Tri Bike -Motherlode or Mid-Level

Well, if finances are an issue for buying the P3 or other hot bike, don't buy it.

You DEFINITELY don't need it.

A standard roadbike with aerobars will deliver 99% of the same results.

I'm all for new bikes if it's an affordable splurge, but it always amazes me that folks are willing to finance a $3k bike when their current roadie will deliver the same exact results. Spending your budgeted money on almost ANYTHING else would be a better investment in terms of performance, be it coaching, aero helmet, new running shoes, wetsuit, pool fees, etc.

IMO, tribikes are the most oversold and overhyped object to triathletes. I bought a P2C Cervelo DA last year because everyone told me I'd be good enough for it, and though it really is a fun bike to ride and I got a lot of compliments on it, I just bought a $695 Giant Defy3 with Shimano 2200 components as a road bike and I'm every bit as fast on it as I am on the Cervelo without aerobars. While I don't regret the Cervelo purchase, if I had to do it again, I definitely would not have bought such a pricey bike, since I'm mainly interested in performance, and not bling, and I could have saved $1800-$2000 had I just bought the intro-level road bike + aerobars.

Again, there is NOTHING subpar or underperforming about the current generation of Shimano 2200 or Sora components. They're not as uber-crips as the 105 or ultegra, but my 2200 spec shifts perfectly and flawlessly, even under reasonable pressure. And I've been riding Dura-Ace for the entire past year on my TT bike, and I'm perfectly, 100% ok with 2200.

No durability issues either - on roadbikeforums, folks have been using 2200 or Sora for 5+ years with almost no adjustments once properly set up. 

First, sorry about the weird issue with my formatting -no idea what I did!

Second, thank you soooo much for this advice.  Greatly appreciated!

Finances are definitely an issue so it's awesome to hear that the motherlode is not the end all be all ...

Again, thanks very much for your insights!

JRo

Huge qualifier there. Of course you would be just as fast on a road bike as you would be on a tri bike when riding in an upright position. The purpose of a tri bike is to allow you to better maximize aerodynamics, power, handling and comfort, not to make you faster in an upright position.

I agree with a lot of the rest of your post, and would maintain that a well-fit entry level bike (say, the P1) would not be noticeably slower than a well-fit P3. After you get past the basics, you're just throwing increasingly laarger amounts of money chasing increasingly smaller incremental benefits.

Agreed - aerobars and the aero position is better on a TT bike. But I'll take it to an even more extreme, and say for certain that you DON"T need a fancy road bike like a Cervelo P1 or S1 (their lowest model, which is still $2000+). An "intro-level" racing bike like my $695 Defy3 is more than good enough to win - Chrissie Wellington was dominating the field early in her career on a roadbike WITHOUT AEROBARS, and then continued dominating for a year or so with clip-ons and a budget roadie that she bought used from someone.

Thank you for saving me about 1500-2000 dollars.
I know I am going to upgrade next year, but I think I will just go with a good Roadie

Yeah, if money is an issue, go for something cheaper that fits. A P1 is a fine choice and will get you into a good tri fit.

There's zero point going overbudget. For any of us mere mortals (by definition anyone posting on this site) the difference between a P1/P2/P3/P4 will never make a difference, and it all comes down to bling and pride of ownership. Now granted I love me some bling, but only as my budget allows. Going broke buying the fancy stuff with dreams of it making you a ton faster is insane.

A P1 and a good training plan will work wonders, and save you several grand.

I really appreciate all the responses.  Considering the price for the Cervelo, I'm relieved to hear that many think it's not worth it.

I will say though that sitting on it was night and day from my road bike with aeros.  I'm not quite 5'1" and, when we put aeros on my roadie, there really was only so much the shop could do.  Consequently, I think I sit pretty upright even when on the bars so I'm envisioning myself definitely being faster on a tri bike simply for that reason.  How much?  I have no idea!  Maybe I'm fooling myself! LOL

I also sat on the Guru but, since there would have to be a lot adjusting to fit me properly, it's just really hard to know what is the right route to go, other than $$$$ factor ...

I know that, to become stronger/faster, it's all about me -not the bike - so I'm not expecting miracles from whatever machine I buy!  I was just looking for some guidance on the question of whether--in a few years time (assuming I progress! I would be kicking myself for not finding a way to get the Cervelo now (since I wouldn't be paying list price but it has only been ridden for 5 mos. so it's quite new).

Thanks everyone!  This site is super helpful!

Best,

JRo

> I will say though that sitting on it was night and day from my road bike with aeros.  I'm not quite 5'1"

I think everyone here is absolutely right.  You do _not_ need a $3000 tri bike.  You don't need a $2000 bike.  A entry level time trial bike will be enough.

However, being as small as you are, finding a bike with the right fit might be something of a problem.

I'm 5'8", and my 53 frame is too big for me.  I'm going to move down to a 51.  

For you, even most 48 or XS fames might be too big.  Here's a chart showing appropriate sizing compliments of Timo79:

Your height in cm:              Racebike:            Tri-bike:

155 - 165                            48 - 51                 46 - 48
165 - 170                            51 - 53                 48 - 50
170 - 175                            53 - 55                 50 - 52
175 - 180                            55 - 57                 52 - 55
180 - 185                            57 - 60                 55 - 56
185 - 190                            60 - 62                 57 - 60
190 - 195                            62 - 64                 60 - 62
195 - 200                            64 - special size   62 - special size

So, I'd a bit of that money that you're saying, and spend it on a good fitting.  Ask around.  Find a shop/fitter who has _excellent_ reviews, and have them help you find the right bike, and make sure that you're fit to it properly.

Edited by mrcurtain 2009-09-06 10:08 PM

A chart like this means just about nothing... I know that you're only trying to be helpful, but unless you understand the geometry of each bike, you have nothing to compare to... and what does a "52-55" mean? Top tube length? Measured how? Or seat tube? measured center-center or center-top? Unfortunately, buying a bike based upon a chart could result in being very uncomfortable on a bike that never fits right and can't be made to fit right... Even the cheapest fitting is better than that!

If money is an issue (and it is with most of us!), make sure that you buy the bike that fits you the best with decent components. You won't see a difference between for example Ultegra and Dura-ace... and I doubt you would ever see a difference (in speed) between a P2C and a P3C.

Most important is to get a bike that fits YOU well right from the start and you won't have to upgrade the frame for many years to come.

Having 5 bikes ranging from entry level HT MTB to full carbon Dura-Ace roadie, I FULLY agree that spending $thousands on upper-end tri bike is NOT cost-effective.  The speed advantage vs a tri-converted road bike (i.e. clip-on aerobars, forward seatpost, tri saddle, optimal fitting, aero wheels) is small (<3%).  And don't forget aero helmet is good bang-for-performance buck too.

Interesting well-done test for power/speed difference here-

http://www.cyclingnews.com/features/how-aero-is-aero

Briefly, pro-rider on full on top-end TT bike riding same documented power (SRM crank) on closed course gained about 10% speed vs road bike with std wheels (44 vs 40 kph).  Tri-coversion of road bike achieved roughly 2/3rds of aero benefit of full TT set-up even without fine-tuning of his 'tri-conversion' riding position.

So a converted roadie is not a TT bike, but can come pretty darn close.  Differences between TT bikes are a small fraction of that difference. 

You don't say what your age or total cycling experience is, but most cyclists find their optimal bike fit changes over their 1st 2-3yrs of serious riding.  I would wait to invest in TT bike until your riding style settles in (power, flexibility, etc.).  And when you pull the trigger remember that proper fit means WAY more that the brand of bike.  Geometry, balance, etc. vary a lot between brands even for same advertised frame size.  Seen too many riders find out that "great deal" on an "almost the right fit" bike is an expensive mistake to make.

Edited by Oldteen 2009-09-07 10:38 AM

'You don't say what your age or total cycling experience is, but most cyclists find their optimal bike fit changes over their 1st 2-3yrs of serious riding.  I would wait to invest in TT bike until your riding style settles in (power, flexibility, etc.).  And when you pull the trigger remember that proper fit means WAY more that the brand of bike.  Geometry, balance, etc. vary a lot between brands even for same advertised frame size.  Seen too many riders find out that "great deal" on an "almost the right fit" bike is an expensive mistake to make."

SOMEBODY NEEDS TO CARVE THIS ADVICE INTO STONE!



Edited by jsselle 2009-09-07 1:08 PM

I would say go with the Cervelo and get the best of both worlds...decent price range and has the capability to be a dedicated tri bike as well as your road bike

you could actually sum it up a lot more briefly than that, the first sentence of the notes:
"We only used one rider and one set of equipment, which is great for controlling variables but it means we shouldn't generalise too much. We did anyway..."


IOW you can't [correctly] draw any conclusions about your own performance from this.

Thanks so much for all the responses!  Much appreciated!

I'm super new to cycling (running background) so I love the advice to wait and see where I settle out in a few years.  Considering where I started (ground zero), I have hopefully nowhere to go but up!

I also can appreciate the advice re: a good bike fit.  But, here's my ignorance shining through --how does it work with a LBS when you order a bike from them?  Since I'm so small, it's hard to know what is really going to work without a lot of adjustments.  If I order a bike from a LBS or if I get a bike from them and they make all these adjustments for me (ie: change the stem, etc.) do I then own it even if I end up not feeling good on the bike?    It feels a little bit like I'm taking a stab in the dark (other than asking on this site, reading reviews, etc.) it's super hard to know without really trying a well-fitted bike if it's the right one.  I get that the LBS doesn't want to get left empty handed with a totally adjusted bike it can't turn around and sell but it does put me in a difficult position of not knowing what to order/try.

I do really trust my LBS and the guys who do the fitting there have done a great job with me on my roadie.  I know they will work as hard as they can to set me up right --still, if the bike just isn't exactly right for me, I'd be super bummed to shell out a ton of dough for that kind of so-so result.

Thoughts?

Thanks again so very much!

JRo

First off; they should have a fit-kit or serotta machine or some sizing/measuring procedure which will get you to the right frame size. Unless you are unusually proportioned (I am, so I understand the difficulty), there really shouldn't be *that* much that they have to mess with. Most bikes these days actually do an ok job with size-appropriate parts (used to be all sizes came with the same width handlebar and same cranks, meaning the small sizes had too wide bars, the big sizes too narrow. That's not so true these days).

My lbs has a 'fit room' where they set the bike up on a trainer, they have tons of 'sizing' parts, which they install temporarily, have you ride, see how it feels. So they aren't making the bike un-sellable if it doesn't work out. Really, there is nothing they will do in the fitting process that they can't fairly easily undo. Anyway, once you figure out what size parts you need, they get 'permanent' choices and install them.

Awesome!  Thanks so much for taking the time to respond!

Best,

JRo

I'm going to both disagree with you, and agree with you.

The chart is not "meaningless"  It's very good as rough guide to use as a starting point. 

But, if you read the rest of my post, you'll see that I was using that chart as a way to explain to the poster that it was especially important that she got a good fitting. 

Fitting a tri-bike is quite a bit different than fitting a road bike.  I would not necessarily trust your LBS to have the know-how to do it correctly.  Are they tri bike specialists?  If so, do they have a bunch of reviews on yelp or somewhere else, that rave about the fittings?

If not, I'd consider checking out someone on this list:

http://www.slowtwitch.com/fitters/

And again, see if you can find reviews before paying anyone for a fitting. 

2 cents.

Ok, maybe I was a bit harsh... sorry about that. As an explaination to why fitting it important, maybe you can use the chart, but I think (reading between the lines... if I'm wrong, I apologize) we agree that you can't buy a bike based upon a chart. And it still annoys me that there's no actual description of what the chart is supposed to tell you... no idea if the measurements refer to the seat tube or top tube and no idea how those are measured to come up with this chart...

Eddy Merkx
http://www.wrenchscience.com/Eddy+Merckx/AXM/Road_Bikes/Frames.html

DeRosa
http://www.wrenchscience.com/De+Rosa/King+3/Road_Bikes/Frames.html

DeRosa in size 62cm would correspond to a Merkx in 51cm... understanding geometry, you would be able to very easily tell the difference, but someone that's not a "bike freak" trying to rely on a chart could end up with a VERY expensive piece of carbon to no personal use at all...