Can we talk swimming HR one more time?

I'm not watching it every single time.....but, I will.

If I swim as slowly as I can, I swim 50yds in 1'. If I go slower than that, I feel like it affects my technique. 50-55" feels ideal.

I can tell you I am NOT slower, breathing less often.....as I'm sure most aren't. I may have misunderstood your question.

Edited by nc452010 2015-09-20 5:54 AM

Agree--I would stop worrying about your heart rate so much. There's a wide range among individuals and across the three disciples. Breathing too often without adequately exhaling can indeed cause you to build up CO2 and thus feel out of breath. I rarely ever breathe every 2 strokes for more than two cycles at a time, except for short periods at race effort in a long event (1500m and up). In the pool, it's typically to re-oxygenate myself after the flip turn, or tank up on oxygen coming into one. In open water, maybe if I have to surge a bit to get around someone, or toward the end (I tend to finish a lot faster than I start--it's just the way I operate.) My normal pattern is 2-2-4, or if I want to do bilateral breathing, 2-2-3. But I find the latter gives me too much air as well, while 2-2-5's not enough at a harder effort. The one exception would be if I am swimming at high altitude--as in 6000 ft. and up. I did a couple lake swims that high and found I was quickly gassed doing 2-2-4 and had to breathe every 2 strokes.

Not sure it is useful for freestyle but if you are feeling out of breath, it might help to just slow down the whole stroke cycle and take longer strokes. I used to swim 200m butterfly in some meets in HS and was one of the only girls on our team who could actually do the event, despite a very slight build. I can still do it today (at 46) when motivated. The trick is in keeping a very steady, slower rhythm, and stretching out each stroke a bit rather than trying to "power" though the water as in a sprint.

Whether it's true or not, I feel slowing down further is crossing the point of diminishing returns. I don't float well (to say the least....I look just like the guy in my photo ) and slowing down to a almost stop seems like it takes MORE energy (due to the dead spots slowing down creates).

Also, the only reason I've been monitoring HR is..............I have NO IDEA what aerobically swimming feels like. To date, I swim until I get a feeling of breathlessness........and I've always assumed that was due to oxygen debt. I've been monitoring my HR.....because I was thinking maybe I just have no idea what swimming at 125 bpm is supposed to feel like....and maybe I just needed to swim "through" that feeling.

Typically, I don't check my HR while swimming. It's only been the last couple times in the pool that it's been monitored.

Can you get some coaching or instruction, or at the very least get someone to video your swim and maybe some of the fish/coaches on the site can give you some feedback? The whole "floating" and "natural buoyancy" thing is overrated. Some people definitely have better natural buoyancy for simply floating around without going anywhere, but for actual swimming, it's primarily about correct body position. I have a typical lean runner's build, with long, muscular legs, but I don't have any problem with bouyancy when swimming. Many (most?) beginners, especially those who have more muscle mass in their legs, tend to "swim downhill", with their legs below their heads. Or they wear themselves out kicking too hard to remedy it. It's usually due to improper body/head position. In your case there are no doubt issues with breathing effectively (probably with exhaling completely underwater) as well. There are plenty of drills you can do to address these issues, but they are most productive when done with a coach who can let you know what you are doing now and what changes you need to make.

Caveat: I'm not a professional coach, though I have helped coach several kids' teams as an assistant. Just a long-time swimmer, who probably doesn't have textbook perfect form myself!

The good news is that if you swimming longer than two minutes or doing repeats without complete rest, you are swimming aerobically. However, there's a huge range in there and figuring out your pace for different intensities is very useful.

Since you mention about 60s/100, swim a 1000 as evenly paced as fast as you can. This will give you a threshold pace estimate per 100 that you can use to estimate other paces (and, as mentioned earlier, learn to use the pace clock and always keep an eye on it).

This will vary, but often a good starting point:

Easy - T pace + 20s
Moderate - T pace + 10s
Threshold - T pace
Fast - T pace - 5s

Shane

^^I'm sorry.....if I could swim an evenly paced 1000m, I wouldn't be here I honestly don't understand swimming jargon very well. I can put on core shorts and swim 4-600yds. So, I suppose I told you wrong. I guess I have swam aerobically. Add in a 2 beat kick and I suppose it takes me a lot more air.....or, something else is at play (when the core shorts are off).

Hot Runner.....are you male or female? I honestly have no idea. FTR, I have joined masters swim class. So far, I've been watched by 3 different coaches (masters swim coaches). The first corrected my body position (I was looking forward). I know my legs are "up", now....because I feel them make a splash every now and then when I get out of rhythm and flutter kick on the surface. Other 2 coaches say my pull is good and my legs are on the surface.

Now....when I breathe every 4 strokes, believe me...there's nothing left to exhale. Breathing every 2 strokes (1 cycle), .....I feel like I'm fully exhaling.....but maybe I'm not. Obviously, something's awry.



Edited by nc452010 2015-09-20 9:10 AM

Sounds like you need to learn how to swim - find someone who can teach you balance in the water to start and progress from there. You should be able to remain horizontal in the water at pretty much any speed if you have good balance.

If this isn't possible, take an old inner tube, cut it long enough to tie around your ankles and then swim 25's with about equal rest until you can keep your feet at the surface. Then go to 50's and so on.

Shane

I'm going to have someone film me, today. It'll be on my iphone, so if you'll have to message me your number if you would be willing to look at it. I'm all ears, and would appreciate corrective criticism. I won't be able to send the files until later this evening.

You can just email me the files at [email protected]; I'll have a look if you want.

Shane

Shane....I sent you 3 files. I didn't realize it until I saw it on film, but I know I'm crossing over with my right arm. If that's my limiter, I can fix that, for sure.

Ha--female! The dude in the picture is Chris McCormack ("Macca"--former Kona Ironman champion). Not sure why it matters....I don't think women on the average are a whole lot more buoyant than men. Little skinny people like myself also tend to sink without proper form....you don't have to be a big muscular dude. At any rate, if your legs are on the surface, then I'm guessing the big issue is more with your breathing. But maybe your form is deteriorating when you don't wear the core shorts? I think a lot of adult onset swimmers, especially triathletes (since they can justify that they race in wetsuits anyway) get dependent on them (or a wetsuit or pull buoy or fins) instead of developing proper body position without any aids. Shane's very knowledgable (have gotten plenty of great running ideas from him) so he should be able to give you some useful feedback.

I thought you were female. But, I never want to assume.

It may be just me and my limited exposure to swimming, but it just seems women have an easier time with buoyancy. If that's a false assumption....I'm simply ignorant as to the reality. My wife's an athlete (not a triathlete). She swims like tarzan but can float like a sponge (@ 5'8" and 130#'s).

As for the wetsuit.....I bought the core shorts this year. I also own a Desoto T1 that I've yet to swim in. I've never entered a wetsuit legal tri.

Edited by nc452010 2015-09-20 7:09 PM