General Discussion Triathlon Talk » IM Swim start format Rss Feed  
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2016-06-18 9:31 AM

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Subject: IM Swim start format

Have all the Ironman branded races gone to a self-seeded start on the swim?  I just got the athlete guide for Vineman and they don't say what the format will be.



2016-06-18 11:06 AM
in reply to: TTom

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Subject: RE: IM Swim start format

WTC seems to be experimenting with their starts.

Last year at IM Boulder they used a "rolling start" where you could seed yourself anywhere you wanted; we walked down a boat ramp into the water and started swimming.  It was a total disaster IMHO; the "lane" of swimmers was far too narrow and far too many people were allowed in at the same time in the confined space. Thus we had people swimming on top of each other even more than a regular in-water start.

IM 70.3 Hawaii last week had a ocean swim, and we did an in-water wave start by age-group.  Within the age-group, you could seed wherever you wanted.  This was much better.

2016-06-18 11:27 AM
in reply to: brucemorgan


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Subject: RE: IM Swim start format
Last year at IM 70.3 Chattanooga they had a rolling start. No seeding per say it was just get in line it was slightly crowded at the start because we had to go upstream for 300-400m before turning. Once you were turned going downstream you had a large section of the river to spread out in
2016-06-19 4:19 PM
in reply to: TTom

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Subject: RE: IM Swim start format
Swim waves are posted on the website
2016-06-20 8:50 PM
in reply to: TTom


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Subject: RE: IM Swim start format
Madison is an in water mass start. Super crazy but tons of fun!! I never got hit in the face so many times, but I'm sure I was doing it to others as well.

Racine 70.3 and Steelhead 70.3 are wave starts and you are assigned to a wave based on age and gender. Obviously you can line up anywhere you want within your wave.
2016-06-20 9:26 PM
in reply to: katgirl2013

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Subject: RE: IM Swim start format

The event guide just says "6:45 Age-Group start".  Found the answer in the FAQ section as follows:

The swim will be a rolling start.

Athletes will enter the water in a continuous stream through a controlled access point, similar to how running road races are started. An athlete’s times will start when they cross timing mats under the swim arch.

Athletes will be directed to self-seed on race morning based on their projected swim time. Volunteers and staff will be in the staging area with signs and will assist with this process. Self-seeding will not be mandatory but will be encouraged. All athletes will have access to a dedicated warm-up area in the water located adjacent to the swim start.

Athletes will begin entering the water at 6:50am. It is expected to take 10 minutes for all athletes to enter the water; we anticipate everyone will be in the water by 7am.


Originally from: http://www.ironman.com/triathlon/events/americas/ironman/vineman/at...



2016-06-21 9:41 AM
in reply to: TTom

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Subject: RE: IM Swim start format

Originally posted by TTom

The event guide just says "6:45 Age-Group start".  Found the answer in the FAQ section as follows:

The swim will be a rolling start.

Athletes will enter the water in a continuous stream through a controlled access point, similar to how running road races are started. An athlete’s times will start when they cross timing mats under the swim arch.

Athletes will be directed to self-seed on race morning based on their projected swim time. Volunteers and staff will be in the staging area with signs and will assist with this process. Self-seeding will not be mandatory but will be encouraged. All athletes will have access to a dedicated warm-up area in the water located adjacent to the swim start.

Athletes will begin entering the water at 6:50am. It is expected to take 10 minutes for all athletes to enter the water; we anticipate everyone will be in the water by 7am.


Originally from: http://www.ironman.com/triathlon/events/americas/ironman/vineman/at... exactly what we did in Boulder last year.  What a disaster that was.  As I said, the boat ramp was too narrow and self-seeding was crap.  We also went in a lot faster than 10 minutes.  Since the timing starts with the timing mats, next time for this kind of start I would see myself way, way in the back.

2016-06-21 9:58 AM
in reply to: TTom

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Subject: RE: IM Swim start format
I do not particularly like the rolling starts, so many people seem to push to get in front. I'm not going to push an shove on dry land to get in front, but will swim through or over if I have to. Self seating with thousands is tuff, when its AG/gender mass starts in the water its not a problem.
2016-06-21 9:03 PM
in reply to: mike761

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Subject: RE: IM Swim start format

Since I will have to deal with this, I'm interested in opinions on the best way to start the swim.  I'm not super speedy (last IM swim was 1:15), so not likely to be crowding the front.  In a Marathon this happens all the time and it pays to seed yourself at a bit faster pace as there are always a bunch of folks who have no business being where they are seeding themselves and you end up spending the first couple of miles just getting around the herd.  The swim venue here is very narrow, so if I'm too far back it'll be the same thing.  Thoughts?

 

2016-06-23 2:48 PM
in reply to: TTom


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Subject: RE: IM Swim start format
Originally posted by TTom

Since I will have to deal with this, I'm interested in opinions on the best way to start the swim.  I'm not super speedy (last IM swim was 1:15), so not likely to be crowding the front.  In a Marathon this happens all the time and it pays to seed yourself at a bit faster pace as there are always a bunch of folks who have no business being where they are seeding themselves and you end up spending the first couple of miles just getting around the herd.  The swim venue here is very narrow, so if I'm too far back it'll be the same thing.  Thoughts?

 




At a 1:15, your best bet would be to hang back and go later after all the overzealous overestimators crowd through. You will have cleaner water to swim and a steady stream of people to draft/overtake.

JMPO, but it would suck to ruin your day or get hurt in the scrum when you already know you won't be vying for a fast swim.
2016-06-23 3:59 PM
in reply to: 0

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Subject: RE: IM Swim start format

First of all, there is *never* a justification for swimming over someone.  Dangerous move.  I am a 28-30 minute HIM swimmer so while not "fast" faster than most.  I am capable of swimming around people ahead of me.  No one "has to" swim over anyone.....  /getting off the soapbox....

As to the question, I agree with dave.  If it's too narrow to start, you gain nothing except going anaerobic at the start fighting through the crowd.  There are enough people at IM that are faster than you, or think they are faster than you, that it will probably be very crowded there.  Unless you are vying for Kona nothing is gained by expending unnecessary energy where it isn't needed.



Edited by ChrisM 2016-06-23 3:59 PM


2016-06-23 11:24 PM
in reply to: ChrisM

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Subject: RE: IM Swim start format

Victoria 70.3 a few weeks ago was rolling self seeded.  As someone mentioned, it is a disaster.  People are either ignorant, or way overestimate their ability.  I tried to move forward to get to my 'time slot' and it was way too crowded, we were packed in like sardines.  Faster swimmers behind slower swimmers with no way around is frustrating for everyone.  WTC needs to find another way, or have marshals and wider line up area.

2016-06-24 8:40 AM
in reply to: IronOx

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Subject: RE: IM Swim start format
Agree--rolling start sounds great in theory but it reality is a mess. We had this at Vietnam 70.3 and I was happy because I though it would be better than last year--when ALL the women (except pros) started after ALL the men, and I spent my entire swim going around/through BOP guys, many of them doing breaststroke. My best HIM swim is about 32;30 accordingly, I seeded myself about halfway through the 30-35 corral. Result--I was passing guys (who had clearly started in the previous corral for "under 30 minutes) within 200 meters of the start, some of them doing breaststroke. And I tend to start kind of slowly, relative to others who are my speed. It was slightly less messy than last year, but only because I was starting further up in the field and the ocean conditions were so rough that people spread out quickly. I continued to pass people for the entire swim, so have to wonder about people's ability to self-seed. Luckily there was enough room to maneuver, which there might not be with lakes, boat launches, and the like.
2016-07-04 9:18 PM
in reply to: Hot Runner

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Subject: RE: IM Swim start format

Again, thanks for the input everyone.  However, the race just corrected "Rolling Start" to "Time Trial Start" on the race Facebook page.  No details on exactly what they mean (1 person/sec, 10 people every 5 sec, whatever - and the FAQ still says rolling), but in looking on line it seems like this is a much more gentle start method than the rolling and lends itself to seeding yourself to your true ability.  Or am I missing something?

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