General Discussion Triathlon Talk » IMLP swim start tips or any 2500+ mass swim start tips...if any Rss Feed  
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2012-08-13 3:29 PM

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Subject: IMLP swim start tips or any 2500+ mass swim start tips...if any

 I threw my hat into the ring for IMLP next year and my only concern is limiting the chance of a "swim collision" from ending my day early (it would take a lot for me not to finish), such as a head injury etc

So I was wondering if there are any tips or things that have worked to get through the initial madness of this swim start....I will have my HTFU hat on but would like to try to have as much of a smooth swim even if I have to swim wide.  I am just looking to finish even thogh I am probably capable of a 13-14 hr finish....I have done the swim distance already in practice in the pool and about 1.5 in the ow and if I had to do it today I would be in the 1:20 range....so though I may be a little faster next year I would be content with that time +/-, as long as I know I am getting on the bike in one piece.

After watching some videos, it seems like if I wait till after the gun goes off, and slowly trudge to the right, wide of the cable, I may find some calmer water....again I am not looking to swim by myself, if that was the case I would not have chosen LP but I am looking to be a little conservative and just have the mindset of it being a long day and finish the swim

So do you have any tips or advice for someone looking for a "calmer" swim than riding the cable....or advice on dealing with the contact even if it is a psycological way of thinking just before the race?  Should I just embrace the contact and just use a recovery stroke if necessary and just go with the flow

I am sure some of you have interesting swim stories.

any input as always would be appreciated...thanks



2012-08-13 3:36 PM
in reply to: #4361218

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Subject: RE: IMLP swim start tips or any 2500+ mass swim start tips...if any
My advice...although it may not be popular today...is to simply seed yourself reasonably, and get your nose in there.  Mass starts are chaotic, but that's part of the fun if you ask me.  It's a race...do your best to get across the finish line in the least amount of time.
2012-08-13 3:43 PM
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Subject: RE: IMLP swim start tips or any 2500+ mass swim start tips...if any

 

Should I just embrace the contact and just use a recovery stroke if necessary and just go with the flow

This gets my vote.  I did IMLP this year with a 1:03 swim time.  I seeded my self in the front 1/3 of the pack and just went with the flow.  There was contact, but if you are a confident and comfortable swimmer, then I think you'll do better embracing the group swim aspect.   Hell when I swam in my youth we'd pack 10 kids in a lane trying to circle swim and there was rougher contact.

2012-08-13 3:52 PM
in reply to: #4361218

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Subject: RE: IMLP swim start tips or any 2500+ mass swim start tips...if any
I agree with the other posters that seeding yourself realistically is important. I like to be about 10 rows back to the outside. I am not front of the pack but I like to move out with the faster pack to get away from the slower swimmers so I don't have to swim through them.
2012-08-13 4:05 PM
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Subject: RE: IMLP swim start tips or any 2500+ mass swim start tips...if any
Without a background in OWS the contact really bothered me during my first few years in the water. As I've become a more confident swimmer the bumping doesn't bother me as much, but i still get uncomfortable with people hitting me in he water. So, I start off to the side near the back. I can thn get into a rhythm and swim along others at my fitness level, at my pace.I'm thinking I need to HTFU as I write this....
2012-08-13 4:06 PM
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Subject: RE: IMLP swim start tips or any 2500+ mass swim start tips...if any

In hindsight, I'm not sure there's anything you can really do to truly prepare for the IM swim start.  Others may disagree, but unless you wait a few minutes for everyone to start in front of you, the IM swim start (not including the wave start races) is a unique experience.  I talked to people about it, I watched video, I read this board, etc.  However, until I actually did it, I didn't know what it would really be like and I'm not sure it's something that can be put into words.

I think you said it - the botton line is that there's a strong HTFU factor when dealing with the washing machine. 



2012-08-13 4:11 PM
in reply to: #4361234

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Subject: RE: IMLP swim start tips or any 2500+ mass swim start tips...if any

tri808 - 2012-08-13 4:36 PM My advice...although it may not be popular today...is to simply seed yourself reasonably, and get your nose in there.  Mass starts are chaotic, but that's part of the fun if you ask me.  It's a race...do your best to get across the finish line in the least amount of time.

I figured as such...dont get me wrong I am very aggressive in my olys and HIM's just after going through a few race reports and hearing of some person getting knocked out of commision I would be more passive in this race....At that distance whether I come in at 12:45 or 13:00 really doesnt matter too me for a first IM

So I guess I will just seed myself toward the back third and just embrace the madness and laugh as I am the kicker or the Kick-ee 

2012-08-13 4:53 PM
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Subject: RE: IMLP swim start tips or any 2500+ mass swim start tips...if any
If you think about the start line at IMLP from the dock to the shore, I was about 2/3 of the way to the shore.  Treading water sucked, but it actually worked out very well.  I took a line from my start position straight to the far turn buoy.  I found myself in relatively open water with a ton of people to my left hugging the cable and a bunch who started even further to my right and stayed out there.  It didn't get crowded for me until the turn almost 1/2 mile in.  On the second lap, it's stretched out enough to follow the cable.
2012-08-13 5:08 PM
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Subject: RE: IMLP swim start tips or any 2500+ mass swim start tips...if any

My advice is to just keep moving.
You will get hit, and you will accidentally hit others. Don't take it personally, and DON'T STOP. Even if you have to adjust a goggle or what not, float horizontally and keep kicking to maintain your lane (so to speak).

At IM Wisconsin 2010 at the VERY beginning, two guys got into a yelling/cussing match because one thought the other purposefully hit him. Really? You want to duke it out in the midst of 3000 of your closest friends? Just keep swimming...  

Haven't done IMLP, but especially at Wisconsin I learned my lesson on the first turn bouey to take it wide. Right up on the bouey was a hot mess that was almost worse than the start.

2012-08-15 9:02 AM
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Subject: RE: IMLP swim start tips or any 2500+ mass swim start tips...if any
This has been around for a while, but its still pretty funny...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r3S0wu4Zbfk
2012-08-15 10:39 AM
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Subject: RE: IMLP swim start tips or any 2500+ mass swim start tips...if any
As others have said, I think it is best to seed yourself where you think you should be given your pace.  At 1:20, probably not front row but also not too far from it.  I usually try to seed myself very close to the front in hopes of drafting.  I would never wait in the back of the pack for things to string out because you will run into and have to work your way through the breaststrokers, weavers, and folks that will stop to catch their breath.


2012-08-15 10:45 AM
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Subject: RE: IMLP swim start tips or any 2500+ mass swim start tips...if any

dgunthert - 2012-08-13 5:53 PM If you think about the start line at IMLP from the dock to the shore, I was about 2/3 of the way to the shore.  Treading water sucked, but it actually worked out very well.  I took a line from my start position straight to the far turn buoy.  I found myself in relatively open water with a ton of people to my left hugging the cable and a bunch who started even further to my right and stayed out there.  It didn't get crowded for me until the turn almost 1/2 mile in.  On the second lap, it's stretched out enough to follow the cable.

Thanks, you just gave me my strategy for next year. Lake Placid will be my first full IM.

2012-08-15 11:16 AM
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Subject: RE: IMLP swim start tips or any 2500+ mass swim start tips...if any
BrianRunsPhilly - 2012-08-15 10:45 AM

Thanks, you just gave me my strategy for next year. Lake Placid will be my first full IM.

It was my first as well.  The strange part is getting back in the water for the second lap.  You come out of the water, cross the timing mat, and then turn left to get back in the water.  The dock I mentioned extends straight out from shore 20 or 30 feet, maybe.  So you wade straight out along the dock, then turn left and swim across what was the start line and continue.  When you're in the MOP, 1000+ people have already waded in along that dock and then started swimming in the minutes before you get there.  That creates a very noticeable current that pulls you along.  Bizarre feeling.  Very much like the whirlpool effect we used to get going in the pool as kids, when everyone would walk in a circle close to the pool walls.

2012-08-15 11:22 AM
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Subject: RE: IMLP swim start tips or any 2500+ mass swim start tips...if any
dgunthert - 2012-08-15 12:16 PM
BrianRunsPhilly - 2012-08-15 10:45 AM

Thanks, you just gave me my strategy for next year. Lake Placid will be my first full IM.

It was my first as well.  The strange part is getting back in the water for the second lap.  You come out of the water, cross the timing mat, and then turn left to get back in the water.  The dock I mentioned extends straight out from shore 20 or 30 feet, maybe.  So you wade straight out along the dock, then turn left and swim across what was the start line and continue.  When you're in the MOP, 1000+ people have already waded in along that dock and then started swimming in the minutes before you get there.  That creates a very noticeable current that pulls you along.  Bizarre feeling.  Very much like the whirlpool effect we used to get going in the pool as kids, when everyone would walk in a circle close to the pool walls.

Apparently not everyone does this.

I was at swim transition and saw the volunteers chasing "that guy" through the chute. After there I was sent to bike-in/bike-out and got to see him being carted back off the bike course.

I am very excited, it's a beautiful place for a first IM. Cleanest fresh water I've ever swam in.

2012-08-15 11:31 AM
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Subject: RE: IMLP swim start tips or any 2500+ mass swim start tips...if any

Here is a blog you might find helpful.

IMLP Swim

 

You may want to consider the outside and head straight to the turn bouy.. the increased distance is minimal .. I have the numbers somewhere but from the wire to the shore is like 200 ft or around 65 meters, for a length of about 800 meters, do that as a triangle and the hypotenuse ~802.6m

2012-08-15 12:01 PM
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Subject: RE: IMLP swim start tips or any 2500+ mass swim start tips...if any

Well I did a 1:12 and started somewhat near the dock but a few rows back.  I did get caught up in the "washing machine" but it was only after people stopped to help a swimmer or two get rescued which caused the entire field to bunch up a bit.  

To me it seemed like so many people tried to go on the way right, so at least in the start I was not crowded at all and had a straight shot to the cable.  I know everyone says to go to the right, but I feel like lots of people try that strategy making it more crowded, and it does add some distance to the swim.  If you want to swim on the cable, it tends to be relatively free on the inside of it, you just have to make sure to go around the outside of the buoys at the turns.  Also, I don't understand the treading water comments, if you're wearing a wetsuit then you shouldn't really need to tread water anyway.



2012-08-15 12:11 PM
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Subject: RE: IMLP swim start tips or any 2500+ mass swim start tips...if any
I think of it this way, the worst swimmers in the race are going to be wide/right and towards the back. This means you'll have to fight your way through them and they will be difficult to manage in doing so b/c they'll be swimming all over the place.

If you go to the cable right off the bat, then you have your 2nd largest group - this group will be similar to the other - lots of craziness. I would recommend what others have stated - seed yourself properly towards the front/middle. Go strong for a few 100/meters and you will find your space. The really fast people will leave you behind and the slower ones will be behind you, or off to the sides.

As for the mauling part; in a WTC IM I just don't think it's realistic to excuse yourself from it. It just is what it is... Don't do IM Texas if you don't want to "get it on" - the canal in the last 1/3 makes tight quarters...think salmon swimming upstream.
2012-08-15 12:24 PM
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Subject: RE: IMLP swim start tips or any 2500+ mass swim start tips...if any
FELTGood - 2012-08-13 1:29 PM

After watching some videos, it seems like if I wait till after the gun goes off, and slowly trudge to the right, wide of the cable, I may find some calmer water....again I am not looking to swim by myself, if that was the case I would not have chosen LP but I am looking to be a little conservative and just have the mindset of it being a long day and finish the swim

I think you have already answered your own question. Keep in mind, for you there won't be any real difference if there are 2500 people in the water or 250 people. Frankly, most people end up have interaction with less than 25 people during the race. So don't be intimidated by the numbers.

While physical contact may be inevitable in a mass start, it's important that you don't react to it. Just make the necessary adjustment and forget it. The quicker you can get back into your stroke the better race you'll have. So I recommend to people that they move aside for the crazies who come not only expecting contact, but quite prepared to dish it out. They are not the greatest swimmers. More likely they had it done to them and they decided if it slowed them down, then it must have made the other guy go faster.

I have no fear of contact of any kind in the water, but so what. My goal is to swim fast while expending the least amount of energy. If I think it is to my advantage to start in the middle near the front, than I will. But I have found that nearly every time I would have been better served by starting over further. I do not preach the "sprint to the first buoy" philosophy. It just makes no sense unless you are looking to be in the top 10 coming out of the water. Sprinting from the start, finding a fast pair of feet and holding position are very high level skills. How many times did you practice that before the race? Why try it on race day?

 The most important self-protection rule in elite swimming: only have one competitor at your side (i.e., do not get boxed in with swimmers on one's left and right sides). I figure if it's good enough for them it's good enough for me.

2013-09-06 5:35 PM
in reply to: FELTGood

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Subject: RE: IMLP swim start tips or any 2500+ mass swim start tips...if any
I've done IMLP twice (both in 1:07). The first was my first IM and I started about half way back and had a relatively contact free time. Even swimming along the buoy line on the first lap. The second time I started a bit further towards front and got a lot more contact and also found it harder to find space to swim. With the time you are looking I'd suggest something like my first approach. I guess it will differ a bit each year though anyway
I have been told that some people (even OK swimmers) start really wide - like nearly to the far shore wide) and then swim a line to the far buoy. Like the other poster but more extreme. For the minimal extra distance covered compared with the likelihood of a free'er swim, might be a good consideration.
I was worried about expending energy treading water but really wetsuits are so buoyant it isn't a problem
2013-09-06 8:17 PM
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Subject: RE: IMLP swim start tips or any 2500+ mass swim start tips...if any
Originally posted by lisac957

My advice is to just keep moving.
You will get hit, and you will accidentally hit others. Don't take it personally, and DON'T STOP. Even if you have to adjust a goggle or what not, float horizontally and keep kicking to maintain your lane (so to speak).

At IM Wisconsin 2010 at the VERY beginning, two guys got into a yelling/cussing match because one thought the other purposefully hit him. Really? You want to duke it out in the midst of 3000 of your closest friends? Just keep swimming...  

Haven't done IMLP, but especially at Wisconsin I learned my lesson on the first turn bouey to take it wide. Right up on the bouey was a hot mess that was almost worse than the start.

This is all really good advice for OP.

2013-09-06 8:44 PM
in reply to: Patrick E

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Subject: RE: IMLP swim start tips or any 2500+ mass swim start tips...if any
I avoided the washing machine at Whistler...


2013-09-06 8:56 PM
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Subject: RE: IMLP swim start tips or any 2500+ mass swim start tips...if any
Originally posted by simpsonboI avoided the washing machine at Whistler...
WOW...that is such an awesome tip!!! I'm sure that will help a bunch of BTers, Thanks again for all your awesome insight!!!
2013-09-06 9:17 PM
in reply to: switch

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Subject: RE: IMLP swim start tips or any 2500+ mass swim start tips...if any
Hey Pink Font was not an option...
2013-09-06 9:26 PM
in reply to: Experior

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Subject: RE: IMLP swim start tips or any 2500+ mass swim start tips...if any
Originally posted by Experior
Originally posted by lisac957

My advice is to just keep moving.
You will get hit, and you will accidentally hit others. Don't take it personally, and DON'T STOP. Even if you have to adjust a goggle or what not, float horizontally and keep kicking to maintain your lane (so to speak).

At IM Wisconsin 2010 at the VERY beginning, two guys got into a yelling/cussing match because one thought the other purposefully hit him. Really? You want to duke it out in the midst of 3000 of your closest friends? Just keep swimming...  

Haven't done IMLP, but especially at Wisconsin I learned my lesson on the first turn bouey to take it wide. Right up on the bouey was a hot mess that was almost worse than the start.

This is all really good advice for OP.

You must be new here Michael

The OP already finished his IM.  This thread started last year and somehow got bumped.

2013-09-06 9:46 PM
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Subject: RE: IMLP swim start tips or any 2500+ mass swim start tips...if any

Originally posted by simpsonbo Hey Pink Font was not an option...

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