Bike improvements: speedwork or long slow rides.
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2013-03-23 6:54 PM |
62 | Subject: Bike improvements: speedwork or long slow rides. First time poster/long time lurker here. I'll start with a little background: I started running in August and shortly thereafter, started riding my mountain bike twice a week for cross training. Usually 10-15 miles. For the last 4 years or so, I would ride once a week or so, and bumped it up to twice per week about 6 months ago. Not long after I got into running, I decided it would be fun to start training for triathlon/duathlon. I got my road bike (Specialized Allez Elite) about a month and a half ago and have ridden it 4 times per week since then. I usually average about 19-20 for an 11-15 mile ride. My question is: would I make more speed improvement by just logging long easy miles at this point in my cycling career, or would intervals yield better results? I'm already in pretty decent shape, aerobically (PR'd a 5k last month in 20:41) and I'm not completely starting from scratch with my cycling. By the way: 26 yr old male, 5'10" 143 lbs Thanks! |
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2013-03-23 7:51 PM in reply to: #4671709 |
Expert 1394 Wilmington, NC | Subject: RE: Bike improvements: speedwork or long slow rides. Conbination of both. I would change the long easy miles to long steady miles on some days and intervals on others. |
2013-03-23 8:08 PM in reply to: #4671709 |
Regular 789 | Subject: RE: Bike improvements: speedwork or long slow rides. You need to incorporate intervals 1-2 times per week to stress your body. The long easy rides should be done at an aerobic pace. As to your running, you need to do the same there. Speedwork along something like this. Week 1 30sec fast/30sec easy X6 Week 2 30sec fast/30sec easy x10 Week 3 x12 Week 4 bump up to 1 min intervals going down to 5 of those. These are just examples only to help improve. Recovery should be a jogging pace and not walking. |
2013-03-23 9:19 PM in reply to: #4671709 |
Extreme Veteran 374 Southeast Michigan | Subject: RE: Bike improvements: speedwork or long slow rides. In my experience, in order to get fast on the bike one needs to push it hard in training. Not all of the time, but a significant amount of time (unlike with running), while also logging enough miles to be able to maintain it. I've tried both approaches. When I logged a lot of miles on the bike and didn't push the pace, my endurance was good and I felt good getting off the bike to run in races, but I couldn't suddenly find that extra gear on the bike in a race if I hadn't done it in training. |
2013-03-23 10:26 PM in reply to: #4671709 |
Master 10208 Northern IL | Subject: RE: Bike improvements: speedwork or long slow rides. Combinations of intervals and tempo blocks. Learn how to work various sizes and intensities for each to improve threshold power. |
2013-03-23 10:48 PM in reply to: #4671809 |
62 | Subject: RE: Bike improvements: speedwork or long slow rides. In my experience with running, putting in more easy miles makes me much faster in races even without speedwork. I guess the same methodology doesn't apply to cycling. I usually do about 2 of the 4 bike rides per week at a pretty high effort. 85-90% of my MHR. The other 2 are usually to spend some time in zone 1 and build my aerobic system. I have made some pretty big improvement since I've started riding regularly but just wanted to see if I was going about training the right way at this point in my cycling career. |
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2013-03-24 12:02 AM in reply to: #4671865 |
Subject: RE: Bike improvements: speedwork or long slow rides. WayneMott - 2013-03-23 5:48 PM In my experience with running, putting in more easy miles makes me much faster in races even without speedwork. I guess the same methodology doesn't apply to cycling. The same methodology does work for running in theory. The problem is the recovery cost and injury risks of too much high intensity running. |
2013-03-24 5:47 AM in reply to: #4671865 |
Master 2563 University Park, MD | Subject: RE: Bike improvements: speedwork or long slow rides. WayneMott - 2013-03-23 11:48 PM In my experience with running, putting in more easy miles makes me much faster in races even without speedwork. I guess the same methodology doesn't apply to cycling. I usually do about 2 of the 4 bike rides per week at a pretty high effort. 85-90% of my MHR. The other 2 are usually to spend some time in zone 1 and build my aerobic system. I have made some pretty big improvement since I've started riding regularly but just wanted to see if I was going about training the right way at this point in my cycling career. Following up on Jason's comment. Yes, there's a difference between run and bike training guidelines. You're doing well if you've figured that out so soon. From the perspective of building the aerobic systems, there needn't be any difference between run and bike training, as you're trying to achieve basically the same effect. And a balance of medium and high intensity workouts should be good for that. But there are a few reasons for the difference in guidelines, as far as I can tell. (i) As Jason mentioned, recovery from the impact of running, and the risk of injury from high intensity / high impact training shifts the balance away from an interval training focus in running. (ii) But there's also a positive reason why the steady running is recommended more than steady biking. The mere act of training our bodies to withstand the pounding and the repetitive eccentric muscle contractions of running has a benefit. It's often described as benefiting run 'efficiency', but it's less well understood than the aerobic training mechanisms (... at least, around here; I've not yet seen a good account of what this involves) (iii) For many people, the effort level of a 'steady' run is comparable to the effort level of a moderately intense bike ride. You can ride at a very low intensity and you're still riding, but if the run effort gets lower you start jogging or even walking. So to some extent we're comparing apples and oranges here. Good news for you is that since you're young and fairly light, you can likely recover from higher intensity running better than many of us around here. You would still do well to establish a solid base of steady miles, but the risks of higher intensity running are lower. It sounds like you're making good progress already. And welcome to BT - do keep being part of the conversation. |
2013-03-24 7:31 AM in reply to: #4671709 |
Pro 5892 , New Hampshire | Subject: RE: Bike improvements: speedwork or long slow rides. Before you should add any speed work to your training, make sure you have sufficient base miles to really take advantage of it. Speed work is tough on your mind and body and without sufficient base miles, it can make you slower. |
2013-03-24 9:09 AM in reply to: #4671709 |
Master 3888 Overland Park, KS | Subject: RE: Bike improvements: speedwork or long slow rides. Ride lots, mostly hard sometimes easy. 90%,of my rides are at a steady to hard effort. I rarely ride easy, only in group rides etc. that's what got me from 20-21 mph sprint bike splits to 22-23 mph OLY bike splits on one years time. |
2013-03-25 8:39 PM in reply to: #4671709 |
Veteran 187 Boulder, Colorado | Subject: RE: Bike improvements: speedwork or long slow rides. Long, easy miles do very little for bike fitness, particularly to someone already fit from two other sports. Long, hard miles is what you need. After a good bit of this, then you can start on "I want to puke" intervals. These will readjust what you think is easy and you will then realize the long, hard miles you were doing were really long "easy" miles; though they were anything but easy. You can go truly easy when you are riding 8 hours/day, every day. But then, even easy soon becomes hard. In short, always go hard on the bike. Running is the sport that you make gains by going easy and longer. |
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