Ironman Run: The Galloway method? (Page 2)

sorry I was lazy and didn't read all the posts, but wanted to share my experience.

Looking back, I was so undertrained for the run.  But I basically did 26 one-mile runs.  Walked each aid station for as long as it took me to get through them and swallow what I took and then started running again.  I got a 4:18 marathon with that and it would have been quicker if it was for so many potty stops (over hydrated most of the day for the conditions we had)

It worked for me and I will probably do this for any more IM's I do.  (Besides, I don't take water from cups well while running)

Good luck with WI

This is only vaguely relevant to the OP (since you asked for PERSONAL EXPERIENCE, not references), and no, Joe Friel is not god, but a lot of triathletes have had excellent success with his principles and coaching (and Going Long is pretty good, though I have no experience doing Ironmans. Training for one, though).

He does advocate run-walk for most people training for an Ironman.

Here's the link to the full article: http://www2.trainingbible.com/pdf/TBCIMRun.pdf

Here's a short quote:

It wasn't meant to 'zing' you.  It was serious advice.

The fact is that you don't want to finish either the swim or the bike exhausted (which is how you described your first IM).  You can EASILY shave an hour off your IM marathon.  But it has NOTHING to do with your marathon strategy.  You need the swim & bike fitness, along with proper pacing, to get you to the run feeling good.

From your original post : "I've heard of a method (Galloway) where it's suggested you should run 6-minutes & walk 2 throughout the entire marathon.  This sounds OK to me."

Maybe you're not training for it but you're certainly planning for it. Walking is only "inevitable" if you a) believe it is, b) don't have have the proper base, c) don't train properly or, d) don't pace the bike correctly.

It may not be what you want to hear but it is what it is. ST refernece not withstanding.

As was well documented this was my strategy as well. And my point is that even though I trained that way I ended up walking parts of the aid stations and the last two hills. And to reiterate  my point above I would say that having had done only 1 marathon the year before and having trained for 36 weeks I DID NOT have a sufficient base to carry me through.

I think the averagee AG'er underestimates the time (in years) it actually takes to build the base to "race" an IM to the best of thier abilities. That is a nicely as I can put it.

I think we all have a realtistic thought as to our own run skills, endurance and ability to run for 26.2 after the swim/bike.

I'm not a strong runner (working on improving), I think I trained smart, and was as prepared as I could be for the run portion on my IM. My plan was to run 4/ walk 1. I had an interval watch set to beep at 4 and then another minute so I could just run or walk until it beeped. It worked well in training and come race day for first 7 miles or so. Then I had my worst ever asthma attack that made me choose not to run anymore so I could breath and finish.  In town it was tough as crowd noise made hearing the beeps impossible.

Lots of books, and coaches think run/walking is ideal for those of us who aren't strong runners with years of training under us as our depth isn't there. For some of us run/walking is actually faster than straight running. My goal is to finish as soon as possible...so doing whatever that is is best for you.

Responding to Rollinbones and JohnnyKay: A little "chops busting" is good…and I’ll accept any advice regardless if there’s a tone of elitism in it.  I frequent two sites, BT and ST.  I intentionally avoided asking ST people this question because I knew what type of answers I'd receive. 

When I started this thread I didn’t anticipate the can of worms it would open. I didn’t think this would begin a debate on "walkers" on Ironman courses. The intent of this thread was to get advice on the Galloway method of Run/Walk in intervals, most likely through water stops. I’m not a marathon walker, or any other sort of walker. Check my logs and race reports and you’ll see. My recent 70.3 finish time was 5:18, so I would think I have a pretty good base. I am however a realist and an "average guy" who is attempting his second Ironman with hopes of a better time and better experience. I understand the concept of a better swim effecting my marathon time. I’m 36 weeks into a 40-week program so switching up my Swim doesn’t make sense. There is however time to devise a Marathon Strategy (point of this thread). As stated earlier…I went into my first ironman with the idea of running straight through. This got me to mile 7 and was forced to walk. Was this because I had a poor swim? Partially yes. Fatigue is fatigue, and I’m sure it snowballed a little from a long swim, but this doesn’t relate directly to how, at this point, I am to plan my upcoming IM marathon. Hence this thread.

I’ve gotten a lot of great advice from every post in this thread. I’m planning on the following strategy….Run to each water stop then force a 2-minute walk while I eat or drink. Repeat this until mile 20-22 and evaluate from there. If I can run the last 10k uninterrupted then I will. If I’m able to hold to this strategy this would knock a solid 1.5 hours off of my last IM marathon.

Thanks for the great advice BT peeps!

Looking at your OP I realize I wasn't in the group from which you were looking for repsonses, for that I aoplogize.

It (walking) was just something that surprised me at my recent IM and so I thought I'd throw my observations and thoughts out there.

With exactly 1 IM and countless MOP finishes in other distances for the me the last thing I want to come off as is elitist.

Train well, have fun and enjoy your experience. 

I thought that too last year.  I went 5:18 about 7 weeks out from my IM.  I did pick up that run training the last 7 weeks going into IM.   It was enough of a base to finish, but not "excel".  

Now about this comment you made

Again....I'm not a 12-hour finisher, nor do I want to be.  I want to do the best Ironman that "I" am capable of.

I originally took that to mean that you were not going to be "able" to go under 12 hours.  But after seeing you went 5:18, maybe you meant you were not going to be out there over 12 hours and were targeting sub-11.  There was a thread a while back that spoke about the  "rule of thumb" of taking your best HIM, doubling it and adding an hour.  It seems to work fairly well, with all other things being equal.  Don't sell yourself short.  Be ready to excel!!

Enough of a base to finish but not excel?  Holy smokes Primo you finished in 11:40.  I guess it's all relative but I would call an 11:40 IM "excelling".  Well done.

I've heard that rule of thumb too (himx2+1), but I don't think it applies to MOP/BOP Ag'ers like myself.  To clarify my time estimate for IMWI...I'm anticipating a 14-15 hour finish.

Agreed.

I appreciate ALL advice and responces, even from a 12+ hour IM finisher like yourself.
I think you've earned the "elite" status with that sort of finish time.
BTW: Congratulations!

Oip - Good topic and great responses.

I had to throw my hat in the ring, although, I have not done an IM (yet).  After knee surgery, I started to incorporate the Galloway method into my long runs.  Here is what I found:

1) The time spent walking, did not add up to much more than my "normal" LSD pace.  As someone posted above, you are still moving, so it averages out.

2) It was key to do it from the start.  I noticed that once the first couple of miles felt good, I would just skip the walk. And I would pay for it at the end of the run.  I believe that the stretching and using different muscles during the walk, helps later. 

With that said, not sure how it will work in the IM.   I *believe* it to be a good strategy.  Especially, b/c everyone always says the first 2-3 miles off the bike seem easy (and many people go too fast during those miles).  So, if you are going to fast, and you take the time to walk, re-fuel, stretch (during the walk), it seems that would help a ton at mile 20 or so.

Good info Schmize.  I can agree that the first few miles of my first IM run did seem easy and I DID pay for it later.  As I recall, when I got off the bike I was fried yet running felt refreshing and relatively easy.  I thought to myself as I cruised past the first couple of water stops at a 8:40'ish pace...."Wow, I feel good!".  As I neared the turn-around at mile 6.5'ish on the first loop I could feel my legs starting to go and my mind falling apart.  A mile later I incorporated a short walk through the 7.5-mile water stop.  When I started back to running it took a lot of effort to lift my legs up.  I remember making it just a few hundred yards before I was back to a fast walk.  It continued falling apart until I was to the point of walk/shuffle for the remaining race.

I'm going to throw in a 3-hr test run in a couple of weeks and test this theory.  It's an unscheduled run so it won't matter what the pace is.  I'll report back how it went.

Everyone's PLAN for an IM should be to get from point A to point B in the shortest amount of time possible.  Period.  For some people that means running the entire 26.2 miles and for others, optimal marathon time means run/walk. 

~Mike

Very well said.