Suunto Ambit2 or Garmin Fenix2? Thoughts?

I don't think there are any wrong choices.  Both are great watches.

The Ambit 2 also gives you Recovery hours, VO2 calcs and such.  It had it before the Fenix did.

I'd say that the big feature differences are:  

The Fenix gives you bluetooth and a vibration alert. 

The Ambit gives you custom apps and firmware stability.  Automatically uploads workouts to Strava too- if you want that.  I haven't tried the new interval and custom workout apps on for the Ambit that were recently updated, so that might be much less of a difference now than it was before the recent updates.  ???

5s recording lengthens the 2S time to 12hrs, but I haven't found that with 60s you get 25.  Maybe in perfect conditions?  60s recording isn't very useful.  Except for long days walking or something.  5s works reasonably well.

I see you in a white Ambit2S.  Looks are everything.  

My Ambit2 is currently telling me I require 94 hours to recover.  no wonder why my legs felt like lead this morning!

One thing to consider, if you do any tris with pool swims, the Fenix2 multisport mode doesn't currently offer pool swim as an option, only open water.

We just finished up a discussion on this a few days ago, link here.

http://www.beginnertriathlete.com/discussion/forums/thread-view.asp?tid=511397&posts=61&page=1

I had the same issue, Fenix 2 or Ambit2. I went with the Ambit2 Sapphire from REI for $450 (I already have a HRM). 

The extra $100 for the Sapphire is for the sapphire. The watch face on a regular ambit is some form of polycarbon plastic, durable, but it can be scratched. Sapphire is the third hardest substance around behind manmade carbon cutting blades and diamonds. So the Sapphire watch face is going to be near impossible to scratch. I am going to wear the watch all the time so I went with the Sapphire, looks nicer and more durable.

Setting the Ambit2 S to 60 second mode means the watch will not give you a pace. It will only locate itself once every minute so it will have no idea how fast you are going in the interim. It will give you an average every 60 seconds I suppose, but that doesn't seem particularly useful to me. 

I skipped the S because I wanted the temp sensor, barometer, better altimeter, but mostly for the battery life. As I will wear it all the time I want it to go longer without a charge. I also plan to use it for hunting trips and such so the less tethered to a plug in I am, the better.

I decided on the Ambit over the Fenix because of the bad reviews I have read on the Fenix. I have read many accounts of people having issues with the original Fenix that were never fixed, then I read that the new Fenix 2 has the same issues as the old one. That along with the fact that Garmin never got the 910 completely bug free made me shy away from Garmin. Yes it has a few more features, but at the end of the day I just want the thing to work, I want it to do what I ask and do it well and fast, from the reviews I have seen the Ambit has a better track record of working well. Also I went to REI and checked out both, the Ambit fit and finish is a bit better IMO.

One thing to consider. The Ambit has a pre-curved watch band, it fit my wrist just fine but it did not fit my wife very well. She said it was uncomfortable and the watch tended to slide around so it was hard to see for her. On my larger wrist it was fine. The Garmin has a better strap for small wrists, so might be worth a trip to REI to try them on before you buy. 

My Ambit2 Sapphire is in the mail as we speak, should have it tomorrow or Friday. I can't compare to DCRainmaker's reviews, but I will post a review once I get mine.

I just got it last week so haven't really had a chance to use it yet.   I'll be messing around with it this coming weekend though for an OWS, and some hiking.  I'll let you know how it does.

Originally posted by Lyoshka Hey Morey Thanks for sharing your thoughts. May I ask how long you had the Ambit2?

Since mid-December

How do you like it, generally?

Love it.

do you have the Sapphire or black (and why is Sapphire $100 more??)

I have the 2S, as the 2 didn't fit my wrist.  Had I known that I was going to wear the watch every day, I would have sprung for the Sapphire and changed to the 2S band, which fits a bit differently.  The Sapphire is more because the case is dressier.  you get a sapphire crystal and a stainless steel bezel.

If I were to go with Ambit2 (or 2S) and were using interval workout feature, how does it alert you? I like the Garmin's 5 second countdown and then a buzz-unobtrusive, but I always know it's coming. What does Ambit2 do (if you used intervals and know)?

I was always amazed at how well designed the garmin custom workout beeps and boops takes you through a complex workout.  There is a basic interval setup in Movescount- but you're limited to just number and duration of high/low intervals.  So, you could have the watch take you through 4min high and then 1 min low, and whatever number of reps you want- but that's it.  if you wanted a complex workout of 400's, 800's, 5min run, 2min walk, 10min tempo- etc... It's not built in.  I think there are apps that may let you do that- but I just don't know.  Never tried.  If this is important to you... Garmin executes this very well.  Not sure about Suunto.  

I agree that 60s isn't very useful, except for maybe in an Ironman just to make sure the watch goes the length of the race, since at that point you just need your pace and overall time.

I'd want all the data!  For my last ultra, I plugged a USB charger into the watch during the race after 6 hours.  it's a workaround.  oh well.

For training, I'm sure I'll be using 1s most of the time, maybe 5s in a marathon or an ultra (or half-iron)? So, in your opinion, other than battery life, what are major differences between Ambit2 and Ambit2 S? I know S is lighter, which is a plus anyway. I'm having a hard time justifying spending extra $190 just for extended battery life.

Other than battery life (and the 2S is plenty good enough for a marathon or a 70.3) I saw no benefit to the other features for me.  Barometric altitude isn't really more accurate than GPS altitude these days.  perhaps more "precise" to give you climb rate, but not useful to me.  Don't need the thermometer either.  Knowing the temperature of your wrist isn't that useful.  I chose the 2S over the 2 because of fit.  I have small wrists.

Does 2S give you the Recovery time, VO2Max, etc?

Yes.  Recovery time is always there under your logbook function.  VO2 is calculated on Movescount.  Not sure if you can get that data real-time, but it's calculated for every run.  It doesn't do those running dynamic things that the new Garmin HR monitor picks up, such as how much you bounce up and down.  Nobody knows what to do with that information yet anyway.

How are Ambit2 and S2 in a tri mode? Pretty seamless or hard to set up the race legs and T1/T2?

It's easy to set up in Movescount (the on-line tool).  it has a default triathlon mode, or you can set it to 'multisport' mode and program any sport in, in any order.  You could set it up for series of any activity.  Swim, Bike, Run (of course), or Ski, Shoot, Ski, Swim, Trek, etc.   Then, when in each of the sport modes, it will display the screens that you have set up for that particular sport.  If you are doing a run, bike, run event... no problem.

So I'm torn, part of me wants the latest and greatest (Ambit2 Sapphire) and part of me wants a more reasonable price point and man, I do love the white. Very different and I think it looks cool (and goes with my Macgirl identity hehehhe). On the other hand, Ambit2 is available at one of the stores and I could have it tomorrow (or whenever I could drive out there) and not wait a week for delivery of the white 2S. I know, patience is a virtue. I just don't have any when it comes to waiting for a new sports toy to arrive Is Movescount site pretty user-friendly? Also, does beginnertriathlete support Suunto uploads, or just Garmin? This is my tri home, so it would def be a sweet bonus, but I don't think uploading manually is a deal breaker.

The white ambit 2S will functionally do everything that the Sapphire will do.  Except for things like a storm alert... that would use the barometer.  But for sports- it's all the same.  you won't be missing anything other than the battery life.

One other difference is that with the Suunto, you must change all of your screen variables on line, and then sync.  With the garmin, you can change the display for each sport from the watch itself.  This is pretty annoying at first, before you get your watch set up the way you want it- but after a few weeks, it won't matter.  Plus- doing it on-line is far easier, as with all the potential variables and apps, it gets too complex to really scroll through everything on the watch.  So- it's easy to see why Suunto went this way.  

Don't forget the option of a plain Ambit2 without the sapphire. the REI sale has that for $412. 

So $113 more for better battery life or $188 more for battery life and the sapphire face.

Yes.  you can set up sport modes and name them whatever you want.  So- you can set up in movescount as many individual sports and variations thereof as you want, name them anything you want, and choose which of them you'd like displayed as choices on your watch.  I think the limit is 10 on your watch at once.  Not sure if there is a limit on movescount but if there is, it's probably a lot.  So, you can create multiple running sports.  One called Run 2:1, one called Run 1:1, etc  And, they'll wait there for you to choose whatever you want for the day.

I don't believe there is a direct way to switch up intervals during a move- without stopping the move and starting a new one. You would end up with two 'moves' for the day if you did that. However, there are a number of well developed apps out there that add a lot of complexity to the interval and custom workout training capabilities of the watch.  none of which I've used, so I cannot help you there.

Overall, the Fenix 2 just leapfrogged the Ambit 2 and has more capabilities.  No doubt.  If I were shopping right now, I'd be pretty excited about the F2- but also pretty worried about its stability.  I've battled through 4 garmins that I could never trust not to freeze up on me... one time while I was moments from starting a race.  There is no Suunto forum anywhere that has the endless list of problems and issues with the watch like there is for the Fenix.  There are a few where people ask questions (like you are doing), and beg for additional capabilities, or discuss apps (http://forums.watchuseek.com/f233/), and there's a suunto help forum where a representative answers questions.  But in all that I've read and experienced, the watches pretty much just work.  The recent firmware update did cause a problem with custom apps that used the lap count number variable- but Suunto heard about it, and had an updated firmware fix for it in a couple weeks.  

the only issue I've had is with their brand new capability to seamlessly and automatically sync your moves with Strava.  it doesn't bring across the altitude information properly.  Suunto replied to my comment on that last week that they know about it and they'll be releasing a fix shortly.  

I don't have any particular brand loyalty.  I'd get a tomtom tomorrow (the cardio looks like a cool watch) if it met my needs.  right now- unless you really need the bluetooth upload and vibration alerts- (cool features), there's no embarrassment in going Suunto.  It's a great product. That said- I'm saving my old garmin for the next time I'm going to the track to do a complex custom workout.

As for an IM.  I think the thought of getting a single watch to do a full IM is not necessary.  You can't see anything while you're OWS swimming anyway (although the pool thing could be important if you need to count a lot of laps), an Edge 500/510 makes a much better choice for the bike leg, as you cannot see your wrist when you're cycling.  So, get a watch that meets your everyday needs, not one for a single race 2 years from now.  

If you're a data geek- the Ambit's can be fun.  For instance, I just added an app "running efficiency" - that will give me how many heartbeats per km I'm doing.  An interesting metric to track.  Also another app that based on my training performance, will give me predictions of my race times for any distances (using well accepted calculations- which you can get from McMillan and other places).  just fun, neat stuff if you wanna' get geeky.  If you wanna get super geeky- you can program apps yourself.

.  I just noticed. that was my 5001st post on BT.  I'm spending way too much time here.

" never had an issue with my 310xt and had it for close to 4 years?"

The 310xt has long gotten high praise for being a stable platform- so no surprise there that it treated you well.  That's always been one of Garmin's best products.  Just a little long in the tooth, packaging and feature wise.

As for some of the salient features of the Fenix2 that are 'better' than the Ambit2:

Complex custom workouts.  The workout creator on Garmin connect is easy to use, and the watch takes you through the paces.  really cool. This sounds like something you really will use and appreciate.  I'm not sure about the implementation, and if you can set up multiple custom workouts that are always there for you.  When I did this with my garmin, I would send it the workout for that day, and then the next day it would be gone.  ??? not sure.

Bluetooth communications.  That means you can upload your workouts through your phone (although, I hear it takes quite a while).  You can also download courses (routes) from your phone to your watch.  That said- the Navigation implementation on the Ambit 2, I think (not sure) is much better, as you can turn it on from within any run/bike, rather than having it as a separate move???  As for getting your text messages and seeing who is calling you through your watch- I guess that's a feature as well, but of course, it only works if you aren't using and ANT+ device (like your HR monitor).  Seems superfluous to me.

Vibration alerts!  Handy, I guess if there's something you want, such as when to do your run/walk interval. I can tell you that the beep sound on the Ambit 2 isn't very loud.  If you are using headphones, you may not hear it.  Me- I hate having my watch annoy me in any way.  

Power Metrics Display:  The Ambit 2 will pick up your power meter, but the Fenix will calculate and display training metrics, such as Np, IF, TSS, etc.  I would consider this really handy for 70.3 and above races.  For the Ambit2, you would need to upload your power file to Training Peaks or Golden Cheetah to see those.  

Virtual partner.  You can get an app for it on the Ambit 2, but I like the way the Fenix implements it much better.

That said- the Ambit 2 has some features that the Fenix doesn't have.

Apps!  pretty much for anything you can think of.  however, you may need to wade through a lot of poorly coded ones.  I'm now tracking my 'running efficiency' which is based on a heart rate to pace calculation.  he he he.

Being able to control your displays from you PC. While it's great for a regular running watch to be able to pick your screens right there on the watch, every time I had to do a hard reset on my garmins, I would lose my setup.  Not too difficult for just a running watch, but when you have specific variables and multiple screens set up for 10 different sports, re-creating that every time you need to do a hard re-boot is more than a little bit of a pain.  I can see why Suunto went in this direction.  Having it all on line is a pleasure when things get complicated.

Navigation- accessible from within moves and without limitations.  much better implementation.

Running Cadence- built into the watch.  Excellent implementation of it as well.  Really clean stable data, even when you hold your arm out to look at the watch.  It doesn't mess up when you stop swinging your arm. It must track the up and down shocks?  For the Fenix you need the special HR monitor or a footpod.

Just to add on to Morey's excellent post.

The Fenix also has parachute mode and geo caching ability that the Suunto does not. Not important to me.

One advantage of the bluetooth that my wife liked is the ability to ping me and find out where I am. However you have to have your phone on you to do this and it kills the battery on the phone and the watch, so not very useful for longer stuff. Also the same can be accomplished with a RoadID app that does not kill your watch battery.

The running metrics for the Fenix sound cool, but then you are stuck with wearing a HRM every time. I prefer the cadence sensor on the Suunto so I can get cadence without another piece of gear. 

Just my .02's worth on the Fenix 2:

• positive: It's a great watch from a functionality standpoint - it does just about everything I'd want it to do
• negative:  like mentioned above, Garmin is notorious for releasing products that have stability issues; mine has had plenty...from freezing up during runs to absolutely horrible GPS tracking
• positive:  I like the way it looks and feels on my wrist; works as a day-to-day watch, too
• negative:  the numbers are a bit hard to read with the white-on-black screen

Bottom line is if the damn thing worked right all the time I would give it 5 stars, but I find it unbelievable how unstable the product is right now.  They're putting out firmware updates like every week or two, so I guess eventually all will be fixed. 

If I didn't have a race next weekend I'd be doing the exchange process through Garmin support to get a different unit...if I experience the same problems I'd ask for a 910XT.

Hope this helps.

good point.  forgot to include that about the Ambit2.  You can change the screen from white on black, to black on white- at any time (push and hold of a button).  i find this very handy.

Shame to hear about how unstable the Fenix2 is for you.  Its feature set is outstanding.  I want so much to love it.  

I would be surprised if Garmin doesn't put out an update to allow you to change the screen color for the Fenix. There have been so many complaints about it, it would seem logical to fix it. Hope they do.

OK, an update. Sorry it's taken so long, work has been busy and I have my first tri of the season this weekend.In a nutshell, I returned the Ambit 2. The main reason is that I found the numbers too small to read, and the menu's are confusing (to me). I bought a Garmin 910xt on sale. I'm just so used to Garmin, it was basically take it out of the box and use it. Swimming indoors was fine, it missed one lap, but it looks like that was during a drill, which the manual says to count as a rest interval. I ordered the QR kit, and since I already have a 800, don't even need to change anything on my tri bike.

For $249 I'm happy. Although I still am not a huge fan of Garmin Connect. I use Golden Cheetah for power anyway.