I just don't understand, and am frustrated

If this is an anomly - fuhgedaboutit! If this is a trend, see if you are overtraining. A heart rate of 180 at 9:13 pace for a person your age seems high.

HR is influence by alot of things.  Fatigue, heat, hydration can all cause you HR to be higher than normal for a workout.  Don't worry about it unless it becomes the 'norm'. 

Not *right* afterwards, but yeah, I did the run after the ride. The ride finished at 10 am, and I took a 2 hour break, and ran at 12 pm. In all honesty, I did a bike TT, because I missed it earlier this week due taking a fall last Saturday on the bike. I wanted to get the TT in to get my heart rate zones for the upcoming training. I was supposed to run first, then do an easy 2 hour spin on the bike. But, last year I was able to do 23 average on the bike in a race, and follow it up with a 7:30ish run. I feel like I've lost fitness, and it sucks! But there's always next year.

Some more info, after my run, I went to the lake office (ran at a park on a lake) to get indoors. My heart rate took a good 20 minutes to go from 180 to 130, which is craaaazy weird. I was pacing back and forth because I felt like I'd pass out if I just sat down. I'm curious if anybody has ever felt like that, with something so out of the norm.

I don't want to sound alarmist, nor am I at all an expert, but yes, this sounds out of the ordinary to me, assuming you are reasonably well trained.  Even after the most awful of blow-ups, I have not seen it take this long for my heart rate to come down (and 130 presumably isn't really 'down' for you).

Maybe a doc on this board will chime in, but in any case, if this happened to me, I'd probably call my doctor and ask what just happened.  Heat stroke and dehydration can lead to increased heart rate, though I have no idea whether it lasts this long, nor whether you should be worried after the fact.  But at the very least, I doubt you'd want to reproduce the conditions that led to this experience, so a little expert knowledge about what the possible causes were could be useful here.

Ok... maybe not 20 minutes, but it took at least 10 to go down from high, to 120-130. Heck, 120-130 is just about my easy run pace, I should be able to easily do a 9 something pace with 120-130 HR. 8 something pace is still comfortable for me, 7 something pace is still achievable, but it's my 1 hour or less pace.

I believe the rule of thumb is your HR should drop 25%, in less then 2 minutes.  Seems I read that somewhere.

Joe

I will have a couple of run days like this each year when the temperature soars.  I experience symptoms similar to what you are describing.  Good hydration and getting acclimated helps immensely.  It typically takes me a week to start feeling somewhat normal running in the heat.  The heat and humidity can definitely affect your run and an hour in that temperature could produce heat injuries if you're not careful.

Sounds like a combination of heat and dehydration.  True overtraining is pretty rare, so I doubt that's what's going on.

Remember that when it gets really hot, you need to pound the fluids. For a 1-hour run in 90-degree heat you should have had at least 20-24oz of some kind of electrolyte drink.

what did you take in for calories and water during the ride? i know a 2 hr hide ride could definitly drain me if i didn't eat right/drink right. . especially if it is the first day with any sort of heat.  also, sometimes we just have 'those days'. .

I ate 2 GU's during the ride. "Breakfast" after the ride. Also, I did get goose bumps during the end of my run. Now that I think of it, that's a sign of heat exhaustion. Wow I'm a dumba** for continuing. I've been bad lately at drinking water too (during my off times).

I saw your initial post and today I was right there with you (minus the biking beforehand), I felt horrible about my run. I had a 6.5 mile run scheduled, which I started around 9:00am. The temp was around 75-80 and after mile two I was just hoping I would run by a house with their sprinkler system running (didn't happen). I averaged 8:30 miles, around a minute 15-30 higher than usual).

Despite my disappointment in how I felt, today I chalked this one up to heat and dehydration. I've had enough good consistent runs over the last few months to still trust in what I am capable of. Had this morning been a race day I would've been properly rested and hydrated; which today, in hindsight, I wasn't. I also don't think I'm acclimated to the summer/spring heat. Keep the faith, I would only be alarmed if this type of performance continues.


Edited by Barkeep 2009-05-24 1:26 AM

Sounds as if you had a heat injury.  I have had one before and had the same symptoms.  Mine was pretty bad and since the wife is a nurse, she was able to give me an IV at the house.  I caution you to really watch yourself in the heat.  You are potentially more suspect for future injuries if you are not taking the right precautions.  Everyone before has already commented on pushing fluids and it food consumption was mentioned.  My injury was brought on by not eating and not drinking enough water after working out in the morning and at lunch.  I became dizzy, disoriented, had goose bumps, rapid breathing and nausated.  After trying to eat something, it came right back up.  I was lucky and should have went to the hospital.  Just watch yourself and at the first signs of symptoms, take a break.   

almost exactly how my run went yesterday.   i ran 8 miles on Thursday in the rain.   it was cool and very comfortable.   finished the run very easy and relaxed in a 8:40 pace.   attempted the same run yesterday and only got to mile 6 and stopped.   my HR hit 182 and i was spent.   Thursday my HR only got up to 170.   no doubt the weather conditions played a huge role in the runs.   Thursday was cool and comfortable.   yesterday was overcast and very very humid.   i probably didn't hydrate well and the sun sucked everything out of me.   living in Florida it'll do that to you    i should have known better.

just plan ahead a bit better next time.   i was telling myself at mile 4 yesterday that i wish i had my fuelbelt with me and that next time i'll bring it along.   i was sweating buckets even at mile 4.   i learned a lesson though

The heat will definitely do this, and especially after you already biked.  Don't think you took enough fluids in, and I may be wrong but if not doing a brick I thought you are supposed to get at least 4 hours between workouts to get the maximum out of them.

It is a bit concerning that it took that long for your heart rate to drop below 100 - that should happen pretty fast, and says to me you were REALLY dehydrated.

maybe a sweat test to see what you lose in that weather.....

Really? 4 hours? I didn't know that. I'll remember that for next time.

Also, anybody have a quick link for the sweat test? I'll do a search :-)

I've really gotta get back to drinking enough water.

I did a run on Thursday and it was really humid out.  My HR was all over the place.  I wasn't frustrated just confused why it was that way.  My trainer told me it was the heat factor.  I ate before hand, hydrated before and during my run.  I was told the heat plays a big factor in what your HR does.  I didn't have a HR monitor last summer, i got it this winter so it was my first experience using it. 

Make sure in your attempt to drink water that you don't drink ONLY water.  It will dehydrate you and clean out your system.  You need to have a healthy balance and keep your electorlytes in check.   I think once you adjust to the heat again and get in plenty of fluids you will be fine.


Christine

Drinking only water won't dehydrate you.  If you exercise long enough to need electrolyte replacement (my rule of thumb for myself is over an hour running or 1.5 hours on the bike) you can get hyponatremia but that isn't the same as dehydration. 

In this case, I agree I think the heat combined with the earlier exertion in the heat got the OP.  I'm glad the OP now recognizes those symptoms so hopefully it won't happen again or if it does will be addressed sooner. 

My short answer is to never get frustrated after one bad workout.

Just take the feedback and roll with it. If you think you were mildly dehydrated drink an extra bottle every day. My body dehydrates quickly and rehydrates slowly so I remain heavily hydrated all the time to take that possibility off the table. If you think you were just at a weak point in your training cycle, take a day off. If you have no idea what happened just move on. Bad workouts happen all the time to serious athletes.

I had a similar one last Tuesday.  For me it was after only 1 day's rest post-race, the first time I had run in 80+ degree weather and I was probably dehydrated.  If it's any consolation, I went out for tempo run two days later and felt great, and did a 2 mile run as the second half of a brick and was comfortably (lower HR) at a pace that was back to what I thought it should be.  Unless it becomes a trend, I wouldn't worry about it.

sweat test: weigh yourself before your bike/run (naked) do it again afterwards - also subtract the amount of fluid you took in

ie if I weigh 143 before running one hour, and 140 afterwards and I drank 8 ounces then my sweat rate is 3.5 pounds per hour

nm

Edited by TriToy 2009-05-24 11:29 AM

You did a very hard effort on the bike and only a short time later tried to do a run with several hard efforts in the warmest temperatures you have run in this season.

I would suggest you follow your plan; if you miss a workout then let it go; don't try to make it up and definitely don't try to do it on the same day with another hard workout.

Shane

Edited by gsmacleod 2009-05-24 11:39 AM