Best wheelset for $500 or less (Page 2)

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2012-08-19 7:34 PM
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Subject: RE: Best wheelset for $500 or less
Ok so areo looks like the best route.  I live in a windy/gusty area how deep a wheel should be I looking for 30, 40, 50?

2012-08-19 8:33 PM
in reply to: #4370346

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Subject: RE: Best wheelset for $500 or less

jbrobston - 2012-08-19 8:34 PM Ok so areo looks like the best route.  I live in a windy/gusty area how deep a wheel should be I looking for 30, 40, 50?

I live in NE FL. Very few rides I do in little to no wind. I race 66mm Reynolds Strikes. I'll be selling these after my first HIM in Oct to get a FLO 90 front and disc rear. It's all what you're comfortable with. I raced these in 12-15 NE winds (crosswind) in an OLY race and didn't feel much movement at all (I'm 240). I do train in my stock felt wheels (30mm i think, why ruin my carbons if I don't need to)

To be completely honest if I did it over again I don't feel my wheels made me that much faster over 40k. My times improved but so did my conditioning. I'm buying a helmet next and feel I did things backwards.

I race mostly flat rides maybe a little rolling, and don't want to fuel any arguments, but at my skill level and weight I think aero is more important than weight

 

Also FWIW if you buy new I've heard nothing but good things about BOYD wheels off the east coast. Twice your price new but something to consider.



Edited by rjrankin83 2012-08-19 8:36 PM
2012-08-19 8:58 PM
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Subject: RE: Best wheelset for $500 or less
I second the Neuvation M28aero's.
2012-08-20 7:03 AM
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Subject: RE: Best wheelset for $500 or less
jbrobston - 2012-08-19 9:34 PM

Ok so areo looks like the best route.  I live in a windy/gusty area how deep a wheel should be I looking for 30, 40, 50?


I would suggest a 50-60mm aero front wheel - note that not all aerowheels are created equal. If you want a fast wheel, a toroidal shaped rim will be the fastest option and then a cover for your rear wheel. If you are going to train on them as well, then I'd get a Hed3 front as they are basically bombproof and again, a cover for your rear wheel.

Shane
2012-08-20 8:33 AM
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Subject: RE: Best wheelset for $500 or less
tri808 - 2012-08-19 7:55 PM

Thank you Shane for being one of the best contributors to BT.  I have no idea how you keep your sanity sometimes.

Agreed.

 

2012-08-20 8:45 AM
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Subject: RE: Best wheelset for $500 or less
Now Neuvations + Disc Cover

Then keep shopping for a nice used front (HED 3, 60mm, 90mm...) to use for race days with the Neuvation + Disc Cover.

More importantly, train more!


2012-08-20 8:53 AM
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Subject: RE: Best wheelset for $500 or less
I just wanted to give some feedback on the Williams 30x wheels.  I have been riding mine for over three years with no issues whatsoever.  They likely aren't the most aero or lighest wheels that can be had, but they are durable and stand up to a larger rider.  I have since added a wheel cover on the back which makes a noticeable speed difference (another thing I like about them is that they are compatible with a wheel cover, unliek the stock Shimanos that came with the bike). 
2012-08-20 9:41 AM
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Subject: RE: Best wheelset for $500 or less

With all this discussion of how weight effects you on hills, I'm a little confused.  While it's obvious that the more weight you carry up a hill, the harder it is to climb.  However what about on decents?  I tend to believe that weight (meaning dead weight of the rider and bike combined) has no bearing on your decending speed on hills.  From physics 101, if you drop a bowling ball and a golf ball from the same height, aerodynamics not factored, both will hit the ground at the same time.  Now if you take a 140lb cyclist and a 220lb cyclist and have them coast down the same hill at the same time, if anything, would you find that the lighter cyclist would win, only because his slimmer profile would create less wind resistance than the heavier cyclist?

Now aside from all of that...  looking at wheel weight and rotational mass/momentum, I wonder if the inertia created by a heavier wheel would help you go faster dowh hill, not due to gravity, but due to inertial mass. 

2012-08-20 11:05 AM
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Subject: RE: Best wheelset for $500 or less
2012-08-20 11:37 AM
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Subject: RE: Best wheelset for $500 or less
siberian - 2012-08-20 10:41 AM

From physics 101, if you drop a bowling ball and a golf ball from the same height, aerodynamics not factored, both will hit the ground at the same time.  Now if you take a 140lb cyclist and a 220lb cyclist and have them coast down the same hill at the same time, if anything, would you find that the lighter cyclist would win, only because his slimmer profile would create less wind resistance than the heavier cyclist?<



I'm 230. I find regularly there's one or two 130-150 Lb person in the race that I play pass-me/pass-you all race. Uphill they kick my butt. Coming back down they're peddling their hearts out and I'm basically gliding and pass them like they're standing still. Lighter cyclist wins uphill, all else being equal, heavier one wins downhill.

2012-08-20 12:33 PM
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Subject: RE: Best wheelset for $500 or less
siberian - 2012-08-20 11:41 AM

While it's obvious that the more weight you carry up a hill, the harder it is to climb.  However what about on decents?  I tend to believe that weight (meaning dead weight of the rider and bike combined) has no bearing on your decending speed on hills.


This is incorrect because of:

From physics 101, if you drop a bowling ball and a golf ball from the same height, aerodynamics not factored, both will hit the ground at the same time.


If you were to do this on the moon, then what you would see is that the cyclists would accelerate at the same rate (basically continuously). However, on Earth, we know that the force opposing motion when moving through a fluid depends on the size and shape of that object.

Now if you take a 140lb cyclist and a 220lb cyclist and have them coast down the same hill at the same time, if anything, would you find that the lighter cyclist would win, only because his slimmer profile would create less wind resistance than the heavier cyclist?


This turns out to be incorrect; in general, the lighter cyclist will have a more aerodynamic profile but, not enough to "outweigh" the advantage the heavier cyclist has with a greater terminal velocity (not that they will achieve terminal velocity). Further, if both adopt a good descending position, the difference in aerodynamics is likely to be quite minimal so the heavier cyclist can actually descend quite a bit faster. The power required to propel a bicycle is:

P = Crr * m * g * v + 1/2 * rho * CdA * v^3 + m * g * v * sin (angle)

Where Crr is the coefficient of rolling resistance (tires), m is mass, g is acceleration due to gravity, rho is the air density, CdA is a factor dealing with the aerodynamics of the rider/bike, v is velocity and the angle is that of the road - positive for climbing, negative for descending.

When descending, the last term is negative due to a negative angle and is therefore can be moved to the left hand side of the equation, effectively meaning the rider gets a power "boost" of that term. Since that term increases with mass, the heavier cyclists gets a bigger power "boost" than the lighter cyclist.

Now aside from all of that...  looking at wheel weight and rotational mass/momentum, I wonder if the inertia created by a heavier wheel would help you go faster dowh hill, not due to gravity, but due to inertial mass. 



Rotational mass makes zero difference in steady state cycling; it really doesn't matter whether it is frame mass, wheel mass or body mass, it affects you the same way when it comes to cycling.

Shane

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