50K training plans?

The wife and I are actually doing our first 50k on Saturday - one of the North Face Challenge Series events - and just followed a regular marathon training plan. Long run was 22 miles. I should say, though, that we are planning on doing a run/walk split - nine minute run/one minute walk - for the whole thing. Don't know if people generally run the whole thing or take intentional walk breaks, but that might influence your training plan.

Good luck, and congrats on finishing IM WI!

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Edited by trid 2010-09-16 1:43 PM

Oooooo that is perfect! Except I wish the plan it pumped out was longer than 13 weeks. Maybe that is ok though?
The race is The Cowtown in Ft Worth, TX on Feb. 27
http://www.cowtownmarathon.org/

THANKS!!

Edit: I found this training plan which is 26 weeks, but the longest run is 20 only miles (three of them though)...
http://www.desertskyadventures.com/resources/plans/50k.html



Edited by lisac957 2010-09-16 2:02 PM

I think if your race is flat no need to go crazy with milage and long runs, a little extra on the long runs of a normal marathon program would probably adequate. Looking at your log and your IM race report I think you can take your own advice though and train for Distance not Time.

Be careful. You are very deficient in run training, and I think you must have felt that in your HIM and IM. I don't say that to desuade you. I did my first 50k on the back of a 2:18 HM PR with about 2-3 months of what seemed like lots of very slow running/walking. Well, to be honest at the time it seemed like lots, but in actuality it was only a couple 10k jogs a week and back to back 20-30ks on the weekend (and those 20-30l would take me 3 - 4.5 hours). I also did not have an IM in my back pocket at the time.

Oh, okay, you have 6 months (missed that before). Yeah, I mean the above applies, if I were you I would try to slowly ramp up your milage as high as you are comfortable with. By December you could very well be in the 70k range per week as long as it is slow and you take it easy, walking a bit. Stop biking and swiming so much. eek..... Then in December you could start a 12 week plan, maybe. Probably try to find a 10k race and a HM race that you can you can run too, maybe, if you are scared you will get bored.

If your race is hilly, you need to tackle hills that are are similar in slope to the ones you will be runnning up and down, you do that again and again and again and again and again. Walking up, running down, walking up, running down...it sucks.

At the end of the day, ultras are time on your feet, if you practice that and you are unconcerned about finish time, you will be fine.

Desertskyadventures.com has a 26 week 50K plan that I have been going off of for my 50K in November (although I injured myself cycling of all things at the end of July and had to take three weeks off. But I'm better now! )

link: http://www.desertskyadventures.com/resources/plans/50k.html

Does not start out too ambitious and builds nicely.

Might be what you are looking for.

Good roads!
Buck

hal higdon now has an ultra plan and redid his website halhigdon.com

Lisa,
Congrats on signing up for the Cowtown 50K.  I'm pretty confident that marathon training should be sufficient training for your 50K...since you don't have a lot of run miles it might be good to hit some softer surfaces as you increase your miles.  I don't know what the Cowtown course looks like, but I'm sure running on some trails (Pawnee Prairie Park by the airport in Wichita has some) or even the grassy part of College Hill Park will help you increase your miles injury free.  I think with the ultra stuff it is more about time on your feet rather than pace.

I saw that but it looks like it's for a 54-mile run. I just need it for a 50K...

Thanks Zach... I need to check out that park. Definitely need a change in scenery for my long runs.

Lisa,

Take a look at this plan and see what you think.

www.rockcreek.com/articles/trail_running/articles/Make_The_Stumpjump_Your_First_50k.asp

Good luck!

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Edited by trid 2010-09-21 6:40 PM

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Just saw this post^^^^.

I try to always do a recovery run after my long run day. So I try to run long on Saturday and then do a 4-5 miler on Sunday to loosen up the legs and get the "feel" of running on tired legs.

Just my 2 cents worth!

YAY, glad I ventured back to the forums! Nice to see this addition.
I am thinking of trying a 50K trail race here in WI in May 2011. There is a marathon Mar 27 that is 1/2 on trails, and I am thinking it might be a good training run, especially if I do a 8-10 miler the day before or after-- (Most plans online seem to rely on back to back long runs)  Also thinking maybe of hiring a coach to get me there safely. (I have no interest in any speed work, or time goals, I just want to be able to run in the woods for as long/far as possible..)

Has anyone hired a coach for ultras?  Any recommendations? 

Has anyone run the Ice Age Trail 50?

I would not recommend doing the marathon. I think it would just take too much time to recover from that. A long run of 20 miles is more in line with what you can safely recover from during training, no matter what the distance you are training for, especially for a first timer.
I have only done one 50K, but my long run before that was not even close to 20 miles. Andrew and I just went through my old BT blogs, and besides him laughing at the stuff I was up to back then, we discovered a run of 11 miles about a month before the 50K. And I had a strong race. Not fast, but picked up speed throughout the race. And I had SO MUCH FUN!
Maybe you can find a trail HALF marathon to do and have back to back long runs of 13-15 miles instead.

I agree that a marathon in March might not be the best idea.

Looking at your mileage for the year you would have to start training a few weeks ago to slowing build volume to attempt the marathon.
After a few weeks of recovery you only have 2 weeks to train before starting your taper for the 50K.


I'm doing a very conservative plan for a March 50K with a slow build of mileage at very easy paces and running 6 days a week. Basically, focusing on volume over intensity with a plan of not getting injured.

Thanks for the thoughts- yeah, I pretty much HATE running on roads (as much as I love trails) I get too beat up/injured, but I never feel anything but tired after running on trails/dirt. I don't even like WALKING on asphalt, so training for a road marathon to prepare for a 50K on trails =no fun at ALL.

And maybe no 50K, I seem to not have the focus right now. I do NOT want to get hurt, I love the woods too much. Maybe I'll shoot for the North Face Endurance Challenge later in the summer.  I'll just stalk you guys...

Well, Hollis...I guess I came into the Ultra forum for a reason...I might be having a little bit of a desire to do a race in March and I am really soul-searching about whether it's something I want to commit to. If I decide to do it, I'll write my own plan and pass it on to you, too. I'm with you on the trail running. I don't live in an area with great nearby trails, which is a real stinker. At least I live close to the end of suburbia, beyond which are endless quiet country roads.

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Possum, 

Have you done any marathons?  If so, how did you feel after?  (Just a caveat, I was far more sore after my marathon in May than I was after my 50-miler last year.) 

I poked around, and Ice Age is May 14, so you've got about 7 weeks between the marathon and ultra.  That's plenty of time if you're well trained and follow a decent marathon strategy (assuming your ultra is the more important "race").  If you can build up to 20-22 miles before the marathon, run it (smartly) and don't worry about doing another 8-10 the day before or day after.  Figure on a week or two of light running after the marathon, another long run (20-22 miles), and then a taper to the ultra. 

If you run the marathon, use it as a day to practice pacing for your ultra.  If you're targeting a 7:00 50K (a 13:30 pace), try to run the marathon in 5:50--5:55 (13:12--13:33 pace). 

Once you enter the ultra world, you find people doing 100-mile races on back-to-back (one lady last year did 100-milers on more than 10 consecutive weekends).  I did a marathon on Friday night and a 30-mile trail run on Saturday the end of October (not that I'm encouraging such nonsense...just that it can be done...)  Key is doing your running at a pace you can sustain f-o-r-e-v-e-r. 

To the OP.  There's not a lot of difference between a marathon and a 50K, so as long as you're training on the appropriate terrain, you can follow an appropriate marathon plan.  (Beware of time-based plans if you're training for a trail run.  Trail runs are usually quite a bit slower, so a 3-hour trail run might be 13-15 miles, and that wouldn't be sufficient for an ultra.) 

For a couple of the long runs, you can do a mid-length run the day before or after.  Running "tired" is a slightly different gait, and you'll want to build up those muscles. 

Otherwise, go into the training and race with a solid strategy.  Most ultra runners walk uphills even early in the race.  There's plenty of time to go nuts in the last 5 miles. 

Does Cowtown have creek crossings?  Running in wet shoes is another aspect of ultras that takes an adjustment. 

On the upside, you can think of ultras as "outdoor buffets"  (although you'll need to be careful given your food allergies).  M&M's, cookies, potato chips, licorice/twizzlers and of course the usual bagels/fruit. 

Love this advice. All of it.  I realize now that what I thought I could do, and the training I was willing to do during a fantastic fall season, change abruptly for me when it is cold and snowy. Started a new job. Family in transition. Now is not my time. But before i die... That race shall be MINE.

Oh, and yeah, I've run marathons, and generally I feel OK after, sore, but not miserable. I am NOT a racer, so I rarely push that hard. My biggest problem seems to be that I run one pace ALL the time, and find going any faster or slower to simply be unfun, so I don't do it.  I'm too old for unfun.