General Discussion Triathlon Talk » My running SUCKS! Rss Feed  
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2013-07-28 7:05 PM

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Subject: My running SUCKS!
I am a 250lbs former powerlifter, football player, swimmer. My swim times are consistently in the top 10% overall / top 5 in my age group. My bikes are continually improving, now middle of the pack or better. But it doesn't matter if I am running 3 miles or 13.1 I have the same pace: 10-10:30 per mile. It doesn't matter if I run inside on a treadmill or out on the pavement. intervals don't seem to help. I can vary my speed all over the place on the treadmill for a 5-7 miler, and then get to a race and .......same story. For Kansas Ironman70.3 I was running 3-4 days a week, and used a running training program. great for building miles, not some much for speed. Today I did a fun sprint race and went from 2nd in the swim to 2nd to last by finish! there were only 2 people in my age group (30-34)with slower run paces then me!!!

Not sure if I am whinning or looking for help! thanks for listening anyway!


2013-07-28 8:04 PM
in reply to: DrPete65

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Subject: RE: My running SUCKS!
To run faster, you need to run more. Your logs are empty so it's hard to give a lot of feedback, but build up your mileage slowly. "Run lots. Mostly easy. Sometimes hard." The speed will come!
2013-07-28 8:37 PM
in reply to: DrPete65

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Subject: RE: My running SUCKS!
Look up the BarryP plan and run at least 6 days a week. Keep your logs to keep yourself honest. You will get faster

Oh, and quit whining unless you are averaging over 30 miles a week and still not getting faster.
2013-07-28 9:02 PM
in reply to: DrPete65

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Subject: RE: My running SUCKS!
You also need to think about your power to weight ratio, I see it all the time - Great big guys with lots of muscle can crank the big gears on the bike but once they get on the run they just can't keep up. If you want to do triathlon for fun and health, keep on lifting those big weights but if you want to compete you are going to have to drop some weight - you will never see a podium in a competitive race at 250.
2013-07-28 9:24 PM
in reply to: DrPete65

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Subject: RE: My running SUCKS!
Everyone's said it but without logs it's tough to tell. How tall are you? 250 powerlifter I'm guessing 5'10" ish? I'm a little taller but started running a little heavier. It will get better/easier with weight loss. How long have you been running? Intervals may not work if you're still relatively new. As it's been said run often.
2013-07-28 10:06 PM
in reply to: DrPete65

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Subject: RE: My running SUCKS!
I agree with what the others have said. Run as often as possible. Getting faster at running isn't easy. I saw some of the biggest increases in speed when training for my marathon, when I was running more than I had in my life.

Running really does have a lot to do with weight. There's a reason that the fastest marathoners in the world are frequently super- skinny (around 100 lbs.). While you don't necessarily have to lose a lot of weight to get faster, it will make it a LOT easier.

Good luck! Keep running!


2013-07-29 12:19 AM
in reply to: The Chupacabra

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Subject: RE: My running SUCKS!
My advice to get faster:

1. Lose weight. I saw a drastic improvement in my speed when I lost 50 lbs. All of a sudden it was just much easier to go faster even with a lower effort.

2. Run lots. Then run more.

3. Intervals. (I know you said these haven't worked for you, but keep at it, they are one of the best ways to get faster)

4. Hill sprints. (painful but they work)
2013-07-29 6:45 AM
in reply to: Chillin

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Subject: RE: My running SUCKS!
Originally posted by Chillin

1. Lose weight. I saw a drastic improvement in my speed when I lost 50 lbs. All of a sudden it was just much easier to go faster even with a lower effort.

2. Run lots. Then run more.


Yes, do these.

3. Intervals. (I know you said these haven't worked for you, but keep at it, they are one of the best ways to get faster)

4. Hill sprints. (painful but they work)


No need to worry about these for right now. I don't think you have a speed problem. You have a power-to-weight problem.

Most tris have relatively flat bike courses, so they favor heavy-but-powerful riders. Uphill riding favors a high power-to-weight ratio, and so is quite different. If you find that you're ok on uphill biking, then yes you have a run problem. But more likely is that you'll have the same problem on uphill biking that you have with running. There's little weight penalty in swimming and in flat riding, but a big penalty in bike climbing and in all running.
2013-07-29 6:53 AM
in reply to: trishie

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Subject: RE: My running SUCKS!

Originally posted by trishie To run faster, you need to run more. Your logs are empty so it's hard to give a lot of feedback, but build up your mileage slowly. "Run lots. Mostly easy. Sometimes hard." The speed will come!

 

^^^^^X2

2013-07-29 10:36 AM
in reply to: morey000

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Subject: RE: My running SUCKS!
Thanks for the input!....................I am 6'2 and although I don't use the logs here, I track all my workouts on an excel spread sheet. I have seriously cut back my weight lifting. Based on body fat percentages, its not realistic for me to be under 210-215 with losing some large amounts of muscle mass. I know that it is not realistic to run 6-7 min miles, but I would like to drop to 8 mins flat. I have done 1 70.3 and the training program I used was just mileage based. slowly building over 16 weeks running 4 days a week. I don't need a podium medal, but I am a competitive person......
2013-07-29 11:06 AM
in reply to: DrPete65

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Subject: RE: My running SUCKS!
I'm a runner just starting to get into triathlons. I did my first half marathon this year & ran it at about the pace you are running now. I only used a training plan that was mileage based. No drills. No intervals. My weight went from 225 to 190 by putting in the miles each week & by eating better. Now, I'm training for two more half marathons in October & I am using Jeff Galloway's training plan. Intervals, acceleration gliders, speed work, time trials...the whole 9 yards. If you want to get faster, you need to work at it. If you are already doing long races, and you are being honest about already putting in the miles needed each week, then I think you would benefit greatly from drills (all due respect to colinphillips). I'm guessing you didn't get good at bodybuilding by just grabbing heavier weights by yourself. I bet you asked others for help. I bet you read up on proper form. I bet you have a plan to warm up & get to your best top weight while lifting. Running is no different. Logging miles will get you to the finish. Working hard on improving your technique will get you to the finish faster.

I am already seeing improvements in my speed and endurance by doing the drills. I did my first half marathon in 2:15. My goal is to do my next one in less than 2:00 with my shoot for the stars goal of 1:45. With my training, I am absolutely confident that 2:00 is very achievable, and 1:45 may not be as far off as it seems.


2013-07-29 11:09 AM
in reply to: DrPete65

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Subject: RE: My running SUCKS!
Originally posted by DrPete65

Thanks for the input!....................I am 6'2 and although I don't use the logs here, I track all my workouts on an excel spread sheet. I have seriously cut back my weight lifting. Based on body fat percentages, its not realistic for me to be under 210-215 with losing some large amounts of muscle mass. I know that it is not realistic to run 6-7 min miles, but I would like to drop to 8 mins flat. I have done 1 70.3 and the training program I used was just mileage based. slowly building over 16 weeks running 4 days a week. I don't need a podium medal, but I am a competitive person......


You have somewhat conflicting goals--maintain some portion of muscle mass not necessary for running and run faster--but at least you recognize that. Regardless, though, the advice you have been given is spot on. Losing weight and running more will help you run faster. You don't need to worry about doing much interval work--a small amount of 'speed' work will go a long way at this stage. More important is to simply (gradually) build up your mileage of mostly easy running. And the more frequently you can run, the better. Any weight you lose will also be a big help--making it easier to move faster and making the running you do less taxing. Don't know if you will get fast enough to reach your running goals, but you will certainly be able to see some meaningful improvements.
2013-07-29 11:21 AM
in reply to: DrPete65

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Subject: RE: My running SUCKS!
Originally posted by DrPete65

Thanks for the input!....................I am 6'2 and although I don't use the logs here, I track all my workouts on an excel spread sheet. I have seriously cut back my weight lifting. Based on body fat percentages, its not realistic for me to be under 210-215 with losing some large amounts of muscle mass. I know that it is not realistic to run 6-7 min miles, but I would like to drop to 8 mins flat. I have done 1 70.3 and the training program I used was just mileage based. slowly building over 16 weeks running 4 days a week. I don't need a podium medal, but I am a competitive person......


You're right that you'd probably have to drop serious muscle mass to lose additional weight. Running is a sustainable power-to-weight sport. Just FYI, I believe the guesstimate is you drop 2-3 sec/mile per pound of weight loss. So dropping 10 lb could make you 20-30s / mile faster. Obviously there are diminishing returns, and fat vs. muscle loss differences, etc.

You're getting good advice by several previous posters. I think your goal of 8 min/mi isn't quite as far off as you think. But don't overthink it. Run frequently, easily, build distance slowly, and things will improve. -J
2013-07-29 10:24 PM
in reply to: DrPete65

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Subject: RE: My running SUCKS!
You might want to check out "Racing Weight" by Matt Fitzgerald - he has a lot of information about how to determine your best racing weight. As wrong as it feels, if you really want to compete you are going to need to lose some of those "look good" muscles and try to keep the go fast muscles. At 6-2 you have an advantage on the swim but you will need to make serious changes to get faster on the run.
2013-07-30 10:49 AM
in reply to: DJBurton65

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Subject: RE: My running SUCKS!
I went from 250lbs to 210-215. Former Bodybuilder/power lifter. Started last year doing Tri's and took 2 podiums. 1 in a sprint last year and 1 in an Oly this year. Keep working it will come. I starved myself to get down to 205 and had horrible results. I hired a coach and the results followed. You don't have to be thin to win.
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