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2009-05-14 11:16 AM
in reply to: #2149799

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Subject: RE: hands during swimming?

firstteeth - 2009-05-14 12:47 AM
I also have appreciated your insight and videos.  (And love the name, my son TJ is my avatar snorkeling last year at age 3.

If I may pick your brain a bit more?  How does your hand enter the water? 

Thanks for all the swim input! 


Sure.

My hand enters at an angle, facing outward, just above my head. The above water clip is a little grainey on youtube, but if you look at the hand with the watch on it, you can get an idea.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pn3FWsQhkYE

I don't think that the exact angle or entry point is of great importance. I think the key is to have your hand enter the water with little resistance (like your hand is diving in), little or no bubbles and then extend under water out to a streamlined or glide position. If you start your pull with a bunch of bubbles you have to pull through the bubbles before you can pull the water. This is a problem because as we all know, pulling our hand through air doesn't move us anywhere. We need the thick water to grab in order to move forward. This head on shot shows my hand entry from under the water. You can see that there are times that I bring some bubbles with me, but the underwater extension/glide allows a brief moment to get rid of them.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QyT97j2CZk0

Hope this helps.



2009-05-14 11:17 AM
in reply to: #2148831

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Subject: RE: hands during swimming?
tjfry - 2009-05-13 1:25 PM
Thanks man, I appreciate that!

tj

That two-beat kick you do is not only the best tip I've gotten from BT but the best advice I've gotten on Triathlon from anywhere. It's going to make a significant difference in my race times and it's already raised my enjoyment of swim training significantly.

I've certainly heard of this kick style before from other sources but my personality is such that I discount all information to zero unless it comes from someone who's proven to me that they are a true expert. After that, I listen to and consider their every word. You've clearly established yourself to me in your posts and that's what caused me to give the kick a real tryout.

Because we have so little O2 here, my previous kick made swimming a miserable out-of-breath drownfest. Now, I'm getting at least the same propulsion from my kick and my legs just drag behind me doing nothing most of the time. After only a week or so I'm doing the same speeds at far less effort. And because I'm not gasping for air so much I've been able to really concentrate on every other aspect of my stroke.

I think it also fits well with wetsuit swimming. In competitive swimming I was basically a sprinter so my leftover style from then was pretty much a continuous kick but not strong like one would use in a 100. My weak continuous kick felt like it did nothing but tire me when I had the extra flotation from the wetsuit. With fewer stronger kicks, I think I'll get some propulsion back in the wetsuit.

So, Thank you!

2009-05-14 11:33 AM
in reply to: #2148072

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Subject: RE: hands during swimming?
mrbbrad - 2009-05-13 8:01 AM
MLJ - 2008-03-11 9:53 AM I find it helpful to watch my hands enter the water as I swim. If I don't make any bubbles when my hand enters, I know it went in smoothly. I think as long as you're not making bubbles, you're doing it fine.



Resurrecting an old thread (See, I used the search utility instead of starting a new thread)

I noticed this morning that I have a lot of bubbles coming off my hands during the pull. I've known this for a while but this morning it jumped out at me like a flare on a moonless night. From what I gather in this thread, the bubbles are a function of trapped air due to location of hand entry in the water. I do know that my hands enter pretty far out; my arm is almost fully extended when the hand enters the water. I have been doing that in an effort to "be long" as I've read many places. I am going to try different techniques and see what happens, but I have a race Sunday and don't plan on changing too much before then but this has now become something to obsess about. Nothing like a good obsession during taper


The problem with being long above the water is that it almost guarantees two things. A lot of air coming with the hand as it enters (because it's coming in almost flat), and it also makes it really easy to drop your elbow, which causes you to miss the catch.

I also endorse the thumb down approach, but you don't need much, just a very slight tilt will work fine. You really have to work at dropping the elbow if your hand is slightly tilted.

hackett1.mpeg (video/mpeg Object)

I love that video. You get to see his hand enter, the extra couple inches of the reach, and then a beautiful high elbow. I sweep a little closer in to the midline and slightly higher in the water with my hand, which probably explains why I'm slower than he is. (There's other reasons, but let me delude myself. ) His hands remain flat the whole way through the stroke.

The one nit people will pick is that his thumb is splayed out, but I endorse that. I've found that with a lot of people, when they squeeze their thumb tight against the hand, it actually causes the hand to cup a bit, which is harder when the thumb is away from the hand a bit.

John
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