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2012-09-30 5:59 AM

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Subject: Biking without a helmet

Instead of a political controversy, here's one from the NY Times. Basically, they say that in Europe, where helmet laws are lax to non-existent, everyone bikes. Whereas in the US (and Australia), where helmets are expected, there is a lot less biking. It is the same premise as a book I read recently, Just Ride, that basically said that we have made biking a more complex enterprise than it used to be, with racing bikes more common than cruisers, getting all kitted out in lycra and spandex, etc.

Personally, I think we have bigger spaces, and a culture that more strongly encourages cars than bikes. I think looking at helmets as a major contributor to the low rates of biking is nonsense. Claiming that it makes cycling seem more "dangerous than it is" is like objecting to safety belts in cars for the same reasons (which was in fact the case once upon a time) - yet now, most people buckle up without a second thought as to the "dangerousness" of being in a car.

And the closing quote - "Mr. De Jong, who grew up in the Netherlands, observes of Amsterdam: “Nobody wears helmets, and bicycling is regarded as a completely normal, safe activity. You never hear that ‘helmet saved my life’ thing.”" is nonsense as well. If no one wears a helmet, of course no one ever says that a helmet saved their lives. Because they weren't wearing a helmet. So it didn't. And then they couldn't say it.



2012-09-30 6:27 AM
in reply to: #4433638

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Subject: RE: Biking without a helmet
Yes, I think linking the levels of biking to the helmet laws is like saying people won't drive because we require seat belts. I think it has more to do with the culture and as the OP indicated the distance people travel to work, play, etc.
2012-09-30 7:25 AM
in reply to: #4433638

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Austin, Texas or Jupiter, Florida
Subject: RE: Biking without a helmet
Yeah, that's probably the same people in Europe saying drinking and driving are fine. Like in this article:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A35079-2004Dec29.html

My mom was a nurse in CA when they passed the helmet law. One of her Dr.s testified before some legislative panel that a helmet law would severely reduce brain donors...
2012-09-30 7:26 AM
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Subject: RE: Biking without a helmet

Are helmets really "expected" here? I know of no law in this state that requires adult bicyclists to wear helmets, and I see people riding all the time without them.

I think helmets are a bit of a red herring in this discussion. Americans don't ride bikes because as a society we've grown fat, lazy, and overly dependent on the automobile for transportation.

2012-09-30 7:29 AM
in reply to: #4433638

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Austin, Texas or Jupiter, Florida
Subject: RE: Biking without a helmet
In FL it's 16 and under. Good point.
2012-09-30 7:35 AM
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Subject: RE: Biking without a helmet
I just move to Germany and it's true - EVERYONE here bikes. I have seen little old ladies that had to have been in their 80's or so peddling down the road with a basket of bread or vegetables strapped in a basket! I would say that it's about 50/50 as to whether or not the folks here are wearing a helmet - personal preference, I guess, but what really cracks me up is the number of people all kitted out! It's totally normal to see someone sporting a nice kit, walk outside to their commuter bike, mout and just ride away, with or without a helmet. No point in my post, just reporting what I've observed since our move here 3 months ago...


2012-09-30 8:47 AM
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Subject: RE: Biking without a helmet

People don't bike here because it's dangerous and, as a society, we're fat and lazy. We're much more geographically spread out than most places in Europe. Distances between home, work, and shopping are greater.

Philly has made a concerted effort to become bike-friendly, and is now the number one big city, per capita, for bike commuting. 31% use helmets. So it's not about helmets.

Several studies were done to show that more bikes mean fewer accidents. Doubling the number of riders decreased the crash risk by 1/3. Drivers, pedestrians, and cyclists are more aware of each other.

2012-09-30 9:07 AM
in reply to: #4433638

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Subject: RE: Biking without a helmet

WTF?!

gearboy - 2012-09-30 6:59 AM

"...in Europe, where helmet laws are lax to non-existent, everyone bikes. Whereas in the US (and Australia), where helmets are expected, there is a lot less biking..."

Let me offer an alternative theory...

Avergae price per gallon of gas in the US as of 9/24/2012:  $3.83
Average price per gallon of gas in Europe as of 9/24/2012:  $9.69

Average price for a 2012 base-model Honda Civic in the US:  about $15,500 (US)
Average price for a 2012 base-model Honda Civic in Europe:  about $24,700 (US)

I really don't think helmets have much to do with it.  If it cost you $145 every time you had to fill your tank with gas, most of us would seriously consider a bike as a means of transportation!

... Just a theory.

 

2012-09-30 9:42 AM
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Subject: RE: Biking without a helmet

I was just at a seminar teaching cities how to design for bicycling and pedestrian traffic.  A couple European cities like Copenhagen and Amsterdam were highlighted, and the first question asked was why don't they wear helmets over there.  The presenter's explanation was that once you've separated bikes and cars, helmets are no longer necessary.  Accidents are greatly reduced, and when they do happen they're at slow speeds involving light bikes instead of two ton vehicles.  In those cities, the infrastructure is designed for bike traffic with cars being segregated. Here we have to put ourselves in traffic on streets designed exclusively for cars.

Clearly this doesn't relate to triathletes hammering along at 30 mph, but for a community that rides to work at a leisurely pace with out fear of drivers, I get what he was saying. 

2012-09-30 9:43 AM
in reply to: #4433721

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Subject: RE: Biking without a helmet
BrianRunsPhilly - 2012-09-30 8:47 AM

People don't bike here because it's dangerous and, as a society, we're fat and lazy. We're much more geographically spread out than most places in Europe. Distances between home, work, and shopping are greater.

Philly has made a concerted effort to become bike-friendly, and is now the number one big city, per capita, for bike commuting. 31% use helmets. So it's not about helmets.

Several studies were done to show that more bikes mean fewer accidents. Doubling the number of riders decreased the crash risk by 1/3. Drivers, pedestrians, and cyclists are more aware of each other.

That is what I was thinking, at least where I live. We don't have a grocery store (or very much at all for that matter) in the village where I live. I am 15 miles away from the nearest town and roads have not been created that are bike friendly. I don't really feel safe pulling my 4 year old in a bike wagon thingy and riding in the shoulder of the highway with semis, combines and other general traffic passing us. But I'm a chicken. 

2012-09-30 10:49 AM
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Subject: RE: Biking without a helmet
I have lived in Holland for 30 years and yes everyone rides a bike, but the car drivers are much more aware of bike riders because they also ride bikes in their spare time and the bicyclists have the right of way in the city. also there are bike lanes everywhere inside the city as well as outside of the city where the paved bike paths are totally separate from the highways. when people race bikes in Holland they do use helmets. I have always rode a bike in Holland without a helmet but now that I live in Canada I always where one. totally different situation.


2012-09-30 12:55 PM
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Subject: RE: Biking without a helmet

It has nothing to do with wearing a helmet.

As the US grew, land was cheap and we had plenty of room to spread out.

Gas and personal transportation is relatively cheap here.  In some climates, such as where I live (Austin), it is very hot during the summer and you would arrive sweat soaked at yoru destination.

As a society we attach a stigma to riding a bike past the age of 16 when everyone should embrace being able to drive a car and to stop riding around on a toy.

Go to a town like Crested Butte and there are many unhelmeted cyclists going from home to work or shopping.  The town is pretty compact and bicycle friendly.

I remember riding my bike through Zurich, Switzerland.  A driver got annoyed because I would not turn left in front of him as he was coming towards me.  My takeaway is there is a different cultural view on riding bikes in Europe or even athletic/outdoor minded communities in the US versus our typical views in the US.

 

2012-09-30 1:23 PM
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Subject: RE: Biking without a helmet

Simple urban design.  Lay out your cities around the Interstate Highway System and design your city streets with a sole focus on the fast and efficient movement of cars, and you'll get fewer people cycling.  With the exception of a few compact, mostly older, cities, this was how we grew up as a nation.

If you intentionally wanted to design for inactivity and obesity, you couldn't do better than most of the U.S.  It's going to be a real kick when the baby boomers get too old to drive.

2012-09-30 2:07 PM
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Subject: RE: Biking without a helmet
the bear - 2012-09-30 7:26 AM

Are helmets really "expected" here? I know of no law in this state that requires adult bicyclists to wear helmets, and I see people riding all the time without them.

I think helmets are a bit of a red herring in this discussion. Americans don't ride bikes because as a society we've grown fat, lazy, and overly dependent on the automobile for transportation.

I'm with the Bear.  I'd say that I see more people without helmets than I see with helmets around here.  I think it's a fat and lazy thing as well as a culture thing.  American's love their cars.

2012-09-30 3:16 PM
in reply to: #4433638

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Subject: RE: Biking without a helmet

Correlation does not equal causation. As others have pointed out, there are far more factors at play than just helmet use and expectations.  It sounds almost like the author just wants to force a connection to prove a point rather than really look for what the roots of issues are.

2012-09-30 4:12 PM
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Subject: RE: Biking without a helmet
CitySky - 2012-09-30 1:23 PM

Simple urban design.  Lay out your cities around the Interstate Highway System and design your city streets with a sole focus on the fast and efficient movement of cars, and you'll get fewer people cycling.  With the exception of a few compact, mostly older, cities, this was how we grew up as a nation.

If you intentionally wanted to design for inactivity and obesity, you couldn't do better than most of the U.S.  It's going to be a real kick when the baby boomers get too old to drive.



THIS. The biggest reason and difference between the U.S. and more cycling dominant countries. AND I agree 100% with your thought that it's going to get uglier and call for massive redesign of our suburban areas when the boomers start being "trapped" in their homes.


2012-09-30 4:48 PM
in reply to: #4433789

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Subject: RE: Biking without a helmet

Drago - 2012-09-30 8:49 AM I have lived in Holland for 30 years and yes everyone rides a bike, but the car drivers are much more aware of bike riders because they also ride bikes in their spare time and the bicyclists have the right of way in the city. also there are bike lanes everywhere inside the city as well as outside of the city where the paved bike paths are totally separate from the highways. when people race bikes in Holland they do use helmets. I have always rode a bike in Holland without a helmet but now that I live in Canada I always where one. totally different situation.

This ^^^^^^

In addition bikes were more popular in Europe before cars were more mainstream and bike racing was very popular. Motorists here in the USA as a general rule have no history with cyclists other than them being in there way.

I hope the feds get their act together and enact more safety regulations for bikes, no seat belts or air bags, think of the lives they would save.

2012-09-30 5:16 PM
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Subject: RE: Biking without a helmet

My wife lived in Europe for a few years.  She said that the best part of it was that she never went "grocery shopping" as we do here.  She said she'd ride her bike, or walk, to the market and buy whatever she wanted to eat for the day.  She'd eat leftovers the next day if she had any, but mostly she said it was a daily activity.

We ride bikes here, for the most part, for exercise.  Of course, a very small minority commute...but in the grand scheme of things the number is too small to be considered.  It's that way because, as others have mentioned, we're just too spread out.  It's nowhere near like that in most parts of Europe.

On the other hand......since the title is "biking without a helmet".....I passed a family of four yesterday who were riding three bikes.  Dan and very small son on their own bikes, each without a helmet, and mom, with an infant in one of those chest carriers, also without a helmet.  They looked like they were having a good time to me.  Like others, I see way more people riding without a helmet than I do with a helmet.  I don't care.



Edited by Left Brain 2012-09-30 5:17 PM
2012-09-30 8:41 PM
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Subject: RE: Biking without a helmet
kevin_trapp - 2012-09-30 8:42 AM

I was just at a seminar teaching cities how to design for bicycling and pedestrian traffic.  A couple European cities like Copenhagen and Amsterdam were highlighted, and the first question asked was why don't they wear helmets over there.  The presenter's explanation was that once you've separated bikes and cars, helmets are no longer necessary.  Accidents are greatly reduced, and when they do happen they're at slow speeds involving light bikes instead of two ton vehicles.  In those cities, the infrastructure is designed for bike traffic with cars being segregated. Here we have to put ourselves in traffic on streets designed exclusively for cars.

Clearly this doesn't relate to triathletes hammering along at 30 mph, but for a community that rides to work at a leisurely pace with out fear of drivers, I get what he was saying. 

Which is also funny because bicycle helmets are not designed for vehicular collisions... not even close. They are designed for falling off your bike. Now we can debate all day that having one on is better than not in a collision... I'm just saying they are not designed for that incident.

2012-10-01 5:25 AM
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Subject: RE: Biking without a helmet
powerman - 2012-09-30 9:41 PM
kevin_trapp - 2012-09-30 8:42 AM

I was just at a seminar teaching cities how to design for bicycling and pedestrian traffic.  A couple European cities like Copenhagen and Amsterdam were highlighted, and the first question asked was why don't they wear helmets over there.  The presenter's explanation was that once you've separated bikes and cars, helmets are no longer necessary.  Accidents are greatly reduced, and when they do happen they're at slow speeds involving light bikes instead of two ton vehicles.  In those cities, the infrastructure is designed for bike traffic with cars being segregated. Here we have to put ourselves in traffic on streets designed exclusively for cars.

Clearly this doesn't relate to triathletes hammering along at 30 mph, but for a community that rides to work at a leisurely pace with out fear of drivers, I get what he was saying. 

Which is also funny because bicycle helmets are not designed for vehicular collisions... not even close. They are designed for falling off your bike. Now we can debate all day that having one on is better than not in a collision... I'm just saying they are not designed for that incident.

At least one of my times that I cracked the helmet was the result of a collision. It's not the collision itself, it's how the car throws you off the bike and to the ground. And of course, we have all had "near misses" where somebody buzzes us on the bike, whether on purpose or not. If we got clipped, we would risk a head injury.

I have also heard that having more bikes on the road increases awareness of bikes on the road, which makes accidents less likely. Then we are still left with things like poorly maintained surfaces like the one that broke my helmet and gave me a minor concussion a few years back. I still slow down at that spot. And here in PA, we have notoriously poor roads.

2012-10-01 6:29 AM
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Subject: RE: Biking without a helmet

powerman - 2012-09-30 9:41 PM

Now we can debate all day that having one on is better than not in a collision... I'm just saying they are not designed for that incident.

Actually we can't as it wouldn't be a debate.  It would be a fact vs opinion).

While I agree they were not designed for auto collisions they DO protect your head from an auto collision.  Any energy absorbed by the helmet is energy that is NOT going into your head.  I have a helmet in 8 or 9 pieces and a lack of a skull fracture (which the doctors kept looking for) as one sample point.

 

But to add one more "me too".  Yes.  It's a cultural difference.  Not helmet laws.



2012-10-01 11:14 AM
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Subject: RE: Biking without a helmet
CitySky - 2012-09-30 11:23 AM

Simple urban design.  Lay out your cities around the Interstate Highway System and design your city streets with a sole focus on the fast and efficient movement of cars, and you'll get fewer people cycling.  With the exception of a few compact, mostly older, cities, this was how we grew up as a nation.

If you intentionally wanted to design for inactivity and obesity, you couldn't do better than most of the U.S.  It's going to be a real kick when the baby boomers get too old to drive.

+1

Post WWII urban design has cause all kinds of problems.  The world boomers were born into was what made our culture car-dependent.

The auto companies (GM specifically) also did no good by destroying public transportation in most cities - even though that started in the 30s.

2012-10-01 11:45 AM
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Subject: RE: Biking without a helmet
scorpio516 - 2012-10-01 12:14 PM
CitySky - 2012-09-30 11:23 AM

Simple urban design.  Lay out your cities around the Interstate Highway System and design your city streets with a sole focus on the fast and efficient movement of cars, and you'll get fewer people cycling.  With the exception of a few compact, mostly older, cities, this was how we grew up as a nation.

If you intentionally wanted to design for inactivity and obesity, you couldn't do better than most of the U.S.  It's going to be a real kick when the baby boomers get too old to drive.

+1

Post WWII urban design has cause all kinds of problems.  The world boomers were born into was what made our culture car-dependent.

The auto companies (GM specifically) also did no good by destroying public transportation in most cities - even though that started in the 30s.

X 1,000!!!

One simple example of the demise of planning and creation of the obese, American, car-nutz, landscape...  THE ELIMINATION OF SIDEWALKS!  That just burns me up!  Entire suburban neighborhoods being built with sidewalks.  The message is clear:  You're not expected to walk anywhere, you have to drive.

After MASSIVE protesting and lobbying in my hometown, they finally listened and many areas are now getting sidewalks.  I want my kids to be able to walk or ride their bike to sports practices, the pizza parlor, ice cream shop, hobby store, etc. on their own!  F "soccer mom taxis"!  Sidewalks empower kids to be independent, responsible and to grow up not having to always rely on automobiles.

(Rant off)

 

2012-10-01 12:05 PM
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Subject: RE: Biking without a helmet

A thread about "organ donors" 

 

 

good discussion

2012-10-02 11:43 PM
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Subject: RE: Biking without a helmet


The helmet has nothing to do with it. Many people don't bike due to sheer laziness.

I know some who live close to work. They ride when they don't own a car... but once they get one, the bike never gets any use.
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