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2013-03-15 8:03 PM
in reply to: #4661783

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Subject: RE: Feds can't force Domino's founder to offer contraceptives, judge says
jldicarlo - 2013-03-15 4:43 PM
lisac957 - 2013-03-15 4:38 PM
jldicarlo - 2013-03-15 4:36 PM

BikerGrrrl - 2013-03-15 4:24 PM I wish I had the job choice that so many seem to have. 

People misunderstand the word "choice".

I have no choice in my job.  I am committed (by law) until a certain date.  Prior to that date I cannot leave my job.  NO CHOICE.

I had a friend tell me he had no choice and couldn't quit his job because he had a family to support.  I told him that's not a choice...just because you don't like the consequences of your actions doesn't mean you still can't CHOOSE that option.  HE has a CHOICE... 

If you could walk into your bosses's office today and give notice and/or quit and he couldn't do anything about it...you have a choice.

But wait didn't you CHOOSE to do what you do in the first place?

The same as anyone else chooses to start a job.  The difference is in what happens AFTER.  Yes, I made the choice to take the job.  But once I signed my life away for pilot training completion (the moment of the choice) I literally COULD NOT QUIT...for ten years.  Contrast that with regular civilian jobs....you may choose to take a job.  Two weeks later you could change your mind and quit if you decide you hate the job.  I don't have that choice.  I literally cannot choose to quit my job...until 12 Aug 2014....

Sure you can.  You may be dishonorably discharged, but you can leave the military if you wanted out right now.  And you'd have to pay the government back as well most likely.  It's a contract, you can break it.  There are consequences, but you can break it if you really wanted to.



2013-03-15 8:23 PM
in reply to: #4661779

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Subject: RE: Feds can't force Domino's founder to offer contraceptives, judge says
DanielG - 2013-03-15 4:40 PM
BikerGrrrl - 2013-03-15 5:24 PMI wish I had the job choice that so many seem to have. 
So, someone's stopping you from quitting? If not, then you do have a choice.
I am responding to the many who said if you don't like the benefits you find another job. I summarize that theory as "job choice." Yes, I can quit. But it's harder to find a job that offers an insurance plan with the exact formulary I want, all other things being equal.It's similar to the argument about if you don't like the way the country is run, move. While that concept is a favorite of mine, the reality is that is easier said than done.
2013-03-15 10:45 PM
in reply to: #4660640

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Subject: RE: Feds can't force Domino's founder to offer contraceptives, judge says
All I want to know is who's paying the attorneys to represent the government?  Oh wait, that would be me, the taxpayer. 
2013-03-17 9:32 AM
in reply to: #4661510

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Subject: RE: Feds can't force Domino's founder to offer contraceptives, judge says
jldicarlo - 2013-03-15 3:24 PM

Artemis - 2013-03-15 2:13 PM
jldicarlo - 2013-03-15 3:01 PM

If you are referring to heavy periods...optional...not a necessity.  Insurance plans don't often pay for optional stuff (think plastic surgery). 

I am so opposed to birth control I won't even take it for my ridiculously insane heavy periods.  If I can survive anyone can survive. 

The only reason to use BC is to not get pregnant...and you can accomplish that by not having sex or being smart about when you do.

No it's not. Taking a pill can help women who have endometriosis - helps prevent build up of tissue outside the uterus - or PCOS - the estrogen can help regulate periods.

Again, those are conditions that are NOT life threatening and can be handled WITHOUT the use of BC.  BC in those situation is akin to asking insurance to pay for a b@@b job because you just don't like yours.  Period inconvenient?  Sorry, that's part of life.  It's a side effect of our "I just want to take a pill so I don't have to deal with this annoying thing" culture that's developed.  These problems aren't new.  Women have put up with these non life-threatening conditions for thousands of years without the aid of BC.  It'll be fine...really.



Ok, Tom Cruise. Time for you to jump up on the couch and profess your love. Oh wait that was with Oprah, not Matt Lauer.

I think you have gotten outside of your area of expertise. People didn't have antibiotics for 1000s of years as well. Do you think we should give those up?
2013-03-17 12:20 PM
in reply to: #4661986

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Subject: RE: Feds can't force Domino's founder to offer contraceptives, judge says
BikerGrrrl - 2013-03-15 9:23 PM

DanielG - 2013-03-15 4:40 PM
BikerGrrrl - 2013-03-15 5:24 PMI wish I had the job choice that so many seem to have. 
So, someone's stopping you from quitting? If not, then you do have a choice.
I am responding to the many who said if you don't like the benefits you find another job. I summarize that theory as "job choice." Yes, I can quit. But it's harder to find a job that offers an insurance plan with the exact formulary I want, all other things being equal.It's similar to the argument about if you don't like the way the country is run, move. While that concept is a favorite of mine, the reality is that is easier said than done.


Boil it down for me, please.

Do you believe it's your right to find a job:
Within your preferred career, that you can stay working at until such a time as YOU want to stop working there, that offers the exact health care packages that you prefer?

I'm not trying to be snotty, honest, there's a disconnect here and I'm trying to figure out what it is.

I can always quit where I work and go work as a janitor, fast food cook, construction worker, etc. May not get the benefits I want, but those are always choices of professions to go to in order to pay the mortgage. I would imagine you can as well. That's job choice, just as is choosing to work within your chosen profession for benefits that are not ideal, part time with no benefits, or chose another profession entirely.



2013-03-17 3:20 PM
in reply to: #4663037

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Subject: RE: Feds can't force Domino's founder to offer contraceptives, judge says
wannabefaster - 2013-03-17 9:32 AM
jldicarlo - 2013-03-15 3:24 PM
Artemis - 2013-03-15 2:13 PM
jldicarlo - 2013-03-15 3:01 PM

If you are referring to heavy periods...optional...not a necessity.  Insurance plans don't often pay for optional stuff (think plastic surgery). 

I am so opposed to birth control I won't even take it for my ridiculously insane heavy periods.  If I can survive anyone can survive. 

The only reason to use BC is to not get pregnant...and you can accomplish that by not having sex or being smart about when you do.

No it's not. Taking a pill can help women who have endometriosis - helps prevent build up of tissue outside the uterus - or PCOS - the estrogen can help regulate periods.

Again, those are conditions that are NOT life threatening and can be handled WITHOUT the use of BC.  BC in those situation is akin to asking insurance to pay for a b@@b job because you just don't like yours.  Period inconvenient?  Sorry, that's part of life.  It's a side effect of our "I just want to take a pill so I don't have to deal with this annoying thing" culture that's developed.  These problems aren't new.  Women have put up with these non life-threatening conditions for thousands of years without the aid of BC.  It'll be fine...really.

Ok, Tom Cruise. Time for you to jump up on the couch and profess your love. Oh wait that was with Oprah, not Matt Lauer. I think you have gotten outside of your area of expertise. People didn't have antibiotics for 1000s of years as well. Do you think we should give those up?

The difference being that antibiotics treat bacterial infections...which could KILL you.

A heavy/bad period will not kill you.



2013-03-17 3:21 PM
in reply to: #4661972

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Subject: RE: Feds can't force Domino's founder to offer contraceptives, judge says
coredump - 2013-03-15 8:03 PM
jldicarlo - 2013-03-15 4:43 PM
lisac957 - 2013-03-15 4:38 PM
jldicarlo - 2013-03-15 4:36 PM

BikerGrrrl - 2013-03-15 4:24 PM I wish I had the job choice that so many seem to have. 

People misunderstand the word "choice".

I have no choice in my job.  I am committed (by law) until a certain date.  Prior to that date I cannot leave my job.  NO CHOICE.

I had a friend tell me he had no choice and couldn't quit his job because he had a family to support.  I told him that's not a choice...just because you don't like the consequences of your actions doesn't mean you still can't CHOOSE that option.  HE has a CHOICE... 

If you could walk into your bosses's office today and give notice and/or quit and he couldn't do anything about it...you have a choice.

But wait didn't you CHOOSE to do what you do in the first place?

The same as anyone else chooses to start a job.  The difference is in what happens AFTER.  Yes, I made the choice to take the job.  But once I signed my life away for pilot training completion (the moment of the choice) I literally COULD NOT QUIT...for ten years.  Contrast that with regular civilian jobs....you may choose to take a job.  Two weeks later you could change your mind and quit if you decide you hate the job.  I don't have that choice.  I literally cannot choose to quit my job...until 12 Aug 2014....

Sure you can.  You may be dishonorably discharged, but you can leave the military if you wanted out right now.  And you'd have to pay the government back as well most likely.  It's a contract, you can break it.  There are consequences, but you can break it if you really wanted to.

Oh, sorry...I figured most people would draw the line at breaking the law.  Yes, could I murder someone and get out, yeah...I'll work on that.

I will modify my definition of choice to limit it to things that do not break the law.  I thought that was inferred.



Edited by jldicarlo 2013-03-17 3:26 PM
2013-03-17 3:33 PM
in reply to: #4663295

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Subject: RE: Feds can't force Domino's founder to offer contraceptives, judge says
jldicarlo - 2013-03-17 4:20 PM

wannabefaster - 2013-03-17 9:32 AM
jldicarlo - 2013-03-15 3:24 PM
Artemis - 2013-03-15 2:13 PM
jldicarlo - 2013-03-15 3:01 PM

If you are referring to heavy periods...optional...not a necessity.  Insurance plans don't often pay for optional stuff (think plastic surgery). 

I am so opposed to birth control I won't even take it for my ridiculously insane heavy periods.  If I can survive anyone can survive. 

The only reason to use BC is to not get pregnant...and you can accomplish that by not having sex or being smart about when you do.

No it's not. Taking a pill can help women who have endometriosis - helps prevent build up of tissue outside the uterus - or PCOS - the estrogen can help regulate periods.

Again, those are conditions that are NOT life threatening and can be handled WITHOUT the use of BC.  BC in those situation is akin to asking insurance to pay for a b@@b job because you just don't like yours.  Period inconvenient?  Sorry, that's part of life.  It's a side effect of our "I just want to take a pill so I don't have to deal with this annoying thing" culture that's developed.  These problems aren't new.  Women have put up with these non life-threatening conditions for thousands of years without the aid of BC.  It'll be fine...really.

Ok, Tom Cruise. Time for you to jump up on the couch and profess your love. Oh wait that was with Oprah, not Matt Lauer. I think you have gotten outside of your area of expertise. People didn't have antibiotics for 1000s of years as well. Do you think we should give those up?

The difference being that antibiotics treat bacterial infections...which could KILL you.

A heavy/bad period will not kill you.



What about statins or blood pressure medicines? Those could also be, wrongly, classified as lifestyle drugs. There are lifestyle choices (far less effective) which prevent the medical condition for which they are prescribed. We could deny those prescriptions and pay the far higher price of heart attack by believing that by avoiding cheeseburgers, you don't need prescription drugs.

Honestly, I simply can't buy the argument that BC should be disallowed because some object to it's use. If you object to using it; that's fine. Just realize that your lifestyle must be modified to accomodate that medical consequence which it can ameliorate.
2013-03-17 3:56 PM
in reply to: #4660640

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Subject: RE: Feds can't force Domino's founder to offer contraceptives, judge says
So, insurance should only provide for care that will keep you from dying? You won't die from a torn ACL but your lifestyle will certainly suffer, and perhaps your livelihood.
2013-03-17 3:56 PM
in reply to: #4660640

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Elite
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Subject: RE: Feds can't force Domino's founder to offer contraceptives, judge says
So, insurance should only provide for care that will keep you from dying? You won't die from a torn ACL but your lifestyle will certainly suffer, and perhaps your livelihood.
2013-03-17 4:03 PM
in reply to: #4663334

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Subject: RE: Feds can't force Domino's founder to offer contraceptives, judge says
bootygirl - 2013-03-17 4:56 PM

So, insurance should only provide for care that will keep you from dying? You won't die from a torn ACL but your lifestyle will certainly suffer, and perhaps your livelihood.


However, the correction to a torn ACL is not contrary to just about any religion so it's not covered by the 1st amendment.

Now, someone whose religion forbids surgery might even have an argument about that when this gets upheld. To be determined.



2013-03-17 4:29 PM
in reply to: #4663307

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Subject: RE: Feds can't force Domino's founder to offer contraceptives, judge says
pitt83 - 2013-03-17 3:33 PM
jldicarlo - 2013-03-17 4:20 PM
wannabefaster - 2013-03-17 9:32 AM
jldicarlo - 2013-03-15 3:24 PM
Artemis - 2013-03-15 2:13 PM
jldicarlo - 2013-03-15 3:01 PM

If you are referring to heavy periods...optional...not a necessity.  Insurance plans don't often pay for optional stuff (think plastic surgery). 

I am so opposed to birth control I won't even take it for my ridiculously insane heavy periods.  If I can survive anyone can survive. 

The only reason to use BC is to not get pregnant...and you can accomplish that by not having sex or being smart about when you do.

No it's not. Taking a pill can help women who have endometriosis - helps prevent build up of tissue outside the uterus - or PCOS - the estrogen can help regulate periods.

Again, those are conditions that are NOT life threatening and can be handled WITHOUT the use of BC.  BC in those situation is akin to asking insurance to pay for a b@@b job because you just don't like yours.  Period inconvenient?  Sorry, that's part of life.  It's a side effect of our "I just want to take a pill so I don't have to deal with this annoying thing" culture that's developed.  These problems aren't new.  Women have put up with these non life-threatening conditions for thousands of years without the aid of BC.  It'll be fine...really.

Ok, Tom Cruise. Time for you to jump up on the couch and profess your love. Oh wait that was with Oprah, not Matt Lauer. I think you have gotten outside of your area of expertise. People didn't have antibiotics for 1000s of years as well. Do you think we should give those up?

The difference being that antibiotics treat bacterial infections...which could KILL you.

A heavy/bad period will not kill you.

What about statins or blood pressure medicines? Those could also be, wrongly, classified as lifestyle drugs. There are lifestyle choices (far less effective) which prevent the medical condition for which they are prescribed. We could deny those prescriptions and pay the far higher price of heart attack by believing that by avoiding cheeseburgers, you don't need prescription drugs. Honestly, I simply can't buy the argument that BC should be disallowed because some object to it's use. If you object to using it; that's fine. Just realize that your lifestyle must be modified to accomodate that medical consequence which it can ameliorate.

Like I said...I only care that I don't pay a higher premium because of it.  If you want to pay a higher premium to have BC covered I could really care less....to each his own.  But I do not want to have to shoulder the cost of something I am morally and physically opposed to.  I understand that a small percentage of the population would be using it solely for a reason other than preventing pregnancy...but I also think that if that was "allowed' then the excuse would get seriously abused.

Whether we like it or not certain medical treatments are in the moral gray area...BC and abortions are the two that stick out the most in my brain.  People who are morally opposed to these medical treatments shouldn't have to contribute financially to their practice.  I cannot control what people do to their own bodies...but I can control whether I enable them or not.

2013-03-17 5:40 PM
in reply to: #4663364

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Subject: RE: Feds can't force Domino's founder to offer contraceptives, judge says
jldicarlo - 2013-03-17 5:29 PM

pitt83 - 2013-03-17 3:33 PM
jldicarlo - 2013-03-17 4:20 PM
wannabefaster - 2013-03-17 9:32 AM
jldicarlo - 2013-03-15 3:24 PM
Artemis - 2013-03-15 2:13 PM
jldicarlo - 2013-03-15 3:01 PM

If you are referring to heavy periods...optional...not a necessity.  Insurance plans don't often pay for optional stuff (think plastic surgery). 

I am so opposed to birth control I won't even take it for my ridiculously insane heavy periods.  If I can survive anyone can survive. 

The only reason to use BC is to not get pregnant...and you can accomplish that by not having sex or being smart about when you do.

No it's not. Taking a pill can help women who have endometriosis - helps prevent build up of tissue outside the uterus - or PCOS - the estrogen can help regulate periods.

Again, those are conditions that are NOT life threatening and can be handled WITHOUT the use of BC.  BC in those situation is akin to asking insurance to pay for a b@@b job because you just don't like yours.  Period inconvenient?  Sorry, that's part of life.  It's a side effect of our "I just want to take a pill so I don't have to deal with this annoying thing" culture that's developed.  These problems aren't new.  Women have put up with these non life-threatening conditions for thousands of years without the aid of BC.  It'll be fine...really.

Ok, Tom Cruise. Time for you to jump up on the couch and profess your love. Oh wait that was with Oprah, not Matt Lauer. I think you have gotten outside of your area of expertise. People didn't have antibiotics for 1000s of years as well. Do you think we should give those up?

The difference being that antibiotics treat bacterial infections...which could KILL you.

A heavy/bad period will not kill you.

What about statins or blood pressure medicines? Those could also be, wrongly, classified as lifestyle drugs. There are lifestyle choices (far less effective) which prevent the medical condition for which they are prescribed. We could deny those prescriptions and pay the far higher price of heart attack by believing that by avoiding cheeseburgers, you don't need prescription drugs. Honestly, I simply can't buy the argument that BC should be disallowed because some object to it's use. If you object to using it; that's fine. Just realize that your lifestyle must be modified to accomodate that medical consequence which it can ameliorate.

Like I said...I only care that I don't pay a higher premium because of it.  If you want to pay a higher premium to have BC covered I could really care less....to each his own.  But I do not want to have to shoulder the cost of something I am morally and physically opposed to.  I understand that a small percentage of the population would be using it solely for a reason other than preventing pregnancy...but I also think that if that was "allowed' then the excuse would get seriously abused.

Whether we like it or not certain medical treatments are in the moral gray area...BC and abortions are the two that stick out the most in my brain.  People who are morally opposed to these medical treatments shouldn't have to contribute financially to their practice.  I cannot control what people do to their own bodies...but I can control whether I enable them or not.



Thanks. I understand and respect your opinion. Mine differs, but that's OK. I do agree with your statement that a procedure or prescription by any other name can be used for malfecience and not as intended. Consider how many "D&C" we're done when abortion was illegal.
2013-03-17 5:59 PM
in reply to: #4663364

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Master
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Subject: RE: Feds can't force Domino's founder to offer contraceptives, judge says
jldicarlo - 2013-03-17 5:29 PM

pitt83 - 2013-03-17 3:33 PM
jldicarlo - 2013-03-17 4:20 PM
wannabefaster - 2013-03-17 9:32 AM
jldicarlo - 2013-03-15 3:24 PM
Artemis - 2013-03-15 2:13 PM
jldicarlo - 2013-03-15 3:01 PM

If you are referring to heavy periods...optional...not a necessity.  Insurance plans don't often pay for optional stuff (think plastic surgery). 

I am so opposed to birth control I won't even take it for my ridiculously insane heavy periods.  If I can survive anyone can survive. 

The only reason to use BC is to not get pregnant...and you can accomplish that by not having sex or being smart about when you do.

No it's not. Taking a pill can help women who have endometriosis - helps prevent build up of tissue outside the uterus - or PCOS - the estrogen can help regulate periods.

Again, those are conditions that are NOT life threatening and can be handled WITHOUT the use of BC.  BC in those situation is akin to asking insurance to pay for a b@@b job because you just don't like yours.  Period inconvenient?  Sorry, that's part of life.  It's a side effect of our "I just want to take a pill so I don't have to deal with this annoying thing" culture that's developed.  These problems aren't new.  Women have put up with these non life-threatening conditions for thousands of years without the aid of BC.  It'll be fine...really.

Ok, Tom Cruise. Time for you to jump up on the couch and profess your love. Oh wait that was with Oprah, not Matt Lauer. I think you have gotten outside of your area of expertise. People didn't have antibiotics for 1000s of years as well. Do you think we should give those up?

The difference being that antibiotics treat bacterial infections...which could KILL you.

A heavy/bad period will not kill you.

What about statins or blood pressure medicines? Those could also be, wrongly, classified as lifestyle drugs. There are lifestyle choices (far less effective) which prevent the medical condition for which they are prescribed. We could deny those prescriptions and pay the far higher price of heart attack by believing that by avoiding cheeseburgers, you don't need prescription drugs. Honestly, I simply can't buy the argument that BC should be disallowed because some object to it's use. If you object to using it; that's fine. Just realize that your lifestyle must be modified to accomodate that medical consequence which it can ameliorate.

Like I said...I only care that I don't pay a higher premium because of it.  If you want to pay a higher premium to have BC covered I could really care less....to each his own.  But I do not want to have to shoulder the cost of something I am morally and physically opposed to.  I understand that a small percentage of the population would be using it solely for a reason other than preventing pregnancy...but I also think that if that was "allowed' then the excuse would get seriously abused.

Whether we like it or not certain medical treatments are in the moral gray area...BC and abortions are the two that stick out the most in my brain.  People who are morally opposed to these medical treatments shouldn't have to contribute financially to their practice.  I cannot control what people do to their own bodies...but I can control whether I enable them or not.



Jehovah's witnesses believe that receiving a blood transfusion is a sin and that if you do get a blood transfusion you will not get in to heaven.

Should we make blood transfusions self-pay because a subset of our population is morally opposed to it?

We can find people who are morally opposed to almost anything (Christian Scientists: getting medical care, Jehovah's Witnesses: blood transfusion, Catholics: birth control). Do we really want to make it possible for small subsets of our population to dictate what the majority gets when it comes to health care?
2013-03-17 6:27 PM
in reply to: #4663526

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Subject: RE: Feds can't force Domino's founder to offer contraceptives, judge says
wannabefaster - 2013-03-17 6:59 PM

Jehovah's witnesses believe that receiving a blood transfusion is a sin and that if you do get a blood transfusion you will not get in to heaven.

Should we make blood transfusions self-pay because a subset of our population is morally opposed to it?

We can find people who are morally opposed to almost anything (Christian Scientists: getting medical care, Jehovah's Witnesses: blood transfusion, Catholics: birth control). Do we really want to make it possible for small subsets of our population to dictate what the majority gets when it comes to health care?


You're missing a very important detail in the comment.

Should a Jehovah's Witness own a company, he could make no blood transfusion part of his company's health benefits. Those that go to work there would have that spelled out as part of the job offering.

You are trying to paint it so everyone's health care is dependent on each company. It's not.

2013-03-17 7:52 PM
in reply to: #4663298

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Subject: RE: Feds can't force Domino's founder to offer contraceptives, judge says
jldicarlo - 2013-03-17 3:21 PM
coredump - 2013-03-15 8:03 PM
jldicarlo - 2013-03-15 4:43 PM
lisac957 - 2013-03-15 4:38 PM
jldicarlo - 2013-03-15 4:36 PM

BikerGrrrl - 2013-03-15 4:24 PM I wish I had the job choice that so many seem to have. 

People misunderstand the word "choice".

I have no choice in my job.  I am committed (by law) until a certain date.  Prior to that date I cannot leave my job.  NO CHOICE.

I had a friend tell me he had no choice and couldn't quit his job because he had a family to support.  I told him that's not a choice...just because you don't like the consequences of your actions doesn't mean you still can't CHOOSE that option.  HE has a CHOICE... 

If you could walk into your bosses's office today and give notice and/or quit and he couldn't do anything about it...you have a choice.

But wait didn't you CHOOSE to do what you do in the first place?

The same as anyone else chooses to start a job.  The difference is in what happens AFTER.  Yes, I made the choice to take the job.  But once I signed my life away for pilot training completion (the moment of the choice) I literally COULD NOT QUIT...for ten years.  Contrast that with regular civilian jobs....you may choose to take a job.  Two weeks later you could change your mind and quit if you decide you hate the job.  I don't have that choice.  I literally cannot choose to quit my job...until 12 Aug 2014....

Sure you can.  You may be dishonorably discharged, but you can leave the military if you wanted out right now.  And you'd have to pay the government back as well most likely.  It's a contract, you can break it.  There are consequences, but you can break it if you really wanted to.

Oh, sorry...I figured most people would draw the line at breaking the law.  Yes, could I murder someone and get out, yeah...I'll work on that.

I will modify my definition of choice to limit it to things that do not break the law.  I thought that was inferred.

No murder required, please don't be absurd.  You can break your contract.  There are consequences ( as there are with any contract ), but you can certainly break the contract without breaking the law.



2013-03-17 8:09 PM
in reply to: #4663652

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Subject: RE: Feds can't force Domino's founder to offer contraceptives, judge says
coredump - 2013-03-17 7:52 PM
jldicarlo - 2013-03-17 3:21 PM
coredump - 2013-03-15 8:03 PM
jldicarlo - 2013-03-15 4:43 PM
lisac957 - 2013-03-15 4:38 PM
jldicarlo - 2013-03-15 4:36 PM

BikerGrrrl - 2013-03-15 4:24 PM I wish I had the job choice that so many seem to have. 

People misunderstand the word "choice".

I have no choice in my job.  I am committed (by law) until a certain date.  Prior to that date I cannot leave my job.  NO CHOICE.

I had a friend tell me he had no choice and couldn't quit his job because he had a family to support.  I told him that's not a choice...just because you don't like the consequences of your actions doesn't mean you still can't CHOOSE that option.  HE has a CHOICE... 

If you could walk into your bosses's office today and give notice and/or quit and he couldn't do anything about it...you have a choice.

But wait didn't you CHOOSE to do what you do in the first place?

The same as anyone else chooses to start a job.  The difference is in what happens AFTER.  Yes, I made the choice to take the job.  But once I signed my life away for pilot training completion (the moment of the choice) I literally COULD NOT QUIT...for ten years.  Contrast that with regular civilian jobs....you may choose to take a job.  Two weeks later you could change your mind and quit if you decide you hate the job.  I don't have that choice.  I literally cannot choose to quit my job...until 12 Aug 2014....

Sure you can.  You may be dishonorably discharged, but you can leave the military if you wanted out right now.  And you'd have to pay the government back as well most likely.  It's a contract, you can break it.  There are consequences, but you can break it if you really wanted to.

Oh, sorry...I figured most people would draw the line at breaking the law.  Yes, could I murder someone and get out, yeah...I'll work on that.

I will modify my definition of choice to limit it to things that do not break the law.  I thought that was inferred.

No murder required, please don't be absurd.  You can break your contract.  There are consequences ( as there are with any contract ), but you can certainly break the contract without breaking the law.

Um, Active Duty Service Commitments are BINDING.  You cannot just "break" them.  This isn't a normal contract.  Every now and then personnel center will "right size" the force and let people voluntarily leave before their service commitment is up, but you can't just walk away no matter how much money you pay them...they don't have to release you.  In fact, many times they will implement "stop loss" meaning you can't leave even if you don't have a commitment.  They own you and they tell you what you can/cannot do.  The only way I could get out right now would be to break the law.  I guess I could also fail the fitness test four times but that takes over a year...so, again...I can't walk into work tomorrow and quit....

Edit: Here's an example of the voluntary measures going on lately.  Again, if you read the article it's only certain career fields.  Pilot is one that they will not approve the waiver for because they are undermanned in pilots.



Edited by jldicarlo 2013-03-17 8:12 PM
2013-03-18 9:13 AM
in reply to: #4663341

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Subject: RE: Feds can't force Domino's founder to offer contraceptives, judge says
DanielG - 2013-03-17 4:03 PM
bootygirl - 2013-03-17 4:56 PMSo, insurance should only provide for care that will keep you from dying? You won't die from a torn ACL but your lifestyle will certainly suffer, and perhaps your livelihood.
However, the correction to a torn ACL is not contrary to just about any religion so it's not covered by the 1st amendment.Now, someone whose religion forbids surgery might even have an argument about that when this gets upheld. To be determined.
I didn't think that BC was contrary to "just about every religion". A quick google confirms that. Many of Protestant groups do not object to it used as family planning within a marriage. Hindus and Buddists have no issues with it. Even muslin scholars believe that using it is not inconsistent with the Quran.
2013-03-18 9:49 AM
in reply to: #4664141

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Subject: RE: Feds can't force Domino's founder to offer contraceptives, judge says
bootygirl - 2013-03-18 10:13 AM

DanielG - 2013-03-17 4:03 PM
bootygirl - 2013-03-17 4:56 PMSo, insurance should only provide for care that will keep you from dying? You won't die from a torn ACL but your lifestyle will certainly suffer, and perhaps your livelihood.

However, the correction to a torn ACL is not contrary to just about any religion so it's not covered by the 1st amendment.Now, someone whose religion forbids surgery might even have an argument about that when this gets upheld. To be determined.

I didn't think that BC was contrary to "just about every religion". A quick google confirms that. Many of Protestant groups do not object to it used as family planning within a marriage. Hindus and Buddists have no issues with it. Even muslin scholars believe that using it is not inconsistent with the Quran.



I have no idea why you want to change the subject to one not even under discussion but I guess that means you're not really interested in the topic I was trying to get a real conversation about.

How you went from "the correction to a torn ACL is not contrary to just about any religion..." to "BC was contrary to 'just about ever religion'..." is beyond me.

I believe I've found the disconnect. Thanks.

2013-03-18 12:24 PM
in reply to: #4660640

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Subject: RE: Feds can't force Domino's founder to offer contraceptives, judge says

 

The sense of entitlement here is astounding.

I must have missed the natural rights to health insurance and employment and who/what bestowed those rights upon us.

No one owes you a job in the field you want to be in.

No one owes you health insurance or health care.

It is completely laughable to think that your employer owes you anything health related at all other than a reasonably safe work environment. I have a job and no benefits whatsoever, I suppose my rights are being violated. My wife has a job and no benefits whatsoever, so I suppose the fact that she is not even offered subsidized BC by her employer is a gross violation of her rights and discriminatory.

If your employer is so incredibly gracious enough to offer you health insurance in addition to your pay for the work you provide I would suggest you don't look that gift horse in the mouth. The appropriate thing to do would be to say thank you and take what you are GIVEN.

Don't like the plan or it doesn't cover every little thing that is important to you? Do what a lot of people do and go get your own dang plan and pay for it.

I don't care if it is for religious reasons or not no employer should be forced to provide health insurance and if they are nice enough to do it they get to decide what is covered.

All this ACA BS is exactly that, unconstitutional BS. It is not based at all on the principles of "insurance" it was specifically designed to bankrupt the private insurance industry, to train the masses that they are owed or have a right to health insurance and to get enough people on board to go to a single payer system. Simple as that. But before the single payer happens, if an employer wants to object I don't have a problem with them using any means available to object. 

ETA: last sentence.



Edited by Aarondb4 2013-03-18 12:24 PM
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