Got Your Mojo WORKIN'! group - CLOSED (Page 63)

I found this kind of interesting http://www.analyticcycling.com/RiderAeroStudy.html Basically A bars will save you approximately 100 seconds over 10k vs being in the drops at 15mph wind. There were a few other things that were interesting too.

Zip up your jersey!

GEORGE -

I'm just back in, checking here, and then will be off again for a while. But on a quick run-through of your most recent post (and it deserves a longer response, as there are several points there), here's what I will say for now.

---If you are training regularly with a group, or even a couple of riders, what your bike shop told you has merit.

---If you are thinking of doing cycling-only races, what your bike shop told you has merit.

---However, if your focus is going to be on triathlons, then they are missing the point that, in triathlons, pack-riding is strictly forbidden (unless you are on the ITU professional circuit!). There are marshals on motorcycles at most USAT-sanctioned races who will penalize you for DRAFTING -- being within three bike lengths of the bike in front of you. These penalties can range from 1 minute to 4 minutes in time-assessed penalties, or in some races they can involve a "stand-down" at the next aid station, or at the end of the bike leg. More on drafting later!

Let me leave this here for now; lots more to say about your post when I return!

Well to answer most of your questions, I plan to use the bike for Tri races.. I train alone so I dont ride in packs.. I guess you can call me the lone wolf.(owwwww) that was me howling.

Lori in one of your post you talked about Aero Bars, Drops and Hoods. I guess the Aero Bars are the bars you clip on the handle bars so you can get into the aero position, but what is Drops and Hoods..

Opps I was talking about the saddle.. I saw the kestrel where you can slide it forward or back and it adjusted the angle.. I read something where road bikes have a different angle then tri's.. Im not sure if they were talking about the saddle or the seat post..

The drops are the curved part of regular road bars, the hoods refer to the brake hoods. The tops are the straight area adjacent the stem

Here is a picture of a rider on the "tops, hoods and drops" no aero bars. The article is about pressure on the hands but the pictures are good

http://www.wisconline.com/featurenew1/cycling_images.html

Edited by Av8rTx 2011-02-07 2:27 PM

Thanks for the link on tops drops and rolls ....  Does anyone know if there is a triathlon dictionary?? All this tri talk gets confusing... I was surfing the web yesterday on different tri stuff and I found some workouts but I had no idea what this guy was saying and it was not the first time I went to a website and they were talking tri talk....

Lori,

Warrior Dash was super fun as well! I think it attracted a different crowd, though. I don't remember the demographics exactly, but it seemed like there was better representation from all ages and genders, more so than during Tough Mudder. That may've been mostly due to it being held in Colorado where we have plenty of athletes young and old, and not Texas where the runners were mostly military (probably due to the abundance of bases around). But I can't be sure. I wish I still had the spreadsheet they sent out with start times and ages so I could do a legitimate comparison, but alas, the computer has eaten it.

Hope that helped just a little bit!
Kasia

P.S. I have a much better mud picture from Warrior Dash (I'm on the left):


And some fire-jumping as well, also from Warrior Dash:


But I found a mid-shock photo from the Electroshock Therapy obstacle of Tough Mudder:


Edited by augeremt 2011-02-07 6:58 PM

But they went to shoe heaven, Steve. They weren't abandoned. They were given with love to help barefoot children in Africa get to school. If you think of it that way, it sounds much better.


Edited by augeremt 2011-02-07 5:51 PM

Remember how I said I hadn't missed a 6 am swim workout for a couple of weeks? Well, that streak ended last week when I needed some serious shut-eye and skipped both Tuesday and Thursday.

I'm back at it tomorrow (I hope) and am really looking forward to getting my butt kicked in the pool. Unfortunately it's been snowing here non-stop for a couple weeks now (who knew that would happen in Colorado?) and if my walk to work this afternoon was any indication, it is not safe to run in this. I was slipping and sliding all over the place!

(JEFF, I learned from you not to mess with ice!)

It's supposed to hit the 50s over the weekend so I'm hoping to get a ride in, at least once. I'm also itching to try out the saddle I bought back in October. Has it really been that long?

Double post. Sorry.


Edited by augeremt 2011-02-07 5:52 PM

I have a question for the masses...actually, many questions...

My "official" triathlon training is supposed to start soon, with a set workout plan and everything, but I don't know how I'm supposed to stick with that when I'm kind of doing my own thing, especially with swimming. I can't really tell the Master's coach to modify her workouts for me, but I'd also like to do the whole process of training for a tri, with base, build, peak, and taper periods, per the recommendations of the book, because I want to have an enjoyable and speedy tri experience.

So, how do I reconcile those two methods of training? Are you guys going to have (or have had) the same kinds of problems?

And also, on a related note...I really enjoy biking. Like, a lot. And I also enjoy group rides, almost as much. Once the time comes for following a laid-out training plan, there are certain distances that I should be doing a given week and certain sets/intervals I should be following at certain times. That totally interferes with getting home from work and REALLY wanting to go on a ride, and going until I'm either pooped or the sun goes down. Or going on a pre-planned group ride on a weekend. Again, how can I make this work with the whole training plan thing?

I guess what I'm getting at is this triathlon thing is another hobby for me. I'm not in it to race, per se, in that I don't have a coach (except for swimming, but that doesn't really count), and I don't structure my workouts to maximize my potential or anything like that. I do want to improve and I do want to get faster. But being the best and the fastest is not my priority. I want to enjoy this whole journey/hobby and getting better at it is a secondary priority. I mean, going faster makes me enjoy it more, but I don't want this to become another one of my many obsessions. I just want to enjoy the process of triathloning. That's pretty much the reason I took up this sport. I was bored of working out for working out's sake and needed something to work towards. And now that I do have a plan and a goal, I just want to work out, in a way. But I still want some guidance/structure and reasons to mix things up. Ay ay ay, I'm going in circles.

Maybe I shouldn't be following a plan in the first place. I think that's the only conclusion to be drawn from this long-winded post.

George,

Ditto everyone else's comments on the purpose of tri shorts. I don't own any (mostly because I'm cheap) but I recently indulged in a couple pair of cycling shorts. Same idea, just a thicker pad. I'm not skinny by any means, as you've seen in my photos, so I felt pretty stupid walking around in spandex in public. Nobody needs to see that. But then I realized I look even stupider in soccer shorts over my cycling shorts riding on a bike, so I got over that pretty quickly. Well, not that quickly, but within a season of biking.

I realized I'd completely gotten over my spandex and self-consciousness issues during TM when I ditched the shorts that kept falling off due to being big, baggy, and wet from mud, at the beginning of the course and ran in my spandex the rest of the way. And then I didn't even think twice about asking muscular and good-looking guys to grab my spandex-clad butt to lift me over a ginormous hay bale structure. Not an issue at all. So I think it gets better with time.

My brother, on the other hand, who is a very fit dude, still refuses to wear just cycling shorts and instead puts on his mountain bike shorts over his spandex. I make fun of him every time. For the mountain bike shorts, that is. So to each his own.

Kasia

George again,

I forgot to mention what I wore for my tris last season. For my first triathlon ever, a sprint, I had regular spandex under my wetsuit for the swim and biked in them as well, and then put on shorts over the spandex for the run. I didn't really like having to adjust them all the time so I stuck with just spandex for the Olympic distance. The bike leg wasn't long enough to necessitate bike shorts or padded tri shorts, so I was ok with that. I didn't put on any additional shorts for the run. I was much more comfortable that way, and it's probably what I'm going to do this year again.

Kasia

George,

So good to hear the race was a success! You have a really good attitude about it, as well. Keep up the training and in 3 weeks you will no doubt meet your goal of 32 minutes.

And your son did awesome in his race. 3rd place is impressive. The adventure race you mentioned sounds really really fun! That's a great idea for a family adventure.

Kasia

Cathy,

Cute photo! They are adorable little girls. And quick goals. You must be speedy!

Kasia

Wow, JOHN, that's some interesting betting going on there. I will have to go with STEVE and say that I'd rather bet money than a race of someone's choosing.

I'm curious to see what he'll think up for you.

Kasia

Craig,

How big are these cars you're building? I couldn't really tell from the photo you posted. Regardless, congrats. And great handywork!

Kasia

Kasia

If you are using one of the plans on BT I know it can be customized. You can combine different  parts of different plans. I'm not sure how to do it. You have to be a bronze or silver member to do it if I recall correctly.

George (again) -

In the time I ve been away, you received a bunch of good responses. So, I'll just add to them, and try to avoid a smuch overlapping as possible.

A tri-specific bike is not imperative, and most people have begun their tri careers on a "retrofitted" road bike -- that is, a road bike with tri stuff added. That is how I started, and my additions were clip-on areobars (the Century model from Profile Design) and a "fast-forward" seat post. I checked the latter a while ago, and they still make them, and they're on sale at my favorite online retailer -- www.tri-zone.com. There are two models there, one carbon and one aluminum. The alum one is on sale at $67.95, and that would be fine for you. When you go to that website, click on Bike Gear, then Components, then Seatposts, and when you see the alum one click on it for a description of how they work.

As for changing gears when you've got bar-end shifters and you're riding the hoods.......you learn! It really is a pretty quick maneuver, to just snap out your right hand and click the shifter towards you (if you're climbing, and the climb is getting steeper). I actually do a lot of my climbing, when seated, in the aero position, and up to a cretain critical point I can generate enough power like that. I think that hads been an acquired skill of sorts, however.

I recognize the benefits of having a road bike with clip-on aerobars, and you got several favorable comments from others. For me, though, i've been on a pure tri bike since spring '01, having spent a season on a retrofitted road bike, and I would never want to go back. It's really quite personal, and for me I have a great fit and know how to access my power in that more aggressive position, and I'm just mostly completely comfortable with all aspects of it. And when I say "mostly", that's there to separate standard conditions from extremes -- high winds, sharing a road that doesn't have a shoulder, and really steep hills -- when I will opt to widen my base and ride on the hoods. I will also do that just when I need a break from being in an aggressive "tuck" for too long, although I can stay in the tuck for a very long time. Still, the option is there to vary my riding position, and I do it on an as-needed basis.

If you went with a road bike and then began adding some tri features such as aerobars and a different seat post, you would need to be re-fitted. The average road bike set-up is not at all conducive to riding aero, and trying to do it just spreads out the rider way too much. At the least, it's uncomfortable; as the most, it's a poor way to utilize your leg strength. Whomever would set you up on a road bike would (hopefully!) do it so you could generate the most power in that more relaxed position, but thta all gets compromised when you try to ride on aerobars, and suddenly much of that potential power gets dissipated. Does that make sense, or do I need to explain it better?

More thoughts on this general topic in the next couple of posts!

MOJOISTAS!!

There's been a lot of stuff here recently about bike fittings, and the responses to George's post earlier today has raised several questions. This will maybe take some time to sort through, although there have been a bundle of fine responses to George already.

I am going to try to find a comment that I believe was made by Joe Friel about fittings, but in the next post I will just give a couple of general thoughts about why and when to get a more serious fitting done.

Stay tuned!

---------------------------------------- Time For A Professional Bike Fitting?? ----------------------------------------------


Most triathletes will never go to the expense of getting a serious, professional bike fitting, and that is fine. For this majority, comfort is paramount, and as long as they are comfortable with the status quo, that's how it will remain.

It is true that in mnay cases a good fitting can make a comfortable ride even more comfortable, but there is the risk that problems will be created with a rider's back, or glutes, or shoulders, or just about anywhere else. And, there is the cost -- most serious fittings take a few hours to do, and cost a couple/few hundred dollars -- not exactly desirable for the fiscally faint-of-heart!

For some of you, however, there may come a time when you want to take that Next Step in your bike performance, and a professional fitting is the logical first step in that process. Some people will get an aerohelmet (the intergalactic tear-dropped shape things), which costs a couple hundred dollars. Others will get aero wheels, a pair of which usually runs over a thousand dollars. BUT, neither of these will pay full dividends unless the rider has a close-to-optimal riding position. In fact, the aero helmet can actually be a detriment if the rider is either in a poor position to begin with, or can't maintain that psoition for very long without lifting their head, in which case the aero helmet creates MORE drag than a standard helmet does.

All of that is to say that, IMHO, buying those expensive toys is kind of like putting the cart before the horse unless the rider is position in the most advantageous way beforehand.


Soooooooo ---- None of youi should feel ANY PRESSURE AT ALL to run out and schedule a professional bike fitting, just becasue it's been taked about here. And even though I am tempted to (and probably will, if I can re-find it) post something written by tri guru Joe Friel that seems to advocate get a serious fit, I don't want that to be a needless spur for any of you to spend that sort of money -- unless you feel that it is time to ratchet your peformance up to the next level.

Okey-dokey?

GEORGE once more (although I'm spreading these out some!) -

When one talks about angles, the point of reference is the seat tube -- the tube that extends up from the bottom bracket to your seat post. The actual angle is measured between the seat tube and a horizontal line drawn through the bottom bracket and parallel to the ground.

On a road bike, this angle is about 72 degrees, whereas on tri bikes it will be in the 76-78 degree range. What a "fast forward" seat post does is is move the seat forward so it sits in a psotion where it would be if the bike had tri tri geometry.

Do you remember where you were looking at the workouts where you cou;dn't understand what the guy was saying? Let me know if you know!

Well...I'm back! Tough game for my Steelers yesterday, but hey at least they made it a decent game in the second half. Congrats to all you Packers fans....good to see a great organization take the Lombardi trophy home.

Steve...thanks for the info on hill riding. I got out this weekend and tried some of the techniques on the hills. Apparently I still have some practice to do, but I do understand the concept. One thing that may be a hinderance for me is I am riding an old Schwinn Road Bike...2 cogs in the front and 7 in the back (14 speed). I can only gear down so much before I feel the momentum coming to a stop. I assume that if I continue to practice your methodology that when I finally get a decent bike, I'll be one step ahead of the game!

Took the family out this weekend to a couple of stores looking at clipless pedals. I think I am going to go with the Shimano as the guy at REI highly suggested these for beginners. Easy to get in and out of and very reliable. Of course I am going to wait until REI posts some kind of coupon

Cathy....great pictures! I happen to love the name Peyton....that is my 4YO daughter's name as well!!

Have a great week training everyone! I'll check in again soon and try to keep up with everyone!

David