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Dealing with negative thoughts
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 2016-05-31 8:02 AM |
New user  246   madison, Wisconsin |  Subject: Dealing with negative thoughtsI'm hoping someone else has had this issue: Training for my first 70.3 in mid July. I've been pretty apprehensive as running has never been my game. (foot issues had me out for 18 months entirely and in a boot for 8 weeks, etc) But I figure I'll aqua bike it and walk the 13.1 if necessary. I've hired a coach this year and we were out on a 40 mile ride the other day. I expressed to him that I felt it necessary to ramp my run distance up to ~15 miles to be confident with the run in this race. He advised me to forget about that and focus on bricks. Even if they are only 15-20 minute runs. On Sunday I rode 33 and "ran" 5k. I put the word run in quotes because I resembled a wounded turtle more than a runner. The pain didn't go away after a mile, or two, or even three. Every step hurt just about every part of my body. I was out of breath the whole time. Just SUCKED! Then I went out yesterday to spin my legs on the bike. 17 miles at a high cadence and I was cooked for the day. Took two naps. Didn't even have much interest in having a beer at our Memorial day picnic. (though I took one for the team and choked it down) I woke up this a.m. just really feeling down. Even had thoughts of selling my bib and hanging it up. I'm sure other folks have been in these emotional trenches. How did you climb out? I think I need a really successful workout, but another bad one would just drive me lower, I fear. |
| 2016-05-31 8:20 AM in reply to: pwoolson |
Champion 7136  Knoxville area | Subject: RE: Dealing with negative thoughts Time to take a day or so off, let yourself have a reset. Do something that doesn't have crap to do with SBR, either physically or mentally. Sometimes you need to push through tough times... sometimes you need to listen to the body/mind and take a break, the key is knowing which and when. |
| 2016-05-31 8:27 AM in reply to: pwoolson |
Member 1748  Exton, PA | Subject: RE: Dealing with negative thoughts I would agree there is no need to do 15 mile runs to participate in a HIM. Keep doing the bricks as suggested, usually mile 4 is where my run legs kick in and I don't like the grim reaper is right behind me. Those first couple of bricks just won't feel that good, but you'll shake it off soon. You may even want to do some shorter bricks during the week; 12 mile bike and 5K run. That way you know you're not toasted and it's just the odd feeling going from one to the other. Don't be afraid to walk during the run of a 70.3, most people do. I just plan on walking through all the break areas, it allows me to refuel easier and since I will walk some anyway, I might as well know where and how long its going to be. Mentally it helps. Good job choking down that beer! |
| 2016-05-31 9:51 AM in reply to: Leegoocrap |
New user 246 madison, Wisconsin | Subject: RE: Dealing with negative thoughts Originally posted by Leegoocrap Time to take a day or so off, let yourself have a reset. Do something that doesn't have crap to do with SBR, either physically or mentally. Sometimes you need to push through tough times... sometimes you need to listen to the body/mind and take a break, the key is knowing which and when. Thanks! I think that might be in order. However, I'm only 1-1/2 weeks off a rest week. Perhaps I hit it a little too hard when I came back. The mental "rest" would be well received. |
| 2016-05-31 9:54 AM in reply to: mike761 |
New user 246 madison, Wisconsin | Subject: RE: Dealing with negative thoughts Originally posted by mike761 I would agree there is no need to do 15 mile runs to participate in a HIM. Keep doing the bricks as suggested, usually mile 4 is where my run legs kick in and I don't like the grim reaper is right behind me. Those first couple of bricks just won't feel that good, but you'll shake it off soon. You may even want to do some shorter bricks during the week; 12 mile bike and 5K run. That way you know you're not toasted and it's just the odd feeling going from one to the other. Don't be afraid to walk during the run of a 70.3, most people do. I just plan on walking through all the break areas, it allows me to refuel easier and since I will walk some anyway, I might as well know where and how long its going to be. Mentally it helps. Good job choking down that beer! Thanks! I think I'll back them down a notch and go with more of a 20k/5k brick. I do run/walk a a rule. 5 min run/ 1 min walk. I've found that if I do a long steady run and my foot starts to ache, I change my gate and then everything starts to hurt. The one minute walk acts as a "reset" button. Not to mention the mental advantage of only having to run for 5 minutes at a time. |
| 2016-05-31 10:31 AM in reply to: pwoolson |
Extreme Veteran 660 | Subject: RE: Dealing with negative thoughts I have to disagree with you guys on a few of the points here I am a big on over training for the run. All my best HIM runs came when I was training for a marathon at the same time. I like to run a 15 mile run 3 weeks out. I also like to do most my run training at the end of the day when I start out tired because that's how you start a run Maybe its just me but if your not running 7 minute miles out of t2 bricks are nice but that big of a deal (But again I have a lot of races under my belt so I kind of know the difference between the suckyness of the brick and actually dying). I will work on bricks more for shorter race. 2 tips for you Over endurance the Bike (Try to get 80 mile bike in) Suck the energy off the people who are doing good and stay away from people who are falling apart. (you will see them) if they tell you they had a great bike leg and are walking stay far away. Finally in a HIM there will be at least 3 or more points where it will totally suck and you will want to quit. At that point think small like jest getting to the next block or the next buoy. A HIM is a hard event no matter what pace you take be proud you are doing it |
| 2016-05-31 6:24 PM in reply to: #5184597 |
| 74 | Subject: RE: Dealing with negative thoughts Buckhamilton, no. Wayyy no. This is the posters first 70.3. Over training for the run AND bike is a recipe for more of the same mental struggled that is being discussed here. Based on my own experience tackling my first 2 halfs in the last two years, listen to your body and take some rest, for body and mind. Many will agree that it takes 2 or 3 weeks of doing nothing to truly lose endurance fitness. You wont be taking any steps back if u take it easy for a bit. And the benefits of being refreshed will be great. |
| 2016-05-31 10:54 PM in reply to: PBT_2009 |
Extreme Veteran 660 | Subject: RE: Dealing with negative thoughts Yes take some time off but he is still has 7 weeks till his race. If you go into aHIM not having ridden 56 miles before the race your race day will be a total suck fest. You want to go in confident you can make the distances. Race day should be about mechanics of the race not pushing your endurance to a level. No science on my part just a bunch of HIm under the belt |
| 2016-06-01 8:11 AM in reply to: pwoolson |
Champion 7547 Albuquerque, New Mexico Bronze member | Subject: RE: Dealing with negative thoughts You've had a couple "bad" training episodes and are focused on the training as the source of your negative thoughts, but please cast a wider net. Has your diet changed? Has your hydration changed with the warming weather? Are you experiencing additional stress because of something at work, with the family, or ?? Somewhat subtle changes to these other areas may show up first in the quality of your training. |
| 2016-06-01 8:37 AM in reply to: BuckHamilton |
Member 1748 Exton, PA | Subject: RE: Dealing with negative thoughts Originally posted by BuckHamilton I have to disagree with you guys on a few of the points here I am a big on over training for the run. All my best HIM runs came when I was training for a marathon at the same time. I like to run a 15 mile run 3 weeks out. I also like to do most my run training at the end of the day when I start out tired because that's how you start a run Maybe its just me but if your not running 7 minute miles out of t2 bricks are nice but that big of a deal (But again I have a lot of races under my belt so I kind of know the difference between the suckyness of the brick and actually dying). I will work on bricks more for shorter race. 2 tips for you Over endurance the Bike (Try to get 80 mile bike in) Suck the energy off the people who are doing good and stay away from people who are falling apart. (you will see them) if they tell you they had a great bike leg and are walking stay far away. Finally in a HIM there will be at least 3 or more points where it will totally suck and you will want to quit. At that point think small like jest getting to the next block or the next buoy. A HIM is a hard event no matter what pace you take be proud you are doing it In order to finish the race you must first toe the line! Everybody is different and the OP has issues with running, and right now is feeling burnt out. For experienced people who are looking to compete in a HIM I would say yes take your long runs out to 15-16 miles, but for someone who plans to do a lot of walking just to finish the run because they have foot issues. It's not wise to push the long runs in this case, 9-10 miles are really fine. For the bike I think anyone doing a HIM should at a minimum get a couple of 60+ mile rides in. Right now the OP is dealing with the mental aspect of the training, just not wanting to do it anymore. This is actually common at about 3-4 weeks out of IM or HIM training, at 7weeks out it won't hurt to take 2 or 3 days off or easy to recharge his batteries. |
| 2016-06-01 9:54 PM in reply to: BuckHamilton |
Expert 2355 Madison, Wisconsin | Subject: RE: Dealing with negative thoughts Originally posted by BuckHamilton I have to disagree with you guys on a few of the points here I am a big on over training for the run. All my best HIM runs came when I was training for a marathon at the same time. I like to run a 15 mile run 3 weeks out. I also like to do most my run training at the end of the day when I start out tired because that's how you start a run Maybe its just me but if your not running 7 minute miles out of t2 bricks are nice but that big of a deal (But again I have a lot of races under my belt so I kind of know the difference between the suckyness of the brick and actually dying). I will work on bricks more for shorter race. 2 tips for you Over endurance the Bike (Try to get 80 mile bike in) Suck the energy off the people who are doing good and stay away from people who are falling apart. (you will see them) if they tell you they had a great bike leg and are walking stay far away. Finally in a HIM there will be at least 3 or more points where it will totally suck and you will want to quit. At that point think small like jest getting to the next block or the next buoy. A HIM is a hard event no matter what pace you take be proud you are doing it Remember he has had injuries previously. 15 miles might have worked for you, but would it for someone with an injury history? If you want to do over distance running, which, in your case I don't recommend I would suggest double run days. 8/6, 10/5, etc. Again I would recommend it. Most people would benefit more by running more frequently 6-8x/week, then running longer. I would agree on the bike comment though....to a degree. The more "fit" you are on the bike the closer you can run to your open run time. I term fitness based on how much energy you can expend on the bike and have done so in training. I.e. the measure would be kilojoules. |
| 2016-06-01 10:01 PM in reply to: pwoolson |
Expert 2355 Madison, Wisconsin | Subject: RE: Dealing with negative thoughts Originally posted by pwoolson I'm hoping someone else has had this issue: Training for my first 70.3 in mid July. I've been pretty apprehensive as running has never been my game. (foot issues had me out for 18 months entirely and in a boot for 8 weeks, etc) But I figure I'll aqua bike it and walk the 13.1 if necessary. I've hired a coach this year and we were out on a 40 mile ride the other day. I expressed to him that I felt it necessary to ramp my run distance up to ~15 miles to be confident with the run in this race. He advised me to forget about that and focus on bricks. Even if they are only 15-20 minute runs. On Sunday I rode 33 and "ran" 5k. I put the word run in quotes because I resembled a wounded turtle more than a runner. The pain didn't go away after a mile, or two, or even three. Every step hurt just about every part of my body. I was out of breath the whole time. Just SUCKED! Then I went out yesterday to spin my legs on the bike. 17 miles at a high cadence and I was cooked for the day. Took two naps. Didn't even have much interest in having a beer at our Memorial day picnic. (though I took one for the team and choked it down) I woke up this a.m. just really feeling down. Even had thoughts of selling my bib and hanging it up. I'm sure other folks have been in these emotional trenches. How did you climb out? I think I need a really successful workout, but another bad one would just drive me lower, I fear. Prepping for Racine or Door? This is part of the game, sometimes your high, sometimes your low. Just need to consistently ask what the risk and reward is. Especially for a 15 mile run with previous run injuries. Could you realistically and safely ramp this up, I would suggest no, see my post above for alternative solutions to "get the volume in." Triathlon is a sport of high volume, high repetition, sustainability is huge. Taking a couple days off or very light is not a big deal. Plans are not static they are meant to be changed and altered based on what life presents. BTW out of curiosity who is coaching you in Madison? I live on the edge of Madison/Verona/Fitchburg. |
| 2016-06-02 7:35 AM in reply to: pwoolson |
Member 228 Lenexa, KS | Subject: RE: Dealing with negative thoughts Originally posted by pwoolson I'm hoping someone else has had this issue: Training for my first 70.3 in mid July. I've been pretty apprehensive as running has never been my game. (foot issues had me out for 18 months entirely and in a boot for 8 weeks, etc) But I figure I'll aqua bike it and walk the 13.1 if necessary. I've hired a coach this year and we were out on a 40 mile ride the other day. I expressed to him that I felt it necessary to ramp my run distance up to ~15 miles to be confident with the run in this race. He advised me to forget about that and focus on bricks. Even if they are only 15-20 minute runs. On Sunday I rode 33 and "ran" 5k. I put the word run in quotes because I resembled a wounded turtle more than a runner. The pain didn't go away after a mile, or two, or even three. Every step hurt just about every part of my body. I was out of breath the whole time. Just SUCKED! Then I went out yesterday to spin my legs on the bike. 17 miles at a high cadence and I was cooked for the day. Took two naps. Didn't even have much interest in having a beer at our Memorial day picnic. (though I took one for the team and choked it down) I woke up this a.m. just really feeling down. Even had thoughts of selling my bib and hanging it up. I'm sure other folks have been in these emotional trenches. How did you climb out? I think I need a really successful workout, but another bad one would just drive me lower, I fear. Not to be a debbie downer, but there's basically too many factors for random posters on a forum to give you a good answer here. There's something comforting about looking to peers for answers, but I'll say what you might not want to hear: talk to your coach. They are going to be most familiar with how you respond to training, what you're eating, what plans are for future training, how your brain responds in certain situations as long as you've been sharing this kind of stuff with them all along. If you've got a good coach, oversharing is better than undersharing (but try to find the right balance). My coach will get info on anything from "I felt great/terrible for that workout" to "my date was a disaster last night." Life affects training and vice versa so talk to your coach to formulate your plan to bounce back and trust the process. |
| 2016-06-02 10:12 AM in reply to: PBT_2009 |
Master 3127 Sunny Southern Cal | Subject: RE: Dealing with negative thoughts My first HIM I had some injuries before and had very little running base. I did do some treadmill bricks with fairly short runs, 20-30 minutes. And lots of aquajogging. I was able to finish it. I'd just make that your focus, and it sounds like you already somewhat have a handle on a strategy with the walk-run approach. Stay positive, focus on getting to the starting line without more injury in training, and then the finish line. Do not be concerned about your race time. If you enjoy the distance, you can always sign up for another. You probably will !! For most of my running I try to stay on softer surfaces (I'm fortunate to live amongst a large network of equestrian trails that I can run on). It's taken me years to get to a consistent running base, with lots of setbacks along the way. Be patient, keep a long-term perspective. Listen to your body. Rest when needed. Abandon a bad run mid-way if your body isn't happy. Better that than cause problems and be sidelined. There's nothing wrong with never being an FOP performer. Do it if it's fun and challenging for you. Don't worry about anybody else's performance, or what anybody thinks of yours. There's nothing wrong with focusing your training on what your body will let you do. If it's a strong swim, then so be it. Use the first time at the distance as a learning experience and build slowly for the same distance the next season. |
| 2016-06-02 11:49 AM in reply to: SevenZulu |
Master 4118 Toronto Bronze member | Subject: RE: Dealing with negative thoughts Originally posted by SevenZulu My first HIM I had some injuries before and had very little running base. I did do some treadmill bricks with fairly short runs, 20-30 minutes. And lots of aquajogging. I was able to finish it. I'd just make that your focus, and it sounds like you already somewhat have a handle on a strategy with the walk-run approach. Stay positive, focus on getting to the starting line without more injury in training, and then the finish line. Do not be concerned about your race time. If you enjoy the distance, you can always sign up for another. You probably will !! For most of my running I try to stay on softer surfaces (I'm fortunate to live amongst a large network of equestrian trails that I can run on). It's taken me years to get to a consistent running base, with lots of setbacks along the way. Be patient, keep a long-term perspective. Listen to your body. Rest when needed. Abandon a bad run mid-way if your body isn't happy. Better that than cause problems and be sidelined. There's nothing wrong with never being an FOP performer. Do it if it's fun and challenging for you. Don't worry about anybody else's performance, or what anybody thinks of yours. There's nothing wrong with focusing your training on what your body will let you do. If it's a strong swim, then so be it. Use the first time at the distance as a learning experience and build slowly for the same distance the next season. Find your reason you want to do this. For you - competition is great and all but when you have some limiters you need to find something else to get you through. In my ramp up to a full IM i got pretty down about being very mediocre to slow in all the sports. I was swimming with a group where i was always the slowest and along with the fatigue I just felt really horrible about myself. My swim coach took me aside and told me to have my day whatever that looks like. To be in my own space. And that pep talk worked wonders. I had an awesome day. Keep taking care of yourself, listen to the coach and follow the plan. One bad day does not a bad race make. Getting ready for these things is really about making it through the training! |
| 2016-06-03 8:26 AM in reply to: PBT_2009 |
| 36 | Subject: RE: Dealing with negative thoughts This is a good thread with a lot of varied perspectives. HIM is a totally different animal than the shorter races IMHO. I am age-group competitive in the shorter races, and a decent enough runner at the 5K distance & at a stretch 10K. I am no 13.1 mile runner. A maximal effort over 6 hours requires a very different strategy, than going all out for a sprint tri. I think like you, OP I just don't like running because it hurts unless I go very slow and keep my HR under 150 --- or go really fast and get it over with for a shorter distance. I suffered from IT band injury early in 2015 and was able to complete a 70.3 at the end of last season. I walked all the aide stations because of the intense pain, but I finished. A 2:30 - 13.1 is not exactly what you'd call a great time, but it was the best I could do given my state of training, and I was a little disappointed because I crushed the swim & bike. For training up to the race - Due to leg pain I ran maybe 3X over 10miles in preparation with a lot of shorter runs. My lesson learned was if I want to be competitive in HIM I have to do a lot more distance running. If you just want to finish the race I would say your run/walk strategy Is the way to go to avoid max pain and possible further injury. I don't care what anyone says, hanging in there and just finishing a 70.3 is a huge accomplishment, even for someone whose general overall fitness is very good to begin with. If I wanted to be age-group COMPETITIVE in 70.3 I would change my whole training strategy and YES over train for the run. I have signed up for a 70.3 mid season, but I am more looking forward and training for the shorter distances. Good luck! |
| 2016-06-03 9:52 AM in reply to: pwoolson |
Pro 5892 , New Hampshire | Subject: RE: Dealing with negative thoughts It really sound like you're overtrained. Do you have a rest day in your training plan, and do you truly take a REST day (i.e. not light run, bike, strength training, etc. etc. etc. etc. etc.)? Talk to your coach express the exact same thing as you posted here. I bet he'll (to she) will recommend you move your recovery week up to allow you to get back into things. Also, if you have a bad day like this, take some time to reflect on all the good days you've had and don't worry about the bad one. It happens to ALL of us (and all pro's for that matter!). Reading this post just emphasis the need for recovery to avoid overtraining. |
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