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2010-09-03 1:06 PM
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Subject: RE: Does it bug you....
Fastyellow - 2010-09-02 4:36 PM

I guess I should make it clear that all I care about at this point is winning my age group...or how I place in that.

When I'm going for overalls in the future...then I guess it won't matter.

I do still think "forgetting" your bib is BS....If I have to take the time to put it on...so should everyone else...or risk a penalty.



i've come back from the race on 3 seperate days where my bib/belt were not there. twice i found them 100 feet away where they blew when someone moved my shoes, another time i never found it.

but i did it just o spite you


2010-09-03 1:41 PM
in reply to: #3079542

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Subject: RE: Does it bug you....
I've never seen a " rule," either from the USAT or the RD that said "Thou shalt have thy age marked on thy calf." I suppose there may be an instance where the RD did make it a rule, but I believe that would be the exception. Second, like others I would not have enough in the tank to do anything about it. It recently happened to me in the last 1/4 mile and there was nothing I could do but finish 2nd AG . Of course the guy was running 6m/m to my 8.
2010-09-03 1:44 PM
in reply to: #3079542

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Subject: RE: Does it bug you....
bryancd states that he doesn't change his race strategy based on any other AG competitor.  Seems to have worked well for him  
2010-09-03 1:57 PM
in reply to: #3080967

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Subject: RE: Does it bug you....
the bear - 2010-09-04 2:41 AM I've never seen a " rule," either from the USAT or the RD that said "Thou shalt have thy age marked on thy calf." I suppose there may be an instance where the RD did make it a rule, but I believe that would be the exception. Second, like others I would not have enough in the tank to do anything about it. It recently happened to me in the last 1/4 mile and there was nothing I could do but finish 2nd AG . Of course the guy was running 6m/m to my 8.


There you go. On issue #1, technically, people could refuse to have their calves marked altogether. Still within the rules. Another reason I haven't seen mentioned is calf numbers are also so officials can make sure people really are starting in the right waves. Anyhow, calf numbers wear off. Often. Can you think of a better system that people would want to implement?

On issue #2, you're definitely right. There are should-be penalties that bother me a lot more, like drafting, but considering that's almost never a problem for me personally, I don't care.
2010-09-03 2:11 PM
in reply to: #3079551

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Subject: RE: Does it bug you....
Fastyellow - 2010-09-02 6:28 PM
COSkiGirl - 2010-09-02 3:25 PM Seriously, how does a leg marking affect your race? 


Seriously? If someone passes me 100 yards from the finish line...I'd really like to know their age group...that would completely determine how I respond.

ETA: it also lets you know where you stand in the race by how many people pass you. If I'm first out of the water, I know exactly where I stand...unless some guy comes by with no marking.


So if the person was not in your AG, you would be content to know you didn't give your all on the finish?  This really doesn't make sense to me.  And if you are able to race while keeping a running tally of your placement in your AG as you race...I am just plain impressed.  Or you are just not racing hard enough for it to matter.  (I do keep track of people passing me on the run, but I am SLLOOOOOWWWW)
2010-09-03 2:17 PM
in reply to: #3080973

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Subject: RE: Does it bug you....
ChrisM - 2010-09-03 12:44 PM

bryancd states that he doesn't change his race strategy based on any other AG competitor.  Seems to have worked well for him  


Well, during the course of an IM, but at the very end all bets are off! I'm just not at mile 36 of the bike chasing AG dudes around.

The only issue I have is that everyone should follow the rules, be they wearing of a race belt or marking their age. If there's no rule stipulating that then that's it.

Edited by bryancd 2010-09-03 2:17 PM


2010-09-03 3:03 PM
in reply to: #3079656

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Subject: RE: Does it bug you....
nc452010 - 2010-09-02 7:58 PM I still don't "get" the whole marking thing, anyways.  What's the purpose?

The only thing I can think of is.....identifying a body.


thats why they put your number on your hand - so that they dont have to remove the wetsuit from your corpse.
2010-09-03 8:14 PM
in reply to: #3079542

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Subject: RE: Does it bug you....
My calf numbers tend to be gone by the end of races... anyway I check out people calves, but ultimately I'm out there racing everyone.  Difficult to say where you're at due the nature of wave starts, TT starts etc. so I'm just passing everyone I can and trying not to be passed.  I find out how I did when they start posting results.  
2010-09-04 12:39 AM
in reply to: #3079542

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Subject: RE: Does it bug you....
I have done body marking several times at triathlons and most of the comments are correct.  The biggest concern is safety.  If you crash or have a medical issue that renders you unable to identify yourself, your number can be matched and treatment can begin.  (of course a road ID could help to...I am not connected nor sell road ID).

And it is true that not only are most markings gones by the end of the race, but I have seen them erased by sweat and sun tan lotions before the swim even begins.

As far as where you are marked, the RD tells volunteers where to mark.  At Iron Girl Las Vegas we marked both front thighs, right calf, and the back of whichever hand you were not going to use to wipe your nose.

Another reason for your numbers both on your body and race bib is at the end of the race.  Most transition areas are blocked off from non athletes and bikes are only allowed out if they match the number on the athlete.  Volunteers always take alot of flack for this delay in exiting, but remember we are trying to protect your equipment and your investment.  If we didn't match bike to number anyone could walk off with your baby.

As a side note, guys you should def volunteer to do body marking.  Grabbing that muscular calf and thigh so you can print those numbers on without smearing is a dream come true.

Edited by SWIM2LIVE 2010-09-04 12:41 AM
2010-09-04 6:55 AM
in reply to: #3079542

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Subject: RE: Does it bug you....
It bugs me, too. I got passed in the last 1/4 mile by a guy with no mark at my last race who turned out to be in my AG. I do fight harder when it's a guy in my AG than I would anyone else.
2010-09-04 11:46 AM
in reply to: #3079542

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Subject: RE: Does it bug you....
i lost podium by 7 seconds in a big race because the guy passed me looked young and i didn't think he was in my AG....so i got 4th instead of 3rd....he passed me in the last .25 mile and i would have definitely mustered some strength if i knew that.

could care less about bib number...but number on the calf is important to me...


2010-09-04 11:53 AM
in reply to: #3079542

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Subject: RE: Does it bug you....
sometimes ya know despite of age you just got to HTFU!
2010-09-04 12:26 PM
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Subject: RE: Does it bug you....
monkeyboy64 - 2010-09-04 6:55 AM It bugs me, too. I got passed in the last 1/4 mile by a guy with no mark at my last race who turned out to be in my AG. I do fight harder when it's a guy in my AG than I would anyone else.


trix - 2010-09-04 11:46 AM i lost podium by 7 seconds in a big race because the guy passed me looked young and i didn't think he was in my AG....so i got 4th instead of 3rd....he passed me in the last .25 mile and i would have definitely mustered some strength if i knew that.

could care less about bib number...but number on the calf is important to me...


That's what you both get for loafing in the last mile . If you had anything left to give, why didn't you give it, regardless of who was passing you?

Edited by the bear 2010-09-04 12:27 PM
2010-09-04 1:02 PM
in reply to: #3079774

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Subject: RE: Does it bug you....
Karibu - 2010-09-02 10:00 PM Fastyellow I am completely with you.
2010-09-04 1:02 PM
in reply to: #3079774

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Subject: RE: Does it bug you....
Karibu - 2010-09-02 10:00 PM Fastyellow I am completely with you.


Me too. 

For goodness sakes, you enter a race - abide by the rules.  If you don't like the rules - don't enter. 

Edited by gts 2010-09-04 1:05 PM
2010-09-04 1:09 PM
in reply to: #3082088

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Subject: RE: Does it bug you....
gts - 2010-09-04 1:02 PM
Karibu - 2010-09-02 10:00 PM Fastyellow I am completely with you.


Me too. 

For goodness sakes, you enter a race - abide by the rules.  If you don't like the rules - don't enter. 


Exactly what rule is not being abided?


2010-09-04 1:26 PM
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Subject: RE: Does it bug you....
gts - 2010-09-04 12:02 PM

Karibu - 2010-09-02 10:00 PM Fastyellow I am completely with you.


Me too.

For goodness sakes, you enter a race - abide by the rules. If you don't like the rules - don't enter.




For goodness sakes, THERE IS NO RULE PER USAT OR WTC THAT I KNOW OF FOR AG MARKINGS.......


And there is a very very good chance even if it was on there it was gone by the time the swim was over.

On the times i actually use something to help get it off, i use PAM in my wetsuit. it will take a number off in seconds.

2010-09-04 1:33 PM
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Subject: RE: Does it bug you....
No one passes me in the last .25 of a race.  Problem solved.

It hasn't happened yet.  I don't anticipate it happening in the future.

(Now if I could just get them to stop passing me for the other 99% of the race).

Edited by pga_mike 2010-09-04 1:34 PM
2010-09-04 1:50 PM
in reply to: #3079542

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Subject: RE: Does it bug you....
If I ever get to the point that I'm competing for the podium- maaybe.  But seeing as I paid to race, I wouldn't just let up a little before the finish- regardless of who's chasing me down or just passed.
2010-09-04 2:56 PM
in reply to: #3082105

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Subject: RE: Does it bug you....
newbz - 2010-09-04 11:26 AM
gts - 2010-09-04 12:02 PM
Karibu - 2010-09-02 10:00 PM Fastyellow I am completely with you.


Me too.

For goodness sakes, you enter a race - abide by the rules. If you don't like the rules - don't enter.
For goodness sakes, THERE IS NO RULE PER USAT OR WTC THAT I KNOW OF FOR AG MARKINGS....... And there is a very very good chance even if it was on there it was gone by the time the swim was over. On the times i actually use something to help get it off, i use PAM in my wetsuit. it will take a number off in seconds.


Well there is a rule about your number that you have sometimes lost....from USAT:

??f. Race Numbers. Participants shall plainly display their race numbers at all times, and shall maintain the race number in an unaltered, unobstructed and readable state at the start and finish gates, in the transition areas, and on the course. Any violation of this Section shall result in a variable time penalty.

So you are responsible for your bib.

I have a question then about the rules. I was unable to find anything about body markings (race number or AG) in the USAT rules. So does that mean that body markings are optional? If they are indeed completely optional, then I would have zero case with regards to AG markings.

It was my understanding that maybe they fell into some clause that says the RD can make them mandatory...or something to that effect.
2010-09-04 3:20 PM
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Subject: RE: Does it bug you....
Fastyellow - 2010-09-04 2:56 PM
newbz - 2010-09-04 11:26 AM
gts - 2010-09-04 12:02 PM
Karibu - 2010-09-02 10:00 PM Fastyellow I am completely with you.


Me too.

For goodness sakes, you enter a race - abide by the rules. If you don't like the rules - don't enter.
For goodness sakes, THERE IS NO RULE PER USAT OR WTC THAT I KNOW OF FOR AG MARKINGS....... And there is a very very good chance even if it was on there it was gone by the time the swim was over. On the times i actually use something to help get it off, i use PAM in my wetsuit. it will take a number off in seconds.


Well there is a rule about your number that you have sometimes lost....from USAT:

??f. Race Numbers. Participants shall plainly display their race numbers at all times, and shall maintain the race number in an unaltered, unobstructed and readable state at the start and finish gates, in the transition areas, and on the course. Any violation of this Section shall result in a variable time penalty.

So you are responsible for your bib.

I have a question then about the rules. I was unable to find anything about body markings (race number or AG) in the USAT rules. So does that mean that body markings are optional? If they are indeed completely optional, then I would have zero case with regards to AG markings.

It was my understanding that maybe they fell into some clause that says the RD can make them mandatory...or something to that effect.


As I've been saying all along. As a USAT official I know of no rule, nor have i ever heard of an individual RD trying to impose such a rule. The USAT has a procedure should a RD want to do so, but I've never heard that one has.

I've been in many USAT-sanctioned races where they didn't even mark your age.

I can also say, as an official, that bib number markings are of little use. As has been pointed out numerous times here, they tend to get faded, smeared, and obliterated during the course of a race. It's a redundant device, I prefer to look for the actual bib or bike number.

One of the funniest things I've ever encountered was an over-ambitious marker at REV3 insisting that I remove my shirt so that she could mark my upper arm, even after I told her I was wearing long sleeves throughout the race.





2010-09-04 3:32 PM
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2010-09-04 3:35 PM
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Subject: RE: Does it bug you....

PennState - 2010-09-04 3:32 PM I love when people get outraged about rules being broken that aren't even rules


Yep. Should be a rule against that.
Cool
2010-09-04 3:38 PM
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Subject: RE: Does it bug you....
PennState - 2010-09-04 1:32 PM I love when people get outraged about rules being broken that aren't even rules


Outraged is a little harsh...lol

I wouldn't say I'm outraged ( I used the word bugged ) . But when a race official announces that body markings are being done....doesn't that sound kind of like a rule or requirement of that race to say the least? It's not like they announce it as "Optional body markings are being done should you so desire"

I guess from now on I'll just get the markings if they are convenient and I have time, as they are obviously not required.
2010-09-04 3:40 PM
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