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2010-09-20 10:13 AM

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Subject: Why even consider long course triathlons?
Have any of you questioned what you are doing in regards to triathlons? I am asking this because a girl here at work was just told that her running career is over. She has been running for the last 20 years including several marathons but cut back the last 5 years or so because she was having back pain. Over the last 6 months or so she has been seeing a physical therapist to help work through it but she is being told now that running has to stop because of the constant pounding she needs to switch to low-impact workouts (elliptical, swimming, etc).  She is devistated but apparently not alone in being told that the running is not really all that great for your joints, back or soft tissues.

It got me thinking if she had stuck to short course only limiting runs to 3-5 miles with only an occasional long run for special occasions or perhaps a HM one or two times per year would she still be in this position? What am I doing to myself and my body by running? She probably only weight 100 pounds so I would assume the extra 75 pounds I carry around has to cause additional stress on the joints and back. Already I have problems returning to an upright position if I bend over almost like I am stuck there and the only way to get back to normal is to roll up very slowly rather than straighten up.

So is this normal anxiety? Should I be concerned that I may do irreparable damage to my body over time and if I truly plan to do more long course running in the future is this something that is likely to happen to me as well? Perhaps I should limit myself to short courses like Olympic with an occasional HM thrown in just for fun. Ughh…this exercise thing is supposed to be a healthy endeavor but it seems that the longer course stuff is really not all puppy dogs and rainbows. Lots to think about over the next few months when I sit down with my family to discuss IronMan next year as a possibility.


2010-09-20 10:17 AM
in reply to: #3107714

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Subject: RE: Why even consider long course triathlons?
I have 2 compressed disks on my spine, osteoarthritis in my spine, and spinal stenosis, all diagnosed at age 35, I'm 37 now. My doc at the pain clinic is a runner and cyclist. I was afraid she was going to tell me to stop running. I was thrilled when she told me to keep on going. She told me my back was going to get worse whether I ran or I sat on the couch, so I might as well take care of the rest of me and do what I enjoy. I'm running a marathon the end of October.

If you can run, then run. What's coming will come, you'll just have to deal with it when/if it does.
2010-09-20 10:20 AM
in reply to: #3107714

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Subject: RE: Why even consider long course triathlons?
Batlou - 2010-09-20 10:13 AM Have any of you questioned what you are doing in regards to triathlons? I am asking this because a girl here at work was just told that her running career is over. She has been running for the last 20 years including several marathons but cut back the last 5 years or so because she was having back pain. Over the last 6 months or so she has been seeing a physical therapist to help work through it but she is being told now that running has to stop because of the constant pounding she needs to switch to low-impact workouts (elliptical, swimming, etc).  She is devistated but apparently not alone in being told that the running is not really all that great for your joints, back or soft tissues.

It got me thinking if she had stuck to short course only limiting runs to 3-5 miles with only an occasional long run for special occasions or perhaps a HM one or two times per year would she still be in this position? What am I doing to myself and my body by running? She probably only weight 100 pounds so I would assume the extra 75 pounds I carry around has to cause additional stress on the joints and back. Already I have problems returning to an upright position if I bend over almost like I am stuck there and the only way to get back to normal is to roll up very slowly rather than straighten up.

So is this normal anxiety? Should I be concerned that I may do irreparable damage to my body over time and if I truly plan to do more long course running in the future is this something that is likely to happen to me as well? Perhaps I should limit myself to short courses like Olympic with an occasional HM thrown in just for fun. Ughh…this exercise thing is supposed to be a healthy endeavor but it seems that the longer course stuff is really not all puppy dogs and rainbows. Lots to think about over the next few months when I sit down with my family to discuss IronMan next year as a possibility.


the current evidence doesn't supports that claim/assumption.
2010-09-20 10:20 AM
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Subject: RE: Why even consider long course triathlons?
You can also get hit by a car the next time you go out either biking or running. Should you curtail your workouts due to that very real risk?

It's all about risk/benefit and what you believe is worth avoiding versus living to the fullest.
2010-09-20 10:21 AM
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Subject: RE: Why even consider long course triathlons?
I'm new to triathlons, but I've been running for a long time.

My general rule is to listen to my body. If I feel something that isn't right I'll stop running and walk home. If I get hurt (or a hint at an injury) I'll take time off. As a result, I've never had a serious running-related injury.

Form also can contribute to injuries. This year I've focused on going away from heel striking, and I'm hoping this can alleviate possible future injuries by being less jarring.

Being smart is part of it. Stretching pre and post workout, strength training, and doing core exercises and yoga will also help out.
2010-09-20 10:21 AM
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Subject: RE: Why even consider long course triathlons?
The correlation between being a runner and her health problems is not the same thing as causation.  Most of my social group consists of long term runners who run 50-70 miles per week and have done so for 10-40 years and none of them have any of those problems.  I have a hard time believing that a running career consisting of only several marathons could be the cause of her issues unless there were other underlying problems or causes as well. 






2010-09-20 10:22 AM
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Subject: RE: Why even consider long course triathlons?
If you can run, then run. What's coming will come, you'll just have to deal with it when/if it does.


Bingo!


I seriously doubt long course/short course had anythung to do with her injuries.


2010-09-20 10:28 AM
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Subject: RE: Why even consider long course triathlons?
natethomas2000 - 2010-09-20 10:21 AM I'm new to triathlons, but I've been running for a long time.

My general rule is to listen to my body. If I feel something that isn't right I'll stop running and walk home. If I get hurt (or a hint at an injury) I'll take time off. As a result, I've never had a serious running-related injury.





Ditto.  Lots of people use phrases like "train through the pain" and stuff like that as mottos or examples of how hardcore they are.  There's a difference between pain and injury...if I even suspect a possible injury at all (normally if it's anything besides just tired or sore muscles) I give it a rest.

That being said, sometimes that doesn't always work.  Some people have very resilient bodies that take the beating, and some people break down.  That's why you see some pro athletes still going strong at 40 and some making a rapid decline at 30.  It's not necessraily soomething they did or didn't do...just luck of the draw.
2010-09-20 10:56 AM
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Subject: RE: Why even consider long course triathlons?
Caveat to what's been said (which I basically agree with, based on a running history that goes back to 1975):  Weight does matter.  Not always PC to say that on a "beginner" forum, but it's true.  I have fewer issues with tendonitis in my feet running at 165 than I did at 205 (and have been able to switch from rigid prescription orthotics to off-the-rack insoles).  My boss (who has multiple marathon finishes) has historically run while VERY overweight and now, at age 50, is paying for it...had multiple meniscus tears repaired recently after a few years of trying unsuccessfully to overcome severe knee pain.  The reality is that this is the sort of degenerative injury that can be exacerbated by weight.  IMO, the added pounding from weight is probably a bigger deal than the added wear from extra miles.
2010-09-20 11:01 AM
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Subject: RE: Why even consider long course triathlons?
JorgeM - 2010-09-20 10:20 AM
Batlou - 2010-09-20 10:13 AM Have any of you questioned what you are doing in regards to triathlons? I am asking this because a girl here at work was just told that her running career is over. She has been running for the last 20 years including several marathons but cut back the last 5 years or so because she was having back pain. Over the last 6 months or so she has been seeing a physical therapist to help work through it but she is being told now that running has to stop because of the constant pounding she needs to switch to low-impact workouts (elliptical, swimming, etc).  She is devistated but apparently not alone in being told that the running is not really all that great for your joints, back or soft tissues.

It got me thinking if she had stuck to short course only limiting runs to 3-5 miles with only an occasional long run for special occasions or perhaps a HM one or two times per year would she still be in this position? What am I doing to myself and my body by running? She probably only weight 100 pounds so I would assume the extra 75 pounds I carry around has to cause additional stress on the joints and back. Already I have problems returning to an upright position if I bend over almost like I am stuck there and the only way to get back to normal is to roll up very slowly rather than straighten up.

So is this normal anxiety? Should I be concerned that I may do irreparable damage to my body over time and if I truly plan to do more long course running in the future is this something that is likely to happen to me as well? Perhaps I should limit myself to short courses like Olympic with an occasional HM thrown in just for fun. Ughh…this exercise thing is supposed to be a healthy endeavor but it seems that the longer course stuff is really not all puppy dogs and rainbows. Lots to think about over the next few months when I sit down with my family to discuss IronMan next year as a possibility.


the current evidence doesn't supports that claim/assumption.


Reposting this because it is SO important.  She needs a second opinion.  
2010-09-20 11:04 AM
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Subject: RE: Why even consider long course triathlons?
I do it because it's there.

My COMPLETELY PERSONAL, ANECDOTAL, NON-SCIENTIFIC-BASED, opinion on the matter is that it has more to do with proper running technique than it does distance. If you run 10 miles a week with poor form, you'll likely develop some sort of problems (the word likely has my bolded disclaimer attached to it as well) and if you run 50 with good form, you won't.

I have a torn meniscus right now, as well as a stress fracture. When I run in my VFF's, my meniscus gives me no problems and when I run in my Asics, my foot gives me no problems. My form is slightly different in the two shoes, as I tend to roll from the outside of my forefoot with the VFF's, as opposed to more mid-strike and flat with my Asics.

My causation=correlation statement of the day means that it's about technique.


2010-09-20 11:27 AM
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Subject: RE: Why even consider long course triathlons?
Here's my recent inspiration.....

I'm 6'1"/190#'s.  A buddy of mine did his 1st tri, yesterday, at 6'/197#'s on 4wks training.

He beat me by 6min.'s (+/-).  His cycling leg (he bought a bike the week of 8/22 and ran the sprint, yesterday) was at over 21mph..  His 5K leg was a hair over 22min..  He finished (@ 38) 21st out of 441 that finished the race.

He's been running and weight training for years.  I'm thinking........if he can do that at his weight/size..........
2010-09-20 11:29 AM
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Subject: RE: Why even consider long course triathlons?
Thanks for all of the responses.  Just listening to her talk about it freaked me out a bit so I was curious as to whether or not my concerns where real.  I did suggest she go get a second opinion from a physical therapy place that specializes in dealing with athletes.  I sort of got the feeling that the person giving this advice is not athletic and/or does not exercise much so has a hard time understanding quitting running is not as simple as just stopping.

Sounds like form and listening to your body are key to long term success.  Beyond that it's really in Gods hands as to how our body's reacts over time.  I am OK with that.

2010-09-20 11:30 AM
in reply to: #3107866

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Subject: RE: Why even consider long course triathlons?
quincyf - 2010-09-20 9:01 AM
JorgeM - 2010-09-20 10:20 AM
Batlou - 2010-09-20 10:13 AM Have any of you questioned what you are doing in regards to triathlons? I am asking this because a girl here at work was just told that her running career is over. She has been running for the last 20 years including several marathons but cut back the last 5 years or so because she was having back pain. Over the last 6 months or so she has been seeing a physical therapist to help work through it but she is being told now that running has to stop because of the constant pounding she needs to switch to low-impact workouts (elliptical, swimming, etc).  She is devistated but apparently not alone in being told that the running is not really all that great for your joints, back or soft tissues.

It got me thinking if she had stuck to short course only limiting runs to 3-5 miles with only an occasional long run for special occasions or perhaps a HM one or two times per year would she still be in this position? What am I doing to myself and my body by running? She probably only weight 100 pounds so I would assume the extra 75 pounds I carry around has to cause additional stress on the joints and back. Already I have problems returning to an upright position if I bend over almost like I am stuck there and the only way to get back to normal is to roll up very slowly rather than straighten up.

So is this normal anxiety? Should I be concerned that I may do irreparable damage to my body over time and if I truly plan to do more long course running in the future is this something that is likely to happen to me as well? Perhaps I should limit myself to short courses like Olympic with an occasional HM thrown in just for fun. Ughh…this exercise thing is supposed to be a healthy endeavor but it seems that the longer course stuff is really not all puppy dogs and rainbows. Lots to think about over the next few months when I sit down with my family to discuss IronMan next year as a possibility.


the current evidence doesn't supports that claim/assumption.


Reposting this because it is SO important.  She needs a second opinion.  


And again, since I fired my physician for saying I shouldn't run based solely on that belief (not on any injury)
2010-09-20 11:49 AM
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Subject: RE: Why even consider long course triathlons?
This is how i look at it.

At some point, i'm either going to be too old, or hurt myself and not be able to do this anymore.
I could change what i'm doing now, and probably prolong that a bit, or i could live my life how i want, and enjoy every minute of it knowing i gave everything i had. If i get hurt/do something that prevents me from keeping up with it, i'll move on to something else.

I absolutely love triathlon, but if i get hurt and have to switch what i do, thats life. It will be a lot easier to move on if i know i was at least giving it my best shot.
It happened to me with rowing. I poured my life into that, made it almost as far as i could, and i know i left nothing on the table there. I hurt myself (3 herniated disks and a chipped vertebra) and that was pretty effectively the end of it.
So i took up triathlon, looked like fun, fast forward to present day.

Frankly, i think if you listen to your body, the benefits FAR outweigh the risks of training. Life is too short not to do what makes you happy.
2010-09-20 11:51 AM
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Subject: RE: Why even consider long course triathlons?
Yeah- I've had a bunch of doctors tell me that I shouldn't run.


I realize that someday I probably won't be able to run at all.  But- today is not that day.


My dad finally stopped running.  But, he's 83 ...and now cycles.


2010-09-20 11:53 AM
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Subject: RE: Why even consider long course triathlons?
I'm 40 yrs old, over 200 lbs and finished Savageman with this for a right hip...

HTFU already

2010-09-20 12:02 PM
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Subject: RE: Why even consider long course triathlons?
About 5 years ago I was seeing a PT for back pain, she said to start running because it's good for your health and body.  My reply was I have bad knees.  She rebutted: I can always have knee replacements but never a spine replacement.
2010-09-20 12:19 PM
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Subject: RE: Why even consider long course triathlons?
newbz - 2010-09-20 9:49 AM This is how i look at it. At some point, i'm either going to be too old, or hurt myself and not be able to do this anymore. I could change what i'm doing now, and probably prolong that a bit, or i could live my life how i want, and enjoy every minute of it knowing i gave everything i had. If i get hurt/do something that prevents me from keeping up with it, i'll move on to something else. I absolutely love triathlon, but if i get hurt and have to switch what i do, thats life. It will be a lot easier to move on if i know i was at least giving it my best shot. It happened to me with rowing. I poured my life into that, made it almost as far as i could, and i know i left nothing on the table there. I hurt myself (3 herniated disks and a chipped vertebra) and that was pretty effectively the end of it. So i took up triathlon, looked like fun, fast forward to present day. Frankly, i think if you listen to your body, the benefits FAR outweigh the risks of training. Life is too short not to do what makes you happy.

Man your story sounds like mine, except for me it was soccer.  I got started when I was a little kid and played fairly seriously up till my 30s.  I tried to continue but my knees just weren't having it.  Cutting side-to-side = bad.  I've had ACL reconstructions in 1992,  2002, 2005 - all on the same knee.  I love soccer so much, the only way for me to quit playing was to make sure I was too busy/tired.  Welcome to triathlons
2010-09-20 12:24 PM
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Subject: RE: Why even consider long course triathlons?
haha exactly, and i got back into rowing pretty quickly as a coach, and love that as well.
I miss it sometimes, but then i think back to the erg, and i'm happy to help others do it.
2010-09-20 12:34 PM
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Subject: RE: Why even consider long course triathlons?

nc452010 - 2010-09-20 12:27 PM Here's my recent inspiration.....

I'm 6'1"/190#'s.  A buddy of mine did his 1st tri, yesterday, at 6'/197#'s on 4wks training.

He beat me by 6min.'s (+/-).  His cycling leg (he bought a bike the week of 8/22 and ran the sprint, yesterday) was at over 21mph..  His 5K leg was a hair over 22min..  He finished (@ 38) 21st out of 441 that finished the race.

He's been running and weight training for years.  I'm thinking........if he can do that at his weight/size..........

I think the "...been running and weight training for years..." portion of this is what a lot of people have a hard time with.  People pick these sports (SBR) up for a year or two and can't grasp how someone that big can go as fast as they do. 

Sometimes genetics coupled with years of hard work does pay off.  At any size!

 



2010-09-20 12:51 PM
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Subject: RE: Why even consider long course triathlons?
AndrewMT - 2010-09-20 11:21 AM The correlation between being a runner and her health problems is not the same thing as causation.  Most of my social group consists of long term runners who run 50-70 miles per week and have done so for 10-40 years and none of them have any of those problems.  I have a hard time believing that a running career consisting of only several marathons could be the cause of her issues unless there were other underlying problems or causes as well. 






And this again   DH is a long-time runner.  He is now a 47-yr-old who runs about 70 miles a week (down from 120 which he was running for many years).  He has a niggling knee injury but guess what?  He injured his knee playing football in high school.  It bothers him because of all the running but the running didn't cause it. 
2010-09-20 12:59 PM
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Subject: RE: Why even consider long course triathlons?
Finding an athlete-friendly doctor is key.

I had swimming problems, and was told to just stop swimming by doctors that didn't understand that swimming was a big part of my life. I eventually found a chiropractor that helped me manage the pain.

Basically, if the Q&A goes like this, I keep going:
Is it going to hurt? Yes.
Am I going to cause injury? No. 
2010-09-20 1:04 PM
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Subject: RE: Why even consider long course triathlons?
I've had an L5/S1 discectomy with nerve damage to the right s1 resulting in weakness.

Post surgery I "quit" running b/c it was ttoo painful. Then I met Bobby McGee, S. African Running coach who works extensively with USAT in their coach training programs. I switched to mid/forefoot running. I now have absolutely NO BACK PAIN when I run. I still dislike running, but he impact and shock absorption of the running impact in your body is affected by HOW you run.

Have your friend check into Chi/Pose/Barefoot, or just fly outto Boulder to do 1 on 1 sessions with Bobby McGee.
2010-09-20 1:49 PM
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Subject: RE: Why even consider long course triathlons?
VeganMan - 2010-09-20 11:02 AM About 5 years ago I was seeing a PT for back pain, she said to start running because it's good for your health and body.  My reply was I have bad knees.  She rebutted: I can always have knee replacements but never a spine replacement.

that's kind of how I look at it.  my knees are bone to bone.  my ortho told me to quit running this past spring.  I've been a runner for about 25-years.  I quit seeing that ortho and started with a chiropactor.  The chiro can't do anything about the lack of cartiledge but I am in much less pain and i am running.  I do try to limit my miles though...I want to go as long as I can before I have the dreaded knee replacement.
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