The L OOOO N G S L OW run

How fast you want to run your 1/2 Mary how did you determine that?

Wishing to do a certain pace doesn't make it so. 

My long runs around the time I did my 2 non tapering train through 1/2 Mary's this spring, I was just about 40"/mile faster than my training long runs.

You really never know.  Sometimes in training like in races you have your good days and bad days.  Your training course might be harder than your race course or vis versa.  Sometimes you just need that thrill and excitement of the crowds and the competition to really fly.  

 I tend to run faster on race day but it may hurt.  You will go into z3 and you have to hold on.  If you race corrently you will be faster.  You have to listen to your body and if you can not hold it then you have to slow down. 

ChrisM - 2008-09-28 4:45 PM My long slow runs have nothing to do with pace on race day   Training is training, racing is racing.  

Mine either.  My race times have been about 1:00 to 1:25/ mile faster than my training paces.  When I look at my results I always think... how the heck did I pull that off? 

Just get the mileage in and don't worry about the pace too much -- especially for the first time you have done a certain distance.  Go out, have fun, listen to your body, and just run.  If you've done the training, I think you'll be surprised at how fast you are on race day.

ChrisM - 2008-09-29 8:45 AM My long slow runs have nothing to do with pace on race day   Training is training, racing is racing.   I assume you aren't going to run the half in zone 2?

So how then do you "train like you intend to race and race like you trained"?

For the most part my pace is determined by my HR but I came up with my goal time based on a the mcmilliam calculator.  I seem to be right in the window for the recovery run.  I took a nap a bit ago...I was exp tired today afterwards.  I think it was the heat.  I also need more fluids now that I am up over 10 miles.  The little 8oz bottles arn't cutting it.  I was 5lbs lighter today which was all sweat.  

Well, it wasn't ALL sweat.  You burn calories when you run, and they have to come from somewhere...    (But it was mostly sweat)

 X2 on the 'run properly according to your current ability and don't worry about your goal pace'.  That's a way to set yourself up for disappointment.  I do like the McMillan calculator for training paces.  I periodically do a time trial (short, like 5K or 10K) and use the result to reset my training paces.  I don't think much about pace on race day until it gets close and I need to do some planning (if it is a long race -- if it is short then the plan is to run very hard the whole way).

Gerrard - 2008-09-28 4:22 PM

ChrisM - 2008-09-29 8:45 AM My long slow runs have nothing to do with pace on race day   Training is training, racing is racing.   I assume you aren't going to run the half in zone 2?

So how then do you "train like you intend to race and race like you trained"?

Good question.   Frankly, I don't.  When I race I go as fast as I can for the distance. If I trained like that, I wouldn't get very many miles in.  You (general you, not you) can take a lot of tri sayings too literally, IMHO.

I don't do long slow distance.  I do long STEADY distance.  My long runs are seldom, if ever, my slowest runs of the week.

As for training like I race, I have done it.  I incorporate faster paces into my long runs, I do tempo runs during the week.

But, I was doing a lot more miles per week, and was focused on a marathon.

My experience with the long run is the more I do them the easier they become. Generally speaking, long runs are about building endurance. It takes time for the body to adapt to the stresses of running long distances. My goal on long runs is to maintain a steady easy pace - not my fastest or slowest, just easy. Easy could be defined as having the ability to carry on a conversation while running. If you're running so fast where that would be difficult - it's likely too fast for a long run. When a person first starts doing long runs the easy pace can be very slow, but over time the body will adapt and the pace will get faster. However, it takes time and there aren't any shortcuts. A problem occurs when people think they should be able to do the long runs faster like they have when training for short distance racing. But think back to when you started running and when going three miles at a fast pace was difficult. It likely took some time to be able to run decently fast for three miles, and it will take time to run fast at longer distances.

For now, focus on getting in the miles for your longs runs - not on the time it takes. Do enough long runs - maybe one or two a week - and over time you will get faster. It could take 4-6-8 months or more. Unless you're some kind of genetic freak it's not likely you are going to be able to build the necessary physiological adaptations in the next couple of weeks for your upcoming race. Use the race as a measuring stick to see where you are and build from there.

Keep in mind that any particular run can be lousy for any number of reasons. Even as much as I run I still have a lousy day about once a month. Don't be overly concerned about one run, but if the runs are all lousy then something should be changed.

I also noticed you seem to have trouble with tightness in your calves. I've found that a good session of stretching after every run will help with this kind of thing. Again, it will take time, but if it's done consistently you should see some relief from this problem over the course of a month or two. The body tends to adapt much slower than most people would like, so you need to be consistent with this stuff over a fairly long period to see the benefits.

First, define "long run".

Some will say that the long run is, by default, a hard workout, because it thrashes you.  I think the reason it thrashes people is because they are not used to the mileage.  Once you get weekly volume up there, a long run of 15-18 miles doesn't leave you burnt (unless you run it faster).

If it were me, I'd alternate on the long run: one week run it harder (but not too hard or you WILL leave your legs thrashed), next couple run it easy.