Timberman - Half Iron : Official Thread (Page 14)

March Totals:

March's totals:
Bike:	151.29 Mi
Run:	27.11 Mi
Swim:	7560.32
Strength:	45m

Happy enough with March, aiming to do more run work in April.

40-44 AGer here, too.  Raced a couple of times in March, so had taper / recovery to deal with, but still got in some reasonably good training:

Swim: 6.25 hrs, ~12,500 yds
Bike: 14.5 hrs, ~350 mi., (incl. trainer)
Run: 14.75 hrs, ~120 mi.

It helped to have an early season HIM and Boston looming to keep me honest.  I also have Coeur d'Alene to deal with along the way, so this will be a busy training / racing season for sure!

Good job everyone!  As a single guy living in San Diego, I can't believe you all manage to find the time to train around the weather and family commitments.  Here's to hoping we all have sunny skies and smooth pavement. Cheers!

35mpw running seems a bit high for a Half. My full IM plan last year only maxed out at ~30. If you want to increase the bike mileage, you certainly can cut back a bit on the running. It's whatever works for you. But if T-man is your goal, my 2cents is that you'd get more bang for your buck with more cycling.

So I started the 20 wk beginner plan here on BT. I switched the plan around to make Monday a rest day, Sat a long run and Sun a long ride. Enjoyed my first day(rest day) and this morning I did 2000 yd swim. I'm going to give the 40 min run a try tonight. I have not been running much because of my leg/calf/knee something going on. I went to PA this weekend and ran/walked the Mt. Penn Mudfest. I'm throwing in the towel on the Ruger's half and will try to run the Highrock Challenge and the Tough Mudder.

Should I be concerned that the HIM plan follows time? I'm slow so I will not be getting in the miles faster athletes will accomplish using the same plan. I think most plans I looked at follow time, right?

Stirling Hotel crew--I had Easter dinner at the hotel---it was just me and my mom and I didn't feel like cooking. There were more people there then I expected--outdoor seating was pretty much filled.

I am using the BT beginning HIM plan and yes it's mainly driven by time BUT with the added dimension of RPE.  I think there's a few keys to this combination:

1) take the easy workouts easy, and make sure to do the "hard" workouts hard.  Blend speed and endurance.

2) as you build base / endurance / etc. - you will be able to run/bike faster at a lower heartrate ... so a RPE 3 workout in June would have felt like RPE 5/6 in April.

The key is to establish your HR zones, there is a good article here on BT on lactate threshold testing, and the spreadsheet I uploaded (see one of my previous posts) contains a tab for calculating HR zones based LTHR, as well as the BT HIM plan.

Anyone up for a swamp ride around lunchtime this week?

NJ Peeps:

1) Don't worry about time vs. distance. Trust the plan. Follow it by time.
A 45 minute run may be more taxing to a slower person than to a faster one. If you add on to complete the mileage, then you might be taxing yourself even further.

2) Stirling Hotel - yes, I am still in. Maybe an evening ride and/or run in the Swamp, followed by endless discussions at the SH about how great(lousy) we are?

3) I'm dropping out of Rutgers Half too. Might run part of it though - depending how the legs feel.

4) Swamp rides are good, but not lunchtime during the week. How are evenings? How about a weekend morning?




Edited by runnerx 2010-04-06 2:59 PM

Ahhh...all good advice above.  It takes time to...and I know people hate to hear this...to see what works best for you.  I am working from a plan of my own design after many years and many events worth of experience, as well as from having read just about everything I could, and having talked about such things with the "experts" I have enountered.

Here I my adopted, simple keys to success.

* Do a long ride and a long run every week.  (I recognize periodization and won't get into the details of how that may work regarding what "long" might involve).
* Do a fast ride and a fast run every week. (see note on periodization above).
* Do a long swim and a fast swim...

AND...whatever plan you choose.  Listen to your body.

A note to newbies...I would suggest that less is more and simply get yourself to be able to cover the race distances going into the race.  Be patient, let the "race" come to you and have your mantra on the day be "Efficiency".  Enjoy the day and if you want to be "fast"...be fast next time.

I acknowledge I am being very simplistic here.  But these are basic principles.

I think first and foremost however, is enjoy the process, the journey, and celebrate your accomplishment.

...BUT, this is just one guys opinion.

Having said all of that, similar to others of you, my training is not JUST for Timberman.  I'm doing other events coming up soon in which I intend to prepare well enough to be respectable.  So, when you see my "stuff" and it makes you feel like you should be going farther or faster, it might not benefit you to do that at all. 

Peace,
~Sam

Good advise Sam!

Mike. I didnt realize you were doing Boston & Coeur d'Alene (did I spell that right?) That definately explains why your volume is so mega high compared to most of the rest of us.  You sure have set the bar pretty high this year! 

Not sure which Garmin you have, but my 205 used to freeze up from time to time.  If you hold down as many of the buttons at one time as you can, it will reset.  I think you only need to hold down two of them at once, but I can never remember which ones they are.  There might be some online info explaining exactly how to do it for each device, but it's probably quicker to just start holding down a bunch of buttons.  Good luck!

Ya, you're right, it seems high for most plans out there, but that is about where I think I'll be holding after the mary in May.  It's only 3 runs per week and a brick thrown in.  8ish,8ish,14ish + a brick run.  IMO, a lot of plans out there have people grossly under-prepared to put up a solid run and are geared towards just getting you to finish and not race the distance.  But, your right, it's whatever works for the individual.  If I was already a strong runner I could probably get by on a lot less.  I busted my a** this off-season on the run since it was my weakness in my first season last year and am finally starting to see the progress.  It took a few months of consistent mileage and I didn't see any benefit until I was over 30mpw for extended periods of time...  I'm naturally stronger on the bike though and with my plan I should be up in the120mpw range come June and should be good.

My motto this year is "ride for show, run for doe.  The run separates the contenders from the pretenders"....I'm really just competing against last years time though......oh and my friends who are doing it.  You reading this triathlonfun?  You're going down!  Bring it on!

Everyone on here is looking good.  It's only early April.  Plenty of time to see significant improvement.  Keep it up everyone!

I think your suspicions are correct. The 10k runs they have in the park (such as the Scotland Run on Saturday) require a full loop plus a little bit more. So there's no way one loop is 6.5 mi. But, it is a very hard course with all those hills, regardless of direction. You can't really judge your fitness level based on it, but it's great training!! My best year of running came after a winter of running races in CP.

Acu-j: Sounded like you had a good running background. Anyone who can handle 35mpw consistently must have one. Again, it's all individual. If you're feeling good with it then it's good for you, but as Sam said, listen to your body. An 8,8,14 week would be awesome. You'll be so solid. Taking in some of Sam's advice, you could always drop one of the 8's down a bit and make it a "fast" day - a tempo run perhaps.

Sam: Great advice! I will add though, a HIM is an endurance event. The long workout is way, way, way more important than the Fast workout. One can complete a HIM with absolutely zero fast days, but you can't do one without the Long days. And fast is relative too. For some more experienced people, doing 400 repeats on the track is good. For others, just throwing in 10minutes at a slightly-faster pace is enough.

SJW: My nutrition plan has me consuming 1800 calories during the race. 100 right before, 1300 on the bike, and 400 on the run. I had my best HIM when I ate an entire PB&J sandwich as soon as I got on the bike.

runnerx- absolutely...I agree that HIM program could drop all speed sessions when the goal is completion.  Basically gradually building up enduance to be able to complete the event feeling confident is huge.

March's totals:
Bike:	12h 21m  - 157.38 Mi
Run:	9h 21m 17s  - 72.56 Mi
Swim:	45m  - 2300 Yd

the bike numbers are a bit confusing because I dont log "miles" when I am riding on the trainer, just time.  The milage is strictly road work.  This is the first time I have ever logged any miles in March, it's been a great winter relatively, here in northern northeast. As you can see, I dont spend alot of time swimming during the winter. 

Today's workout included 3 x 10minute intervals in Zone4 with a short, 20 minute brick run in zone3. 

When I started training for half and full marathons, I used the FIRST running plan which focuses on 3 key runs: interval, tempo and long.  While I would add in other "easy" days when just training for standalone running races, I found that the plan worked well for triathlon prep in that you could maintain a solid run fitness base in three sessions and use the other days to swim and bike.  Runner's World has featured this system and you can check out plans for various distances here.

It's true that you don't need to do speedwork to finish a HIM, but if you're looking to race and compete, I think it's important to add in some intensity training.  Core work will help you hold up on the run, too.  A solid bike leg will bring you into position, but you do really need a strong run to close the deal.

After 4 HIM races, I'm still trying to dial in my nutrition.  I don't take in all that much and I think I'm in for a big wake-up call at CDA (my first full).  I'm going to start working with Carbo-Pro to see if I can stomach that during training.

For a race between 3-6 hours, you'll be mostly working off of the meals from the night before and the morning.  As long as you supplement with a couple hundred calories per hour for quick energy, you shouldn't empty yourself out all that much.  It's after the 8, 9, 10 hour mark that I think the fun will begin.

For all of my longer races to date (marathons / HIMs), I have just used Shot Bloks and salt and I don't take in all that much (like 150-200 calories / hour).  I have a big pasta meal the night before, oatmeal and fruit in the morning (usually about 250-400 kcal) and then 3 Bloks with caffeine (another 100) in transition before heading down to the swim start.

I pack a plastic bag with Bloks and salt tabs in my feed box up front and pick at it during the bike, taking 2-3 Bloks and a salt tab every half hour or so.  The last thing I grab before running out of T2 (if I don't forget) is the baggie.

I bring one bottle with water on the bike and leave one spot open to take a bottle at the first fluid station on the course.  I have to force myself to drink on the bike - I don't do a good job of that.  At Oceanside, both bottles were still about half-full after the race.  I did take water at almost every aid station on the run.

Good luck - and as everyone seems to say, "You have to find what works for you."

halfironmike & runnerx - thanks for sharing your experiences. I didn't really consume too much liquid/GU's/other carb sources during races because they were Sprints/Olympics and also it does not always sit so well with my stomach to consume anything when excercising. However I tend to sweat heavily so I feel I'm going to have to be disciplined and force myself with the drinking fluids especially as well as getting carbs on board. Not sure I'd manage to hold down a PBnJ sandwich before hopping on the bike but we'll see . I've been trying this HEED drink recently which seems to be doing the job fluid wise.

Mike - Good stuff you wrote. Definitely if you're experienced and/or are racing the HIM, then yeah, I'm all for speedwork. But seems like we have some HIM newbies on here and I don't want to have anyone feel like they HAVE TO do speedwork.

FWIW, I use Carbo-Pro and love it. It's like it isn't even there. No taste, doesn't add density to your drink. Just invisible calories which is exactly what you need. But, I would put 2 bottles of Carbo-Pro / sports drink on the bike so you get in as many calories as you can early in the bike before switching to the less-caloric stuff from the aid stations.

You also mentioned doing Core work. I need to get more of that in but I just don't seem to find the time. Out of curiosity, when do you all fit in your strength workouts?

Just to add to my post:
Take in water initially on the bike until you're settled in. THEN start on the fueling.

Here are a couple great articles from Coach Gordo that explains stuff better. The first is about IM Nutrition (not HalfIM) but good tips nonetheless: http://www.coachgordo.com/gtips/nutrition_body_composition/ironman_...

And here's one on HIM Strategy in general:
http://www.coachgordo.com/gtips/race_strategy/pacing_your_first_hal...




Edited by runnerx 2010-04-07 2:00 PM

I like do my core stuff immediately after interval / tempo workouts.  Just some sets of planks / leg lifts for about 5-10 minutes (1-2 minutes each).  It's easier to do it when I train with a group cause everyone motivates each other.  When I'm by myself, I think about doing it and then usually bug out haha.  I have a ball at home that I work with sometimes (or when I'm sitting at the computer) and I try to stretch when watching TV.

March was bad...

March's totals:
Bike:	16h 11m 01s  - 281.51 Mi
Run:	15h 39m 13s  - 111.31 Mi
Swim:	5h 12m 25s  - 15150 M
Strength:	2h 05m

April has started out even worse (one run of 5 miles, cut off at 3 because of severe knee pain). 

Unfortunately, after months and months of slow, steady, smart periodized progress in both running and biking I've run into a pair of injuries just weeks before Boston.  I hurt my ankle a few weeks back, relatively minor but it forced me to miss a number of days over a two week stretch in March.  Then this past weekend I did a 20 mile race that I ran real conservative, but it appears to have angered my knee.  Took three days off then ran on Thursday; hurt again so took four more days off and ran last night and holy hell, the pain was intense. 

Anyway, I don't really care that much if I run Boston--it's on the list of things to do this year but I'm not official and I'll be doing it many times down the road.  But the two HIM's are of utmost importance to me so if I'm not feeling 100% come race day then I'm just not gonna run, no reason to lay myself out for another month when I have a HIM the first weekend of June.

(sorry for the rant, it's been a frustrating few weeks--it took me a month to get my new bike and I still can't ride it since the cranks are at Quarq; my 310XT just broke and is now in the process of being replaced by Garmin; and now the knee injury after 6 months of near perfect health...just very frustrating)

Edited by Brownie28 2010-04-07 3:28 PM

Brownie!

How do you like Lackey?  I hope he gets a W tonight.  Just would like to start the season one game ahead of the Yankees.



Mandy