General Discussion Triathlon Talk » Wade/bike/run? Rss Feed  
Moderators: k9car363, alicefoeller Reply
2015-11-16 12:07 PM

User image

Expert
2373
20001001001002525
Floriduh
Subject: Wade/bike/run?
I wrapped up this years racing calendar with my 3rd tri of the year yesterday. Like one I did this spring, the swim was in water that was, at max, waist deep. Swimming was an exercise in futility as most were wading, and I ended up doing a dolphin-dive for most of it. I understand that this may be of benefit to RDs as the likelihood of someone getting into a serious problem in water they can stand up in is pretty minimal, however, I will be careful to research races I will put on next year's calendar to make sure the water is sufficiently deep so that the swim portion of the race requires actual swimming.


2015-11-16 12:26 PM
in reply to: Oysterboy

User image

Master
2429
200010010010010025
Falls Church, Virginia
Subject: RE: Wade/bike/run?
Wow, that sounds pretty frustrating. Like you, I understand the safety side of it, and I'm sure a lot of nervous swimmers will appreciate it. But I've been working really hard on my swim. Like you, I want to use it in my next race!
2015-11-16 1:39 PM
in reply to: Oysterboy

User image


98
252525
Portland, Oregon
Subject: RE: Wade/bike/run?
Interesting...There's a local tri that I've been interested in doing, with a downriver swim that's supposed to be beginner-friendly in that you can stand up if you need a rest (It's along a shallow sandbar.). The official rules say you're not supposed to advance while standing, (i.e., no wading) but either way I'd be totally annoyed with someone standing up and blocking my path!
2015-11-16 2:36 PM
in reply to: martymo

User image

Expert
1111
1000100
Albuquerque, NM
Subject: RE: Wade/bike/run?
Originally posted by martymo
The official rules say you're not supposed to advance while standing, (i.e., no wading)


Actually, it's legal to use the bottom for forward progress during the swim. One could walk the whole way, legally, if possible.

Wading through waist deep water should be way slower than just swimming
I'd be fine with navigating through a bunch of waders - then not having to deal with them again during the swim.

2015-11-16 3:13 PM
in reply to: Oysterboy

User image

Coach
9167
5000200020001002525
Stairway to Seven
Subject: RE: Wade/bike/run?
Originally posted by Oysterboy

I wrapped up this years racing calendar with my 3rd tri of the year yesterday. Like one I did this spring, the swim was in water that was, at max, waist deep. Swimming was an exercise in futility as most were wading, and I ended up doing a dolphin-dive for most of it. I understand that this may be of benefit to RDs as the likelihood of someone getting into a serious problem in water they can stand up in is pretty minimal, however, I will be careful to research races I will put on next year's calendar to make sure the water is sufficiently deep so that the swim portion of the race requires actual swimming.


are you saying it was futile because people were in your way? Because swimmign waist deep water is not much of a problem and way faster than walking. dolphin diving could be faster depending on the depth.
2015-11-16 3:36 PM
in reply to: Oysterboy


72
2525
Subject: RE: Wade/bike/run?
Sounds like you did Rocketman


2015-11-16 5:20 PM
in reply to: AdventureBear

User image

Elite
7783
50002000500100100252525
PEI, Canada
Subject: RE: Wade/bike/run?

Originally posted by AdventureBear
Originally posted by Oysterboy I wrapped up this years racing calendar with my 3rd tri of the year yesterday. Like one I did this spring, the swim was in water that was, at max, waist deep. Swimming was an exercise in futility as most were wading, and I ended up doing a dolphin-dive for most of it. I understand that this may be of benefit to RDs as the likelihood of someone getting into a serious problem in water they can stand up in is pretty minimal, however, I will be careful to research races I will put on next year's calendar to make sure the water is sufficiently deep so that the swim portion of the race requires actual swimming.
are you saying it was futile because people were in your way? Because swimmign waist deep water is not much of a problem and way faster than walking. dolphin diving could be faster depending on the depth.

Agreed - it has to be more like knee deep before swimming becomes the slower choice.

2015-11-16 5:43 PM
in reply to: axteraa

User image

Master
8247
50002000100010010025
Eugene, Oregon
Bronze member
Subject: RE: Wade/bike/run?
This was the situation for the first and last 200-300m at IM Vietnam 70.3 last year, maybe due to very low tide. Lots of the less-confident swimmers walked out/in as far as they could. Swimming is much faster than walking at that depth, and I swam past a lot of legs! I actually found it easier to pass people walking than people swimming--I guess they take up less space when vertical. They're also not flailing around as much to the sides, which you tend to get with weaker swimmers in a race. (My pet peeve is passing BOP guys doing breaststroke--women almost always start last in SE Asia, so in reality most of my "swim" is usually spent negotiating my way around guys who are swimming much slower than I can--I'll take swimming through waders over that.)
2015-11-16 6:39 PM
in reply to: axteraa

Master
10208
50005000100100
Northern IL
Subject: RE: Wade/bike/run?

Originally posted by axteraa

Originally posted by AdventureBear
Originally posted by Oysterboy I wrapped up this years racing calendar with my 3rd tri of the year yesterday. Like one I did this spring, the swim was in water that was, at max, waist deep. Swimming was an exercise in futility as most were wading, and I ended up doing a dolphin-dive for most of it. I understand that this may be of benefit to RDs as the likelihood of someone getting into a serious problem in water they can stand up in is pretty minimal, however, I will be careful to research races I will put on next year's calendar to make sure the water is sufficiently deep so that the swim portion of the race requires actual swimming.
are you saying it was futile because people were in your way? Because swimmign waist deep water is not much of a problem and way faster than walking. dolphin diving could be faster depending on the depth.

Agreed - it has to be more like knee deep before swimming becomes the slower choice.

He said max depth, not average. Also have to consider the measuring stick. Arend & I would still be running & diving if it's AB. 

2015-11-16 9:01 PM
in reply to: RockTractor

User image

Extreme Veteran
1175
1000100252525
Langley, BC, 'Wet Coast' Canada
Subject: RE: Wade/bike/run?
Originally posted by RockTractor

Originally posted by martymo
The official rules say you're not supposed to advance while standing, (i.e., no wading)


Actually, it's legal to use the bottom for forward progress during the swim. One could walk the whole way, legally, if possible.

Wading through waist deep water should be way slower than just swimming
I'd be fine with navigating through a bunch of waders - then not having to deal with them again during the swim.




Just curious about this rule - I have looked through Triathlon Canada rules and it appears that it is prohibited to make forward progress using the ground or an inanimate object, unless otherwise stated by the Race Delegate... (page 14 of the rules I found)

4. SWIMMING CONDUCT:
4.1. General Rules:
a.) Athletes may use any stroke to propel themselves through the water. They may also
tread water or float. Unless otherwise specified by the Technical Delegate, an athlete
may not use either the bottom or inanimate objects to gain an advantage.


Any Canucks here with more knowledge on this?
Are the US rules different? International rules? Just curious


2015-11-16 9:28 PM
in reply to: triosaurus

User image

Member
285
100100252525
Cypress, Texas
Subject: RE: Wade/bike/run?
Originally posted by triosaurus

Originally posted by RockTractor

Originally posted by martymo
The official rules say you're not supposed to advance while standing, (i.e., no wading)


Actually, it's legal to use the bottom for forward progress during the swim. One could walk the whole way, legally, if possible.

Wading through waist deep water should be way slower than just swimming
I'd be fine with navigating through a bunch of waders - then not having to deal with them again during the swim.




Just curious about this rule - I have looked through Triathlon Canada rules and it appears that it is prohibited to make forward progress using the ground or an inanimate object, unless otherwise stated by the Race Delegate... (page 14 of the rules I found)

4. SWIMMING CONDUCT:
4.1. General Rules:
a.) Athletes may use any stroke to propel themselves through the water. They may also
tread water or float. Unless otherwise specified by the Technical Delegate, an athlete
may not use either the bottom or inanimate objects to gain an advantage.


Any Canucks here with more knowledge on this?
Are the US rules different? International rules? Just curious





USAT competitive rules are a little different:

4.2 Bottom Contact and Resting. A participant may stand on the bottom or rest by holding an inanimate object such as a buoy, boat, rope or floating object. Excluding the bottom, a participant shall not use any inanimate object to gain forward progress. A violation of this section shall result in a variable time penalty, unless the Head Referee in his/her sole discretion determines that (i) the violation was substantial and resulted in an unfair time advantage, or (ii) the violation constituted endangerment under Section 3.4(1).

So looks like you can use the bottom to propel forward, but not anything else.



2015-11-17 4:19 AM
in reply to: johnthecat

User image

Expert
2852
20005001001001002525
Pfafftown, NC
Subject: RE: Wade/bike/run?
There's a great story I read somewhere about the first few guys to do "the triathlon" in Hawaii (the original site.....not Kona). They wanted to bring some hotshot in from Europe (if I remember correctly). Problem was, he couldn't swim a lick, and walked the entire 2.4 mi. in shallow water.

I don't get too uptight when I hear people complaining about others wearing wetsuits, etc...

Heck, there's an IM 70.3 race in Mexico that you could walk the entire swim course, if you could make the cutoff. I can't recall the site, but there's plenty of Youtube videos to prove it.
2015-11-17 8:35 AM
in reply to: triosaurus

User image

Member
1748
100050010010025
Exton, PA
Subject: RE: Wade/bike/run?
Originally posted by triosaurus

Originally posted by RockTractor

Originally posted by martymo
The official rules say you're not supposed to advance while standing, (i.e., no wading)


Actually, it's legal to use the bottom for forward progress during the swim. One could walk the whole way, legally, if possible.

Wading through waist deep water should be way slower than just swimming
I'd be fine with navigating through a bunch of waders - then not having to deal with them again during the swim.




Just curious about this rule - I have looked through Triathlon Canada rules and it appears that it is prohibited to make forward progress using the ground or an inanimate object, unless otherwise stated by the Race Delegate... (page 14 of the rules I found)

4. SWIMMING CONDUCT:
4.1. General Rules:
a.) Athletes may use any stroke to propel themselves through the water. They may also
tread water or float. Unless otherwise specified by the Technical Delegate, an athlete
may not use either the bottom or inanimate objects to gain an advantage.


Any Canucks here with more knowledge on this?
Are the US rules different? International rules? Just curious





I guess beach starts in Canada is not allowed then? You can't do a beach start swim without using the bottom to gain advantage.
2015-11-17 8:42 AM
in reply to: 0

User image

Expert
1111
1000100
Albuquerque, NM
Subject: RE: Wade/bike/run?
There's a Tri here in NM that you can walk the whole way. My dentist told me he raced it when he was younger. His story goes that he was terrified the whole time during the swim due to the proximity of other swimmers and his general lack or preparedness. Only later, after the race, did he find out he could have stood up anytime he wanted... :-)

Edited by RockTractor 2015-11-17 8:43 AM
2015-11-17 8:44 AM
in reply to: mike761

User image

Expert
1111
1000100
Albuquerque, NM
Subject: RE: Wade/bike/run?
Originally posted by mike761

Originally posted by triosaurus

Originally posted by RockTractor

Originally posted by martymo
The official rules say you're not supposed to advance while standing, (i.e., no wading)


Actually, it's legal to use the bottom for forward progress during the swim. One could walk the whole way, legally, if possible.

Wading through waist deep water should be way slower than just swimming
I'd be fine with navigating through a bunch of waders - then not having to deal with them again during the swim.




Just curious about this rule - I have looked through Triathlon Canada rules and it appears that it is prohibited to make forward progress using the ground or an inanimate object, unless otherwise stated by the Race Delegate... (page 14 of the rules I found)

4. SWIMMING CONDUCT:
4.1. General Rules:
a.) Athletes may use any stroke to propel themselves through the water. They may also
tread water or float. Unless otherwise specified by the Technical Delegate, an athlete
may not use either the bottom or inanimate objects to gain an advantage.


Any Canucks here with more knowledge on this?
Are the US rules different? International rules? Just curious




I guess beach starts in Canada is not allowed then? You can't do a beach start swim without using the bottom to gain advantage.


You have to dive before your feet touch the water

... ouch!
2015-11-17 8:46 AM
in reply to: mike761

User image

Elite
7783
50002000500100100252525
PEI, Canada
Subject: RE: Wade/bike/run?

Originally posted by mike761
Originally posted by triosaurus
Originally posted by RockTractor
Originally posted by martymo The official rules say you're not supposed to advance while standing, (i.e., no wading)
Actually, it's legal to use the bottom for forward progress during the swim. One could walk the whole way, legally, if possible. Wading through waist deep water should be way slower than just swimming I'd be fine with navigating through a bunch of waders - then not having to deal with them again during the swim.
Just curious about this rule - I have looked through Triathlon Canada rules and it appears that it is prohibited to make forward progress using the ground or an inanimate object, unless otherwise stated by the Race Delegate... (page 14 of the rules I found) 4. SWIMMING CONDUCT: 4.1. General Rules: a.) Athletes may use any stroke to propel themselves through the water. They may also tread water or float. Unless otherwise specified by the Technical Delegate, an athlete may not use either the bottom or inanimate objects to gain an advantage. Any Canucks here with more knowledge on this? Are the US rules different? International rules? Just curious
I guess beach starts in Canada is not allowed then? You can't do a beach start swim without using the bottom to gain advantage.

Triathlon Canada follows the ITU rulebook.  The 2015 rules state (see bold):

4.SWIMMING CONDUCT:

4.1.GeneralRules:

a.)Athletes may use any stroke to propel themselves through the water.They may also tread water or float. Athletes are allowed to push off the ground at the beginning and the end of every swim lap;

b.)Athletes must follow the prescribed swim course;

c.)Athletes may stand on the bottom or rest by holding an inanimate object, such as a buoy or stationary boat;



2015-11-17 9:14 AM
in reply to: Gatornate

User image

Expert
2373
20001001001002525
Floriduh
Subject: RE: Wade/bike/run?
Originally posted by Gatornate

Sounds like you did Rocketman


Yep, boy that wind was killer
2015-11-17 12:56 PM
in reply to: RockTractor

User image


98
252525
Portland, Oregon
Subject: RE: Wade/bike/run?
Originally posted by RockTractor

Originally posted by martymo
The official rules say you're not supposed to advance while standing, (i.e., no wading)


Actually, it's legal to use the bottom for forward progress during the swim. One could walk the whole way, legally, if possible.

Wading through waist deep water should be way slower than just swimming
I'd be fine with navigating through a bunch of waders - then not having to deal with them again during the swim.




Sorry, I didn't mean in ALL triathlons...I just meant for this particular one, according to the race website's rules.
2015-11-17 3:48 PM
in reply to: martymo

User image

Master
4452
200020001001001001002525
Subject: RE: Wade/bike/run?

Originally posted by martymo
Originally posted by RockTractor
Originally posted by martymo The official rules say you're not supposed to advance while standing, (i.e., no wading)
Actually, it's legal to use the bottom for forward progress during the swim. One could walk the whole way, legally, if possible. Wading through waist deep water should be way slower than just swimming I'd be fine with navigating through a bunch of waders - then not having to deal with them again during the swim.
Sorry, I didn't mean in ALL triathlons...I just meant for this particular one, according to the race website's rules.

I had to stop and stand on the swim at IM Copenhagen this summer--not because I needed to rest but because my buddy and I were laughing so hard at all the people running in the water.  About 300m of the swim was about knee deep; totally swim-able but some felt they could go faster running I guess!  I looked it up after because I was curious about the rules, and there is nothing that says you can't do it.

2015-11-17 9:34 PM
in reply to: IronOx

User image

Veteran
1900
1000500100100100100
Southampton, Ontario
Subject: RE: Wade/bike/run?
we have races that feature swims close to and parallel to the shore - its the Kid of Steel series. I think its great for kids that might not have the swim skills but still want to try the sport.

As for adults doing a race like that?????
2015-11-18 6:58 AM
in reply to: DaveL

User image

Master
8247
50002000100010010025
Eugene, Oregon
Bronze member
Subject: RE: Wade/bike/run?
Reminds me of my last HIM--the swim was in a small lake, and they said, "If you're a weak swimmer, just swim from dock to dock." (They were about as close as driveways on a street.) You could have possibly done the whole swim within a few feet of shore, hanging onto a dock every 20 meters or less, though that would have involved considerable extra distance. I just went straight out to the buoy and back, which was the actual course, and set a PB. Mom (watching) said that almost everyone in the first (self-selected "fast" wave) made a beeline across the lake to the buoy; those in the second wave traced the shore/docks. It was a long, narrow lake but still, the shore-huggers must have done at least 100m-200m more).


2015-11-18 7:31 AM
in reply to: Hot Runner

User image


489
100100100100252525
Subject: RE: Wade/bike/run?

I cut my finger pretty badly on the river bed at Challenge Roth this year.  Very risky to walk barefoot on the bottom of a river (not so much the sea I guess) with all the debris that may be there.

2015-11-18 4:23 PM
in reply to: Dan-L

User image

Master
8247
50002000100010010025
Eugene, Oregon
Bronze member
Subject: RE: Wade/bike/run?
With sea you want to make sure there's not a reef down there. I don't know about Kona, but when I lived on Oahu I cut my feet several times walking on coral. Ditto for swimming over coral in shallow water. If you have long arms, could be painful.
New Thread
General Discussion Triathlon Talk » Wade/bike/run? Rss Feed  
RELATED POSTS

HELP swim /bike/ run swim/ bike/ run.Transition help

Started by deadman
Views: 1005 Posts: 1

2011-08-22 9:33 PM deadman

Bike/Run Run/Bike Fitness translation

Started by japewang
Views: 1330 Posts: 7

2011-08-06 5:06 PM runk8run

Sat-Sun: Bike-Run or Run-Bike

Started by morey000
Views: 1214 Posts: 13

2010-09-18 6:03 PM morey000

Run-Bike or Bike-Run ?

Started by MaverickNH
Views: 1572 Posts: 8

2010-02-21 8:48 AM AndrewMT

Run more = run faster, bike more = bike faster?

Started by trey800hj
Views: 2596 Posts: 10

2009-02-23 9:04 PM newbz
RELATED ARTICLES
date : August 6, 2009
author : ChiRunning
comments : 0
In this second part, Danny Dreyer, Founder and Head Coach of Chi Running, will discuss several ways to correct your posture for better running.
 
date : June 3, 2009
author : ChiRunning
comments : 1
Danny Dreyer, Founder and Head Coach of Chi Running, will discuss how to improve your transition from the bike to the run.
date : August 20, 2008
author : mrakes1
comments : 0
During this past weekend's Olympic distance triathlon, lack of fuel and dehydration hurt me during the run. I feel a little lost with knowing what, when and how much to consume.
 
date : August 13, 2008
author : eschmits
comments : 2
After I left the running store, I couldn't stop thinking about the sprint tri and how much of a challenge it would be for me. So instead of joining a gym, I started riding my bike and it felt great.
date : January 29, 2006
author : KevinKonczak
comments : 0
Discussions on bricks, bike steering when reaching for hydration, and flip-turns.
 
date : June 14, 2005
author : PirateGirl
comments : 1
The XTERRA off-road triathlons consist of a lake swim, a mountain bike trail ride, and a trail run. I decided to try the AZ Xtreme Desert XTERRA Tri as my 1st off-road triathlon, and my 3rd tri ever.
date : December 13, 2004
author : kanoelani
comments : 0
My first experience as a triathlete and my post-season plan.
 
date : September 2, 2004
author : Ron
comments : 0
A compilation from the old site.