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2007-04-09 10:45 AM

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Subject: swim volume increase
Last month I swam 10,000 yards and I was very comfortable with it.  I usually just swam 1,000 yards a day, 3 days a week, with an occasional longer swim on the weekend.  Since the weather is getting warmer (soon), I'm thinking about just swimming every weekday morning (1,000-1,200 yards/day) since I'll be outside after work for running/cyling.  Would the increase from 10,000 yards in one month to 20,000 yards the next be a bad idea?  Some of my swims will be speed drills,  the rest will be endurance focused.  I have felt great in the water and even swam 1,800 on Saturday w/o any problems.  My max HR has come down in the pool, which is awesome, also.  Any thoughts or suggestions?  Should I obey the 10% rule as in running/cycling, or can I get away with a drastic increase like this?

Edited by jcdenton2000 2007-04-09 10:46 AM


2007-04-09 10:55 AM
in reply to: #753726

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over a barrier
Subject: RE: swim volume increase
If you start to feel shoulder pain (joint) 24-48hrs after the swims you might want to tone it down...

You should be fine.
2007-04-09 12:05 PM
in reply to: #753726

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Supersonicus Idioticus
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Subject: RE: swim volume increase
Try it for a week, doing more easy swims. If you feel tired throughout the day, tone it down.

And it might be double your swim mileage, but if your bike/run mileage stays the same, it's only like increasing your mileage by 20%
2007-04-09 12:08 PM
in reply to: #753726

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Subject: RE: swim volume increase

I recommend a gradual increase.  I suffered through some bad tendonitis last year as a result of increasing my volume too much too soon.  Now I was only swimming twice a week and only about 1200 yds a swim to start and increased it to 2000 yds.  So maybe your already high level will not cause the same problems, but....

Would it be that hard to only increase it about 20-25% a week?  You'll be where you want to be real quick and not have to worry about injury.  The tendonitis required PT, a steroid shot and about a month out of the water.  It wasn't worth it to me.

2007-04-09 12:23 PM
in reply to: #753726

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Not a Coach
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Subject: RE: swim volume increase
FWIW, I have had no problems breaking the 10% rule in swimming.  (I've tried breaking it in all 3 sports and swimming is definately the least risky in my experience. )  As noted above, just try to be aware if there is any unusual soreness.  But if you spend a lot of that time focusing on drill work, for example, it should be nothing but good for you.
2007-04-09 9:50 PM
in reply to: #753726

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Subject: RE: swim volume increase
jcdenton2000 - 2007-04-09 9:45 AM

Last month I swam 10,000 yards and I was very comfortable with it. I usually just swam 1,000 yards a day, 3 days a week, with an occasional longer swim on the weekend. Since the weather is getting warmer (soon), I'm thinking about just swimming every weekday morning (1,000-1,200 yards/day) since I'll be outside after work for running/cyling. Would the increase from 10,000 yards in one month to 20,000 yards the next be a bad idea? Some of my swims will be speed drills, the rest will be endurance focused. I have felt great in the water and even swam 1,800 on Saturday w/o any problems. My max HR has come down in the pool, which is awesome, also. Any thoughts or suggestions? Should I obey the 10% rule as in running/cycling, or can I get away with a drastic increase like this?


Why don't you start by just adding one swim per week for 1-2 weeks, rather than adding 3 swims a week?


2007-04-09 10:10 PM
in reply to: #753726

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Subject: RE: swim volume increase
If you have good rotation when you're swimming (freestyle stroke) then you shouldn't have too many problems with your rotator cuff... but lay off if it starts to hurt at all. You could probably pick up the yardage to about 2500 to 3000 yards a night. That would include a long warmup (anywhere between 500-1000) yards and a long cooldown (in the ballpark of 200-500 yards). Then of course you could throw in your sprint work and when you're feeling stronger, you could swim some stuff like a T30! (see how far you can go in 30 minutes). Another good workout is the broken mile. If you're in a pool start out with 11 lengths, and subtract one length each time. For lengths 11-9 rest 15-20 seconds... lengths 8-5 rest about 10-15 seconds; and on lengths 4-1 rest 5 seconds between and sprint hard!
I think that the T30 and the broken mile or the two best workouts for builing endurance... but the broken mile is better for getting better at sprinting at the end of your swimming portion. You could also try swimming sets of 200s (about 5-10 200s) with a pull bouy and alternate using paddles and not using paddles every other 200.
Those are my suggestions! Sorry if you didn't want a workout guide though.

If you do want any other workouts ask me and I can give you some good ones.
2007-04-10 10:59 AM
in reply to: #753726

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Subject: RE: swim volume increase
If you want to improve you should swim 3 times a week and at least 8000-10000 yards total.That will bring your total to 35000-40000 yards a month which IMHO is the bare minimum for any triathlete who wants to get faster.
Do it gradually over the course of couple months and you won't have any problems.
2007-04-10 11:40 AM
in reply to: #753726

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Lethbridge, Alberta
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Subject: RE: swim volume increase
If swimming 1000 to 1200 yds every weekday morning is what fits your schedule, then try it. From my own recent experience I prefer building volume with more frequency first, as you would be doing. Go easy for the first while, perhaps even cutting back the daily distances until you're comfortable with the extra sessions. As mentioned above, watch out for overuse pains and be careful that you are not getting too over-tired from the extra work load. Good luck.

Edited by Micawber 2007-04-10 12:06 PM
2007-04-10 11:41 AM
in reply to: #754762

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Subject: RE: swim volume increase
sharp4850 - 2007-04-09 11:10 PM

If you have good rotation when you're swimming (freestyle stroke) then you shouldn't have too many problems with your rotator cuff... but lay off if it starts to hurt at all. You could probably pick up the yardage to about 2500 to 3000 yards a night. That would include a long warmup (anywhere between 500-1000) yards and a long cooldown (in the ballpark of 200-500 yards). Then of course you could throw in your sprint work and when you're feeling stronger, you could swim some stuff like a T30! (see how far you can go in 30 minutes). Another good workout is the broken mile. If you're in a pool start out with 11 lengths, and subtract one length each time. For lengths 11-9 rest 15-20 seconds... lengths 8-5 rest about 10-15 seconds; and on lengths 4-1 rest 5 seconds between and sprint hard!
I think that the T30 and the broken mile or the two best workouts for builing endurance... but the broken mile is better for getting better at sprinting at the end of your swimming portion. You could also try swimming sets of 200s (about 5-10 200s) with a pull bouy and alternate using paddles and not using paddles every other 200.
Those are my suggestions! Sorry if you didn't want a workout guide though.

If you do want any other workouts ask me and I can give you some good ones.


Very interesting. I am going to try the broken mile workout tomorrow morning! I'm wondering what I'll have left at the end.
2007-04-10 11:47 AM
in reply to: #753726

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Mountain View, CA
Subject: RE: swim volume increase
I think it depends on your shoulders more than anything. In my case, I start to have rotator cuff problems if I ramp up the volume too quickly (say, going from ~2000 to 3000-3500 per workout in the course of a week or two), but your shoulders might be hardier than mine. I would ease into it for the first two or three weeks, perhaps going with your plan of adding workouts but not distance per workout, and see how you feel. If you feel good, either stay with it or increase your volume further; if you start to hurt, though, DO NOT push it--you'll only regret it later on if you end up unable to swim for a month or longer!


2007-04-10 12:37 PM
in reply to: #753726

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Kansas City, MO
Subject: RE: swim volume increase

Thank you all for your responses.  My schedule works best if I swim in the morning and I typically have about 30 minutes to do so.

Another question: does the "long slow distance" theory apply to swimming?  Meaning, if all the swimming I do is in the range of 1000-1500 yards, 5 days a week, will I see an improvement in my times, or do I need to also include longer sets of 2000+?

2007-04-10 1:05 PM
in reply to: #755564

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Subject: RE: swim volume increase
jcdenton2000 - 2007-04-10 12:37 PM

Thank you all for your responses.  My schedule works best if I swim in the morning and I typically have about 30 minutes to do so.

Another question: does the "long slow distance" theory apply to swimming?  Meaning, if all the swimming I do is in the range of 1000-1500 yards, 5 days a week, will I see an improvement in my times, or do I need to also include longer sets of 2000+?

If you're doing any kind of warm-up (which you generally should), 1000-1500y total doesn't leave you with a lot of "quality" swim time.  All that frequency will help some, but it would be similar to only doing 3 mile runs or 10 mile rides.

2007-04-10 1:11 PM
in reply to: #753726

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Expert
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Kansas City, MO
Subject: RE: swim volume increase
I usually don't count my warm-ups as part of my logged distances.  I typically do 100 yards as a warm up and 100 yards as a cool down, with 1000-1500 yards of actual 'work' in between.
2007-04-10 2:10 PM
in reply to: #755667

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Media, PA
Subject: RE: swim volume increase
100y is getting wet.  My warm-ups are generally in the 500-800y area.  Do the best with what you have available to you.
2007-04-10 4:25 PM
in reply to: #753726

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Subject: RE: swim volume increase
warm ups are agreat time to focus on drill work, untimed so you don't rush things.

Main set can be a little speed work, endurance work, ladders, mix it up.

cool down can be a time to refocus on form while tired...this is a great time to see if you're really putting it all together.


2007-04-10 6:02 PM
in reply to: #753726

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Extreme Veteran
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Fridley, MN, USA
Subject: RE: swim volume increase
Yea, you should really do alot more for your warmup. I would suggest doing something like a 500 swim, 400 pull, 300 kick, 200 drill, 100 activate for a warmup. That right there will give you the chance to get really loose, and as AdventureBear said, work on your technique. I'm not sure about the long distance theory in swimming but I do know this: I got up to doing 10,000 yards a night during the swim season (about 35,000 yards a week) to train for a 23 second race! So overtraining definately will help.
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