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2017-08-12 10:04 AM

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Subject: Charlottesville protest
Watching the idiots in Charlottesville. If your organize a "counter-protest" you are just looking for a fight....I don't care if you are carrying a cross and singing Amazing Grace.


2017-08-12 3:48 PM
in reply to: #5226136

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Subject: RE: Charlottesville protest
Nice victim blaming.
2017-08-12 4:59 PM
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Subject: RE: Charlottesville protest

I can't imagine feeling strongly enough, on either side, to waste a weekend fighting over it, much less dying over it.  I suppose it could get there for me, but for now it just looks like a bunch of goofs with nothing better to do.

Fishing was good this morning.



Edited by Left Brain 2017-08-12 4:59 PM
2017-08-12 5:42 PM
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Subject: RE: Charlottesville protest

Just watched the video of the car plowing into a group of protesters, or I guess counter-protesters in this case.  Honestly, having been on some of these protest details firsthand, it was only a matter of time before some azzhole plowed into a group protesting in the street. (there are cars on roadways folks, and some real lunatics driving some of them, you can't win that battle.....find a park to protest in)  I'm surprised it took this long considering the population of nut jobs we live with these days and how high the emotions have reached.  I hope whoever did that spends the rest of his days in prison away from the rest of us.



Edited by Left Brain 2017-08-12 5:45 PM
2017-08-12 9:29 PM
in reply to: crowny2

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Subject: RE: Charlottesville protest
Originally posted by crowny2

Nice victim blaming.


I did not BLAME anyone. I'm simply saying there are consequences for your actions. Go to a gay pride parade with anti homosexual protest signs and you might get you as)s kicked.

Point is, go to a rally to protest the rally and things might not end well.

Hold you own rally, parade, march and express you first amendment rights.
2017-08-12 9:58 PM
in reply to: Rogillio

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Subject: RE: Charlottesville protest
Should "hate speech" be banned?

Who then decides what is hate speech?

Should certain organization be labeled hate groups?

If so who decides what is a hate group?

The first amendment was written to protect "hate" speech.....or speech that others filed offensive or hateful.

When the triple k shows up at a BLM rally they are looking for trouble.


2017-08-12 10:16 PM
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Subject: RE: Charlottesville protest

I get your point Rogillio.  I follow the twitter accounts of some national level protesters (BLM, etc) and, when the pictures and videos of the white nationalists marching through the campus came out Friday night, there was a call for people to head to Charlottesville to "put a stop to the white supremacist march".  Of course, once that happens you have the right mixture for violence.  The same way you have white supremacist groups head to BLM protests to "stop them".  It's the same mixture, and it usually ends poorly.  Neither side is without blame if you want to use the 1st amendment as a measure....and of course we should. Go have your own protest, but leave others alone in their protests.  How hard is that?

Still, to be clear......the criminal act of driving a car into a crowd is another matter altogether.  Hang that guy, or throw him in a hog pen to be eaten.....I don't care.



Edited by Left Brain 2017-08-12 10:20 PM
2017-08-13 7:18 AM
in reply to: Left Brain

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Subject: RE: Charlottesville protest

rogillio, you're a massive hypocrite

2017-08-13 8:33 AM
in reply to: dmiller5

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Subject: RE: Charlottesville protest
I see the pretense here for white pride. I think Trump tapped into a lot of that "tired of being blamed for being white sentiment." So many groups and movements in the country singled out and blamed their cause or needs on white males being in charge and taking from them. This rally is nothing more than the klan using that "tired of being blamed for being white" to emerge from the shadows. Do I think all these people that marched are klan? Of course not. But the klan was there, in force.

I don't agree that we need to hang the driver from Ohio. We do need to take him out of protective custody and let the system work it's magic.
2017-08-13 10:49 AM
in reply to: mdg2003

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Subject: RE: Charlottesville protest
Originally posted by mdg2003

I see the pretense here for white pride. I think Trump tapped into a lot of that "tired of being blamed for being white sentiment." So many groups and movements in the country singled out and blamed their cause or needs on white males being in charge and taking from them. This rally is nothing more than the klan using that "tired of being blamed for being white" to emerge from the shadows. Do I think all these people that marched are klan? Of course not. But the klan was there, in force.

I don't agree that we need to hang the driver from Ohio. We do need to take him out of protective custody and let the system work it's magic.


White pride? Whites aren't allowed to be proud. Whites are supposed to be ashamed of their heritage. I'm am successful because I am white not because I worked my as)s off for the last 40 years.....I am white so I was born on 3rd base.
2017-08-13 11:02 AM
in reply to: dmiller5

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Subject: RE: Charlottesville protest
Originally posted by dmiller5

rogillio, you're a massive hypocrite




Still haven't learned to debate and discuss without insulting/attacking people have you Dave? LOL



2017-08-13 11:33 AM
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Subject: RE: Charlottesville protest

Originally posted by Rogillio
Originally posted by mdg2003 I see the pretense here for white pride. I think Trump tapped into a lot of that "tired of being blamed for being white sentiment." So many groups and movements in the country singled out and blamed their cause or needs on white males being in charge and taking from them. This rally is nothing more than the klan using that "tired of being blamed for being white" to emerge from the shadows. Do I think all these people that marched are klan? Of course not. But the klan was there, in force. I don't agree that we need to hang the driver from Ohio. We do need to take him out of protective custody and let the system work it's magic.
White pride? Whites aren't allowed to be proud. Whites are supposed to be ashamed of their heritage. I'm am successful because I am white not because I worked my as)s off for the last 40 years.....I am white so I was born on 3rd base.

I'm proud of a lot of things.  I'm a proud father, husband, friend, police officer, homeowner, dog owner.....hell, the list is endless.  But I don't feel a sense of pride just because I'm white.....that's silliness.  I didn't have anything to do with that.  I don't know what kind of "privilege" being white affords me because I have never lived in the skin color of another person.  When people of color say they have to work harder in order to achieve the same things I've been able to achieve in life I tend to take them at their word.  I didn't have anything to do with that either, but I believe them.  I have no idea what the answer is for this latest round of race problems......but I believe it starts with education, on every side. 

If I were King I'd rebuild schools in poor neighborhoods, and not in some half-assed way......I'd make them gems.......we have let them turn to chit, or in many cases, become non-existent....the neighborhoods are a reflection of that.  If you want to talk about pride, let's talk about what happens when there is a complete lack of anything to be proud of, and care for, and nourish......that's what you're seeing IMO. 



Edited by Left Brain 2017-08-13 11:34 AM
2017-08-13 11:58 AM
in reply to: Left Brain

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Subject: RE: Charlottesville protest
It just seems to me that if a major point of one's self-worth and pride is one's race, then you don't have a helluva lot to be proud of.
2017-08-13 3:48 PM
in reply to: Oysterboy

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Subject: RE: Charlottesville protest

Originally posted by Oysterboy It just seems to me that if a major point of one's self-worth and pride is one's race, then you don't have a helluva lot to be proud of.

Hope that applies to all and not just Whites...  

2017-08-13 9:12 PM
in reply to: velocomp

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Subject: RE: Charlottesville protest
I am not proud that I am white nor am I ashamed of the fact. As previously stated, I had nothing to do with that.

i was not born rich or good looking or with athletic ability. But I don't resent those that were.

I don't condone what happened this weekend but think both sides are to blame. The white supremacist were clearly looking for a fight.....and the opposition brought it to them. Had the opposition not shown up, it would have been non event. As despicable as the protests ere, the antiprotest are equally culpable.

Side note....what exactly is a white nationalist? Are there also black nationalists? It globalist is the opposite of nationalist then I am a nationalist. I am sick of the US supporting the entire world. I've seen the term white nationalist use synonymously with nazi, skin head and white supremacists....which I find repulsive. No stones David, just trying to understand the term.
2017-08-13 11:01 PM
in reply to: Rogillio

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Subject: RE: Charlottesville protest


2017-08-13 11:14 PM
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Subject: RE: Charlottesville protest

Thought I'd share this picture on this thread.  My respect for black Police Officers is massive the last 3 years.  I have had to send them to BlackLivesMatter protests where they are subjected to the most vile hatred any of us could imagine from black protesters.  And then on the other end, they stand and protect these azzholes.  I don't know how they do it, getting it from both sides, but I'm proud to stand with them. The overwhelming majority of us could not put up with the crap they deal with......and they're out there every day, coming back for more, just doing the job with strength and dignity.  I am humbled by them.  Black, white, brown, whatever.....they are the best of us, truly. 

 



Edited by Left Brain 2017-08-13 11:41 PM




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2017-08-14 7:29 AM
in reply to: Left Brain

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Subject: RE: Charlottesville protest
Originally posted by Left Brain

Thought I'd share this picture on this thread.  My respect for black Police Officers is massive the last 3 years.  I have had to send them to BlackLivesMatter protests where they are subjected to the most vile hatred any of us could imagine from black protesters.  And then on the other end, they stand and protect these azzholes.  I don't know how they do it, getting it from both sides, but I'm proud to stand with them. The overwhelming majority of us could not put up with the crap they deal with......and they're out there every day, coming back for more, just doing the job with strength and dignity.  I am humbled by them.  Black, white, brown, whatever.....they are the best of us, truly. 

 




A man amongst morons.
2017-08-14 7:31 AM
in reply to: Rogillio

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Subject: RE: Charlottesville protest
Originally posted by Rogillio

Originally posted by mdg2003

I see the pretense here for white pride. I think Trump tapped into a lot of that "tired of being blamed for being white sentiment." So many groups and movements in the country singled out and blamed their cause or needs on white males being in charge and taking from them. This rally is nothing more than the klan using that "tired of being blamed for being white" to emerge from the shadows. Do I think all these people that marched are klan? Of course not. But the klan was there, in force.

I don't agree that we need to hang the driver from Ohio. We do need to take him out of protective custody and let the system work it's magic.


White pride? Whites aren't allowed to be proud. Whites are supposed to be ashamed of their heritage. I'm am successful because I am white not because I worked my as)s off for the last 40 years.....I am white so I was born on 3rd base.


I don't think you read my post Rog.
2017-08-14 8:51 AM
in reply to: mdg2003

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Subject: RE: Charlottesville protest
Velo: My post said nothing about any specific race. As a white man I can only provide my perspective but I would like to think if I were black or asian that I would harbor the same sentiment.

Rog: Don't conflate race and heritage. Race is your genetic make-up nothing more. Switch a few dozen genes here and there. Heritage is something completely different and something you should be proud of. I am extremely proud to be an American and count the fact that I have relatives that fought, and many died, in every war this country ever fought in going back to the revolutionary war. I am proud of what I have accomplished, not because I am white but because I have worked hard. I have been lucky, sure, but I really do not know if that luck was because I am white. Nor do I think that being white has held me back. I believe my limiter is my own talent.

Also, what you described above is Economic Nationalism, much of this I personally believe as well. I think that days when the US could act globally as a police force have waned as our economy has shrunk and we, as a nation, have to find a way to grapple with this new reality. Somehow, this economic world view has become conflated with Societal Nationalism (see the Wiki link Dave provided above) and so the KKK and neo-nazis find a home in this worldview.

This is the problem Trump has, he just never seems to recognize subtleties in the argument. But then again, I don't think he is all that bright and he reinforces my opinion on a virtually daily basis.
2017-08-14 8:58 AM
in reply to: Left Brain

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Subject: RE: Charlottesville protest

Originally posted by Left Brain

If I were King I'd rebuild schools in poor neighborhoods, and not in some half-assed way......I'd make them gems.......we have let them turn to chit, or in many cases, become non-existent....the neighborhoods are a reflection of that.  If you want to talk about pride, let's talk about what happens when there is a complete lack of anything to be proud of, and care for, and nourish......that's what you're seeing IMO. 

Hasn't worked, and won't work until the residents of the neighborhood take ownership of what they have.  Until then, that "gem" just becomes a target of destruction.  Holds for both the physical assets as well as the time/emotional investment of education.  



2017-08-14 9:26 AM
in reply to: McFuzz

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Subject: RE: Charlottesville protest

Originally posted by McFuzz

Originally posted by Left Brain

If I were King I'd rebuild schools in poor neighborhoods, and not in some half-assed way......I'd make them gems.......we have let them turn to chit, or in many cases, become non-existent....the neighborhoods are a reflection of that.  If you want to talk about pride, let's talk about what happens when there is a complete lack of anything to be proud of, and care for, and nourish......that's what you're seeing IMO. 

Hasn't worked, and won't work until the residents of the neighborhood take ownership of what they have.  Until then, that "gem" just becomes a target of destruction.  Holds for both the physical assets as well as the time/emotional investment of education.  

It's not been tried.....at least not here in St. Louis, but I did get to witness the utter destruction of black neighborhoods when busing was forced upon them and their schools were allowed to deteriorate.  Those schools were part of the Public High League here, the most feared HS league in the state.  Those teams, and schools, were an absolute source of pride for those neighborhoods and was the glue that held them together.  When the students of those schools, and the athletes, were bused out to the suburban (and wealthier) schools, it spelled the end.

I don't know how it is where you are (I can't imagine it's different anywhere), but here, property values track right along with the best school districts.  And again, that's only one benefit........these neighborhoods and the residents (read children) that live there need a reset.....and chance to build pride in their community.  Certainly there are other components......grocery stores, jobs, etc....but it starts with good schools and good education.

NO....it has NOT been tried here, and I doubt it's been tried, to much degree, anywhere.  The cost is prohibitive and would require that money currently used to fund many "entitlement" programs be moved toward this endeavor. 

I worked these neighborhoods.....the people there WILL take ownership of something they can be proud of.....because they don't have anything else.

2017-08-14 9:42 AM
in reply to: Left Brain

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Subject: RE: Charlottesville protest
Lefty, I think one angle that your argument does not voice is that some neighborhoods need role educational models. We all talk a good game for the benefits of education but unless you see someone who has had their life lifted out of poverty based on the empowerment that an education can provide, it all seems like pixie dust and, accordingly, the need for quality schools is not recognized. This will take years of steady investment in human capital to overcome, and we have a bad track record on this.
2017-08-14 9:52 AM
in reply to: Oysterboy

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Subject: RE: Charlottesville protest

Originally posted by Oysterboy Lefty, I think one angle that your argument does not voice is that some neighborhoods need role educational models. We all talk a good game for the benefits of education but unless you see someone who has had their life lifted out of poverty based on the empowerment that an education can provide, it all seems like pixie dust and, accordingly, the need for quality schools is not recognized. This will take years of steady investment in human capital to overcome, and we have a bad track record on this.

Yep, and it's time to do it better.  I agree that it may take a couple of generations.....but we are headed down a rat hole without it.  There are PLENTY of role models, but right now there is no reason to return to a neighborhood that is a war zone.  I won't  be told that hundreds of people have not lifted themselves from these impoverished neighborhoods....because I can name dozens just from the area I have worked.  You have to make a reason for them to come back and invest in their community.....because it's a forking scary damn place and they worked their arses off against all odds just to get the hell out.!  A great school.....a center for education and pride is a good reason.

2017-08-14 12:29 PM
in reply to: Left Brain

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Subject: RE: Charlottesville protest
"because it's a forking scary damn place and they worked their arses off against all odds just to get the hell out.!"

Bingo.
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