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2015-04-07 3:03 PM

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DC
Subject: Vivoactive & Garmin's Future
Just read DR Rainmaker's highly anticipated (by me at least) review of Garmin's Vivoactice "smart watch." Raised an interesting point: If "Connect IQ" fails, Garmin may as well given the diversity of smart watches now out there now & the growing potential.

Anyone agree? More important, since I'm in the market, have you replaced your training device w/a "smart one"? Receiving a text message on my device would be divine as it would indicate whether I need to stop & pull out the phone.


2015-04-07 3:33 PM
in reply to: Porfirio

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Subject: RE: Vivoactive & Garmin's Future
I've got the 920, and while I didn't buy it to be able to read text messages & who's calling as the come in, I have to say it has been super handy.
2015-04-07 3:55 PM
in reply to: Jet Black

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DC
Subject: RE: Vivoactive & Garmin's Future
Originally posted by Jet Black

I've got the 920, and while I didn't buy it to be able to read text messages & who's calling as the come in, I have to say it has been super handy.


Cool. I guess the "concern" is that it's less than ideal everyday watch.
2015-04-07 4:16 PM
in reply to: Jet Black

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Subject: RE: Vivoactive & Garmin's Future

Originally posted by Jet Black I've got the 920, and while I didn't buy it to be able to read text messages & who's calling as the come in, I have to say it has been super handy.

Seriously?  I have to read the package inserts more closely.  All I've focused on is the non-smart part (which might be between my ears, but anyway) and what it can do from a s/b/r standpoint.

Actually just got a new one in the mail yesterday, as mine had a TINY hairline crack and was a bit wonky on OWS's.  Just a plug for Garmin customer service, I guess...

Now psyched to go read up on the non-s/b/r stuff (which took a bit of study in itself to get to the bottom of).

So, maybe they can survive even if the smart part is not the main thing (or all consumers are as dense as I).

Matt

2015-04-07 4:33 PM
in reply to: Porfirio

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Subject: RE: Vivoactive & Garmin's Future

I've been keeping an eye on the vivoactive and waiting to see initial reviews.  I'm not an everyday watch wearer because I can never wear one watch all the time.  A normal watch constantly needs to be taken off during training, and a training watch just looks too bulky for normal wearing.

I commute to work each day, so getting call or text notifications would be nice while my phone is in my backpack.  I would almost never pull over to answer a call or text on a training ride, but would do so if necessary during my commute.

I also like the golf gps functionality of the vivoactive.  Something that a apple watch cannot do on it's own without built in GPS.  Bluetooth uploads for running activities is a nice bonus over my 910, which would still serve as my race day watch.

I suppose it's just a wait and see at this point.

2015-04-07 5:44 PM
in reply to: mcmanusclan5

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Subject: RE: Vivoactive & Garmin's Future
Originally posted by mcmanusclan5

Originally posted by Jet Black I've got the 920, and while I didn't buy it to be able to read text messages & who's calling as the come in, I have to say it has been super handy.

Seriously?  I have to read the package inserts more closely.  All I've focused on is the non-smart part (which might be between my ears, but anyway) and what it can do from a s/b/r standpoint.

Actually just got a new one in the mail yesterday, as mine had a TINY hairline crack and was a bit wonky on OWS's.  Just a plug for Garmin customer service, I guess...

Now psyched to go read up on the non-s/b/r stuff (which took a bit of study in itself to get to the bottom of).

So, maybe they can survive even if the smart part is not the main thing (or all consumers are as dense as I).

Matt





You've just got to Bluetooth sync it to the phone (which I assume you've already done), then make sure notifications are turned on.


And the 920 works great as an everyday wear for me, but I do have pretty big forearms so it doesn't look that out of place.


2015-04-07 7:50 PM
in reply to: Jason N

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DC
Subject: RE: Vivoactive & Garmin's Future
Originally posted by Jason N

I've been keeping an eye on the vivoactive and waiting to see initial reviews.  I'm not an everyday watch wearer because I can never wear one watch all the time.  A normal watch constantly needs to be taken off during training, and a training watch just looks too bulky for normal wearing.

I commute to work each day, so getting call or text notifications would be nice while my phone is in my backpack.  I would almost never pull over to answer a call or text on a training ride, but would do so if necessary during my commute.

I also like the golf gps functionality of the vivoactive.  Something that a apple watch cannot do on it's own without built in GPS.  Bluetooth uploads for running activities is a nice bonus over my 910, which would still serve as my race day watch.

I suppose it's just a wait and see at this point.




Also a daily self-propelled commuter (run or bike). So my "wants" are shared buy others. Yeah, it really is a wait/see.
2015-04-07 7:54 PM
in reply to: Porfirio

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Subject: RE: Vivoactive & Garmin's Future

Originally posted by Porfirio Just read DR Rainmaker's highly anticipated (by me at least) review of Garmin's Vivoactice "smart watch." Raised an interesting point: If "Connect IQ" fails, Garmin may as well given the diversity of smart watches now out there now & the growing potential. Anyone agree? ...

Well, what I think Ray (DCRainmaker) is saying, is that Garmin has structured its current batch of products around ConnectIQ.  The price of the Vivoactive is fairly low for what it is, so there's probably not a lot of margin, which means they need volume.  And, they're not going to get volume unless there are a lot of useful apps, that extend beyond the running community.  Picture an iphone with only the calendar and calculator apps  What they've created is a potentially versatile smart watch.  

Now- if you were a software developer.  Would it be more worth your time to create apps for the AppleWatch, or the VivoActive? (easy answer)

Clearly, Garmin has invested heavily in this hardware development.  They have come up with a brilliant direction, some great hardware, but if they didn't implement the software tools well enough, and it doesn't get sufficient play in alternative markets to runners/cyclists, it could cost them that growth end of the business.  

but- actually.  I don't think I agree with Ray.  Even if Connect IQ doesn't get much play, they still have put out some great watches.  A smart watch, with GPS, activity monitor, bluetooth, etc... should sell well in a variety of markets.  Why they hobbled it by not including some more advanced running functions (virtual trainer/partner, nav, etc)... well, that is to get you to buy the Fenix3/920xt.

My Ambit 2 isn't as sexy looking, but I can write simple apps for it myself, and it's so friggen stable and reliable- it will be hard to give up.  I want the Fenix3- but will wait until it finishes with its public beta.  too many little issues right now that I don't want to deal with.

 

2015-04-07 10:23 PM
in reply to: 0

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Subject: RE: Vivoactive & Garmin's Future
It will be interesting to see what happens to Garmin if the Apple Watch and other Android Wear watches take hold. I'm not convinced yet, but who knows. I can easily see Garmin turning into much more of a niche market than it already is-- that is already happening because of smart phone apps.

For me personally, the deal-breaker on something like the Apple Watch is that it can't be used for swimming. Right now I have the Garmin 910xt and I wish I had the bluetooth and wifi connectivity. smart notifications, and activity tracking like the 920xt or Fenix 3. I have been leaning towards getting a Fenix 3 (and passing on the 910 to my friend) for these features and to have something I can wear daily... But I have to admit that I am waiting to see how people like the Apple watch before deciding to upgrade-- I'm a bit torn.

I actually didn't realize that the Vivoactive could be used for swimming (with swimming metrics). Now I might be leaning towards that....

Edited by jennifer_runs 2015-04-07 10:28 PM
2015-04-08 9:31 AM
in reply to: morey000

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DC
Subject: RE: Vivoactive & Garmin's Future
 The price of the Vivoactive is fairly low for what it is, so there's probably not a lot of margin, which means they need volume.  And, they're not going to get volume unless there are a lot of useful apps, that extend beyond the running community.


Excellent point.
2015-04-08 10:01 AM
in reply to: 0

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Subject: RE: Vivoactive & Garmin's Future

Maybe it's a "generational thing", but I would never want to be bothered by a text or phone call while I'm out running or riding. I only carry my phone while riding in case I get stuck. We've survived for a long time as a species without instant access to communication.

Sidebar story, a couple of years ago I was taking my now 16 year old step daughter to a local sports clinic. We'd be less than 5 miles from home and out of the house a couple of hours at most. I realized I left my cell phone at home so I asked her if she had hers. She didn't, but wanted to know why I asked. Told her I didn't have mine and wondered if she had hers just in case. When she realized we had no cell phone she got a bit agitated and asked in a very concerned tone, "What are we going to do!?" I told here we were going to drive to the clinic, have some fun, then go home, just like people had done for generations before the advent of cell phones.



Edited by mrbbrad 2015-04-08 10:01 AM


2015-04-08 10:46 AM
in reply to: 0

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Subject: RE: Vivoactive & Garmin's Future
Originally posted by mrbbrad

Maybe it's a "generational thing", but I would never want to be bothered by a text or phone call while I'm out running or riding. I only carry my phone while riding in case I get stuck. We've survived for a long time as a species without instant access to communication.




Well, I suspect I'm the same generation as you and I have to say that I love having mine with me. When my kids were younger I used to feel better about leaving them in the house alone for short times if I had my cell phone with me. Yes they were old enough to be home alone, but still young. I would do loops from the house and never be more than about 5-10 min from home. I suspect if my mom had been a runner when we were that young, she wouldn't have gone out of the house. Oh wait, she was never a runner. It just gives me a bit of peace of mind, and has let me exercise more when I want to.

The kids are older now, but I'm dealing with aging parents including my father who is dying and don't want to miss an important message if I'm out on a long run or ride. So I carry my phone with me. Again, I know people in the past who wouldn't want to go out for so long because they'd be "away from the phone."

Edited by jennifer_runs 2015-04-08 10:47 AM
2015-04-08 11:02 AM
in reply to: jennifer_runs

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Subject: RE: Vivoactive & Garmin's Future

I was actually just reading about the VivoActive because it could be used everyday and do my sport thing.  It is kind of limited in the data it tracks (for sports) but i like the activity tracker and i would use it for my bike commute (when i start again). I have a fitbit, which i got for free, and like the metrics but dislike wearing so many devices.  I love my 310 and use it constantly (I also have the Garmin swim) so the vivoactive could be a nice bridge. 

While the Fenix could do all of it the things I want probably i like the style of the Vivoactive. And that is something. Styling is important for an everyday watch ... 

side note: Makes me feel like an oldie but i remember drooling, absolutely drooling over the 305 when it came out because it could do so much more than any other watch. How quickly we've moved forward - that was only in 2006? 

 

2015-04-08 11:21 AM
in reply to: mrbbrad

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DC
Subject: RE: Vivoactive & Garmin's Future
Originally posted by mrbbrad

Maybe it's a "generational thing", but I would never want to be bothered by a text or phone call while I'm out running or riding. I only carry my phone while riding in case I get stuck. We've survived for a long time as a species without instant access to communication.



Heard (another) wonderful report on NPR about driving & texting. The social scientist described the urge/importance of maintaining contact via our cell phones to our evolutionary need to constantly be "in touch" w/our environment. E.g., for a caveman, a tap of the shoulder may be a predator or a potential mate.

Answering emergency calls during my morning commute is a big deal to me &, I suspect to others well. And, who wants to miss out on those opportunities, e.g., wife calling my & asking me if she should pick up some beer as she is currently as the grocery store.
2015-04-08 11:32 AM
in reply to: Porfirio

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Subject: RE: Vivoactive & Garmin's Future

Originally posted by Porfirio....e.g., wife calling my & asking me if she should pick up some beer as she is currently as the grocery store.

She has to ask?  the answer to that question is always 'yes!'.

 

2015-04-08 11:54 AM
in reply to: morey000


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Subject: RE: Vivoactive & Garmin's Future
I literally ordered one after reading DC's review!

I have a Sony Smartwatch 3 now that I thought I could use instead of my Fenix 2. I thought the Fenix 2 was great and it was. But it was almost too much watch and super thick. Returned it to REI and bought the sony which runs on android wear. I love it but I can't use it in the water (yes its waterproof) because when you put it under water the screen turns on/off. So it doesn't work for swimming essentially. The running aspect works nicely with the Endomondo app. Touch the screen, say track my run and boom it starts. So that is nice. I do wear it every day and love the ability to control my music and stuff right from my wrist.

But after seeing this review and how nice and slim it is PLUS the ability to do nearly everything and more than I have now, it's a no brainer. HOWEVER, the big sell for me was the price. At $150 less than their upper level watches it made much more sense to me.

It gets delivered tomorrow. Let's hope the app development takes off because to me that is the only big thing holding this back.


2015-04-08 11:59 AM
in reply to: PompEner

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DC
Subject: RE: Vivoactive & Garmin's Future
Originally posted by PompEner

I literally ordered one after reading DC's review!

I have a Sony Smartwatch 3 now that I thought I could use instead of my Fenix 2. I thought the Fenix 2 was great and it was. But it was almost too much watch and super thick. Returned it to REI and bought the sony which runs on android wear. I love it but I can't use it in the water (yes its waterproof) because when you put it under water the screen turns on/off. So it doesn't work for swimming essentially. The running aspect works nicely with the Endomondo app. Touch the screen, say track my run and boom it starts. So that is nice. I do wear it every day and love the ability to control my music and stuff right from my wrist.

But after seeing this review and how nice and slim it is PLUS the ability to do nearly everything and more than I have now, it's a no brainer. HOWEVER, the big sell for me was the price. At $150 less than their upper level watches it made much more sense to me.

It gets delivered tomorrow. Let's hope the app development takes off because to me that is the only big thing holding this back.


Would really appreciate hearing how it holds up, overall, to the Sony 3.
2015-04-08 1:34 PM
in reply to: Porfirio

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Subject: RE: Vivoactive & Garmin's Future
I've had the VivoActive since 4/6, so I can give my quick impressions of it. First, battery life is excellent, and I think this is a key differentiator with the Apple Watch and it's 18-hour max battery. I've done a few runs with it, and it handles pretty well. It doesn't feel quite as robust as my FR220, but it certainly gets the job done. If I'm doing a half marathon or full marathon, I think at this point I'd keep with my FR220. But anything shorter, or a random run, sure. I haven't swam or biked yet, so I'll defer to Ray.

In terms of it being a "smart watch" the notifications work pretty well. And you can select which apps can push notifications to you so that you aren't inundated with alerts (I turned off Words with Friends, for example). The alerts are fairly unobtrusive.

For this community, it is not a multi-sport triathlon watch at this point. You cannot set it up for a triathlon; you would need to switch between sports in transition. Of course, there's nothing stopping a developer from creating this functionality. But I don't see it as a replacement for a 305/910/920/etc.

All in all, I think it's a solid every day watch for a multi-sport athlete.
2015-04-08 2:06 PM
in reply to: Omne38103

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DC
Subject: RE: Vivoactive & Garmin's Future
If I'm doing a half marathon or full marathon, I think at this point I'd keep with my FR220. But anything shorter, or a random run, sure.



Why wouldn't you use the Vivoactive for a half/full?
2015-04-08 3:19 PM
in reply to: Porfirio

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2015-04-09 10:48 AM
in reply to: Porfirio


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Subject: RE: Vivoactive & Garmin's Future
Originally posted by Porfirio

If I'm doing a half marathon or full marathon, I think at this point I'd keep with my FR220. But anything shorter, or a random run, sure.



Why wouldn't you use the Vivoactive for a half/full?


Hard to describe why I feel that way. Maybe at this point it's just familiarity with the FR220 in longer distances. Maybe it's the physical buttons on the FR220. I think it's easier to see my the screen on the FR than the VA


2015-04-09 12:46 PM
in reply to: Omne38103

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Subject: RE: Vivoactive & Garmin's Future

... or maybe it's because the Vivo currently doesn't have the pacing features you might want, like Virtual Partner or Virtual Racer.

2015-04-10 10:48 AM
in reply to: morey000


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Subject: RE: Vivoactive & Garmin's Future
Originally posted by morey000

... or maybe it's because the Vivo currently doesn't have the pacing features you might want, like Virtual Partner or Virtual Racer.





Something along those lines that I just downloaded from the Garmin IQ store was a race predictor. I'm running a half mary on Sunday so I figured what the hell! I'll give it a shot. It's just a data field within the running app so it's worth a shot. The dev has a bunch of different distances so you can tailor to your needs.

I'll update more once I swim and run today, plus the half on Sunday.
2015-04-10 12:53 PM
in reply to: PompEner

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Subject: RE: Vivoactive & Garmin's Future

I see the Vivoactive as fitting somewhere in the "enthusiast" level.

Personally, it isn't for me since I want OWS and powermeter capability.  Also, the battery life is going to be an issue in a half or full-distance race.  It's aggrivating that I will probably spend $200 more for those differences, but nobody said this sport was cheap.

For the dabblers, more people are going to look to Apple if only for the Apple branding.  Plus, the additional GPS in the watch really doesn't make a huge difference when people (like my sister) are using any of the dozens of running apps out there with their phone's GPS.

So, that leaves the middle group - people who want something more complex than a running app, but more real-world functional than a traditional GPS watch.  

My biggest gripe isn't that it lakes the OWS/powermeter/etc., but that Garmin likely left those out intentionally to push folks like me to the 920xt.  Presumably they are building on the same code as the 9X0 series, the Edge XX0, and the Fenix series, and with native ANT+ support, it almost seems like more work to remove the powermeter functionality than to just leave it in.  

My two bits, anyway.

 

2015-04-10 3:28 PM
in reply to: mirthfuldragon

DC
Subject: RE: Vivoactive & Garmin's Future
more people are going to look to Apple if only for the Apple branding.  Plus, the additional GPS in the watch really doesn't make a huge difference when people (like my sister) are using any of the dozens of running apps out there with their phone's GPS.


This is the ticket! Before I'm researching into the growth (market dominance) from upcoming Apple/Android platforms before I pull the trigger on replacing my current forerunner for the Vivoactive.

Like Eazy E said, "the suspense, is making me sick!" What you got Garmin!?
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