011-04-14 7:54 AM
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Subject: RE: I suck at swimming.........Help
I can empathize...that was me for the first month or so that I started swimming. If your problem is just cardiovascular, it will DEFINITELY get better with consistent practice. It is hard to believe when you are suffering so much at such small distances though, but trust me - unless you are pushing yourself much more downward than forward, YOU WILL get better.

Agreed - a video would help us to give you more specific advice. Keep up the effort though and try not to get too down about the amazing frustrations inevitable with beginner swimming. At the least, watch other people who are moving well through the water, identify a few things about their stroke that seem to be common, and try to incorporate that into your stroke.

Good luck!
2011-04-14 8:20 AM
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Subject: RE: I suck at swimming.........Help
Float forward, don't thrash and splash.
2011-04-14 8:50 AM
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Subject: RE: I suck at swimming.........Help
It sounds like you are running low on oxygen while you swim. Concentrate on breathing out the entire time that your face is in the water, breathe out fast enough so that all you have to do when your mouth clears the waterline is breathe in. It's hard to improve your stroke technique if you are not cofortable with your face in the water for extended periods of time. You can also wear some short fins, this allows you to move down the pool easier, so you can focus on technique instead of survival. Stick with it, triathlons are a blast.


2011-04-14 9:01 AM
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Subject: RE: I suck at swimming.........Help

Have you tried the Central Florida Marlin Masters team? Their website says they do stroke coaching.

http://centralfloridamarlins.com/masters.htm

2011-04-14 9:33 AM
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Subject: RE: I suck at swimming.........Help

Hi Mitch,

I was at your same exact point last week, except I couldn't swim longer than 100yds without panicking/gasping for air. I'm taking a clinic that has helped TREMENDOUSLY. It really is all about form and technique. I highly recommend you looking into signing yourself up for a clinic/class. It may be a little expensive, but it's well worth it if you want to learn how to swim efficiently. Good luck!

2011-04-14 9:54 AM
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Subject: RE: I suck at swimming.........Help

You sound like I was 2 years ago. I couldn't swim more than 2 laps without stopping. This wasn't just a one time thing, it was every time I went to the pool for about a year. No matter what I tried I just couldn't get better. It was pure frustration. Fast forward to now. Last week I swam 2.5 miles non-stop and I don't even consider it a workout unless I swim at least 2000 yards.

I can clearly remember the day all the frustration ended for me. It was my break-thru moment. I was finally able to forget about speed and focus on "slow". It doesn't matter how fast you go if you can not complete the distance.

Here's what worked for me. I pushed off the wall slowly with my feet and tried to glide. As I began to slow I swam one stroke. I did this several times, then I added a second stroke, and then another, etc. Each time I did this I tried to maintain the same "slow" pace. In my mind I kept telling myself I need to visualize myself in a marathon, but I am walking. In other words, I am doing a speed and effort that I can maintain all day. Eventually I made it to the end of the pool and I was relaxed and I was not winded.

Technique is very important. You will receive a lot of tips on BT. Once I was able to go slow I was able to apply these tips to improve my technique and become more efficient.

Btw, I did  have some very minor coaching. I was training with a group so we had a coach help us 2 or 3 times, but he basically did to me what your coach did to you. He was so shocked with how poor a swimmer I was he focused on the others because he pretty much thought I was a waste of time. I didn't have the funds to hire a personal coach so I had to self teach. Well, at my last tri I placed in the top 25% overall for the swim, so I guess it wasn't a waste of my time.

Good luck. Keep working at it and it will finally click.

 

2011-04-14 3:27 PM
in reply to: #3446192

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Subject: RE: I suck at swimming.........Help
Renee - 2011-04-14 9:01 AM

Have you tried the Central Florida Marlin Masters team? Their website says they do stroke coaching.

http://centralfloridamarlins.com/masters.htm

I called these guys several times and they are never there.  Left messages but on response.
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