General Discussion Triathlon Talk » Once your HR spikes at high heat....are you doomed? Rss Feed  
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2016-09-26 3:42 PM

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Subject: Once your HR spikes at high heat....are you doomed?
I flatted at mile 2.5 of the bike course, yesterday. My ineptness at changing a flat.....(new disc, new tire, first time using a CO2......blah, blah, blah)...coupled with the bugs eating me alive.....and my HR was 171 when I got back on course.

It was 92 / "feels-like" 95. I could never get it below 160 for very long.

It made for a BRUTAL "run". So, my question is.......what can a person do (other than train in the heat, more)? I live in NC and train in the heat (we don't have a choice!).

I could lose a few pounds.....which I will (6'1/190). But, I was at a loss, out there.


2016-09-26 5:55 PM
in reply to: nc452010

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Subject: RE: Once your HR spikes at high heat....are you doomed?
What was your RPE on the run?
2016-09-26 6:05 PM
in reply to: kloofyroland

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Subject: RE: Once your HR spikes at high heat....are you doomed?
First 4 or so miles, I was OK. I was consciously dialing it back, hoping to negative split the second half. Around mile 6, I knew it wasn't gonna happen. RPE was probably a 7. The cramps that started a little after mile 7 almost made me abandon. I shuffled in. I cramped all the way to the end, off and on.....even cramping in the finishing chute.
2016-09-26 6:05 PM
in reply to: #5199947

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Subject: RE: Once your HR spikes at high heat....are you doomed?
Don't know the exact conditions but seems similar to my White Lake debacle a few years ago. I was on the bike pretty hard, really too hard for weather conditions, and just tanked the run afterwards. Heart rate thru the roof, I walked most of the half and just looked back at my data and my average heart rate was 153. That was a 2 hr 45 min half with a 2 hr 50 min bike split.

I initially thought my issue was nutrition but now convinced it was part hydration and a whole lot of going too hard on the bike. Maybe after the mechanical issue you suffered you inadvertently were pushing too hard on the bike trying to recover time? Sounds like it was a brutal day...
2016-09-26 6:07 PM
in reply to: nc452010


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Subject: RE: Once your HR spikes at high heat....are you doomed?

Not much you can do in high heat on race day other than try to cool aggressively at aid stations with ice/water if available, but even that has limited effect. 

 

Best bet is to accept the heat, and slow your pace down enough so you're not deathmarching the end - you'll go faster overall with a steadier pace. 

 

90+F makes for a really slow run for all except the well heat-acclimated. 

2016-09-26 8:28 PM
in reply to: #5199966

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Subject: RE: Once your HR spikes at high heat....are you doomed?
Same thing happened to me. I was about 6 miles into a 15 mile run at the end of a long day. Probably hour 9 of 11 to give you an idea. My support team was supposed to meet me at mile 4 and didn't make it until mile 6. Well past my ideal time. I was in the 4pm NC August sauna. My HR was climbing and climbing but my effort was nearly the same. I knew I was getting behind and had to shut it down. So I walked until they found me probably 10min later. When I hit the turn around i stopped and took a 10 min break and ate some snickers. Once I got back to running my rpe and HR were more in line. Then it started to rain and it cooled it off quite a bit. I was able to finish strongish for the run fitness I brought.

All that said once your HR gets up there it takes a while to get it back down. Especially in the heat. You could have dialed it way back like it did.

That must be a hard tire to change to get you up to 171!


2016-09-26 9:13 PM
in reply to: Nick B

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Subject: RE: Once your HR spikes at high heat....are you doomed?
My HR's always a little high, right out of the water. The flat came at mile 2.5, in a part on the course where you can really make time (like 24 mph). Between the bugs......seeing all the riders zooming by......and my ineptness at changing the flat, quickly......AND the close proximity to the swim finish......yeah. It was something else.
2016-09-26 10:30 PM
in reply to: yazmaster

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Subject: RE: Once your HR spikes at high heat....are you doomed?
Originally posted by yazmaster

Not much you can do in high heat on race day other than try to cool aggressively at aid stations with ice/water if available, but even that has limited effect. 

 

Best bet is to accept the heat, and slow your pace down enough so you're not deathmarching the end - you'll go faster overall with a steadier pace. 

 

90+F makes for a really slow run for all except the well heat-acclimated. 




Yup, this^. What can also help is a glove you can soak in cold water or stuff ice in to help regulate your core temp a bit so your HR doesn't go crazy high.
2016-09-27 2:09 AM
in reply to: Nick B

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Subject: RE: Once your HR spikes at high heat....are you doomed?
I wouldn't even be too worried about training n the heat much as opposed to just *being* in the heat.

Heat exposure in of itself is going to help us to get better at cooling ourselves ( sweat etc. ) but doing a lot of training in heat is going to result in poorer fitness than training in better conditions, so you're better off only training a small amount in heat, but getting other heat exposure in general.

Just being outside when it's hot, sauna, blasting heat in the car etc. helped me prep for a HOT HOT ultra this summer.

Heat hit 97 f on course, there were record dnf rates, and I generally don't deal well with the heat.

My key was a combination of heat acclimation, and constantly dousing myself in water with a dedicated bottle, getting ice from aid stations ( couple buffs were great for this ) and watching the heart rate knowing when to back off.

Otherwise, not a whole lot more you can do. The heavier we are, generally the harder time we have cooling ourselves.
2016-09-27 7:27 AM
in reply to: nc452010

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Subject: RE: Once your HR spikes at high heat....are you doomed?
I would worry less about the high HR than the cramps. Stress alone is enough to make your HR skyrocket! I remember once finding that mine was over 160--before the race even started! 160 on a hot run in those conditions actually sounds quite normal for me. I would guess I was in the 170's by the end of Vietnam 70.3 this year. If you have the fitness to hold it, feel okay, and are acclimated to heat, you can simply "accept" a higher HR than in more temperate conditions, and also accept that this is going to come at speeds that are slower than you could do at the same HR in cooler conditions. It's just the nature of the beast. But if you're NOT feeling good (i.e. cramping), I would look not only at your efforts to cool yourself but also your pacing on the biker (as others have said, maybe consciously or unconsciously pushing too hard to try to make up time), hydration, and balance of fluids and electrolytes. For me, a common mistake is drinking a lot to try to cool off (if cold water is available) and then not taking in enough sodium and other electrolytes to balance things out, thus flirting with hyponatremia. Cramps, nausea, feeling light-headed, tingling in your hands can be signs of this; taking in more electrolyte drink or possibly salt tabs can help.

I live in this stuff pretty much year-round and race in it a lot; it's been a learning process. Basically on a HIM run in those conditions I am doing everything possible to cool myself. If the aid stations have ice then I am shoving it into a lot of locations in my tri suit as well as my mouth, pouring cold water over my head, drinking, squeezing the sponges until there is nothing left.Yes, I know that technically may not lower your core temp but hey, it keeps me going. Someone I did part of the run with said I practically do a water dance at each aid station! I don't walk the stations, but I do slow down to get what I need and get the volunteers (if possible) to throw water on me. I carry two bottles of my own electrolyte drink so I can just grab water, ice, and sponges at the stations. Plus dial back the effort level a bit--you simply can't take quite the same risks as in cool conditions due to the distinct possibility of DNF or worse due to heat illness.
2016-09-27 11:49 AM
in reply to: nc452010

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Subject: RE: Once your HR spikes at high heat....are you doomed?
Just curious on your flat as I think I had read prior that you had switched tubes. What is a pinch issue or did you run over something? Have thought about changing over just trying to get another opinion. Sorry to hear about the flat for sure....


2016-09-27 12:01 PM
in reply to: dfquigley

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Subject: RE: Once your HR spikes at high heat....are you doomed?

Originally posted by dfquigley I wouldn't even be too worried about training n the heat much as opposed to just *being* in the heat. Heat exposure in of itself is going to help us to get better at cooling ourselves ( sweat etc. ) but doing a lot of training in heat is going to result in poorer fitness than training in better conditions, so you're better off only training a small amount in heat, but getting other heat exposure in general. Just being outside when it's hot, sauna, blasting heat in the car etc. helped me prep for a HOT HOT ultra this summer. Heat hit 97 f on course, there were record dnf rates, and I generally don't deal well with the heat. My key was a combination of heat acclimation, and constantly dousing myself in water with a dedicated bottle, getting ice from aid stations ( couple buffs were great for this ) and watching the heart rate knowing when to back off. Otherwise, not a whole lot more you can do. The heavier we are, generally the harder time we have cooling ourselves.

 

I am doing Coz at the end of the year, same size as OP at 6'2" 190#, live in so cal so heat training is not all that easy to get to (although lately.....).   I did a little research and plan on this  ^^^  More in general heat exposure -- sauna, etc -- rather than training in heat, or if training in heat just being in it and going slowly.   Coupled with race day cooling techniques - mostly de soto cool gear -- hopefully that will be enough

I also have a very hard time getting HR down on run once it's up, especially when hot

2016-09-27 5:41 PM
in reply to: dandr614

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Subject: RE: Once your HR spikes at high heat....are you doomed?
Originally posted by dandr614

Just curious on your flat as I think I had read prior that you had switched tubes. What is a pinch issue or did you run over something? Have thought about changing over just trying to get another opinion. Sorry to hear about the flat for sure....


I have no idea why it flatted. I don't recall running over anything....and it was pumped up to 100 #'s. I just felt it go flat.
2016-09-27 7:17 PM
in reply to: nc452010

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Subject: RE: Once your HR spikes at high heat....are you doomed?

Originally posted by nc452010
Originally posted by dandr614 Just curious on your flat as I think I had read prior that you had switched tubes. What is a pinch issue or did you run over something? Have thought about changing over just trying to get another opinion. Sorry to hear about the flat for sure....
I have no idea why it flatted. I don't recall running over anything....and it was pumped up to 100 #'s. I just felt it go flat.
Next time you'll use some sealant!

2016-09-27 7:35 PM
in reply to: Donto

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Subject: RE: Once your HR spikes at high heat....are you doomed?
Originally posted by Donto

Originally posted by nc452010
Originally posted by dandr614 Just curious on your flat as I think I had read prior that you had switched tubes. What is a pinch issue or did you run over something? Have thought about changing over just trying to get another opinion. Sorry to hear about the flat for sure....
I have no idea why it flatted. I don't recall running over anything....and it was pumped up to 100 #'s. I just felt it go flat.
Next time you'll use some sealant!




Got a link?
2016-09-28 12:04 PM
in reply to: nc452010

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Subject: RE: Once your HR spikes at high heat....are you doomed?

Originally posted by nc452010
Originally posted by Donto

Originally posted by nc452010
Originally posted by dandr614 Just curious on your flat as I think I had read prior that you had switched tubes. What is a pinch issue or did you run over something? Have thought about changing over just trying to get another opinion. Sorry to hear about the flat for sure....
I have no idea why it flatted. I don't recall running over anything....and it was pumped up to 100 #'s. I just felt it go flat.
Next time you'll use some sealant!

Got a link?

Enjoy!

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