General Discussion Triathlon Talk » At a crossroad on whether I can continue swimming Rss Feed  
Moderators: k9car363, alicefoeller Reply
2016-05-08 6:32 PM


2

Subject: At a crossroad on whether I can continue swimming
First time Tri participant here. My race is June 12th. It's a sprint. I'm active and I run several 5-10Ks a year, HIIT training 2-3 times a week, etc. I figured a triathlon would be a challenge but I did NOT foresee the swimming to be so difficult. I've been swimming now for about 4 months (well, really 3 because I took a month of in mid March when I hurt my shoulder from swimming) and while I've increase my yardage from day 1, I'm not really making much improvement and I'm not feeling confident about this race.

I started with some group lessons at the Y which did initially help me go from 50 yards to 100 at a time. In a given workout I would log about 1200 yards in an hour- with several breaks in between. I do have a coach and I had one 1:1 lesson where she gave me some additional pointers. My last workout for my main set I did 100,200,300,100,200 which was an improvement for me but I definitely struggled through it. I'm also doing 300 yards ~15 minutes which is super super slow.

Today I went for my first open water swim to practice. It was 58 degrees and while I had a wetsuit (mind you, it's a partial- surf wetsuit) the coldness took my breath away. I spent most of the time getting acclimated to the water and I didn't swim much. This is where I began to really doubt my participation in the swim portion of the race. I know the temperature will be warmer but I'm having so my doubts. I'm not a quitter but this swim training has been so physically and mentally draining. People say it's fun, training and doing the tri is fun but I've cried after almost all of my swim sessions. I personally just don't think I'm cut out for this sport and I'm trying to tell myself that I just need to get through this race and I've come this far but I also don't want to get DQ'd if I can't complete the swim portion. It's not too late for me to switch from the Tri to the Dual. I'll be disappointed but I also know I'll finish in a respectable time that way, and I'll feel better over the next few weeks since I won't have to swim anymore. It's basically a Catch-22 and I'm super torn.

I've read some of the threads and it does seem like I'm struggling more than the average beginner. I would really love some feedback from anyone who has been in my position.



2016-05-08 6:55 PM
in reply to: 0

User image

Master
2406
2000100100100100
Bellevue, WA
Subject: RE: At a crossroad on whether I can continue swimming

Two things come to mind reading your post, which I'll separate and reply to individually.

Originally posted by ambitious07  In a given workout I would log about 1200 yards in an hour- with several breaks in between. ... I'm also doing 300 yards ~15 minutes which is super super slow.

A 2:30 to 2:45 / 100 yards is slow but you're still swimming there.  You could get some pointers from a coach on getting better.  But the 5/100y you say (300 yards in 15 minutes) indicates something is wrong with your swimming style.  Are you sure you're not exaggerating that?

If you're doing 2:30/100 yards, then you're not much different than most beginners.  Hang in there, and it will come.  Swimming is a technical technique sport. You have to awaken your kinesthetic senses, learn body position and rotation, learn stroke technique, hand entry, so on and so forth. Being active and running several 5 and 10ks per year does give you the conditioning, but doesn't give you the techniques.  That will come in time and with practice and coaching. 

Further, swim practice is akin to piano practice. It doesn't help and in fact hurts to go practice for an hour and just play the wrong notes.  You get used to the wrong notes (wrong technique) and that gets in the way of learning the proper notes (proper technique). For you, it sounds like 1:1 coaching will be most effective, especially given your June 12th tri date

Today I went for my first open water swim to practice. It was 58 degrees and while I had a wetsuit (mind you, it's a partial- surf wetsuit) the coldness took my breath away. I spent most of the time getting acclimated to the water and I didn't swim much. 

OK, first thing - 58 degree water is INCREDIBLY COLD for most people. I've swam in 58 degree water and I hated it.  At that temperature most people need a full swimming wetsuit (not a surf wetsuit, those don't have the shoulder mobility you need).  So yes, I have no surprise at all when you say you swam in 58 degrees, it took your breath away, and you spent all your time trying to acclimate to it.  The same exact thing would happen to me, and this is my 14th triathlon season including 11 full Ironmans.  So you can't beat yourself up over that

Second thing - you do need a swimming wetsuit.  Orca is a good lower end brand if you don't want to spend much, and depending on location you might be able to rent.

Don't give up yet. Swimming is usually the hardest thing to learn for most people, especially if they are an adult learner like me.  I signed up for my first triathlon in 2003 as a forcing function to learn how to swim. I struggled horribly to try to learn to exhale through my nose, and just couldn't do it.  So I gave up and used nose clips for several seasons including my first Ironman in 2006. After that, I vowed to give up the nose clips and successfully did so for the 2007 season. 

For my Ironman, I also did Total Immersion training.  I recommend that a TI workshop if you can afford it.  TI has its fans and detractors, but I think given the limited information I have that it might be a good fit for you.  You learn body position, comfort in the water, various drills, and how to put it all together.



Edited by brucemorgan 2016-05-08 6:56 PM
2016-05-08 7:06 PM
in reply to: #5180740

User image


263
1001002525
Subject: RE: At a crossroad on whether I can continue swimming
Don't hire a coach right now... It's a waste of your money. Go to www.swimsmooth.com, click on beginner and start reading. That there is free which coaching is not. Second, invest in a cheap Xterra full wetsuit (around 120 bucks) and ditch your surfing wetsuit.

All that is free advice that a coach would charge you for. You're welcome and start reading and watching videos on swim smooth.
2016-05-08 7:47 PM
in reply to: brucemorgan


2

Subject: RE: At a crossroad on whether I can continue swimming
I really appreciate the feedback. Unfortunately I'm not exaggerating the 5/100. The only way is if the clock is broken. I don't think it is. My dilemma is that I went for a 1:1 lesson for $80 and some good pointers were made but the coach didn't say I needed more private lessons. I also don't want to shell out much more money than I already have. You know how some people just weren't meant to do certain sports? I'm really starting to think I'm just not meant for this.
2016-05-08 7:58 PM
in reply to: ambitious07

User image


1300
1000100100100
Subject: RE: At a crossroad on whether I can continue swimming
You should be able to be ready to finish the swim with another month to go. Open water is different from a pool but you are already on the right path practing open water before the race. A surfing wetsuit was definitely not helping you. Keeping working with your coach,'you'll get there. Where are you in PA? If your close I'll help you out.
2016-05-08 8:50 PM
in reply to: #5180740


19

Subject: RE: At a crossroad on whether I can continue swimming
Advice is worth what you pay for it...so here goes. We tri because we choose to. We all have our own reasons that lead us to make that choice, but I doubt any of us make the choice because we want to be stressed out and miserable. If you're not ready yet for the swim leg of a triathlon, then don't do it. Switch to the dual, and go enjoy yourself. There's no shame in making an honest evaluation of your level of readiness, and concluding you aren't where you need to be. Now, with that being said, I would tell you not to give up on swimming altogether. Swimming is tough. There's a lot to figure out. Learning to run or bike comes quickly, then you just start logging miles and building your endurance level. Swimming...well, not so much. But you already know that.

I'll share my journey in an effort to inspire you stick with it. I'm in my late 40's. In July of last year I decided I wanted to run a marathon. In had never ran more than 3 miles at one time, and that was in my early 20's. I had spent the better part of 3 decades not being very active. Completed a marathon in Charleston in January of this year. Yeah me!! What's this have to do with learning to swim? I'm getting there. Along about October last year, I decided I wanted to get into triathlons. I registered for HIM Chattanooga. In November, I decided an HIM wasn't ambitious enough, so I registered for IMFL. Being new to training, I was consumed with getting ready for the January marathon. I thought I'll start swimming and biking in February...4 months should be plenty of time to get all that figured out. Got a membership at the Y and went to do my first swim workout. Holy cow!!!!! I couldn't swim 25 yards. I thought...how can this be...I just ran a marathon...I have superhuman cardio endurance capability. After about the 3rd workout with little to no progress, I realized I had to learn how to swim. Bought the Total Immersion book and videos and studied them religiously. Went to the pool 3-4 days a week for 2 months. At the end of March, I could struggle out a 300 yard set without pausing more than a few seconds at each wall. I was beginning to panic. I had signed myself up to swim 1.2 miles in open water in less than an hour and 10 minutes and I still couldn't swim more than 300 yards without resting. I had less than 8 weeks left to figure it out. I had already brainwashed myself into believing it would be ok to flip on my back and rest as needed, swim breaststroke, sidestroke, dog paddle...whatever it took. Just get myself capable of "swimming" 1.2 miles in no more than 1:09:59. Through it all, I kept going back to the pool and pushing myself. I hated swim workouts. I hated seeing other swimmers just go and go and go...lap after lap...from the time I arrived at the pool until I gathered up my gear in frustration and left. But I kept going back. Somewhere in April, I had a really good day. I managed to swim a 600 yard set. It was exhausting, but it was progress. Kept going back. Then a few weeks ago, something amazing happened. I swam 1000 yards non-stop. What was amazing about it was that I was relaxed and comfortable the entire set. I wasn't out of breath when I finished it. As they say, "something had clicked." A couple days later I went to the pool and swam 1.2 miles without resting. I spent those few days thinking about what it was exactly that had clicked for me. The Total Immersion material and a lot of YouTube videos got me in pretty good shape with respect to learning efficient swimming form. The following are what I felt were important with respect to form. (1)Learn a proper catch/pull keeping the elbow high. This lets your back and chest muscles do the work, giving the shoulders a break. (2)Learn to swim with just a minimal kick, just enough to help keep your hips afloat. The leg muscles suck up a lot of energy. That's it. These two things are what I spent my first 2 months focusing on. But there were two other keys to success that I think played a big role in getting to the click. Balance and breathing. You'll see a lot about balance in the training literarure/videos. It's important. It's about keeping your head down in the water between breaths, and not lifting it up out of the water to get a breath. Do this well, and you will be successful at keeping your kick effort at a minimum. Breathing. This one took me the longest to finally get it. I breathe every stroke to my right side. Is this the best way...the correct way? I don't know, but it worked for me. What limited me from swimming long sets was feeling out of breath, heart pounding as a result. I thought I needed to breathe more...exhale fully between breaths, and take a full deep breath when I turned to breathe. A friend suggested breathing less frequently, maybe every other stroke or every 3rd stroke to both sides. I thought she was nuts, but the fact was she could swim all day and I couldn't. I tried the every other stroke rhythm, but it just made me try and breathe in even deeper when I took a breath. I tried the every 3rd stroke rhythm, but my form and balance fell apart when I would try and breathe to my left side. What now? Thought about it and concluded that another way to solve this puzzle might be to keep my every stroke to the right rhythm and just breath in and out less. Success!! When I stopped trying to empty my lungs between breaths and just taking a short breath when I turned my head to get a breath, that out of breath feeling disappeared. It took me a couple of swim workouts to find the right amount of inhale/exhale that worked for me, but I found it. I think this was the final key that made it click for me.

So...stick with it. You'll figure out what finally makes it click for you. There's nothing special about me. I'm no smarter than you or anyone else. In the mean time, stop stressing about it. Switch to the dual. Go have fun. Keep working on the swimming. It'll happen for you just like it did for me and thousands of other people that figure out this thing called triathlon we love to do.

Blake


2016-05-08 9:16 PM
in reply to: ambitious07

User image


370
1001001002525
, North Carolina
Subject: RE: At a crossroad on whether I can continue swimming
58 is brutal. No way I'm getting in water that cold! Don't take that too hard. That would be rough on me in a full suit, booties, gloves, and a head thingy. I think escape from alcatraz is some where in that range.

What distance is your race?

I started with Total Immersion and it helped me tremendously. I bought the book and did the drills. If you are the 2:30-3:00 min range per 100 it could help you out a ton. Second thing would be too take a look at yourself swimming. Have someone film you above and below water. This will give you pretty good feedback on what your body is doing. Sometimes we have a hard time sensing where our bodies are doing something as unfamiliar as swimming.

Take a strong look at Total Immersion swimming. I'd be right now you really need to work on your balance in the water and your breathing. That would help with both.
2016-05-08 10:49 PM
in reply to: ambitious07

User image

Veteran
2297
2000100100252525
Great White North
Subject: RE: At a crossroad on whether I can continue swimming
You need 25s and 50s. The ladder set you described is not ideal at all.
2016-05-09 7:13 AM
in reply to: Goggles Pizzano

User image

Member
1748
100050010010025
Exton, PA
Subject: RE: At a crossroad on whether I can continue swimming
Originally posted by Goggles Pizzano

You should be able to be ready to finish the swim with another month to go. Open water is different from a pool but you are already on the right path practing open water before the race. A surfing wetsuit was definitely not helping you. Keeping working with your coach,'you'll get there. Where are you in PA? If your close I'll help you out.


x2 -- I'm North-west of Philly- if your in this area I don't mind helping you out. I taught swimming for 11 years. If you anywhere in the philly area I may be able to hook you up with someone the can help.

couple points:

surf wetsuit will make swimming difficult, its not meant for swimming and will kill your shoulders
58° will eliminate about 20% of the participants in a triathlon, so don't worry about that. June events you should see water in the mid 60's.
You should not be crying after a swim practice-
Keep things short, mostly 25's to 200's. but where you are probably 25's and 50's
The good news is at your speed you have some technique flaws- when fixed you will be able to swim much faster and it feel much easier.
You seem determined- ANYONE can learn to swim with good technique
Shoulder injury from swimming is from poor technique.

PM me if your around Philly area see what we can do.
2016-05-09 7:28 AM
in reply to: blakester

User image


1300
1000100100100
Subject: RE: At a crossroad on whether I can continue swimming
What did you sign up for on the 12th, escape the cape?
2016-05-09 8:27 AM
in reply to: ambitious07

User image

Expert
2852
20005001001001002525
Pfafftown, NC
Subject: RE: At a crossroad on whether I can continue swimming
Your story is not unlike many others' (including mine). I did a few tris 6 yrs ago and never did learn to swim (well enough to enjoy them).

I started back in the water last August. It took me months to be able to swim 300yds. I went about it in a way that's a little unorthodox, but I've done 3 tris this season already......two with open water swims (500M and 1500M).....and did my first 1.2 mi. open water swim, yesterday. I was a collegiate athlete, but I had zero endurance background.

I wish I could tell you it will come to you in a flash (and, it might!). But, it's taken at least 3X/wk (swimming) for me to get where I am.....which is....I no longer fear the swim leg of any tri AND I don't dread swim practice.

I wish you luck.


2016-05-09 10:03 AM
in reply to: ambitious07

User image

Master
3205
20001000100100
ann arbor, michigan
Subject: RE: At a crossroad on whether I can continue swimming
I am not a huge Total Immersion fan but........

At your level I would buy the Total Immersion book and DVD. Read cover to cover. Watch the video. Start doing the drills. Pay attention to every single stroke you take because there is room for huge improvement in what you are doing with very little fitness change.

For me, reading TI and incorporating the drills and techniques took me from a dog paddler/swimming hack to 1:45/100 with very little change in fitness. It has subsequently taken nine years and four to five million! yards of swimming to get to 1:17/100. But the low hanging fruit of your stroke flaws should get you 80% of the way to where you need to be.
2016-05-09 10:11 AM
in reply to: #5180760

User image

Coach
9167
5000200020001002525
Stairway to Seven
Subject: RE: At a crossroad on whether I can continue swimming
I specialize in triathlon swim instruction and technique in and have worked with phobic beginners to ironman pros.

Nothing interferes with improving swim technique more than the pressure we put on ourselves to perform on what fees like a restricted timeline.

If your in a hurry to learn to swim you'll be naturally resistant to the patience needed to instill new habits.

I wouldn't give up on swimming but I'd be supportive of switching to the du and taking the pressure off learning to swim.

2016-05-09 11:00 AM
in reply to: ambitious07

User image

Expert
1183
1000100252525
Fort Wayne, IN
Subject: RE: At a crossroad on whether I can continue swimming
I just looked through my race log and found the coldest swim I've been in was 61°F. With a full wetsuit, this still felt cold. I suspect that by June 12th, the water will be substantially warmer for you. If you get a full wetsuit, this would help you swimming with the extra buoyancy and would help keep you warmer as well.
2016-05-09 12:43 PM
in reply to: ambitious07

User image

Expert
2852
20005001001001002525
Pfafftown, NC
Subject: RE: At a crossroad on whether I can continue swimming
BTW......If you'll promise to pass it on (when you're done with it), I'll send you the total immersion DVD I bought for free. I'm not sure which one it is, but it's the one folks suggest to people that are/were in "our" situation.

Shoot me a PM, if interested.
2016-05-09 1:28 PM
in reply to: ambitious07

User image


1502
1000500
Katy, Texas
Subject: RE: At a crossroad on whether I can continue swimming
If you think you can finish the swim safely, I would say just go for it. Who cares how long it takes. If it is your first triathlon, the only goal should be finishing it anyway and perhaps it would help you get past your anxiety just to do it. It sounds like you can swim, just not very fast.


2016-05-09 4:16 PM
in reply to: nc452010

User image

Coach
9167
5000200020001002525
Stairway to Seven
Subject: RE: At a crossroad on whether I can continue swimming
Originally posted by nc452010

BTW......If you'll promise to pass it on (when you're done with it), I'll send you the total immersion DVD I bought for free. I'm not sure which one it is, but it's the one folks suggest to people that are/were in "our" situation.

Shoot me a PM, if interested.


Can't pass that up!
2016-05-11 10:58 AM
in reply to: AndyEWU07

User image

Pro
6011
50001000
Camp Hill, Pennsylvania
Subject: RE: At a crossroad on whether I can continue swimming

Originally posted by AndyEWU07 Don't hire a coach right now... It's a waste of your money. Go to www.swimsmooth.com, click on beginner and start reading. That there is free which coaching is not. Second, invest in a cheap Xterra full wetsuit (around 120 bucks) and ditch your surfing wetsuit. All that is free advice that a coach would charge you for. You're welcome and start reading and watching videos on swim smooth.

I probably shouldn't bother, but...

How can you be so vehemently opposed to coaching when you obviously have no idea what coaches do?  Equating watching videos of swimming with interactive in-person instruction is so ridiculous as to be comical.

That's akin to suggesting to someone contemplating buying a house that they buy a tent instead.  After all, both provide protection from the elements, and the tent is cheaper.

 

2016-05-11 3:06 PM
in reply to: TriMyBest

User image


1300
1000100100100
Subject: RE: At a crossroad on whether I can continue swimming

Don,  you buy into his routine every time!  I'm starting to get why he keeps going with it

What happened to our OP here?

2016-05-11 3:09 PM
in reply to: Goggles Pizzano

User image

Pro
6011
50001000
Camp Hill, Pennsylvania
Subject: RE: At a crossroad on whether I can continue swimming

Originally posted by Goggles Pizzano

Don,  you buy into his routine every time!  I'm starting to get why he keeps going with it

What happened to our OP here?

LOL!  Yeah, I know.  I just told Suzanne Atkinson today that I don't have much patience for BS lately.  

 

New Thread
General Discussion Triathlon Talk » At a crossroad on whether I can continue swimming Rss Feed  
RELATED POSTS

Continue swimming or do riding?

Started by favfc
Views: 747 Posts: 4

2011-06-05 8:53 AM jsnowash

Continue with masters or swim on my own?

Started by Amanda M
Views: 941 Posts: 11

2009-03-19 6:21 AM Amanda M

Canned Soups & Sodium

Started by AMR310
Views: 873 Posts: 1

2008-07-11 10:05 PM AMR310

Canned veggies?

Started by lil_turtle
Views: 1407 Posts: 11

2007-08-08 11:28 AM tkbslc

TI Swimming and whether to continue swimming laps...

Started by workoutbunny
Views: 1330 Posts: 16

2005-07-15 8:38 AM Gatsby
RELATED ARTICLES
date : December 14, 2011
author : AMSSM
comments : 2
What is the recommended way to recover from a cycling-related lower back injury?