General Discussion Triathlon Talk » Aero Bars on Road Bike? Rss Feed  
Moderators: k9car363, alicefoeller Reply
2012-05-04 9:17 AM

Member
796
500100100252525
Malvern, PA
Subject: Aero Bars on Road Bike?

I am a fairly experienced road cyclist but new to tri's.

I do have a set of aero bars that a friend gave me.  I am cosnidering trying them.  However I have  concerns/questions that I am hoping some of the road cyclists here might be able to address.

I am aware that to do a real conversion to Time Trial/Tri bike I would need to adjust my saddle position with a zero setback post and make some other changes to my road bike.

I don't want to do that, as I have only one good road bike so I can't make it a dedicated TT/Tri bike.  I want to keep my current fit but just add the aerobars.

I am wondering if that is worthwhile....my current setup is fairly aggressive with a saddle to handlebar drop of about 8 cm.  I can pretty darned aero even in the hoods with my forearms parallel to the ground.

Given this, what is the value of adding aero bars to my current setup?

Doug



2012-05-04 9:52 AM
in reply to: #4190179

User image

Melon Presser
52116
50005000500050005000500050005000500050002000100
Subject: RE: Aero Bars on Road Bike?

I'm seeing a couple difficulties with that.

First, if they're full-size bars (not shorties or a looped bar), they will redistribute your weight forward on your roadie. That will compromise handling and safety, as it's not how the mechanics of a road bike were designed to perform, and certainly not optimally. Any aero time gains may be negated because so many people "weave" the front wheel with long aerobars.

Second, I'm thinking that it may also mess with your power output because of the sub-optimal hip angle and front body position. It is different than just riding the drops.

 

2012-05-04 9:59 AM
in reply to: #4190179

User image

Master
1858
10005001001001002525
Salt Lake City
Subject: RE: Aero Bars on Road Bike?

I'm in the same situation as you.  I've opted to race with the good fitting road bike instead of messing with the fit and balance of the bike by trying to add aero bars.  If you do want to go with a set of aero bars, go with a set of shortys that won't stretch you out over the front of the bike too much.

2012-05-04 10:05 AM
in reply to: #4190179

User image

Member
5452
50001001001001002525
NC
Subject: RE: Aero Bars on Road Bike?

I'm in your shoes - considering clip-ons, but don't want to alter my fit.  If anything, I'll go with shorties.  I think it might be worthwhile to make you more narrow (decrease frontal area, or something like that).  Here is this article: http://www.bikeradar.com/gear/article/how-aero-is-aero-19273/.  These looked like full clip-on aero bars, but I couldn't tell if they altered the fit set up with the clip-ons.  The anecdotal evidence is the pros that go off the front often get down and rest their forearms on the bars.  I assume there is some sort of benefit to this.  Shorty clip ons could mimic this position.

 

2012-05-04 11:25 AM
in reply to: #4190179

User image

Expert
1644
100050010025
Oklahoma
Subject: RE: Aero Bars on Road Bike?
I was in the same position. I decided on going with a set of shorties(vision tech mini's). I didn't change my set up at all and I'm comfortable in aero and can still ride on the hoods or in the drops.
2012-05-04 12:10 PM
in reply to: #4190179

User image

Veteran
134
10025
Murfreesboro, TN
Subject: RE: Aero Bars on Road Bike?

I'd give them a try and not change the seat or drop, if you don't like it you can take them off.

I put on Profile T-3's on mine and, while it does not give optimum aero, it does allow you to stay down in aero position longer than just staying in the drops. Core/elblow support vs hand/core support was better for me. I saw some improvement during my last sprint.  My LBS told me to stay back in the saddle too, because of the geometry of the road bike, meaning putting the seat in the offset transferred power from my quads to my hams, which is not a good thing.



Edited by Chris.1333 2012-05-04 12:11 PM


2012-05-04 12:32 PM
in reply to: #4190179

User image

Elite
3498
20001000100100100100252525
Laguna Beach
Subject: RE: Aero Bars on Road Bike?

Let's look at this from a historical persepctive:

Commercial aerodynamic handlebars showed up about 1987. Athletes began using them in 1988.

The first athletes bolted them to road bikes. Mike Pigg, Jeff Devlin, etc. In less than 60 days- literally- everyone realized there was a problem. When people used aerobars on this road bike they slid forward on the saddle.

Several companies introduced a "quick fix" solution like the "Seat Shifter", a spring loaded seatpost that could slam your saddle forward up to 7 cm with the push of a control lever on your handelbars. Mike Pigg used this.

This is where TriAya's observations come into play, and she is spot on as usual: rider weight moved forward as the saddle came forward and bike handling became very poor.

In the background Dan Empfield and Ralph Ray intuited that, if the geometry of the bike were designed "from the aerobars back" (Dan Empfield quote) the rider position would improve, handling would be more stable and aerodynamics may improve. Empfield and Ray made a bike with a 90 degree seat tube angle (a road bike, as you know, is around 73-74 degrees). This seat angle was later moderated t 80 degrees on the Quintana Roo Superform, then to 78 degrees on the Quintana Roo Kilo, a bike named for its 2.2 pound (1 kilogram) frame weight.

Suddenly both bike times and run times in triathlon began to drop. Athletes roade their bikes faster and then, somewhat inexplicably, began to commonly run below 35 minutes for 10K off the bike. The first time I ever ran below 40 minutes for a 10K off a bike was off a Superform. The first time I went below 35 minutes for 10K was off a custom Holland bike with an 80 degree seat tube angle and a 71 degree head tube angle with a super long front-center measurement and 650c wheels.

Also in the background a number of university studies made some interesting findings about steep seat angles. Basically, they appeared to be trending better, more physiologically economic results:

"The results of this test are, to me, startling. These were road racers riding a road race bike, and they in general rode with considerable economy at 80 degrees versus their usual angle of 74 degrees. Oxygen consumption at the given rate of exertion was about 37 ml/kg/min at 80 degrees versus about 38.5 at 74 degrees (if you’re consuming more oxygen to do a given amount of work, you’re working harder, i.e., you’re less efficient)."

Source: http://www.slowtwitch.com/Tech/What_science_says_of_seat_angles_222.html

Bottom line based on good science: Aerobars are on a road bike are a bad idea. People figured that out within 60 days of the first aerobars becoming commercially available.

Now, the reality is many people aren't in a position to buy a new bike when they want to use aerobars in a triathlon, so they bolt them on their road bike. Is it better than just riding the road bike? Yes. The historical precedent from 1988 proves this. Mike Pigg, etc.

Aerobars on a road bike are, however, a historically proven compromise over aerobars on a tri bike.

2012-05-04 12:42 PM
in reply to: #4190179

Member
796
500100100252525
Malvern, PA
Subject: RE: Aero Bars on Road Bike?

Tom,

Great posting.  Very helpful.

Obviously, if someone is serious about tri he/she should have a dedicated Tri/TT bike with appropriate geometry.

However, many of us are not in a position to cough up the money for a tri specific bike, hence my query.

Doug

2012-05-04 12:50 PM
in reply to: #4190805

User image

Melon Presser
52116
50005000500050005000500050005000500050002000100
Subject: RE: Aero Bars on Road Bike?
datlas - 2012-05-05 1:42 AM

Tom,

Great posting.  Very helpful.

Obviously, if someone is serious about tri he/she should have a dedicated Tri/TT bike with appropriate geometry.

However, many of us are not in a position to cough up the money for a tri specific bike, hence my query.

Doug

Doug, what kind of aerobars did your friend give you? Make/model?

2012-05-04 1:35 PM
in reply to: #4190818

Member
796
500100100252525
Malvern, PA
Subject: RE: Aero Bars on Road Bike?
TriAya - 2012-05-04 12:50 PM
datlas - 2012-05-05 1:42 AM

Tom,

Great posting.  Very helpful.

Obviously, if someone is serious about tri he/she should have a dedicated Tri/TT bike with appropriate geometry.

However, many of us are not in a position to cough up the money for a tri specific bike, hence my query.

Doug

Doug, what kind of aerobars did your friend give you? Make/model?

I am at work now but will check and post tonight when I get home.

I think they are Profile Design T1 but will verify.

2012-05-04 5:50 PM
in reply to: #4190179

Member
796
500100100252525
Malvern, PA
Subject: RE: Aero Bars on Road Bike?

I just checked.

They are Profile Design make, "Aerolite" model.  I think they are several years old as my friend gave them to me 3 years ago and he may have had them for a few years too.

Doug



2012-05-04 7:55 PM
in reply to: #4190179

User image

Extreme Veteran
386
100100100252525
Rio Rancho - where you can ride year round!
Subject: RE: Aero Bars on Road Bike?

I have Profile Design T2 Plus. I used them for a few years on my SPecialized Allez bike and never had handling issues, and that was with me riding on the tip of the seat. I recently purchased a Cervelo S2 and put these on about a month ago, and have not had any issues with handling in aero position sitting on the tip of the seat. 

 I only do sprint tris to this point. But if I were to move on in distance to Oly I would use the same. Even for a 1/2 distance I would use the same bike setup.

I'm like you, I don't have the money to get a TT bike. I enjoy riding more than aero riding so going this route provides me the best of both worlds.

But like others said, put them on your bike without changing the setup. Make small adjustments to the aero bars so you are comfortable in this position for longer periods of time and you are ready to go.

2012-05-05 5:30 AM
in reply to: #4190179

User image

Champion
9407
500020002000100100100100
Montague Gold Mines, Nova Scotia
Subject: RE: Aero Bars on Road Bike?
I have a tribike and use that for tris and TTs but I have raced with aerobars on a road bike in some draft legal events and currently have them on my road bike since I'm coaching draft legal junior athletes.

I suggest that your plan is the best way to add aerobars to a road bike; instead of trying to turn your road bike into a tribike, just add the aerobars to your road bike as an alternate position. Generally this will mean you want shorty (ITU style) aerobars so that you can use the bars without being too stretched out.

As to the running better off a steepeer seat tube angle, I wouldn't worry about that as that study is questionable at best.

Shane
2012-05-05 7:47 AM
in reply to: #4191957

User image

Champion
7036
5000200025
Sarasota, FL
Subject: RE: Aero Bars on Road Bike?

gsmacleod - 2012-05-05 6:30 AM I have a tribike and use that for tris and TTs but I have raced with aerobars on a road bike in some draft legal events and currently have them on my road bike since I'm coaching draft legal junior athletes. I suggest that your plan is the best way to add aerobars to a road bike; instead of trying to turn your road bike into a tribike, just add the aerobars to your road bike as an alternate position. Generally this will mean you want shorty (ITU style) aerobars so that you can use the bars without being too stretched out. As to the running better off a steepeer seat tube angle, I wouldn't worry about that as that study is questionable at best. Shane

This is pretty much what I did.  I worked with my fitter on a "compromise" set-up that would work either riding on the brake hoods or on the aerobars.  I ride on the aerobars 90% of the time, but it's also nice to have the hoods and drops on long rides to change positions.

With my physique my aero position is still relatively upright, so the compromise set-up isn't that much of a penalty.

Mark 

2012-05-05 8:05 AM
in reply to: #4190179

Member
354
1001001002525
Subject: RE: Aero Bars on Road Bike?

I use Profile Jammers (fairly short aerobars) on my road bike and have loved them.  Not quite as aero as full-length bars, but I didn't have to alter any of my fit on the bike.  They're great in headwinds and as an alternate hand position on long rides.

 

I've used them for about five years (put them on my new bike when my old frame died) and probably about 30,000+ miles.  Love 'em.

2012-05-05 8:14 AM
in reply to: #4191603

User image

Melon Presser
52116
50005000500050005000500050005000500050002000100
Subject: RE: Aero Bars on Road Bike?
datlas - 2012-05-05 6:50 AM

I just checked.

They are Profile Design make, "Aerolite" model.  I think they are several years old as my friend gave them to me 3 years ago and he may have had them for a few years too.

Doug

Exact same ones I have, and I also got them from a friend (almost new) in 2008 so they're probably really the same. Because they're adjustable, you can essentially make them into shorty bars, and that's what I'd (as others in this thread have) recommend you do.



2012-05-05 8:46 AM
in reply to: #4190772

User image

Member
448
10010010010025
Clemson, SC
Subject: RE: Aero Bars on Road Bike?
Tom Demerly. - 2012-05-04 1:32 PM

Let's look at this from a historical persepctive:

 

Great post! Thanks for the insight.

New Thread
General Discussion Triathlon Talk » Aero Bars on Road Bike? Rss Feed