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2010-11-18 10:02 AM

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Subject: Beginners Swim difficulties rant
I'm an absolute newbie to the tri world, and am really having difficulty with the swim portion. I've been able to gradually build my run endurance, bike has never been a problem, but the swim training kicks my butt regardless. Just started swimming 4-6 weeks ago with no swimming skills/technique, other than I could swim to save my life, and that's about it. Initally I could only do 50y or so at a shot, but can now do 125-150y, but after the first set, i'm only good for 50's. I've picked up and read the TI book, watched the TI videos, but I still find it to be quite challenging as I dont have any swim buddies like i do for cycling. I've signed up for lessons in january @ new paltz swim studio (TI instructor michael trunkes) and am really hoping that he can help me make significant progress, as i'm shooting for 4 sprints in may/june/july and an olympic in august (nautica nyc).  Am I crazy for having signed up for an olympic without ever having done a sprint? I dont know what it is about the swim, other than I know that I am just fighting the water....average HR on the bike for 50-60 mile ride is 150 or so. I can sustain ~4 miles jogging with HR @ 165 or so. After even a 50y in the pool, my HR is only ~140, but it feels as if its going closer to 180 or so, as my HR is so strong, I could measure it by counting the throbs in the back of my head. is it normal for the swim to "feel" so much more challenging to the body?


2010-11-18 10:07 AM
in reply to: #3216499

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Subject: RE: Beginners Swim difficulties rant

Slow things down .. you get faster initialy by swimming slower, focus on form, position in the water and balance

Do Drills

If you can book (even a couple) 1-2-1s with a coach, it is money well spent and not that expensive

2010-11-18 10:14 AM
in reply to: #3216512

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Subject: RE: Beginners Swim difficulties rant
WildWill - 2010-11-18 8:07 AM

Slow things down .. you get faster initialy by swimming slower, focus on form, position in the water and balance

Do Drills

If you can book (even a couple) 1-2-1s with a coach, it is money well spent and not that expensive

X2! I was the same, one day I decided to stop fighting it, slowed down and relaxed. It all came together. Enjoy the experience!
2010-11-18 10:44 AM
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Subject: RE: Beginners Swim difficulties rant
Cavemann - 2010-11-18 11:02 AM I'm an absolute newbie to the tri world, and am really having difficulty with the swim portion. I've been able to gradually build my run endurance, bike has never been a problem, but the swim training kicks my butt regardless. Just started swimming 4-6 weeks ago with no swimming skills/technique, other than I could swim to save my life, and that's about it. Initally I could only do 50y or so at a shot, but can now do 125-150y, but after the first set, i'm only good for 50's. I've picked up and read the TI book, watched the TI videos, but I still find it to be quite challenging as I dont have any swim buddies like i do for cycling. I've signed up for lessons in january @ new paltz swim studio (TI instructor michael trunkes) and am really hoping that he can help me make significant progress, as i'm shooting for 4 sprints in may/june/july and an olympic in august (nautica nyc).  Am I crazy for having signed up for an olympic without ever having done a sprint? I dont know what it is about the swim, other than I know that I am just fighting the water....average HR on the bike for 50-60 mile ride is 150 or so. I can sustain ~4 miles jogging with HR @ 165 or so. After even a 50y in the pool, my HR is only ~140, but it feels as if its going closer to 180 or so, as my HR is so strong, I could measure it by counting the throbs in the back of my head. is it normal for the swim to "feel" so much more challenging to the body?


I still, relatively, suck at swimming.  All I can say is hang in there, it does get easier. 
2010-11-18 11:39 AM
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Subject: RE: Beginners Swim difficulties rant
The swim lessons will help a lot.  Swimming is much more about technique then endurance.  The problem is it is hard to see your own technique issue.  Some people are naturals when it comes to swimming others aren't (like me).  Having a swim coach point out your swim issues will help tremendously.
2010-11-18 1:04 PM
in reply to: #3216499


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Subject: RE: Beginners Swim difficulties rant
Hey Cave,

Take things in increments and take to heart the view of the TI approach that your get strength, speed and endurance through focusing on form rather than on time or distance.

I started TI a little over a year ago. I was in the same situation as you--no swimming ability apart from knowing how not to drown.  That first day in the pool I couldn't make it a full 25 meters and was probably taking 30 strokes to do just that. I spent the first few months doing little else but drills. I resisted the urge to move on to the next level of drills until I was ready. It took patience, but I didn't want to try out my new stroke before I'd built it: there's no point in swimming a lot of whole stroke if you don't have the basics of balance and form down, as all you are doing is ingraining bad habits. Today I go up and down the pool with ease, taking 14-18 strokes per length. I have a long ways to go, but I credit the patient application of the TI system for my success so far.

What I noticed was that improvement came in small increments. For a while I had a problem with my pulling right hand going way off line (a sign of imbalance). I kept up with the core balance drills and the underswitch drills and one day it stopped happening. If you keep at it you will begin to notice little breakthroughs like that and they eventually add up to a major improvement. Treat every one of those moments like a victory and you'll keep coming back for more. 

So be patient and spend lots of time in the pool to increase your comfort level--as your ability to relax while holding good form improves, that HR will come down.


2010-11-18 6:19 PM
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Subject: RE: Beginners Swim difficulties rant
I have the same problems. I can only do about 1x100 straight then i have to stop for a min between each 50, but it seems like its starting to get a little easier. I still have a LONG ways to go! I think what has helped me most was just putting in the time in the water and trying to get my comfort levels to where they need to be. (When I started out a few weeks ago I could only swim with my head up, I would panic as soon as my face was under and I'd start sucking water. So at least you werent as bad as me haha). Good luck and keep trying its got to get better wth time!
2010-11-18 6:24 PM
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Subject: RE: Beginners Swim difficulties rant
Cavemann - 2010-11-18 11:02 AM I'm an absolute newbie to the tri world, and am really having difficulty with the swim portion. I've been able to gradually build my run endurance, bike has never been a problem, but the swim training kicks my butt regardless. Just started swimming 4-6 weeks ago with no swimming skills/technique, other than I could swim to save my life, and that's about it. Initally I could only do 50y or so at a shot, but can now do 125-150y, but after the first set, i'm only good for 50's. I've picked up and read the TI book, watched the TI videos, but I still find it to be quite challenging as I dont have any swim buddies like i do for cycling. I've signed up for lessons in january @ new paltz swim studio (TI instructor michael trunkes) and am really hoping that he can help me make significant progress, as i'm shooting for 4 sprints in may/june/july and an olympic in august (nautica nyc).  Am I crazy for having signed up for an olympic without ever having done a sprint? I dont know what it is about the swim, other than I know that I am just fighting the water....average HR on the bike for 50-60 mile ride is 150 or so. I can sustain ~4 miles jogging with HR @ 165 or so. After even a 50y in the pool, my HR is only ~140, but it feels as if its going closer to 180 or so, as my HR is so strong, I could measure it by counting the throbs in the back of my head. is it normal for the swim to "feel" so much more challenging to the body?


You have lots of time to get comfortable in the water BUT make sure that you practice OWS. It's a different ball game, and one that can throw people for a loop if they have not practiced it......... 
Good Luck ! It sounds like you are on the right track with regards to getting some coaching. 
2010-11-18 6:25 PM
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Subject: RE: Beginners Swim difficulties rant
I went through the same thing when I started.  Follow the advice above and get to the pool 3x a week and don't give up.  For some it clicks quickly, for others (like me) it can take months.  It took me about 6 months.

Here is my blog post about it once I was confident I would finish my first tri this spring. 
2010-11-18 6:30 PM
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Subject: RE: Beginners Swim difficulties rant

the good news is that if you get into NYC Tri, you don't need to swim the swim portion.  every year there are people who float down the river with the wild current.

 

 

2010-11-18 6:51 PM
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Subject: RE: Beginners Swim difficulties rant
Cavemann - 2010-11-18 9:02 AM Initally I could only do 50y or so at a shot, but can now do 125-150y, but after the first set, i'm only good for 50's.
  This is a perfect—accurate almost to the yard—description of where I was when I started last swimming July. 

Last week I did three 600-yard sets with 1.5 minutes between sets to swim a mile in 43 minutes. 

Each time you get in the pool you can go a little further and then all the sudden you can make 200 yards non stop.  Then 300 yards non stop.  I still remember how excited I was on the day I did 400 yards.

Tomorrow I'm going to try to do a mile swim in two sets of 900 yards.


2010-11-18 7:19 PM
in reply to: #3216499

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Subject: RE: Beginners Swim difficulties rant
The more I think about it, swimming is just like golf.  It's all technique.  And you can't see how bad your technique is till you see video of yourself.  It's also why it's so much easier for someone to give you pointers, then for you to try and self diagnose your problems.

Go to a local driving range and you'll see the really bad hackers are the ones who often swing way too hard.  If they simply slowed down and let technique overide their brute strength, they would see much better results to start off.  Once you get the technique down...then you can start applying more power to hit the ball further.

Same thing with swimming.  Your average novice swimmer uses way too much energy trying to plow through the water...when they should really be focusing on slowing down their movements to improve their form and technique...then applying power to go faster.

Lastly...being a good pool swimmer is like being a good driving range golfer.  You need to get out on the course from time to time if you want to be a good golfer...and you need to get in the OW from time to time if you want to be a good swimmer outside the pool.  But it's okay if most of your actual practice is at the driving range or at the pool.

2010-11-19 8:45 AM
in reply to: #3216523

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Subject: RE: Beginners Swim difficulties rant
Oldred - 2010-11-18 10:14 AM
WildWill - 2010-11-18 8:07 AM

Slow things down .. you get faster initialy by swimming slower, focus on form, position in the water and balance

Do Drills

If you can book (even a couple) 1-2-1s with a coach, it is money well spent and not that expensive

X2! I was the same, one day I decided to stop fighting it, slowed down and relaxed. It all came together. Enjoy the experience!


Once I figured out how to slow down I was the same way.  It's harder than it seems to slow down in the water.  It feels like you're going to sink but you won't.  I like to feel like I'm gliding in the water.  You swim lessons will help you big time.  I was a lifeguard as a kid but still had trouble in the water.  I went to swim lessons as a refresher only to find an olympic swimmer type and he showed me a few things but messed me up on other so your choice in swim instructors is important and it seems you've done it right.  Don't get discouraged, getting back into the "swim" of things takes time. 
2010-11-19 8:57 AM
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Subject: RE: Beginners Swim difficulties rant
Just more affirmation to what others have said. Get some lessons and practice, practice, practice. January of this year I was the same place you are. I was very discouraged by my initial lack of progress. In fact, after one particularly frustrating session, I posted a thread on here titled "am I a hopeless swimmer?"! Fast forward to last weekend when I finished a HIM and came in the top 1/4 with my swim time. I still don't think I'm a good swimmer but all the practice and drills go a long way. Stick with it - you'll get there. Good luck and don't get discouraged.
2010-11-19 11:00 AM
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Subject: RE: Beginners Swim difficulties rant
I do master swim class and I still suck at swimming. When I kick, I go no where slowly. It doesn't ever get easier. I can complete the swim portion of a sprint. I have gained the ability to not drown.
2010-11-19 11:11 AM
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Subject: RE: Beginners Swim difficulties rant
Others have said fantastic advice about the swim. I commend you for having a plan as far as how to make the improvement. Swimming really is one of those things in which the mind's plan for how to get through the water isn't necessarily the best plan. TI and your lessons will be great for you because it will help imprint on your mind the easiest way to get through water. Once you have that down, you can work on endurance and speed.

As far as your plan for and Olympic race. I think you have a steady plan in place and time to pull it off safely. The key will be transitioning out of the pool before your races so you can build some confidence and skills in that setting.

Best of luck and be patient with your plan and training.


2010-11-19 2:43 PM
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Subject: RE: Beginners Swim difficulties rant
Far Left Texas - 2010-11-18 5:51 PM Tomorrow I'm going to try to do a mile swim in two sets of 900 yards.


And I did it!  And I'm pretty sure the second set was 950 yards.

In two weeks I think I'm going to try to do one mile in one set - 36 laps without stopping.
2010-11-19 3:18 PM
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Subject: RE: Beginners Swim difficulties rant
FLT -- excellent! And I'm jealous you get to swim in a 50 meter pool

To the original OP -- you are not alone. I think everyone feels this way at some point when the start. I still recall vividly the first lap I ever swam in a 'real' attempt to swim was 28 strokes, and left me breathless and hanging on the wall for dear life. That was only 4 months ago. I'm still crappy at it, but wtih a few lessons and time in the pool, and a good plan of drills, stroke work, etc, you start to get it.
2010-11-19 3:19 PM
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Subject: RE: Beginners Swim difficulties rant
Cavemann - 2010-11-18 10:02 AM

I'm an absolute newbie to the tri world, and am really having difficulty with the swim portion. I've been able to gradually build my run endurance, bike has never been a problem, but the swim training kicks my butt regardless. Just started swimming 4-6 weeks ago with no swimming skills/technique, other than I could swim to save my life, and that's about it. Initally I could only do 50y or so at a shot, but can now do 125-150y, but after the first set, i'm only good for 50's. I've picked up and read the TI book, watched the TI videos, but I still find it to be quite challenging as I dont have any swim buddies like i do for cycling. I've signed up for lessons in january @ new paltz swim studio (TI instructor michael trunkes) and am really hoping that he can help me make significant progress, as i'm shooting for 4 sprints in may/june/july and an olympic in august (nautica nyc).  Am I crazy for having signed up for an olympic without ever having done a sprint? I dont know what it is about the swim, other than I know that I am just fighting the water....average HR on the bike for 50-60 mile ride is 150 or so. I can sustain ~4 miles jogging with HR @ 165 or so. After even a 50y in the pool, my HR is only ~140, but it feels as if its going closer to 180 or so, as my HR is so strong, I could measure it by counting the throbs in the back of my head. is it normal for the swim to "feel" so much more challenging to the body?


At least you can do 50 yards or more. I was unable to get past 25 yards and couldn't break that glass wall for 6 months. And I signed up for my first two sprint tri's knowing that I could only do 25 yards. That took some faith. And all I did was endless yardage after I could swim past 25. It took me 2 years to finally realize I need to do drills, which I now religiously practice.

But the best thing I did was join the local area Y which gives me access to two locations, one with multiple pools, and I am now in a masters swim class which is free to active Y members. I now have a coach who will watch and analyze the swimmers, above and below water, and will spend the time working with each swimmer, and has an understanding for the uniqueness of the triathlete swimmer.

Yardage, yardage, yardage + drills, drills, drills + a live coach...All those aspects are needed.

And have you thought about the wetsuit yet?
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