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2010-06-30 9:52 AM
in reply to: #2786136

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Master
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Woodbridge , Virginia
Subject: RE: Gym sues mother of drowned boy
Its always sad to lose a child..

I work at a gym with a pool..

Some parents think the gym is a babysitter, especially in the pool area. Lifeguards are constantly telling parents they have to be in the pool with there children.. And its clearly stated in the rules posted all around the pool. "parents must accompany children in the pool" So guard tell the kids to get out of the pool.. parents look dumbfounded because they don't understand why.. and the funny thing is that they repeat offenders.. its like they think rules have changed or no one remembers the rules.. its frustrating.



2010-06-30 10:31 AM
in reply to: #2786136

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Master
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Subject: RE: Gym sues mother of drowned boy
     There is nothing that could replace the loss of a child. No amount of money.

I wonder what kind of mother would leave a 4 year old in a pool unattended? The same kind of mother who sneaks into a gym? The same kind of mother who thinks the same gym is responsible for the loss of her child and 25 mil should cover it?

The article biased toward the plaintiff in this case. I'm sure the gym(insurance) was willing to  settle for a reasonable amount.

Another waste of the legal/lottery system.

A country that was once built by hard working, honest, independent individuals is now being picked clean by vultures of the entitlement system. Welcome to the new world order

"Hope and Change"
2010-06-30 12:28 PM
in reply to: #2786136

Veteran
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Michigan
Subject: RE: Gym sues mother of drowned boy

This is a major pet peeve of mine...There should be rules around allowing young kids to be in a pool if they are not accompanied by a responsible adult.  Almost every day I see young children in the pool with parents sleeping, reading, talking or sitting too far away from their children.  I was in the pool with my children within arms reach for many, many years even when the water was cold or I really didn't want to go in.  I took the time and effort to train them how to swim and also how to follow pool and safety rules.  My kids are 10 and 11 and this year when the pool opened, I reinforced the rules with them again.  They asked me to get in with them again and go over water safety.  They like to practice the drill on how to handle a situation where someone is panicking and grabs them in the water.  In my mind, the lifeguards are the secondary line of defense.  It is my job to make sure my kids are safe in the pool.

2010-06-30 1:03 PM
in reply to: #2786136

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Champion
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Bellingham, Washington
Subject: RE: Gym sues mother of drowned boy
Not to steal the thread, but just saw on breaking news that Former QB Randall Cunningham's 2 year old son drowned in the hot tub.

Sad when kids die so young. 
2010-06-30 1:30 PM
in reply to: #2953535

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Champion
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Subject: RE: Gym sues mother of drowned boy

I think I'd be too worried to bring my kid to the pool

As an aside, Lifetime's not exactly known for an overly moral way of doing things.   They are a big corporation and I am sure have staff attorneys who had to counter sue.  That's America for you. 

I think that even if the women climbed over the fence, the probably have a legitimate claim against Lifetime.  That's just how it works.  Similarly, cannot a person be sued if a burglar slips and falls on their property?  Doesn't make it right, but the owners of the properties have some responsibility no matter how you got there.    I am sure they are pizzed and suing only because since the woman didn't sign the guest waver she didn't give up her rights in a case like this.



Edited by BikerGrrrl 2010-06-30 1:31 PM
2010-06-30 3:20 PM
in reply to: #2786136

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Subject: RE: Gym sues mother of drowned boy

Here's my take of what may be going on.

Mom makes a mistake in judgement and was not paying attention when she should have been.  Lifeguard and gym also had some fault in the child's drowning.

Mom goes to lawyer seeing if she can get some sort of financial compensation for her funeral bills, time off from work, therapy, etc.

Laywer examines the gyms insurance policy, and determines that they possibly could sue for $25M.  It has nothing to do with the level of fault...simply a number based on how much they can afford.

Mom gets talked into suing for $25M by her laywers, not realizing that the lawyers are simply out to make more money for themselves, and don't care if they smear the mom's name in the eye of the public as a greedy/irresponsible mom.

The case will likely get settled for some amount less than $25M, but the mom will realize that no amount of money can replace a child, and even worse, she is now known by many people as a greedy person trying to abuse the system.  People are now jealous/envious/disgusted with her (ETA: as far as abusing the system...not losing a child), and while the money is nice...she realizes she could have easily settled for a reasonable amount outside of court and the public eye. 



Edited by tri808 2010-06-30 3:23 PM


2010-06-30 4:39 PM
in reply to: #2954027

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Master
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Portland, Oregon
Subject: RE: Gym sues mother of drowned boy
tri808 - 2010-06-30 1:20 PM

Here's my take of what may be going on.

Mom makes a mistake in judgement and was not paying attention when she should have been.  Lifeguard and gym also had some fault in the child's drowning.

Mom goes to lawyer seeing if she can get some sort of financial compensation for her funeral bills, time off from work, therapy, etc.

Laywer examines the gyms insurance policy, and determines that they possibly could sue for $25M.  It has nothing to do with the level of fault...simply a number based on how much they can afford.

Mom gets talked into suing for $25M by her laywers, not realizing that the lawyers are simply out to make more money for themselves, and don't care if they smear the mom's name in the eye of the public as a greedy/irresponsible mom.

The case will likely get settled for some amount less than $25M, but the mom will realize that no amount of money can replace a child, and even worse, she is now known by many people as a greedy person trying to abuse the system.  People are now jealous/envious/disgusted with her (ETA: as far as abusing the system...not losing a child), and while the money is ice...she realizes she could have easily settled for a reasonable amount outside of court and the public eye. 



Yeah, this whole thing is the attorney's fault. The attorney MADE her sue. It was forced on her out of the blue through no decision of her own. She couldn't possibly be one of those people who blame everyone else but themselves when things go wrong. 

Is there a half-sarcasm font? Attorneys advise. Clients decide what to do given their options. She made the decision to sue and the amount to sue for. No one made her do it.

 
2010-07-01 11:28 AM
in reply to: #2786625

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2010-07-01 2:51 PM
in reply to: #2786136

Expert
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Cambridge
Subject: RE: Gym sues mother of drowned boy
OTOH, Disclaimer saves all maybe?


Additionally, Life Time claims that Stafford and Stack's membership agreements specifically state that the company is not liable for any costs associated with injuries sustained by their guests.

Does Death count as an injury?

Its a Sad and tricky un! 
2010-07-01 4:50 PM
in reply to: #2955937

Expert
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Las Vegas, NV
Subject: RE: Gym sues mother of drowned boy
PennState - 2010-07-01 11:28 AM
ChineseDemocracy - 2010-04-12 7:48 PM
Swanny - 2010-04-12 5:40 PM What kind of mother would not be their by their kids side? I take my daughter to LTF and I am in the water with her. On swim days I end up with 4 hours in the water, 2 1/2 of them in water making sure she is safe.

Look at the decisions made.  Some HS kid making minimum wage is a LG, and you want to put your child's life in their hands? That's nuts. The parents failed in many ways. They snuck in, they stole a service. Mom and Dad failed their child, period.  The law may decide in favor for the family, but the judge in their mirror says guilty.

Crap, what a horrible thing.


I totally agree with you Swanny. 

x3


I read this thread yesterday and have been thinking about it. Regardless of whether the parents should have been at the pool, are justified in suing or in being sued, I think we need to remember that child's life was lost and his mother wil have to live with that forever. I don't know this woman and I don't know the circumstances, but I feel bad for her regardless.

I took my 3 kids to the pool today. It's a shoreline pool with a lot of kids and a lot of lifeguards. I let my older kids ( who are almost 5 & 3) play around in life jackets while I sit in the very shallow water with the baby who is 10 months old. I honestly cannot say that my kids are all "in arms reach" of me the whole time (except for the baby), but I do have a constant eye on them and will pull them back to shallow end if they get out to deep. I have talked to other people in the pool while I've been there with my kids. My kids have run into the pool ahead of me at times. 

I just feel it was a tragic accident. I hate to put all the blame on the mother. Everyone has accidents  

Edited by jpbis26 2010-07-01 4:52 PM
2010-07-01 6:28 PM
in reply to: #2786136

Master
2356
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Westlake Village , Ca.
Subject: RE: Gym sues mother of drowned boy
I have a question....

What level of responsibility is placed on a lifeguard? They are people and not perfect. Their job is to try and HELP prevent a tragedy....not INSURE there isn't one. That's impossible.

My point is that it is possible for a lifeguard to be doing everything possible to prevent someone from getting hurt and still fail. Things happen....a moments distraction. What if someone came up and asked the guard a question about pool safety and the kid slipped under? There's a million scenarios.

Are lifeguards responsible for everyone at the pool....or are they there to do what they can in the event of an emergency?


2010-07-01 6:52 PM
in reply to: #2956958

Master
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Subject: RE: Gym sues mother of drowned boy
Fastyellow - 2010-07-01 7:28 PM I have a question....

What level of responsibility is placed on a lifeguard? They are people and not perfect. Their job is to try and HELP prevent a tragedy....not INSURE there isn't one. That's impossible.

My point is that it is possible for a lifeguard to be doing everything possible to prevent someone from getting hurt and still fail. Things happen....a moments distraction. What if someone came up and asked the guard a question about pool safety and the kid slipped under? There's a million scenarios.

Are lifeguards responsible for everyone at the pool....or are they there to do what they can in the event of an emergency?


In this country it is their level of insurance coverage.

Tragic. But get real. You sneak into a gym, don't watch your own child, the child drowns and you sue the gym. Some body will pick up the tab. Dues paying members or employees loosing benefits or jobs. Equally tragic
2010-07-01 7:18 PM
in reply to: #2786136

Veteran
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Lakewood Ranch, Florida
Subject: RE: Gym sues mother of drowned boy
I have a 4 yr old Daughter who takes swim lessons once a week and i would NEVER let her out of my sight, especially in a pool setting, was the child wearing swimmies or a vest ??? and if not, WHY ???  My daughter is never out of arms length when we r in any pool, including ours... I think the family is suuing the gym because of pure guilt.. i will sue the gym and thus it is not my fault, happens all the time to people, very sad but unfortunately true. 
The mother will have to live with this fact, she was not watching her child and it caused a tragedy.



 
2010-07-02 9:53 AM
in reply to: #2786136

Champion
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Henderson NV
Subject: RE: Gym sues mother of drowned boy
I am sorry for the loss of a child, but my belief is I am responsible for the things I can control: i.e. keeping an eye on my own child. If I am there with the child it is my FULL responsibility to care for that child not a LG. If the child is left at school then they except responsibility until I pick the child up.

My grandkids 8 & 10 do not go in the pool without me. Can they swim? yes, but if something happens is it their fault or mine or is it the 10 yo's fault? I guess I can let a judge decide.
2010-07-02 12:14 PM
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2010-07-02 2:44 PM
in reply to: #2786136

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Subject: RE: Gym sues mother of drowned boy
I lifeguarded for several years when I was a teenager.

One summer I worked at a public pool and we had 3-5 saves EVERY DAY... people would drop their kids off at the pool (kids under 10), or go as a family and leave their kids while they waited in line for the slides.

I remember taking a little boy -- maybe 5-6 years old -- who slipped under the water (I grabbed him right away) and taking him to his mom, who was in line for the water slide. She asked if she had to get out of line while I filled out the incident report.

I take some offense to "lifeguards are idiot high school kids." Yes, some are, but it's a harder job than people think -- sitting in the sun all day exhuasts you, and in crowded pools - especially when there are noodles, rafts, lifevests, etc. - it can be difficult to see every person and every situation.


2010-07-03 7:53 AM
in reply to: #2958717

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Urbandale, IA
Subject: RE: Gym sues mother of drowned boy
trishie - 2010-07-02 2:44 PM I lifeguarded for several years when I was a teenager.

One summer I worked at a public pool and we had 3-5 saves EVERY DAY... people would drop their kids off at the pool (kids under 10), or go as a family and leave their kids while they waited in line for the slides.

I remember taking a little boy -- maybe 5-6 years old -- who slipped under the water (I grabbed him right away) and taking him to his mom, who was in line for the water slide. She asked if she had to get out of line while I filled out the incident report.

I take some offense to "lifeguards are idiot high school kids." Yes, some are, but it's a harder job than people think -- sitting in the sun all day exhuasts you, and in crowded pools - especially when there are noodles, rafts, lifevests, etc. - it can be difficult to see every person and every situation.

Funny, but those people calling them "idiot" teens is probably the same person that gets ticked when the lifeguard tells them to follow the rules becasue it's a teen. 
2010-07-03 9:14 AM
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2010-07-03 9:56 AM
in reply to: #2954276

Subject: RE: Gym sues mother of drowned boy
ell-in-or - 2010-06-30 12:39 PM
tri808 - 2010-06-30 1:20 PM

Here's my take of what may be going on.

Mom makes a mistake in judgement and was not paying attention when she should have been.  Lifeguard and gym also had some fault in the child's drowning.

Mom goes to lawyer seeing if she can get some sort of financial compensation for her funeral bills, time off from work, therapy, etc.

Laywer examines the gyms insurance policy, and determines that they possibly could sue for $25M.  It has nothing to do with the level of fault...simply a number based on how much they can afford.

Mom gets talked into suing for $25M by her laywers, not realizing that the lawyers are simply out to make more money for themselves, and don't care if they smear the mom's name in the eye of the public as a greedy/irresponsible mom.

The case will likely get settled for some amount less than $25M, but the mom will realize that no amount of money can replace a child, and even worse, she is now known by many people as a greedy person trying to abuse the system.  People are now jealous/envious/disgusted with her (ETA: as far as abusing the system...not losing a child), and while the money is ice...she realizes she could have easily settled for a reasonable amount outside of court and the public eye. 



Yeah, this whole thing is the attorney's fault. The attorney MADE her sue. It was forced on her out of the blue through no decision of her own. She couldn't possibly be one of those people who blame everyone else but themselves when things go wrong. 

Is there a half-sarcasm font? Attorneys advise. Clients decide what to do given their options. She made the decision to sue and the amount to sue for. No one made her do it.

 


I completely agree.  Mom made the decision to sue...but my point is that the attorney is the one who came up with $25M based on what he felt was the maximum he could sue for based on the gym's insurance...not what he honestly feels the mom deserves.

The attorney actually benefits from this case going public...where I think the mom didn't want it too.  An attorney likely knows the publicity the case would get...where the mom...still mourning the loss of her child...is likely just agreeing to whatever the lawyer suggests. 

Who knows...maybe the lawyer did present two options...with one option assuring her that the case would be settled privately for a lower amount...but my GUESS...is that the lawyer sugar coated the $25M option...and didn't advise her of the ramifications of the case going public.

Either way...the whole thing is tragic.

Edited by tri808 2010-07-03 10:01 AM
2010-07-03 2:13 PM
in reply to: #2786244

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Subject: RE: Gym sues mother of drowned boy
Gaarryy - 2010-04-12 3:33 PM what confuses me is it reads that the child was having problems, thrashing in the water, etc. who saw that happening but did nothing about it??

I'm amazed that none of the other people in the pool noticed the child having problems, to go along with the mother, friends of the mother, or the lifeguards.. No one?? 

I'm thinking there might be more that isnt' being reported in this story.


Right who saw the child struggling?
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