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2014-04-22 9:01 PM

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Subject: Quit or stay - another WWCOJD

I teach a gym class at the local YMCA on Tuesday and Thursday mornings. The kids I teach range from age 4 - 15. The format of the class is 30 min fitness activities then 45 min of a sport. Parents are on Y premises during this time. The Tuesday class has only 13 kids,  33 on Thursday. Tuesday is high maintenance. These kids have never played an entire game of any sport we've taught without quitting, or falling on the floor pretending to be hurt so they can go run to Mom. They argue with me about every call if it does not go in their favor, and by arguing I mean yelling at me or bawling. If their team is losing they quit the game by either laying down on the floor right in the middle of play,  running out the room crying to see their Mom or just walking off the court. Thursday with 33 kids - no one ever quits, argues, runs to their parent. It is like night and day.

So I've been  teaching this since December I guess and trying week after week to encourage good sportsmanship which is in the Y handbook. Today I had 2 sports planned. During the first sport half the class quit with kids walking on and off the court whenever they feel like it. They get upset about something they just quit then decide to come back and play after Mommy comforts them. The second sport was badminton and I only had enough rackets for 6 kids to play at a time so they had to take turns. So I decided I would reward the good sports who never quit by giving them the first turn to play badminton. This seemed very simple but all heck broke loose. All the poor sports ran out of the room bawling to Mom and now I have 3 Moms ragging on me saying their kid said they were not going to get a turn. Right, this makes a lot of sense. All freaking year I've been trying to find a way to keep your kids IN the game.

Later I hear from my Supervisor that one of the Moms came to see her and tattle on the other Moms who were all sitting around trashing me behind my back while I'm in working with their kids. They are saying they will quit the program if I am the teacher for the next session. Huh? Because I gave a reward for kids doing the right thing? Dumbfounded, I really am. And the weirdest thing is these same Moms who don't want me to teach anymore have more than one child in the program and in all cases one child received the reward while maybe brother or sister did not. So no one is saying good job to the ones who did the right thing and also not disciplining the children who constantly quit. It is a pathetic display of children repeating the behavior modeled for them.

Now, I told my Supervisor I will happily quit. I mean I am making minimum wage here. I am only doing this to help out the Y - it's not like I'm making a living off of this. I said if they don't want me around then it is no skin off my back. She says no, she would rather have me stay on and hope these families quit so she does not have to deal with them anymore either!

I am split 50/50 - part of me does not want the bully whiners to get their way so easily as to have me quit. The other part of me is tired of dealing with this every Tuesday for the measly pay and would happily stay home and drink an extra cup of coffee!

So what would you do?



2014-04-22 9:11 PM
in reply to: trigal38

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Subject: RE: Quit or stay - another WWCOJD

I no longer work at a YMCA.  I tried hard for three years of full time and it was the longest three years of my life and the biggest mistake I made in my life.  I had the worst example of a human being as the Executive Director and if you talk to anyone on the board about it, watch out.  And I was in a very small town... Good luck in your decision.

 

2014-04-22 9:16 PM
in reply to: trigal38

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Subject: RE: Quit or stay - another WWCOJD

Stay - and stick to your guns. 

Oh......and thanks for doing what you do.  Our kids grew up at the Y.....and they were taught values like you are teaching by people just like you..  Those lessons were invaluable as we raised our kids.

You can't control stupid parents....just do what's right.

2014-04-22 9:26 PM
in reply to: Left Brain

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Subject: RE: Quit or stay - another WWCOJD

Originally posted by Left Brain

Stay - and stick to your guns. 

Oh......and thanks for doing what you do.  Our kids grew up at the Y.....and they were taught values like you are teaching by people just like you..  Those lessons were invaluable as we raised our kids.

You can't control stupid parents....just do what's right.

 

Word.   Especially if management has your back.   I would also start a new rule:  When you leave the room, you're not allowed back that day.  

I tell my kids the same thing:  "If you're going to play, PLAY.  If you're going to quit, QUIT. Make a decision and stick with it."   by "quit" I mean: once they start a sport for the season, they have to stick with it until the end.  If they don't want to play the next season, I'm not going to make them. 

 

2014-04-22 9:40 PM
in reply to: moondawg14

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Subject: RE: Quit or stay - another WWCOJD

Originally posted by moondawg14

Originally posted by Left Brain

Stay - and stick to your guns. 

Oh......and thanks for doing what you do.  Our kids grew up at the Y.....and they were taught values like you are teaching by people just like you..  Those lessons were invaluable as we raised our kids.

You can't control stupid parents....just do what's right.

 

Word.   Especially if management has your back.   I would also start a new rule:  When you leave the room, you're not allowed back that day.  

I tell my kids the same thing:  "If you're going to play, PLAY.  If you're going to quit, QUIT. Make a decision and stick with it."   by "quit" I mean: once they start a sport for the season, they have to stick with it until the end.  If they don't want to play the next season, I'm not going to make them. 

 

Good call!

2014-04-22 10:07 PM
in reply to: moondawg14

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Subject: RE: Quit or stay - another WWCOJD

Originally posted by moondawg14 Word.   Especially if management has your back.   I would also start a new rule:  When you leave the room, you're not allowed back that day.  

I tell my kids the same thing:  "If you're going to play, PLAY.  If you're going to quit, QUIT. Make a decision and stick with it."   by "quit" I mean: once they start a sport for the season, they have to stick with it until the end.  If they don't want to play the next season, I'm not going to make them. 

Absolutely.  With management on your side, stick with it and run the program your way. 

Our son is in Jiu Jitsu at our local Y and, although the class is for 6 to 8 year olds, they run a very strict program.

If the kids are acting up, not paying attention or talking when the sensai is instructing then its 10 pushups.

If a kid shows up late, the parent gets a lecture that it is not acceptable and their kid will have to sit and watch if it happens again.

You don't need to be that strict, but I would bet that most parents will support you if you set a few ground rules (or am I being naïve?).

 



2014-04-22 10:45 PM
in reply to: trigal38

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Subject: RE: Quit or stay - another WWCOJD
All good recommendations so far as I see it.
It all stems (like most things) from bad parenting in my opinion. That said, like mentioned earlier, don't give up.
Just be crystal clear about expectations with both the parents and the kids.
The age range of 4 to 15 is huge.
Is the Tuesday class younger? More varied?
The good part is that your actions will be magnified in the smaller class of 13 kids.
Always stay positive...even when doling out reward or punishment.

btw, enlisting the help of a "volunteer," (aka obnoxious, complaining parent) could prove helpful. Sometimes these parents can't see past their perfect little snot-nosed kid. Once they start contributing to the operation there's a chance they'll gain a better perspective.

btw, don't sweat the complainers. You could be the best Y gym class teacher ever, and you'll have knuckleheads complain. Be positive, have fun, and reinforce good sportsmanship. That way, you can't lose!
Good luck.

2014-04-23 6:42 AM
in reply to: ChineseDemocracy

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Subject: RE: Quit or stay - another WWCOJD

Agree with the idea "quitting means your out for the day". My attempt to reward the children who continued to play was the first step towards a meaningful consequence and it is clear how well that worked out LOL! Honestly I think that had enough of an impact that it may help some of the older children improve their behavior. Or maybe a good place to start would be if you leave in the middle of the game you do not get to come back in until that game is finished and we start a new one.

Some of the children in this class show autistic like tendencies and/or ADHD so I have tried to be very patient & encouraging with the group as a whole. I am the first one to point out when they do the right thing, try hard, communicate instead of cry. But I feel like I am walking on a tightrope because it does not matter what I do - someone will ALWAYS be upset, crying and leaving the game. Is crying when you don't get your way, don't play the game you like, don't always get the first turn, don't get the ball when you think you should a result of Autism or ADHD?  There is never a consequence from Mom when the children in this class run out of game, just sweet talk and they sit on the bleachers until they feel better. A lot of the worst offenders do not have these extra concerns. Their mother is the instigator and there are 4 children from this family in this one class.

My supervisor wants to have a "talk" with children & Moms at the beginning of the next class and review the sportsmanship guidelines in the handbook which all of the parents signed a copy of. But I just don't even care anymore. The children are living up to the model of behavior created by them from their parent. They cry when they don't get their way and so does their Mom. Miss Dina tried to encourage positive behavior - we'll just quit. Whatever, no wonder the kids act the way they do.

Thanks for the encouragement!

2014-04-23 6:45 AM
in reply to: ChineseDemocracy

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Subject: RE: Quit or stay - another WWCOJD

if you enjoy it and the good kids are worth it - stay.  if those parents are going to take their bratty kids out of the class anyway, you have nothing to lose!  you obviously run a good program, and success with the thursday kids shows it.  don't let a bunch of beyotches that obviously spoil/coddle their kids ruin something you love (i'm assuming you love this - nobody subjects themselves to other peoples small children without some level of love there!)

 

2014-04-23 8:01 AM
in reply to: 0

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Subject: RE: Quit or stay - another WWCOJD

Originally posted by trigal38

My supervisor wants to have a "talk" with children & Moms at the beginning of the next class and review the sportsmanship guidelines in the handbook which all of the parents signed a copy of. But I just don't even care anymore. The children are living up to the model of behavior created by them from their parent. They cry when they don't get their way and so does their Mom. Miss Dina tried to encourage positive behavior - we'll just quit. Whatever, no wonder the kids act the way they do.

Thanks for the encouragement!

The part I highlighted, caught my attention.  One thing to remember is that even when the kids have a poor role model in their parents, that doesn't mean that they can't meet expectations set by a teacher or others.  Set high expectations, knowing that they have the ability to reach them.  Don't come down to their level.

And good on you for doing this.  Kids need people to care.  But don't get emotionally tied to the results.  It is tough as you aren't doing this for the money.  You do it because you care.  Just don't "Care" too much.



Edited by velocomp 2014-04-23 8:01 AM
2014-04-23 8:19 AM
in reply to: trigal38

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Subject: RE: Quit or stay - another WWCOJD

Originally posted by trigal38

Agree with the idea "quitting means your out for the day". My attempt to reward the children who continued to play was the first step towards a meaningful consequence and it is clear how well that worked out LOL! Honestly I think that had enough of an impact that it may help some of the older children improve their behavior. Or maybe a good place to start would be if you leave in the middle of the game you do not get to come back in until that game is finished and we start a new one.

Some of the children in this class show autistic like tendencies and/or ADHD so I have tried to be very patient & encouraging with the group as a whole. I am the first one to point out when they do the right thing, try hard, communicate instead of cry. But I feel like I am walking on a tightrope because it does not matter what I do - someone will ALWAYS be upset, crying and leaving the game. Is crying when you don't get your way, don't play the game you like, don't always get the first turn, don't get the ball when you think you should a result of Autism or ADHD?  There is never a consequence from Mom when the children in this class run out of game, just sweet talk and they sit on the bleachers until they feel better. A lot of the worst offenders do not have these extra concerns. Their mother is the instigator and there are 4 children from this family in this one class.

My supervisor wants to have a "talk" with children & Moms at the beginning of the next class and review the sportsmanship guidelines in the handbook which all of the parents signed a copy of. But I just don't even care anymore. The children are living up to the model of behavior created by them from their parent. They cry when they don't get their way and so does their Mom. Miss Dina tried to encourage positive behavior - we'll just quit. Whatever, no wonder the kids act the way they do.

Thanks for the encouragement!

Setting expectations and sticking to them is important.  My daughter runs the school age programs at a "Y" and one challenge for staff is to see the good they are doing amongst the crud that is going on. Someone will always be upset, but please know that the positive work you are doing is (or will be) appreciated by all involved at some point. 



2014-04-23 8:27 AM
in reply to: 0

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Subject: RE: Quit or stay - another WWCOJD

Originally posted by velocomp

Originally posted by trigal38

My supervisor wants to have a "talk" with children & Moms at the beginning of the next class and review the sportsmanship guidelines in the handbook which all of the parents signed a copy of. But I just don't even care anymore. The children are living up to the model of behavior created by them from their parent. They cry when they don't get their way and so does their Mom. Miss Dina tried to encourage positive behavior - we'll just quit. Whatever, no wonder the kids act the way they do.

Thanks for the encouragement!

The part I highlighted, caught my attention.  One thing to remember is that even when the kids have a poor role model in their parents, that doesn't mean that they can't meet expectations set by a teacher or others.  Set high expectations, knowing that they have the ability to reach them.  Don't come down to their level.

And good on you for doing this.  Kids need people to care.  But don't get emotionally tied to the results.  It is tough as you aren't doing this for the money.  You do it because you care.  Just don't "Care" too much.

Yes, I am to the point that I barely care at all anymore and feel like I could just set up some equipment and sit on my rear end for the rest of the class. But I'm not that kind of person so that won't happen.

There are good things happening. Two of the children with Autistic tendencies are twin brothers. Yesterday one twin played the whole class, never quit and turned out to be the best server for his team  and scored the most points - this is huge! The other twin talked to me when he was frustrated instead of quitting the game - also huge! But their Mom is one of people named as saying they will quit the program if I am teaching again. Just very disappointing to me that they are not seeing the growth that I see happening.



Edited by trigal38 2014-04-23 8:34 AM
2014-04-23 8:36 AM
in reply to: mehaner

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Subject: RE: Quit or stay - another WWCOJD

If you ask me, it sounds like a lot of hassle and time for not a lot of reward financially or emotionally. I personally wouldn't do it, but then again those kids acting that way (and their parents supporting them) would drive me to saying, "I'm not getting paid enough to put up with this." 

 

2014-04-23 10:04 AM
in reply to: KSH

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Subject: RE: Quit or stay - another WWCOJD

If you can get full commitment, in writing, from your boss, up to the Executive Director of the facility, to start the rule when you quit you are done for the day, then yes.  I think at that point, you actually have support from your entire management team, and that is not the case with many YMCA facilities.  They all depend upon the ED of the facility and if they want to deal with the upset parents, or if they just back the parents that yell and scream the most and or the loudest, or the few parents that are on the board of directors that only care about their one child and not the betterment of the facility.

Unless you have it in writing that they support it and it is on the registration from that the parents have to read and sign, you will have problems, unless your immediate supervisor is there dealing with the upset parent, while you work with the children.  I have been in your shoes and have also been the immediate supervisors position and understand what you are trying to do and make it better.  We tried many different things, even to the point of making a parent be out there with their child for all of the time frame to work with their child.  I have done the leave and you are done for the day, which was approved verbally by the ED, but when a parent complained, he did not back that up and brought the kid back out.

 

 

2014-04-23 10:27 AM
in reply to: Left Brain

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Subject: RE: Quit or stay - another WWCOJD

Originally posted by Left Brain

Stay - and stick to your guns. 

Oh......and thanks for doing what you do.  Our kids grew up at the Y.....and they were taught values like you are teaching by people just like you..  Those lessons were invaluable as we raised our kids.

You can't control stupid parents....just do what's right.

+1 and thank you as well.  For the kids playing by the rules, you are making a difference and they will remember it.

2014-04-23 10:52 AM
in reply to: trigal38

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Subject: RE: Quit or stay - another WWCOJD

Oh do I completely feel for you.  I have been a youth coach at the YMCA in my town for about 5 years.  Mainly because I love spending the time with my kids and I get to be involved in their teams, be a role model (hopefully) and help them be successful. 

I have had some bad parents.... I mean some REALLY bad parents in 2nd grade basketball no less.  I had the team vote for winners like Most Improved, Offensive / Defensive Player of the year, Hustle Award, and a few others.  Sure, not every kid got an award but not every kid deserved an award.  I had a mom explode on me during the presentations of these awards.  Her kid was mortified by her behavior and the rest of the parents were very pissed off. 

I handled it better than I ever believed I could have and polietly asked her to talk to me in private and not to take anything away from the kids who did win.  She told me that she would not let her son be on a team that I coached again, which was hard for me to hear.  99% of the parents I have dealt with have given me positive feedback so this was out of the norm.  Some people can just never be happy.

Regarding your situation, I agree with the person that said to get the Y's management on board before you start kicking kids out of the gym.  I'm happy to sit a kid down during practice that is being disruptice or disrespectful.  I will have them run lines in basketball and around the field in football.  They are still within my sight which is my obligation, but they are no longer a problem.  If they don't want to be in the program you are teaching then they should not be forced to stay there and ruin it for the others. 

However if management doesn't have your back, you will be made out to be the problem.... 



2014-04-23 11:10 AM
in reply to: siouxcityhawk

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Subject: RE: Quit or stay - another WWCOJD

Good points and thanks for the perspectives from others who have worked with the Y. At this point I do not feel vested in this program enough to care to hassle myself with all of this. A new session starts in May and if asked to work I will most likely decline. I have one more week of April which I will finish out and then look forward to enjoying my freedom!

2014-04-23 1:18 PM
in reply to: trigal38

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Subject: RE: Quit or stay - another WWCOJD

it sounds like you are making progress.  And if you positively affect one child's life, what is that worth?  And if you change one child's life?  What is that worth.

2014-04-23 1:25 PM
in reply to: trigal38

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Subject: RE: Quit or stay - another WWCOJD

Originally posted by trigal38

Good points and thanks for the perspectives from others who have worked with the Y. At this point I do not feel vested in this program enough to care to hassle myself with all of this. A new session starts in May and if asked to work I will most likely decline. I have one more week of April which I will finish out and then look forward to enjoying my freedom!

Well, this changes things a bit.  If I were you I'd organize a dodgeball game on the last day......play on one of the teams and put the kids that drive you nuts on the other team......you know what to do from there.

2014-04-23 1:32 PM
in reply to: trigal38

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Subject: RE: Quit or stay - another WWCOJD

Is there a "No Parent's in the gym" rule? We had a "No parents on deck" rule whenever I taught swim lessons (except special needs). That way, I never had to tell parents to STFU :-P

2014-04-23 1:39 PM
in reply to: Left Brain

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Subject: RE: Quit or stay - another WWCOJD

Originally posted by Left Brain

Originally posted by trigal38

Good points and thanks for the perspectives from others who have worked with the Y. At this point I do not feel vested in this program enough to care to hassle myself with all of this. A new session starts in May and if asked to work I will most likely decline. I have one more week of April which I will finish out and then look forward to enjoying my freedom!

Well, this changes things a bit.  If I were you I'd organize a dodgeball game on the last day......play on one of the teams and put the kids that drive you nuts on the other team......you know what to do from there.

Heh - best idea yet!!



2014-04-23 1:47 PM
in reply to: Left Brain

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Subject: RE: Quit or stay - another WWCOJD

Originally posted by Left Brain

Originally posted by trigal38

Good points and thanks for the perspectives from others who have worked with the Y. At this point I do not feel vested in this program enough to care to hassle myself with all of this. A new session starts in May and if asked to work I will most likely decline. I have one more week of April which I will finish out and then look forward to enjoying my freedom!

Well, this changes things a bit.  If I were you I'd organize a dodgeball game on the last day......play on one of the teams and put the kids that drive you nuts on the other team......you know what to do from there.

x2

2014-04-23 2:33 PM
in reply to: Left Brain

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Subject: RE: Quit or stay - another WWCOJD
Originally posted by Left Brain

Originally posted by trigal38

Good points and thanks for the perspectives from others who have worked with the Y. At this point I do not feel vested in this program enough to care to hassle myself with all of this. A new session starts in May and if asked to work I will most likely decline. I have one more week of April which I will finish out and then look forward to enjoying my freedom!

Well, this changes things a bit.  If I were you I'd organize a dodgeball game on the last day......play on one of the teams and put the kids that drive you nuts on the other team......you know what to do from there.




Ha! That is hilarious! Just make sure the good ol' fashioned red rubber dodge balls are used...not the ridiculously politically correct spongy "no sting" balls. Also, make sure they're smaller and not hyper-inflated so the kids could really grip 'em and rip 'em! Head shots still aren't allowed...but...accidents do happen.

2014-04-23 4:10 PM
in reply to: ChineseDemocracy

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Subject: RE: Quit or stay - another WWCOJD
If you chose to stay, my advice would be to get together with management and meet with everyone, or at least the kids. As a united front, with management taking the lead, establish the rules, expectations, and consequences. As an Elementary PE Teacher, I know how disruptive the quiting, whinning, complaining can be to the whole learning environment. I would have some consequences similar to a school setting

For the kid:

If you leave, you don't get to come back that day.
So many infractions, you miss a day (appoligize and discuss how problems will be fixed)
Still problems, miss a day and meet with managment before returning to class (including a plan of how the problems will be fixed)
Still problems, Gone

2014-04-24 8:41 AM
in reply to: TriJedi

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Subject: RE: Quit or stay - another WWCOJD
you should use electro shock therapy, if they start acting like brats shock them, if they bawl shock them. If the parents complain shock the parents
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