General Discussion Triathlon Talk » Mike Ricci's LT TT Test... Rss Feed  
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2006-10-16 2:17 PM
in reply to: #570146

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Subject: RE: Mike Ricci's LT TT Test...

Hi there,

I don't really understand the question - how does LT correlate to Avg HR? We are looking for avg HR during an LT test to get your training zones.

What were you heart rates for the 5k and for the test? Thanks.

 



2006-10-16 2:46 PM
in reply to: #550965

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Subject: RE: Mike Ricci's LT TT Test...
Thanks Mike,

Maybe the link I posted, didn't go through, I edited it and now it should work.
However, in summary:

LT TT (9/22/06): 30 minutes on track, Avg HR was 162 for last 20 minutes
5K (10/15/06): 20:40 in 5K race, Avg HR was 167.

Both efforts were all out. Trying to find out if my LTHR was accurate in first TT??

Thanks again!

HR data for 5K only: http://trail.motionbased.com/trail/episode/view.do?episodePk.pkValu...
2006-10-16 2:53 PM
in reply to: #570187

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Subject: RE: Mike Ricci's LT TT Test...

schmize - 2006-10-16 12:46 PM Thanks Mike, Maybe the link I posted, didn't go through, I edited it and now it should work. However, in summary: LT TT (9/22/06): 30 minutes on track, Avg HR was 162 for last 20 minutes 5K (10/15/06): 20:40 in 5K race, Avg HR was 167. Both efforts were all out. Trying to find out if my LTHR was accurate in first TT?? Thanks again! HR data for 5K only: http://trail.motionbased.com/trail/episode/view.do?episodePk.pkValu...

Thanks for posting the summary. I honestly don't have time to look at links or read logs - that type of attention is definitely in the 'personal coaching' arena.

I think you can go with a number around 160-162 until you get the LT test done with the proper protocol.

2006-10-16 3:04 PM
in reply to: #550965

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Subject: RE: Mike Ricci's LT TT Test...
Mike - Makes sense.

Thanks again for your time!
2006-10-16 10:50 PM
in reply to: #568773

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Subject: RE: Mike Ricci's LT TT Test...

I've been reading "Daniel's Running Formula" recently and Jack suggests that a your average HR for a 5k race is approximately 105% of your LT.  If that's the case then your LT would be about 185bpm.  That's a right on target with what Mike is suggesting as well as your LT test

 

TriathleteNut - 2006-10-13 4:27 PM Thanks Ron! Mike - I ran a 5K race this past weekend. My average HR was 194... Of course it wasn't 30 minutes but it was a 26 minute run that I did all out pretty much. I was in Zone 5 for 21 minutes out of the 26 (based on my LT TT test). When I ran my TT my average HR was 186... I was in Zone 5 for that TT for less than 10 minutes of the total 30 minutes I ran it. Why is there such a difference? Would the 194 be a higher HR because of 'race day' adrenaline or something? Should I use the race HR average or my TT as my average HR?

2006-10-18 9:33 PM
in reply to: #550965

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Subject: RE: Mike Ricci's LT TT Test...
Mike...

I did a TT today...

I went out and decided to run for 5 miles and stop knowing that I can do 5 miles in 45 minutes or so. The first mile was warm up. I thought that my first mile was 'easy' but according to splits it was faster than normal but my HR was kinda low. I started to pour it on when my watch beeped at mile 1 and didn't check my watch, I just ran at RPE of 8/9 out of 10 making sure I still had enough for the end. At mile 4 I put more into it and ran through mile 5 knowing I gave it everything I had. I pulled back and cooled down for about a quarter of a mile.

I know I gave it everything as I hit a personal best 5 mile run today (44:45).

Mile 1 0:08:58 170 warm up
Mile 2 0:08:48 183
Mile 3 0:09:12 190
Mile 4 0:09:00 189
Mile 5 0:08:47 190
Mile 5.24 0:04:31 176 cool down

So based on this data my Average HR is Mile2-5 of 188bpm. Originally I had calculated it as 186 (a previous TT) and my race two weeks ago i was at an average of 194. But that was a race.

So what do you think?





Edited by TriathleteNut 2006-10-18 9:37 PM


2006-10-18 9:35 PM
in reply to: #572369

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Subject: RE: Mike Ricci's LT TT Test...

TriathleteNut - 2006-10-18 7:33 PM Mike... I did a TT today... I went out and decided to run for 5 miles and stop knowing that I can do 5 miles in 45 minutes or so. The first mile was warm up. I thought that my first mile was 'easy' but according to splits it was faster than normal but my HR was kinda low. I started to pour it on when my watch beeped and didn't check my watch and just ran and once I hit 5 miles I pulled back and cooled down for about a quarter of a mile. I know I gave it everything I had as I hit a personal best 5 mile run today (44:45). Mile 1 0:08:58 170 warm up Mile 2 0:08:48 183 Mile 3 0:09:12 190 Mile 4 0:09:00 189 Mile 5 0:08:47 190 Mile 5.24 0:04:31 176 cool down So based on this data my Average HR is Mile2-5 of 188bpm. Originally I had calculated it as 186 (a previous TT) and my race last week i was at an average of 194. But that was a race. So what do you think?

186! Good job!

2006-10-18 9:36 PM
in reply to: #550965

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Subject: RE: Mike Ricci's LT TT Test...
So is it 186 or 188? 188 is the average of mile 2-5. Is this better results versus my 5K race two weeks ago?
2006-10-18 9:43 PM
in reply to: #572372

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Subject: RE: Mike Ricci's LT TT Test...

TriathleteNut - 2006-10-18 7:36 PM So is it 186 or 188? 188 is the average of mile 2-5. Is this better results versus my 5K race two weeks ago?

Sorry, I would go with 188. You are comparing apples and oranges. One was a 5k with competition against others, and one was solo. Did you eat, sleep, and rest EXACTLY the same for the two tests? Did you run the same exact course? IF you follow the protocol that I use, and warm exactly the same each time (15-20' wu, and 4x20" strides), then run 30 minutes all out, taking the average of the last 20', you are then using a PROVEN protocol that works and gets results. Right now, you are taking two random runs and trying to see which is better and they probably aren't even close to being alike.

So - my opinion its 188 - I wouldn't worry about 1-2 beats. Re-test again in 4 weeks. Pick a course, time of day, and rest protocol you can repeat each time and see what happens over time. It's not that hard.

2006-10-18 9:45 PM
in reply to: #550965

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Subject: RE: Mike Ricci's LT TT Test...

Keep in mind these are estimates we're talking about here. So you've got data suggesting somewhere in the 186-188 range. I'd say that anything in that range is realistic and you can't really pick a specific number as being exactly your LT. Personally, I'd go with the lower end to be conservative. Training at a slightly lower level than optimum will give you better results than training a a level slightly higher than optimum. Think of it like this...you're better off being a little short of the edge than pushing over it and falling off the cliff.

 

EDIT

Mike beat me with his response.   I think we're essentially saying the same thing here though.  You need to use a consistent protocol to test each time if you want to make comparisons and 1-2bpm is nothing to lose sleep over.  Either way it's not like you're going to blow your training.



Edited by TH3_FRB 2006-10-18 9:48 PM
2006-10-18 10:21 PM
in reply to: #550965

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Subject: RE: Mike Ricci's LT TT Test...
Thanks all! It might all be a moot point. I'm scheduling a VO2 max test for next week.


2006-10-18 10:25 PM
in reply to: #572389

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Subject: RE: Mike Ricci's LT TT Test...
A VO2 isn't going to give you your LT with the exactness that an LT test will. If you have a choice do an LT test where they draw blood, that way there is no confusion.
2006-10-19 6:42 PM
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Subject: RE: Mike Ricci's LT TT Test...
If you can get the VO2max test with blood sampling for LT then you get the best of both worlds.  VO2max gets you different information which can be very useful if you also know your LT.  VO2max by itself doesn't help much with your training.  It is more a measure of your potential than your current fitness.  HR and speed at VO2max are both useful bits and knowing your LTHR as a percentage of your VO2max HR gives you a good measure of where your current fitness is relative to your potential.  Your goal should be to increase both your LTHR and your VO2max but also to push your LTHR as close to VO2max HR as possible.  One mofe note...LTHR and VO2max are sport specific so getting tested for running doesn't tell you what you need for cycling.  You might guesstimate that cycling LTHR is 6-10bpm lower than running but that may or may not be close.
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General Discussion Triathlon Talk » Mike Ricci's LT TT Test... Rss Feed  
 
 
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