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2016-07-15 2:10 PM

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Master
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Los Angeles, CA
Subject: Bike FTP test on trainer odd results
Hello everyone,

I did a bike FTP test on my trainer yesterday morning using the following method on a KK Road Machine:

1. Few minutes easy spinning at 80-100rpm small ring
2. 3x0:30/0:30 warmup at low Z4 to warm up legs more in big ring
3. 1x3:00/3:00 @ Z5a @ 85-90rpm big ring
4. 3x1:00/1:00 @ Z5a @ 90-95rpm big ring
5. 1x20:00 ^Z4 to Z5abc 88-98rpm big ring (gradually increased effort)
6. Cool down easy spinning in small ring

I'm 41 years old and weigh 148lbs. For that 20 minute lap my average HR was 5bpm less than the test I ran about 6-7 weeks ago but my FTP was 5watts higher. I also took a 1 and a half week vacation and did virtually no training 3 weeks ago. After the test was done, I felt totally ready to get off the bike. What are your thoughts about this?

Thanks for reading and your replies,
Roland


2016-07-15 2:33 PM
in reply to: kloofyroland

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Not a Coach
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Media, PA
Subject: RE: Bike FTP test on trainer odd results

Sounds like you probably put down a good effort since you put out 5w more than last time.  Not exactly sure what you are asking though.  What was 'odd' about it in your mind?

2016-07-15 3:03 PM
in reply to: kloofyroland

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Extreme Veteran
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Subject: RE: Bike FTP test on trainer odd results
Originally posted by kloofyroland
using the following method on a KK Road Machine:


power meter or virtual power ?
if virtual power, how do you ensure tire tension is consistent ?


but i just think you are fitter :-)
2016-07-15 3:35 PM
in reply to: JohnnyKay

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Master
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Los Angeles, CA
Subject: RE: Bike FTP test on trainer odd results
Originally posted by JohnnyKay

Sounds like you probably put down a good effort since you put out 5w more than last time.  Not exactly sure what you are asking though.  What was 'odd' about it in your mind?




Oh! My question was how can my new LTHR decreased by about 5% when my FTP increased by about 2.5%? Seems odd to me. I thought LTHR would either go up or stay the same. The conditions were the same (early morning bike trainer workout indoors, same nutrition and hydration).
2016-07-15 3:40 PM
in reply to: marcag

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Master
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20005001001002525
Los Angeles, CA
Subject: RE: Bike FTP test on trainer odd results
Originally posted by marcag

Originally posted by kloofyroland
using the following method on a KK Road Machine:


power meter or virtual power ?
if virtual power, how do you ensure tire tension is consistent ?


but i just think you are fitter :-)


Virtual power and yup, the tension was set the same (spin at 20mph to 0mph in about 15 seconds).

Fitness gains ftw! Thanks!

But more watts at lower LTHR? That seems really weird to me.
2016-07-15 3:40 PM
in reply to: kloofyroland

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Champion
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Montague Gold Mines, Nova Scotia
Subject: RE: Bike FTP test on trainer odd results
Originally posted by kloofyroland

Oh! My question was how can my new LTHR decreased by about 5% when my FTP increased by about 2.5%? Seems odd to me. I thought LTHR would either go up or stay the same. The conditions were the same (early morning bike trainer workout indoors, same nutrition and hydration).


Assuming and accurate test, the answer is you got fitter.

Shane


2016-07-15 3:42 PM
in reply to: kloofyroland

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Melbourne FL
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Subject: RE: Bike FTP test on trainer odd results

Originally posted by kloofyroland
Originally posted by JohnnyKay

Sounds like you probably put down a good effort since you put out 5w more than last time.  Not exactly sure what you are asking though.  What was 'odd' about it in your mind?

Oh! My question was how can my new LTHR decreased by about 5% when my FTP increased by about 2.5%? Seems odd to me. I thought LTHR would either go up or stay the same. The conditions were the same (early morning bike trainer workout indoors, same nutrition and hydration).
Your much more rested even though you did nothing for awhile?  I stopped monitoring HR on the trainer, unlike outdoors I found it to be a lot more inconsistent on the trainer. 

2016-07-15 4:04 PM
in reply to: kloofyroland

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Subject: RE: Bike FTP test on trainer odd results
Originally posted by kloofyroland

Originally posted by marcag

Originally posted by kloofyroland
using the following method on a KK Road Machine:


power meter or virtual power ?
if virtual power, how do you ensure tire tension is consistent ?


but i just think you are fitter :-)


Virtual power and yup, the tension was set the same (spin at 20mph to 0mph in about 15 seconds).

Fitness gains ftw! Thanks!

But more watts at lower LTHR? That seems really weird to me.


5w innaccuracy at high wattage is pretty easy to get with VP IMO

Also, I sometimes find the first 10min are different but usually the last 5 min of the test are pretty similar.
2016-07-15 4:31 PM
in reply to: Donto

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Master
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Los Angeles, CA
Subject: RE: Bike FTP test on trainer odd results
Originally posted by Donto

Originally posted by kloofyroland
Originally posted by JohnnyKay

Sounds like you probably put down a good effort since you put out 5w more than last time.  Not exactly sure what you are asking though.  What was 'odd' about it in your mind?

Oh! My question was how can my new LTHR decreased by about 5% when my FTP increased by about 2.5%? Seems odd to me. I thought LTHR would either go up or stay the same. The conditions were the same (early morning bike trainer workout indoors, same nutrition and hydration).
Your much more rested even though you did nothing for awhile?  I stopped monitoring HR on the trainer, unlike outdoors I found it to be a lot more inconsistent on the trainer. 




Interesting point. But on a trainer indoors, aren't the conditions more controlled so HR wouldn't be so inaccurate?
2016-07-15 4:40 PM
in reply to: marcag

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Master
2759
20005001001002525
Los Angeles, CA
Subject: RE: Bike FTP test on trainer odd results
Originally posted by marcag

Originally posted by kloofyroland

Originally posted by marcag

Originally posted by kloofyroland
using the following method on a KK Road Machine:


power meter or virtual power ?
if virtual power, how do you ensure tire tension is consistent ?


but i just think you are fitter :-)


Virtual power and yup, the tension was set the same (spin at 20mph to 0mph in about 15 seconds).

Fitness gains ftw! Thanks!

But more watts at lower LTHR? That seems really weird to me.


5w innaccuracy at high wattage is pretty easy to get with VP IMO

Also, I sometimes find the first 10min are different but usually the last 5 min of the test are pretty similar.



I'll keep a log of the tests I do this year before my race in October.
2016-07-15 4:49 PM
in reply to: kloofyroland

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Subject: RE: Bike FTP test on trainer odd results
Originally posted by kloofyroland
But on a trainer indoors, aren't the conditions more controlled so HR wouldn't be so inaccurate?


For me, when doing indoor intervals
my HR will be +/- 5bpm for threshold or below intervals. Hydration and caffeine make the difference. Good day/bad day also.
It will be pretty consistent for above threshold intervals. I'll usually always end the last interval at the same place



2016-07-18 6:46 AM
in reply to: kloofyroland

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Expert
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Fort Wayne, IN
Subject: RE: Bike FTP test on trainer odd results
I think you just got fitter.
2016-07-18 10:49 AM
in reply to: kloofyroland

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Pro
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Melbourne FL
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Subject: RE: Bike FTP test on trainer odd results

Originally posted by kloofyroland
Originally posted by marcag
Originally posted by kloofyroland using the following method on a KK Road Machine:
power meter or virtual power ? if virtual power, how do you ensure tire tension is consistent ? but i just think you are fitter :-)
Virtual power and yup, the tension was set the same (spin at 20mph to 0mph in about 15 seconds). Fitness gains ftw! Thanks! But more watts at lower LTHR? That seems really weird to me.
FYI, I read and have seen some PM correlation data that showed when the unit is cold a coast down of ~ 12 sec best matches the published power curve.  After ~10 min of warmup the coast down will be ~2 sec longer or ~14 sec. Doesn't matter though as long as you are consistent with the setup.

2016-07-18 1:26 PM
in reply to: Donto

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Master
2759
20005001001002525
Los Angeles, CA
Subject: RE: Bike FTP test on trainer odd results
Originally posted by Donto

Originally posted by kloofyroland
Originally posted by marcag
Originally posted by kloofyroland using the following method on a KK Road Machine:
power meter or virtual power ? if virtual power, how do you ensure tire tension is consistent ? but i just think you are fitter :-)
Virtual power and yup, the tension was set the same (spin at 20mph to 0mph in about 15 seconds). Fitness gains ftw! Thanks! But more watts at lower LTHR? That seems really weird to me.
FYI, I read and have seen some PM correlation data that showed when the unit is cold a coast down of ~ 12 sec best matches the published power curve.  After ~10 min of warmup the coast down will be ~2 sec longer or ~14 sec. Doesn't matter though as long as you are consistent with the setup.




Thanks! I'll adjust my tension to that cold coast down time.
2016-08-25 12:51 PM
in reply to: kloofyroland

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Master
2759
20005001001002525
Los Angeles, CA
Subject: RE: Bike FTP test on trainer odd results
Hi guys!

Sooooo, I did another FTP test this morning and achieved an FTP increase of 7.1% over my test done on July 14, yay!!! My average HR during the test averaged 2.8% higher than the last test. So this time my HR average went up, hehe.

Suffering on the bike trainer and on long weekend rides really works!!!

=^.^=
Roland
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