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2008-05-19 1:53 PM

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Subject: Cassette question: 12-23 vs 12-25 and 12-27

Couple of quick questions.   I currently have a 12-23 cassette and it's not cutting it on really hilly courses. 

1.) Can I just by another rear rim/tire and slap a 12-25 or 12-27 cassette on and just change them as needed? 

2.) Could I just swap out my 12-23 permanently for a 12-25?  I read something about the gears being closer together on the 12-23, and how that's an advantage.  I have no clue what that means.

Please help.  Thanks.



2008-05-19 1:55 PM
in reply to: #1411396

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over a barrier
Subject: RE: Cassette question: 12-23 vs 12-25 and 12-27
I have a 12-23/12-25/12-27 and use them depending on the course. You can use them with the same wheel you don't need an extra wheel. Although I have race and training wheels.
2008-05-19 1:55 PM
in reply to: #1411396

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Subject: RE: Cassette question: 12-23 vs 12-25 and 12-27
2008-05-19 2:21 PM
in reply to: #1411396

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Subject: RE: Cassette question: 12-23 vs 12-25 and 12-27

So would there be any disadvantage for me to get rid of my 12-23 permanently??

My lbs had me under the impression that you have to 'adjust' the gearing after your swap cassettes?? 

This stuff is like rocket science to me.  I truly have no clue...

2008-05-19 2:25 PM
in reply to: #1411396

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over a barrier
Subject: RE: Cassette question: 12-23 vs 12-25 and 12-27
You might need to make a tweak to your rear derailleur, I haven't experienced shifting problems bouncing between cassettes.

2008-05-19 2:28 PM
in reply to: #1411396

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Subject: RE: Cassette question: 12-23 vs 12-25 and 12-27

So is there any reason why I wouldn't just get rid of the 12-23 in favor of the 12-25, so I always have an extra two granny gears for the steep climbs??

Does a 12-23 have any advantage over a 12-25? 



2008-05-19 2:52 PM
in reply to: #1411396

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Subject: RE: Cassette question: 12-23 vs 12-25 and 12-27
with a 12-23 noone can call you a sissy
2008-05-19 3:05 PM
in reply to: #1411624

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Subject: RE: Cassette question: 12-23 vs 12-25 and 12-27

steves_training - 2008-05-19 2:52 PM with a 12-23 noone can call you a sissy

The guy pushing the 11-21 might.

2008-05-19 3:07 PM
in reply to: #1411396

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Subject: RE: Cassette question: 12-23 vs 12-25 and 12-27

From Sheldon Brown's site, here's the gears for standard Shimano cassettes, you can see what you are gaining/losing with the three cassettes:

FW0714 Dura-Ace 10 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 21 23
FW0715 Dura-Ace 10 12 13 14 15 16 17 19 21 23 25
FW0716 Dura-Ace 10 12 13 14 15 16 17 19 21 24 27

As I understand it, the bigger difference between the cogs (i.e., on the 12-27, goes from 21 to 24, whereas on the 25 goes from 21 to 23) will make the shifting a little less... smooth?  there is a bigger difference and you might feel like you are missing an 'in between' gear, if that makes sense.  You don't lose any big gears with any cassette.

I ride a 27.  I don't always use it, but I am glad it's there when I need it

Also, may not be able to just slap a separate wheel on with a separate cassette without some adjustment, depends on teh wheel.  I have the same shimano 12-27 on my Mavics and HEDs, and when I swap wheels the shifting is a little funky unless it gets adjusted



Edited by ChrisM 2008-05-19 3:11 PM
2008-05-19 3:12 PM
in reply to: #1411513

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Subject: RE: Cassette question: 12-23 vs 12-25 and 12-27

running2far - 2008-05-19 12:25 PM You might need to make a tweak to your rear derailleur, I haven't experienced shifting problems bouncing between cassettes.

x2

2008-05-19 3:23 PM
in reply to: #1411522

Subject: ...
This user's post has been ignored.

Edited by JeepFleeb 2008-05-19 3:25 PM


2008-05-19 3:40 PM
in reply to: #1411756

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Subject: RE: Cassette question: 12-23 vs 12-25 and 12-27
JeepFleeb - 2008-05-18 10:23 PM
Dream Chaser - 2008-05-19 2:28 PM
So is there any reason why I wouldn't just get rid of the 12-23 in favor of the 12-25, so I always have an extra two granny gears for the steep climbs??

Does a 12-23 have any advantage over a 12-25?


My opinion is that the 12-27 will make you the faster triathlete.

I want to cover the bike course as fast as I can as easy as I can. I'd rather have the 27 for the hills and headwinds when I need it. I might be giving up a smaller cog or two that I'll need at other times, but better to go too easy than too hard.

Don't forget about that run you've still got to do.

x2 very wise suggestion

I have the same opinion even if very beginner. I always try to feel great when I start running and that is possible using high cadence over 90rpm always. 12-27 makes the life easier on all the cases.

 

2008-05-19 4:55 PM
in reply to: #1411396

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Subject: RE: Cassette question: 12-23 vs 12-25 and 12-27

I've got SRAM 11-23 and 12-26 cassettes that I swap out.  I use the 12-26 for training most of the time.  I don't have to contend with any hills here in Florida, but it helps with the wind.  I mostly use the 11-23 on my HED.3 rear wheel as my "race" cassette.

Mark

2008-05-19 5:03 PM
in reply to: #1411396

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Subject: RE: Cassette question: 12-23 vs 12-25 and 12-27

I'm a somewhat inexperienced biker.  When I got a new bike in 2005, it came with an 11-23.  I found that I didnt have as much power going up hills as I wanted.  I replaced the 11-23 with a 12-27 and found hills to be MUCH easier. 

I don't feel like I gave up much to make this change either.  If I'm pushing the big ring in the front, with either the 11 or the 12 on the back, I'm going down a fairly steep hill.  Under those circumstances, as a triathlete, I'm probably better off tucking in and saving the legs for later.  Let gravity do the work.

I never really felt that I needed an in-between gear for a 12-27. 

Put it this way.  You'll be happy to have the 27 on hills.  You likely won't miss the gears you give up to get it.  Its almost a no-brainer.



Edited by Ridgelake 2008-05-19 5:04 PM
2008-05-19 6:48 PM
in reply to: #1411396

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Subject: RE: Cassette question: 12-23 vs 12-25 and 12-27
I ride a 23 on both bikes. My tri bike is a double front chain ring and the roadie is a triple. When I replace cassettes I will probably go with a 25 on the roadie and a 27 on the tri bike. Pretty hilly around here.
2008-05-19 7:11 PM
in reply to: #1412229

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Subject: RE: Cassette question: 12-23 vs 12-25 and 12-27

At Columbia this weekend (which is a notoriously hilly course) I ran my 11-21 on the disk ........ I never used the 21 ........ Tongue out ........ you would be fine with a 12-25 on just about every course out there.

As long as there is not excessive wear on your chain you will be fine switching the whole cassette over.  If your chain has 2500+ miles on it, get a new chain while your at it.



2008-05-19 7:18 PM
in reply to: #1411396

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Subject: RE: Cassette question: 12-23 vs 12-25 and 12-27

I just got a new bike and when I ordered it I told them I wanted a 12/27 on it.  Like has been sated, I'd rather have it and not need it than need it and not have it.  The 12/27 give you a broader range of grear rations and the only thing  you are giving up is a little "grainularity" (if that word makes sense) in gear choices. 

 

I was concerned that my chain might need an extra link but my LBS showed me when I was in the 59 and 27, I still had 'play' on my derailer.  He then said I should never be cross-chaining (least I think that is the term he use) like that anyway. 

 

~Mike  

2008-05-19 7:28 PM
in reply to: #1412287

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Subject: RE: Cassette question: 12-23 vs 12-25 and 12-27

Rogillio - 2008-05-19 8:18 PM I was concerned that my chain might need an extra link but my LBS showed me when I was in the 59 and 27, I still had 'play' on my derailer.  He then said I should never be cross-chaining (least I think that is the term he use) like that anyway. 

And you shouldn't be running a 59, even if you're Allesandro Pettachi!!

(Edit: Yes, the right term is "cross chaining" which is when you have the extreme gear limits of big to small and small to big, i.e. never use the big chainring and easiest gear in the back and never use the smallest in the front and hardest on the back.  Just put your chain in that position sitting still and then go look at your bike from the bike and you will immediately know why).



Edited by Daremo 2008-05-19 7:31 PM
2008-05-19 7:53 PM
in reply to: #1411396

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Subject: RE: Cassette question: 12-23 vs 12-25 and 12-27

I agree with what Aaron said above. 

Why get ride of one to get another unless the LBS will swap them for free?

I have 4 different cassettes that I use in varying terrains...11-28 for Lake Placid..big up hills and fast down hills, 12-27 standard I use, 12-25 use on flatish race courses, and 12-23 for flat courses.

Having different gears allow you to make a hilly course/ride flatter by using easier gear. It is all relative to how strong a cyclist you are. I'd always rather have more gears I don't need to use then grind up a hill and burn out my legs.

It is a ratio of your power/weight ratio relative to the hills you will be riding.

When I get a new bike, I just pick a different cassette instead of getting the a duplicate of a cassette I already have as I ride my power tap wheel on all my bikes. 



Edited by KathyG 2008-05-19 7:53 PM
2008-05-19 7:59 PM
in reply to: #1411396

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Subject: RE: Cassette question: 12-23 vs 12-25 and 12-27

Bought a new bike with 11-23...my question is: is it possible to just by ONE gear, take off the 11 and put a 25 in the back shifting everything up one?

 

 

2008-05-19 8:28 PM
in reply to: #1412309

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Subject: RE: Cassette question: 12-23 vs 12-25 and 12-27
Daremo - 2008-05-19 7:28 PM

Rogillio - 2008-05-19 8:18 PM I was concerned that my chain might need an extra link but my LBS showed me when I was in the 59 and 27, I still had 'play' on my derailer.  He then said I should never be cross-chaining (least I think that is the term he use) like that anyway. 

And you shouldn't be running a 59, even if you're Allesandro Pettachi!!

 

 

Oops, meant 53....da big one!



2008-05-19 8:59 PM
in reply to: #1412353

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Subject: RE: Cassette question: 12-23 vs 12-25 and 12-27
KathyG - 2008-05-19 2:53 AM

I agree with what Aaron said above.

Why get ride of one to get another unless the LBS will swap them for free?

I have 4 different cassettes that I use in varying terrains...11-28 for Lake Placid..big up hills and fast down hills, 12-27 standard I use, 12-25 use on flatish race courses, and 12-23 for flat courses.

Having different gears allow you to make a hilly course/ride flatter by using easier gear. It is all relative to how strong a cyclist you are. I'd always rather have more gears I don't need to use then grind up a hill and burn out my legs.

It is a ratio of your power/weight ratio relative to the hills you will be riding.

When I get a new bike, I just pick a different cassette instead of getting the a duplicate of a cassette I already have as I ride my power tap wheel on all my bikes.

11-28??? 

Never heard of 28: is that Campagnolo? 

2008-05-19 9:02 PM
in reply to: #1412364

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Subject: RE: Cassette question: 12-23 vs 12-25 and 12-27
mykle15 - 2008-05-19 8:59 PM

Bought a new bike with 11-23...my question is: is it possible to just by ONE gear, take off the 11 and put a 25 in the back shifting everything up one?

Old way you could make up your own cassette..now a days different gears are attached so you can't create your own.

2008-05-19 9:04 PM
in reply to: #1412494

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Subject: RE: Cassette question: 12-23 vs 12-25 and 12-27
Plissken74 - 2008-05-19 9:59 PM
KathyG - 2008-05-19 2:53 AM

I agree with what Aaron said above.

Why get ride of one to get another unless the LBS will swap them for free?

I have 4 different cassettes that I use in varying terrains...11-28 for Lake Placid..big up hills and fast down hills, 12-27 standard I use, 12-25 use on flatish race courses, and 12-23 for flat courses.

Having different gears allow you to make a hilly course/ride flatter by using easier gear. It is all relative to how strong a cyclist you are. I'd always rather have more gears I don't need to use then grind up a hill and burn out my legs.

It is a ratio of your power/weight ratio relative to the hills you will be riding.

When I get a new bike, I just pick a different cassette instead of getting the a duplicate of a cassette I already have as I ride my power tap wheel on all my bikes.

11-28??? 

Never heard of 28: is that Campagnolo? 

Sram makes it and it is Shimano compatiable. It is a bit tricky to get adjusted as Shimano's specs say largest cassette is 27. I rode it on my Orbea over the winter and it worked well and it took a couple trips to bike store to get it adjusted well on my Kuota.

It was designed for hilly courses where you need easier for up hills and a bit more for fast down hills. I see it now on many 2008 women's road bike as it makes it a little easier gearing.

2008-05-19 9:41 PM
in reply to: #1411396

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Subject: RE: Cassette question: 12-23 vs 12-25 and 12-27

12-27 for training (with mid-end, aluminium wheels) and 12-23 (on 50mm carbon race wheels) for racing as the race courses here in Singapore are usually flatter then the routes I train on.

I did use the 12-23 (with carbon wheels) for training a couple of times and didn't notice too much difference because it was offset by the lighter wheels to a degree - at the end of the day, you can always drop to the granny gear if you need to.

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