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Training with Power, I love it!
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 2013-11-19 10:50 AM |
Veteran  660    Northern Illinois |  Subject: Training with Power, I love it!I never thought those words would come out of me. I did my first Tri in 1988. I have always considered myself "old school". No heart monitors or power meters for me. I recently bought a new KK Road Machine and had extra $$ on the gift card so I got the Kinetic Inride also. I do a lot of Spinerval DVD's and Troy is always talking about % of FTP he wants you working at. I thought I would give it a try thinking in the back of my mind I probably wasted $189. I couldn't have been more wrong. I didn't enjoy the 20 minute test though!! After all these years I have found a new energy during my trainer sessions. I have a lot to learn but I'm enjoying the trainer like never before. Nothing earth shattering here, but I thought I would share for those that might be on the fence about giving power a try. If you can get past the $$ I would recommend it. |
| 2013-11-19 11:05 AM in reply to: TriBoilermaker |
Veteran 930 Morgan Hill, California | Subject: RE: Training with Power, I love it! Great, that's all I need is a glowing recommendation to train with power! Now, just to find the $$$. Glad it makes the trainer better. I do know that lots of people really recommend training with power, and I'd like to. Now, what is the compelling argument my wife will buy? hmmm. |
| 2013-11-19 11:09 AM in reply to: kmac1346 |
Veteran 660 Northern Illinois | Subject: RE: Training with Power, I love it! Originally posted by kmac1346 You're right it is a lot of money. I'm far from the expert but I don't know of any cheap way to do it. If you already have a KK trainer then it's $189, I don't know if there is anything less than that. Good luck with the sales pitch, you are on your own there!!Great, that's all I need is a glowing recommendation to train with power! Now, just to find the $$$. Glad it makes the trainer better. I do know that lots of people really recommend training with power, and I'd like to. Now, what is the compelling argument my wife will buy? hmmm. |
| 2013-11-19 11:15 AM in reply to: kmac1346 |
Elite 7783  PEI, Canada | Subject: RE: Training with Power, I love it! The absolutely cheapest way to do it (that I know of) would be to do a virtual power setup using Golden Cheetah. All you would need is a supported trainer, an ANT+ speed sensor and an ANT+ stick. and I suppose a computer that you could setup near the trainer - a laptop would be ideal IMO but not required. |
| 2013-11-19 11:36 AM in reply to: 0 |
Master 2094 | Subject: RE: Training with Power, I love it! Originally posted by axteraa The absolutely cheapest way to do it (that I know of) would be to do a virtual power setup using Golden Cheetah. All you would need is a supported trainer, an ANT+ speed sensor and an ANT+ stick. and I suppose a computer that you could setup near the trainer - a laptop would be ideal IMO but not required. With a little Tweaking you can play the video on the screen and see your HR, Power and cadence at the top. Total cost $59 for the Garmin GSC-10. Even less if you go with an Asian knock-off Edited by pschriver 2013-11-19 11:37 AM |
| 2013-11-19 3:29 PM in reply to: pschriver |
Member 285 | Subject: RE: Training with Power, I love it! Dont forget about Trainerroad either. awesome website. You can train with virtual power for the $59 worth of equipment you need and a $10/month fee. You can use an HDMI/Apple TV to pull up the power on your TV and you can have it horizantal along the bottom while you watch whatever you want on the computer. plus it comes with training plans and a boatload of workouts. it makes riding the trainer FAR more bearable and productive. |
| 2013-11-19 3:55 PM in reply to: Iwannarunlikeforrest |
Member 55 | Subject: RE: Training with Power, I love it! Power is awesome. |
| 2013-11-19 5:25 PM in reply to: axteraa |
Extreme Veteran 1175 Langley, BC, 'Wet Coast' Canada | Subject: RE: Training with Power, I love it! I had a quick look at the GC website, but did not see a list of supported trainers. Is there a list that I missed? Thanks |
| 2013-11-19 5:58 PM in reply to: Iwannarunlikeforrest |
Member 2098 Simsbury, Connecticut | Subject: RE: Training with Power, I love it! Originally posted by Iwannarunlikeforrest Dont forget about Trainerroad either. awesome website. You can train with virtual power for the $59 worth of equipment you need and a $10/month fee. You can use an HDMI/Apple TV to pull up the power on your TV and you can have it horizantal along the bottom while you watch whatever you want on the computer. plus it comes with training plans and a boatload of workouts. it makes riding the trainer FAR more bearable and productive. Ok now THAT is cool! My trainer is on the list........ I see a Garmin speed sensor in my future!! THANKS! |
| 2013-11-19 6:05 PM in reply to: triosaurus |
Elite 7783 PEI, Canada | Subject: RE: Training with Power, I love it! Originally posted by triosaurus I had a quick look at the GC website, but did not see a list of supported trainers. Is there a list that I missed? Thanks Yeah, their documentation is rather..... umm, lacking... Within GC, I see it gives me a drop down list that includes: |
| 2013-11-19 11:08 PM in reply to: Iwannarunlikeforrest |
Pro 6520 Bellingham, WA | Subject: RE: Training with Power, I love it! Originally posted by Iwannarunlikeforrest Dont forget about Trainerroad either. awesome website. You can train with virtual power for the $59 worth of equipment you need and a $10/month fee. You can use an HDMI/Apple TV to pull up the power on your TV and you can have it horizantal along the bottom while you watch whatever you want on the computer. plus it comes with training plans and a boatload of workouts. it makes riding the trainer FAR more bearable and productive. I've been considering Trainerroad and wondered about hardware. What would be the ideal setup? With Xmas coming I have to put a list together. |
| 2013-11-20 2:21 AM in reply to: popsracer |
| Subject: RE: Training with Power, I love it! The minimum requirements are an ANT+ speed sensor and a ANT+ dongle. http://www.amazon.com/Garmin-Speed-Cadence-Bike-Sensor/dp/B000BFNOT... http://www.amazon.com/Garmin-USB-Stick-Fitness-Devices/dp/B00CM381S... The speed sensor captures speed and transmits that speed to your computer in real time to the dongle. From there, software (Trainer Road, Golden Cheetah, etc) calculates virtual power based on that speed using a known speed/power curve for the trainer you have. Most of the common trainers have a power curve established. Look around for deals. I think someone was selling two ANT+ sticks for $25 in the classifieds...can't remember if it was on here or ST. |
| 2013-11-20 2:22 AM in reply to: Jason N |
| Subject: RE: Training with Power, I love it! Originally posted by Jason N The minimum requirements are an ANT+ speed sensor and a ANT+ dongle. Of course you need a PC as well. http://www.amazon.com/Garmin-Speed-Cadence-Bike-Sensor/dp/B000BFNOT... http://www.amazon.com/Garmin-USB-Stick-Fitness-Devices/dp/B00CM381S... The speed sensor captures speed and transmits that speed to your computer in real time to the dongle. From there, software (Trainer Road, Golden Cheetah, etc) calculates virtual power based on that speed using a known speed/power curve for the trainer you have. Most of the common trainers have a power curve established. Look around for deals. I think someone was selling two ANT+ sticks for $25 in the classifieds...can't remember if it was on here or ST. |
| 2013-11-20 6:22 AM in reply to: axteraa |
Pro 6011 Camp Hill, Pennsylvania | Subject: RE: Training with Power, I love it! Originally posted by axteraa The absolutely cheapest way to do it (that I know of) would be to do a virtual power setup using Golden Cheetah. All you would need is a supported trainer, an ANT+ speed sensor and an ANT+ stick. and I suppose a computer that you could setup near the trainer - a laptop would be ideal IMO but not required. An even cheaper option if you understand the concepts well enough is to create a table of estimated power at various speeds for your particular trainer using the published power curve, then use that to test to estimate FTP and design training sessions from it. I did this before I had a power meter about 3 years ago over the winter. It was more work, but I found it to be very educational.
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| 2013-11-20 6:54 AM in reply to: TriMyBest |
Pro 6582 Melbourne FL Gold member | Subject: RE: Training with Power, I love it! Originally posted by TriMyBest Exactly what I have done for the KK/CO trainers. I have the full BT/Jorge Cycling plan in Excel, I've shared it with many on BT. After doing the 5' & 20' test you'll have your Critical Power # and the percentage/zones tables to use with any training protocol that provides power related zones.Originally posted by axteraa The absolutely cheapest way to do it (that I know of) would be to do a virtual power setup using Golden Cheetah. All you would need is a supported trainer, an ANT+ speed sensor and an ANT+ stick. and I suppose a computer that you could setup near the trainer - a laptop would be ideal IMO but not required. An even cheaper option if you understand the concepts well enough is to create a table of estimated power at various speeds for your particular trainer using the published power curve, then use that to test to estimate FTP and design training sessions from it. I did this before I had a power meter about 3 years ago over the winter. It was more work, but I found it to be very educational. |
| 2013-11-20 7:16 AM in reply to: axteraa |
Extreme Veteran 1018 | Subject: RE: Training with Power, I love it! Is the Golden Cheetah as good as trainer road? |
| 2013-11-20 9:19 AM in reply to: popsracer |
| 274 | Subject: RE: Training with Power, I love it! Originally posted by popsracer Originally posted by Iwannarunlikeforrest Dont forget about Trainerroad either. awesome website. You can train with virtual power for the $59 worth of equipment you need and a $10/month fee. You can use an HDMI/Apple TV to pull up the power on your TV and you can have it horizantal along the bottom while you watch whatever you want on the computer. plus it comes with training plans and a boatload of workouts. it makes riding the trainer FAR more bearable and productive. I've been considering Trainerroad and wondered about hardware. What would be the ideal setup? With Xmas coming I have to put a list together. For the ANT+ stick I would recommend getting the Suunto Mini Movestick. It's really small (hence the mini) so you can keep it plugged into your laptop/pc without noticing it is there. |
| 2013-11-20 9:39 AM in reply to: popsracer |
Veteran 275 Algonquin, IL | Subject: RE: Training with Power, I love it! Originally posted by popsracer Originally posted by Iwannarunlikeforrest Dont forget about Trainerroad either. awesome website. You can train with virtual power for the $59 worth of equipment you need and a $10/month fee. You can use an HDMI/Apple TV to pull up the power on your TV and you can have it horizantal along the bottom while you watch whatever you want on the computer. plus it comes with training plans and a boatload of workouts. it makes riding the trainer FAR more bearable and productive. I've been considering Trainerroad and wondered about hardware. What would be the ideal setup? With Xmas coming I have to put a list together. I assume you have a trainer? You just need an ANT+ stick and a cadence/speed sensor. And a large fan and plenty of towels. I use a laptop right near my bike and then have my TV tuned to whatever I feel like watching. I have seen some neat setups where people have side-by-side 40" flat screens; one running TR, the other as a TV. TR is the best money I spend on training. Once you do your FTP test, the workouts appear in a nice GUI. It holds you "accountable" in that your pwoer targets for the workout are displayed and at the end of each interval, a quick summary appears on how close to target your were and how consistent you held that power. There are alos videos you can buy that match workouts, such as Sufferfest. Nate from TR is on BT and is pretty good about responding to TR threads. I have been using TR for almost three years now (beta tester) and it has imporved my cycling immensly. I actually look forward to going to the basement for pain. |
| 2013-11-20 9:48 AM in reply to: cartman1966 |
Member 285 | Subject: RE: Training with Power, I love it! Originally posted by cartman1966 Originally posted by popsracer Originally posted by Iwannarunlikeforrest Dont forget about Trainerroad either. awesome website. You can train with virtual power for the $59 worth of equipment you need and a $10/month fee. You can use an HDMI/Apple TV to pull up the power on your TV and you can have it horizantal along the bottom while you watch whatever you want on the computer. plus it comes with training plans and a boatload of workouts. it makes riding the trainer FAR more bearable and productive. I've been considering Trainerroad and wondered about hardware. What would be the ideal setup? With Xmas coming I have to put a list together. I assume you have a trainer? You just need an ANT+ stick and a cadence/speed sensor. And a large fan and plenty of towels. I use a laptop right near my bike and then have my TV tuned to whatever I feel like watching. I have seen some neat setups where people have side-by-side 40" flat screens; one running TR, the other as a TV. TR is the best money I spend on training. Once you do your FTP test, the workouts appear in a nice GUI. It holds you "accountable" in that your pwoer targets for the workout are displayed and at the end of each interval, a quick summary appears on how close to target your were and how consistent you held that power. There are alos videos you can buy that match workouts, such as Sufferfest. Nate from TR is on BT and is pretty good about responding to TR threads. I have been using TR for almost three years now (beta tester) and it has imporved my cycling immensly. I actually look forward to going to the basement for pain. ^^This *Note: you can also buy a bluetooth Wahoo SC sensor instead of using ANT. It's the same price, but if you have a newer Mac then it has built in bluetooth and you dont need the ANT+ Stick, essentially saving you $40. Thats what i did. Just an FYI, you can upload any of the Trainerroad files (tcx.?) to websites like Strava and it will include all the power/HR data along with distance. |
| 2013-11-20 12:30 PM in reply to: GAUG3 |
Elite 7783 PEI, Canada | Subject: RE: Training with Power, I love it! Originally posted by GAUG3 Is the Golden Cheetah as good as trainer road? It doesn't include any plans and not nearly as refined but if you are willing to do a little work to figure it out it's free. It really depends on what you want. If you want simplicity with little effort in setup, GC probably isn't the way to go. If you like to tinker, give it a shot. |
| 2013-11-20 3:10 PM in reply to: cartman1966 |
Pro 6520 Bellingham, WA | Subject: RE: Training with Power, I love it! Originally posted by cartman1966 Originally posted by popsracer I assume you have a trainer? You just need an ANT+ stick and a cadence/speed sensor. And a large fan and plenty of towels. I use a laptop right near my bike and then have my TV tuned to whatever I feel like watching. I have seen some neat setups where people have side-by-side 40" flat screens; one running TR, the other as a TV. TR is the best money I spend on training. Once you do your FTP test, the workouts appear in a nice GUI. It holds you "accountable" in that your pwoer targets for the workout are displayed and at the end of each interval, a quick summary appears on how close to target your were and how consistent you held that power. There are alos videos you can buy that match workouts, such as Sufferfest. Nate from TR is on BT and is pretty good about responding to TR threads. I have been using TR for almost three years now (beta tester) and it has imporved my cycling immensly. I actually look forward to going to the basement for pain. Originally posted by Iwannarunlikeforrest Dont forget about Trainerroad either. awesome website. You can train with virtual power for the $59 worth of equipment you need and a $10/month fee. You can use an HDMI/Apple TV to pull up the power on your TV and you can have it horizantal along the bottom while you watch whatever you want on the computer. plus it comes with training plans and a boatload of workouts. it makes riding the trainer FAR more bearable and productive. I've been considering Trainerroad and wondered about hardware. What would be the ideal setup? With Xmas coming I have to put a list together. I have a Cycleops Fluid 2. From what I could gather on the TR website, they can approximate your power based on your particular trainer but was wondering about getting a Powertap. I'm assuming that would be much more accurate. I guess you'd still need a cadence/speed sensor? What about display for power output, etc.? That would just be on a laptop? |
| 2013-11-20 3:17 PM in reply to: popsracer |
Elite 7783 PEI, Canada | Subject: RE: Training with Power, I love it! A Powertap will give you speed and cadence on the trainer on it's own without a separate sensor. |
| 2013-11-20 3:31 PM in reply to: popsracer |
| 274 | Subject: RE: Training with Power, I love it! The speed/cadence sensor connects to the TR software and displays real time in the workout chart/view. |
| 2013-11-20 3:39 PM in reply to: popsracer |
| 1660 | Subject: RE: Training with Power, I love it! Originally posted by popsracer Originally posted by cartman1966 Originally posted by popsracer I assume you have a trainer? You just need an ANT+ stick and a cadence/speed sensor. And a large fan and plenty of towels. I use a laptop right near my bike and then have my TV tuned to whatever I feel like watching. I have seen some neat setups where people have side-by-side 40" flat screens; one running TR, the other as a TV. TR is the best money I spend on training. Once you do your FTP test, the workouts appear in a nice GUI. It holds you "accountable" in that your pwoer targets for the workout are displayed and at the end of each interval, a quick summary appears on how close to target your were and how consistent you held that power. There are alos videos you can buy that match workouts, such as Sufferfest. Nate from TR is on BT and is pretty good about responding to TR threads. I have been using TR for almost three years now (beta tester) and it has imporved my cycling immensly. I actually look forward to going to the basement for pain. Originally posted by Iwannarunlikeforrest Dont forget about Trainerroad either. awesome website. You can train with virtual power for the $59 worth of equipment you need and a $10/month fee. You can use an HDMI/Apple TV to pull up the power on your TV and you can have it horizantal along the bottom while you watch whatever you want on the computer. plus it comes with training plans and a boatload of workouts. it makes riding the trainer FAR more bearable and productive. I've been considering Trainerroad and wondered about hardware. What would be the ideal setup? With Xmas coming I have to put a list together. I have a Cycleops Fluid 2. From what I could gather on the TR website, they can approximate your power based on your particular trainer but was wondering about getting a Powertap. I'm assuming that would be much more accurate. I guess you'd still need a cadence/speed sensor? What about display for power output, etc.? That would just be on a laptop? I have a Cycleops FLuid2. I also purchased a powertap after enjoying virtualpower. Unfortunately, virtualpower does NOT match closely with powertap power per the power curve used by TR. Mine was off by over 70 watts (Fluid 2 virtual power was 70watts higher than powertap.) On the bright side, the Fluid2 is extremely precise. The readings between workouts for a given powertap power were precise down to the 0.1mph with a speed sensor, meaning that using virtualpower was every bit as good as using realpower for TR training. In fact, my indoor training hasn't changed one bit since I got the powertap on trainerroad - just gives me numbers that I can correlate to outdoor racing/riding (which is very helpful.) As long as you're going all out on that FTP test, it doesn't matter what number the virtualpower is - it'll be ok for power-based training with the Fluid2. |
| 2013-11-20 4:08 PM in reply to: axteraa |
Pro 6520 Bellingham, WA | Subject: RE: Training with Power, I love it! Originally posted by axteraa A Powertap will give you speed and cadence on the trainer on it's own without a separate sensor. Sorry for the dumb questions but does the powertap transmit the data directly to the laptop or would you still need an ANT+ stick? Also, how does the powertap give you cadence? With the powertap, if I'm riding on the road, will it synch up to my 910xt so I could use that to read my data? |
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