General Discussion Triathlon Talk » 13 hour cutoff Rss Feed  
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2004-10-06 4:58 PM

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Elite
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Subject: 13 hour cutoff
I was visiting another site and saw a post on whether or not IM should give a different award to those that finish under 13 hours. Maybe a gold medal for sub 10, silver for sub 13 and bronze for sub 17. I know TripleThreat has an opinion on this matter and I have my own as well, but I am curious to see what others think of this question.
Should there be a difference in the award for finishing an IM in a certain amount of time?


2004-10-06 5:22 PM
in reply to: #69934

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Master
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Newbury Park, CA
Subject: RE: 13 hour cutoff
Heck no! Your a stud even at 16:59:59.
2004-10-06 5:54 PM
in reply to: #69942

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Elite
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Subject: RE: 13 hour cutoff
OK, then if the goal is just to finish. Does it matter what color ribbon or medal you get?
and Would the thought of getting a better medal be enough to push you during the race if you were close?
2004-10-06 6:38 PM
in reply to: #69934

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Master
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Subject: RE: 13 hour cutoff
They give awards to the top three per age group. After that if you need to tell people you did more than just finish you can tell them your time or you can tell them you were x/y in your age group, or overall. Non Tri people don't understand what's going on anyway. Imagine if you told them you got a silver at IM Lake Placid. Are you going to tell them you didn't actually come in second.

On the other hand I don't race for what they give me anyway, unless I turn pro and can make some money. So they can give away what they want and recognize different groups anyway they please but whats the point?
2004-10-06 6:39 PM
in reply to: #69934

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Master
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Subject: RE: 13 hour cutoff
And no, the possibility of getting a different color finisher medal wouldn't push me anymore that last 1/2 hour. That is gonna need to come from a lot deeper inside.
2004-10-06 7:22 PM
in reply to: #69934

Expert
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NC Illinois
Subject: RE: 13 hour cutoff
Actually, my opinion has softened on the issue. I am fine with a different color ribbon. They can take the 13-hour cutoff and shove it. Those that will use the ribbon color to create a "heirarachy of worthiness" are already doing so with finishing times.

A different color ribbon may give some folks a little something to shoot for next year. It adds some "visuality" to the goal. Instead of thinking "I'm going sub-13 this year" (after just finishing the year before), one could say "I'm getting the silver ribbon". No one outside of the race will really care what a silver ribbon means vs. a bronze ribbon, so there's really no harm done.

As for the cutoff (sorry, voicing my known opinion again) ... when folks start advocating a new cutoff time that is significantly lower than their own finishing time, then I'll take them seriously. Until then, their behavior is analogous to "2nd generation immigrants" ('okay, me and my family are here, close the borders').


2004-10-07 3:57 PM
in reply to: #69985

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Elite
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Subject: RE: 13 hour cutoff
Actually my stance has softened some as well. At first, when I read that thread my blood pressure went through the roof. I have thought about it since and if the WTC or IMNA decided to give different medals I wouldn't have a big problem with it. Neither my wife, family, freinds or coworkers would care what color medal or ribbon I got. The accomplishment alone would be enough. So for that I wouldn't mind.
The problem that I have is that the WTC isn't the one bringing this topic up. It's the guys who are finishing 3-4 hours after the winners that seem to care the most about differentiating between them and us "14+ hour Oprahs". If in the future they do implement this award system I hope they make the time cutoff 10 hours, not 13. Make it worth something.
I wanted to wait to see what others have to say, but I had to get that off my chest.
I think the thing that bothers me the most is that I have met a lot of triathletes from pros to BOPers. I have always thought of this community as one of the most tight knit and caring communities. I have seen pros waiting around to cheer in the last runner, people stopping to help other cyclists and others that have gone back on the course to run somebody in. It really bothers me to read all of the negative comments and just plain bitterness. I expect that kind of attitude from house league hockey, not from the tri community.
my .02

So, lets here your opinion...I know you are out there.


and I'm bored here at work
Tom
2004-10-07 4:13 PM
in reply to: #69934

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Subject: RE: 13 hour cutoff
I am really fighting against the increasingly negative perception I have regarding triathletes/triathlon. I need to stop reading threads that I know are going to contribute to the negativeness and focus on everything positive about triathlon.

If in the future they do implement this award system I hope they make the time cutoff 10 hours, not 13.

True. It isn't the pros or the "sub-10s" that are making these comments, it's the 11s and 12s guys. I refer to them as the "Keyshawn Johnson's" of triathlon ... they think they're much bigger stars than they really are (only a very small % of the 11s and 12s are like this). Their comments were way out of line and more self-serving than they should be.

I need to keep reminding myself that these guys, along with those that ridicule what others wear/ride, are not a reflection of the average triathlete.
2004-10-07 6:21 PM
in reply to: #70328

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Elite
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San Diego
Subject: RE: 13 hour cutoff
I agree, I realize that it is only a small group of jerks in this sport, but when I went to the other site, all I read was negative comments. I am going to see Dan Empfield on Wednesday and I was thinking about bringing this up to him, but I think this is out of his control. It's just a bad reflection on him and his site.
again my .02
2004-10-10 2:46 AM
in reply to: #69934

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Elite
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Subject: RE: 13 hour cutoff
I just kinda got in here cause I was lurking around in Ironman land (although I have no plans for that for a year at least) and saw this thread.

My opinion is that:
(1) I really don't care if they want to give out different ribbons or medals or whatever.
(2) There's only a few people in the community who are all up in arms about it - the same ones who are all "het-up" about people who say they ran a marathon when they actually **walked** some of it. These people are uptight and need to relax.
(3) Ironman is an accomplishment, no matter who you are or what your time is, just like doing a marathon is an accomplishment.

Slowtwitch (the forum, for those who didn't know) has a different mood to it than this forum. Every triathlon board I've been on has a different mood. Slowtwitch forum seems to have more members who like to throw out controversial topics, people who like to argue, etc. It's not that it's necessarily bad, but you're not going to get all fuzzy, warm feelings from it either. I like it for the strong dose of reality it brings, for the fact that professional triathletes sometimes post, for some VERY good and detailed info on nutrition, biking, etc. etc. I've been lurking (and occasionally posting) for a while and I didn't think that this particular thread was that negative. There were some very good arguments posted on both sides, and I think there was only one person who was really saying there should be a 13 hour cutoff. Most of it was people who were saying that the different ribbon, etc. might be a way to keep yourself motivated and very clearly see your improvement. If you got a bronze ribbon two years, then maybe you'd feel a real accomplishment if you earned a silver the next year. I think most of the people on Slowtwitch are people who have been doing triathlons for years. It is not a newbie board, and not really geared for support of that kind. However, if you have a bike/nutrition/running question - that is a very good place to go for some VERY knowledgable input. It's not a place to be if you're sensitive or get your feelings easily hurt. People on there are blunt and call it like they see it. It's sorta like having a board where every member posts like "the bear"
2004-10-10 5:50 PM
in reply to: #70881

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Resident Curmudgeon
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Subject: RE: 13 hour cutoff

However, if you have a bike/nutrition/running question - that is a very good place to go for some VERY knowledgable input. It's not a place to be if you're sensitive or get your feelings easily hurt. People on there are blunt and call it like they see it. It's sorta like having a board where every member posts like "the bear"

Thanks for the back-handed compliment, Shellee!



2004-10-10 7:28 PM
in reply to: #70952

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Elite
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Subject: RE: 13 hour cutoff
Hey, that WAS a compliment - or, at least, a description!

None of these things are bad in MY book!
Blunt - check
calls it like he sees it - check
knowledgable - check

sounds like the bear to me...
2004-10-10 8:26 PM
in reply to: #70972

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Resident Curmudgeon
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Subject: RE: 13 hour cutoff
So what part of "Thanks" did you not understand?

Edited by the bear 2004-10-10 8:27 PM
2004-10-10 8:51 PM
in reply to: #70979

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Elite
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Subject: RE: 13 hour cutoff
It must have been the back-handed that threw me off. I just want you to know, that I meant that in a pure, clear, unadulterated way.
2004-11-01 5:53 AM
in reply to: #69934

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Subject: RE: 13 hour cutoff
Hi all just thought I would way in on this.

I think what makes this sport different is that we all well most of us understand what it takes to finish, and to me a ribbon defining where in the grand scheme of things means nothing we are all on this road for different reasons.

I started because I was FAT and needed something to inspire me, I really hate the them and us that seems to be creeping into this sport.

I hope we all still if we can wait for the last person.

I know personally how that feels when you cross and there are people there that have waited for me to cross..

I do not know who they are, they are just there and god bless them...

The fast folk know who they are, I think most of them shove the medal or what have you in there pocket when they get it. because chances are they have got many of them.

I hope this makes sense it is 4:00 in the morning after all.

Roy


Edited by royj 2004-11-01 5:55 AM
2004-11-01 1:43 PM
in reply to: #69934

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Elite
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Chicago
Subject: RE: 13 hour cutoff
I don't support this idea and won't support it as long as Kona exists.

If someone finishes an ironman in under 17 hours by "walking" the marathon, then they swam and biked fast enough to do that.

Do they diminish the accomplishment of those who train and race at sub 11 hours? I don't think so.

My $0.02.

Edited by bzl763 2004-11-01 1:44 PM


2004-11-07 5:16 PM
in reply to: #69934

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Extreme Veteran
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Madison, WI
Subject: RE: 13 hour cutoff
My opinion...
If you are doing IM for a medal and a T-Shirt, you need to check yourself. I think that the reward of making a PR, qualifying for Kona, or Just making it across the line is all the reward most of us need. Having different rewards would just add uneeded headaches and levels of elitism our sport doesn't need.

First, I have not finished an IM distance race. I missed the bike cutoff at IM WI 2004 by 7 minutes. Though I did not finish, I am an IRONMAN, just not a finisher. Anyone who puts in the months of training and makes it to the start line is an Ironman in my book!

Madtown Mike
"The Journey is the Destination"
2004-11-07 6:01 PM
in reply to: #80004

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Master
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Subject: RE: 13 hour cutoff

I know there is a 17hour cutoff for the race, but I did not realize there was a cutoff time for the bike.  Do they also have one for the swim?  What are they.

2004-11-07 6:05 PM
in reply to: #69934

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Master
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Subject: RE: 13 hour cutoff

A 2.4-mile ocean swim, 112-mile bike race and 26.2-mile run. Competitors have 17 hours to finish. Cutoff times are also applied to the swim (2:20 after start of race) and the bike (10:30 after the start of race.)

Thats from Kona.  I tried to find it for Florida but couldn't.  They may or may nt be the same.  I've seen your swim times.  This won't be a problem for you.

2004-11-07 8:13 PM
in reply to: #69934

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Subject: RE: 13 hour cutoff
To the best of my knowledge, all IronMan North America Events have the following cutoffs:

Swim: 2:20 hrs
Bike: 10:30 hrs from start or 5:30pm w/ 7am start time
Run: 17:00 hrs
2004-11-08 1:59 PM
in reply to: #69934

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Pro
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Subject: RE: 13 hour cutoff
Watched the finishers at IM-Florida on saturday from about 9:30 ( elapsed time clock ) until about 14:00.

Finishing in itself is such an accomplishment, as evidenced by the people finishing, and the look on their faces as they approached the finishing line. They didn't care what color medal they might get. If it matters that much, spray-paint it when you get home.

Did the guy crossing at 13:00 deserve anything less than the guys who finished in under 10? I don't think so.

I have my own IM aspirations for 2006. 9 Hours, 16 Hours, 59 minutes. You're still an Ironman.

The announcer doesn't change the greeting / announcement as time progresses. It's always "Congratulations, you *are* an IRONMAN", and that's imho how it should be.


2004-11-08 4:56 PM
in reply to: #80395

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Champion
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Subject: RE: 13 hour cutoff
ABSOLUTELY!!!
Well said.
LW.
2005-01-22 9:25 AM
in reply to: #69942

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Subject: RE: 13 hour cutoff
PGoldberger - 2004-10-06 5:22 PM

Heck no! Your a stud even at 16:59:59.


Hah, I liked that one.

Yeah, the medal could be a bottle cap strung on dental floss and I'd still be there.
2005-01-22 2:52 PM
in reply to: #80018

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Subject: RE: 13 hour cutoff

Yes, there are cutoffs for the swim and bike.  At least for IM North America events...  The swim cutoff is 2:20, and you have to be off the bike by 5:30pm (or, swim plus T1 plus bike combined cutoff of 10.5 hours).

-Steve

2005-01-22 7:03 PM
in reply to: #69934

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Extreme Veteran
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Subject: RE: 13 hour cutoff
Screw the 13 hr cutoff. I agree there should be SOME cutoff (let's keep it reasonable), there's just no reason to lower it.

As far as different medals/ribbons/etc.. for different finishing times, go for it. Ultramarathons have been doing that for years (big ass belt buckle for under 24 hours for a 100 mile trail race).
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