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2006-02-11 5:15 PM
in reply to: #343145

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Subject: RE: Kids refuse to raise money by selling candies
I went to high school where people lived way too far apart to expect kids to go door to door to sell crap.  Aside from car washes used to fund team social activities, most of the fundraising in the community was done with the help of local businesses...in particular, grocery stores, restaurants, and Target.  Typically, the business would donate some percentage of the day's sales to the group.  The group might volunteer to bag groceries at the store, help elderly people with their bags, or just drum up a whole lot of business.  It was pretty successful where I lived, and often times people would add a small donation to the group as well.  Most of the parents like this method much more than buying junk they don't need or want for a few bucks just so someone's kid gets 25 cents towards their goal.


2006-02-11 5:41 PM
in reply to: #343464

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Subject: RE: Kids refuse to raise money by selling candies

McFuzz - 2006-02-10 8:49 PM ...Teacher recognition, fine, but I have challenged the PTO officers to think of things this way: Would it motivate the students to sell (whatever) so the proceeds can buy teacher gifts/.../.../...? If not, then don't! (Teachers were not thrilled at that question.) Too many organizations are doing too many fundraisers with no real purpose! 

Yes, I believe most kids do think it is worthwhile show appreciation to their teachers!  For our PTA, just 3% of the expense budget is allocated to Teacher Appreciation.  My children participated in a couple of the recognition activities and were thrilled to be able to show their teachers that they were appreciated.  For one, we used some of the budgeted money to buy food, which we prepared and served to the teachers at a luncheon.  Some of the kids (including mine) helped prepare and serve the food. 

However, teacher recognition is only a small portion of the budget.  The majority of our budget goes towards items for the classrooms and enrichment programs.

One more note...the PTA is open to everyone!  We always ask people for feedback, ideas, suggestion, etc.  I found that most people love to complain but hate to help!



Edited by kimta 2006-02-11 5:43 PM
2006-02-11 6:02 PM
in reply to: #343506

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Subject: RE: Kids refuse to raise money by selling candies

ChuckyFinster - 2006-02-10 10:20 PM
kimta - 2006-02-10 12:39 PM If you are poor, you should rightfully be denied the same educational opportunities as someone who has more money?
Of course, what world do you live in where this is not the case? More money = more opportunity. This is a fact of life. I'm surprised you are just scratching your head over this truth. Surely you are not saying that the child of an illegal immigrant whose parents work the cabbage fields for sixteen hours out of the day, should be able to go to an elite private school... on somebody else's dime? Answered your question with a question.

My question to you was - do you think if someone is poor, they should be denied the same opportunities?  I was asking your opinion.  I know that in the majority of situations, people who have more money get more opportunities - and I am not scratching my head over that - it is a fact.  If you are wealthy you get advantages regardless of whether you deserve them or not.  My opinion is that sometimes people can use a little assistance in an effort to move forward and I don't think there is anything wrong with that.  I am guessing that you strongly disagree and that you probably have never needed help from anyone.

And no, I don't believe that a child of an illegal immigrant family should get a free ride to an elite private school.

2006-02-11 8:43 PM
in reply to: #343796

Elite
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Livingston, MT
Subject: RE: Kids refuse to raise money by selling candies
kimta - 2006-02-11 3:02 PM

My question to you was - do you think if someone is poor, they should be denied the same opportunities? 


ChuckyFinster - 2006-02-10 10:20 PM Of course.




2006-02-12 12:24 AM
in reply to: #343375

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Master
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The real USC, in the ghetto of LA
Subject: RE: Kids refuse to raise money by selling candies
ChuckyFinster - 2006-02-10 4:48 PM

DerekL - 2006-02-10 1:40 PM

So poor=losers now?

Wow.



No, just their parents.



i will side with finster. when i was applying to USC one of my teachers that wrote a letter for me, he asked me "are you a legacy" to which i said "no i wish, only to CSUN." and he smiled and said "well at least you kids will be." most of the things i have done, is to better myself for my future wife and kids, that they may have everything i did not. as much as i wished i had what others had, i plan on doing what i can to give my kids what i did not have.

edit; lets not get into the best thing any parent gives is their dna conversation.

Edited by tyrant 2006-02-12 12:25 AM
2006-02-12 2:52 AM
in reply to: #343145

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Eilat, Israel
Subject: RE: Kids refuse to raise money by selling candies
If the child of an illegal immigrant or anyone else for that matter shows talent and high potential I believe they deserve assistance or if you want to call it a "free ride".  In the end it's usually been those of modest menans that have contributed the most to society. 


2006-02-12 7:58 AM
in reply to: #343796

Subject: ...
This user's post has been ignored.
2006-02-12 8:15 AM
in reply to: #343905

Champion
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Subject: RE: Kids refuse to raise money by selling candies

Wow, talk about non sequiturs of the highest order.  And I'm not just referring to this response.  I'm pre-coffee this morning, so I'm going to get into it, but nothing posted so far provides any evidence to support the assertion that all poor people are "losers".  Of course some are, as are some middle class and some rich folks.  For every "well you can afford blah blah blah" you have people who DO have a job, who ARE struggling to get by, having to choose which medicine to buy this week, what kind of food to buy.

I have no idea why I'm wasting my time.

tyrant - 2006-02-12 12:24 AM
ChuckyFinster - 2006-02-10 4:48 PM
DerekL - 2006-02-10 1:40 PM

So poor=losers now?

Wow.

No, just their parents.
i will side with finster. when i was applying to USC one of my teachers that wrote a letter for me, he asked me "are you a legacy" to which i said "no i wish, only to CSUN." and he smiled and said "well at least you kids will be." most of the things i have done, is to better myself for my future wife and kids, that they may have everything i did not. as much as i wished i had what others had, i plan on doing what i can to give my kids what i did not have. edit; lets not get into the best thing any parent gives is their dna conversation.
2006-02-12 8:35 PM
in reply to: #343145

Elite
2458
20001001001001002525
Livingston, MT
Subject: RE: Kids refuse to raise money by selling candies
Life is a series of decisions. If you have had bad luck consistently, you have to question the decisions that you have made and it tells me more than anything that you don't learn from your mistakes. I can accept poverty from the insane and the handicapped. Anyone else it should just be a short transitory period. There is a saying in sports that "bad teams lose close games" which I think is appropriate to more than just sports. Here are some common decisions people have to make:

Don't have a job but you have a bigscreen color TV?

Only make 40k a year but own a 40k car?

Have five boys that you can barely afford to raise and decide to have sixth child in hopes of having a girl (friend of the family, true event)?

Choose a job that cuts your salary down significantly and makes you "happy" instead of choosing a career path that secures your future?

Take money out of your house to fund your upside down budget instead of cancelling cable tv and taking a sack lunch to work?

Indulge your vices (alcohol, tobacco, drugs) instead of contributing to your company matching 401k?

Choose bankruptsy as the easy way out over paying your creditors?

And my personal favorite, get off work at 5, drive home in your new Expedition, sit down and flip on your big screen tv, order pizza to feed yourself and your six children, paid for with the money you got from refinancing the house that you inherited, complain to your family and friends about your crappy job, only to finish up with a few smokes and brewskis. Go to bed, rinse, repeat.

The above is a true life family. I can't blame the kids, they didn't get to choose their parents.
2006-02-12 8:56 PM
in reply to: #343145

Champion
8936
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Subject: RE: Kids refuse to raise money by selling candies

Because everybody who's poor fits into one of those categories.

What a bunch of ridiculous drivel.

2006-02-12 9:28 PM
in reply to: #344336

Elite
2458
20001001001001002525
Livingston, MT
Subject: RE: Kids refuse to raise money by selling candies
DerekL - 2006-02-12 5:56 PM

Because everybody who's poor fits into one of those categories.

What a bunch of ridiculous drivel.



Long standing poverty being either a series of bad decisions or the result of being mentally/physically handicapped? Well, doesn't it? What's your explanation? I could list more drivel for your entertainment pleasure if you'd like...



2006-02-12 9:42 PM
in reply to: #344361

Champion
8936
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Subject: RE: Kids refuse to raise money by selling candies

No really, that's ok.  I've heard more than enough from you.

It's honestly not even worth it anymore.  Enjoy living in your own little world.

ChuckyFinster - 2006-02-12 9:28 PM
DerekL - 2006-02-12 5:56 PM

Because everybody who's poor fits into one of those categories.

What a bunch of ridiculous drivel.

Long standing poverty being either a series of bad decisions or the result of being mentally/physically handicapped? Well, doesn't it? What's your explanation? I could list more drivel for your entertainment pleasure if you'd like...
2006-02-12 11:59 PM
in reply to: #343777

Coach
9167
5000200020001002525
Stairway to Seven
Subject: RE: Kids refuse to raise money by selling candies
dingorock - 2006-02-11 6:15 PM

I went to high school where people lived way too far apart to expect kids to go door to door to sell crap. Aside from car washes used to fund team social activities, most of the fundraising in the community was done with the help of local businesses...in particular, grocery stores, restaurants, and Target. Typically, the business would donate some percentage of the day's sales to the group. The group might volunteer to bag groceries at the store, help elderly people with their bags, or just drum up a whole lot of business. It was pretty successful where I lived, and often times people would add a small donation to the group as well. Most of the parents like this method much more than buying junk they don't need or want for a few bucks just so someone's kid gets 25 cents towards their goal.


There were Targets around when Dingo was in high school? I must be old!
2006-02-13 1:20 AM
in reply to: #343511

Master
2278
2000100100252525
State of Confusion
Subject: RE: Kids refuse to raise money by selling candies
Lucy - 2006-02-10 9:40 PM

My kid is in Boy scouts.  They don't sell popcorn or candy or cookies or anything.  What their troop does is unique- they have this huge circus style tent that they rent out.  IT's in the yellow pages and all.  When it's set up to be rented out, the boys who show up to unload it from the shed/load it on the truck/go to the site/set it up/ and then reverse it again a few days later get a certain amount of money which is tallied up.  At summer camp time, the money-cash- is given to the boys to use for whatever they want.  It paid for his summer camp trip to the Jamboree last summer and then some.  

The other major thing they do is work for tips at the Church's Lenten Fish Fry.  They serve food (prepared by the Mens Club) and clear tables. 

ta-dah!  The parent's dont do anything except supervise those boys! And drive, of course.



Don't mean to hijack, but hey Lucy, can I borrow this idea for my son's cub scout pack? GREAT idea!!
2006-02-13 1:30 AM
in reply to: #344329

Master
2278
2000100100252525
State of Confusion
Subject: RE: Kids refuse to raise money by selling candies
ChuckyFinster - 2006-02-12 8:35 PM

Life is a series of decisions. If you have had bad luck consistently, you have to question the decisions that you have made and it tells me more than anything that you don't learn from your mistakes. I can accept poverty from the insane and the handicapped. Anyone else it should just be a short transitory period. There is a saying in sports that "bad teams lose close games" which I think is appropriate to more than just sports. Here are some common decisions people have to make:

Don't have a job but you have a bigscreen color TV?

Only make 40k a year but own a 40k car?

Have five boys that you can barely afford to raise and decide to have sixth child in hopes of having a girl (friend of the family, true event)?

Choose a job that cuts your salary down significantly and makes you "happy" instead of choosing a career path that secures your future?

Take money out of your house to fund your upside down budget instead of cancelling cable tv and taking a sack lunch to work?

Indulge your vices (alcohol, tobacco, drugs) instead of contributing to your company matching 401k?

Choose bankruptsy as the easy way out over paying your creditors?

And my personal favorite, get off work at 5, drive home in your new Expedition, sit down and flip on your big screen tv, order pizza to feed yourself and your six children, paid for with the money you got from refinancing the house that you inherited, complain to your family and friends about your crappy job, only to finish up with a few smokes and brewskis. Go to bed, rinse, repeat.

The above is a true life family. I can't blame the kids, they didn't get to choose their parents.


This sounds like 75% of the middle class, not "poor", people that live in my neighborhood.
2006-02-13 1:34 AM
in reply to: #343958

Master
1867
10005001001001002525
The real USC, in the ghetto of LA
Subject: RE: Kids refuse to raise money by selling candies
DerekL - 2006-02-12 8:15 AM

Wow, talk about non sequiturs of the highest order.  And I'm not just referring to this response.  I'm pre-coffee this morning, so I'm going to get into it, but nothing posted so far provides any evidence to support the assertion that all poor people are "losers".  Of course some are, as are some middle class and some rich folks.  For every "well you can afford blah blah blah" you have people who DO have a job, who ARE struggling to get by, having to choose which medicine to buy this week, what kind of food to buy.

I have no idea why I'm wasting my time.

tyrant - 2006-02-12 12:24 AM
ChuckyFinster - 2006-02-10 4:48 PM
DerekL - 2006-02-10 1:40 PM

So poor=losers now?

Wow.

No, just their parents.
i will side with finster. when i was applying to USC one of my teachers that wrote a letter for me, he asked me "are you a legacy" to which i said "no i wish, only to CSUN." and he smiled and said "well at least you kids will be." most of the things i have done, is to better myself for my future wife and kids, that they may have everything i did not. as much as i wished i had what others had, i plan on doing what i can to give my kids what i did not have. edit; lets not get into the best thing any parent gives is their dna conversation.


yeah. i pinch my pennies, and eat the most basic and cheap food i can find. life style i work 40 hours a week, and do school full time, and YEAH i live like any other person below the poverty line, i buy the cheapest stuff i can. BC i happen to be so Fing rich that i dont get financial aid. these people never seen how i live, by each penny. ive gone 24 hours without a meal, in wait for a pay check. i will tell you, people can get a job if they want one. im not rich, or well to do, just american hardowrk with the dream in my eyes. to bad im not black or mexican BC if i was i might be a hero, now im just the forgotten norm soley BC im white!!! dont judge me! i eat freaking cup-a-soup twice a day.


2006-02-13 7:16 AM
in reply to: #343788

Champion
7547
5000200050025
Albuquerque, New Mexico
Bronze member
Subject: RE: Kids refuse to raise money by selling candies
kimta - 2006-02-11 5:41 PM

McFuzz - 2006-02-10 8:49 PM ...Teacher recognition, fine, but I have challenged the PTO officers to think of things this way: Would it motivate the students to sell (whatever) so the proceeds can buy teacher gifts/.../.../...? If not, then don't! (Teachers were not thrilled at that question.) Too many organizations are doing too many fundraisers with no real purpose! 

One more note...the PTA is open to everyone!  We always ask people for feedback, ideas, suggestion, etc.  I found that most people love to complain but hate to help!



My wife and I have both served as officers on the PTO/PTA's. I'll step up to the challenge rather than just throw darts.
2006-02-13 7:56 AM
in reply to: #344329

Wife, Mother, Friend.
2457
20001001001001002525
South
Subject: RE: Kids refuse to raise money by selling candies

Choose a job that cuts your salary down significantly and makes you "happy" instead of choosing a career path that secures your future?

 

what's the problem here?

I cut my job from full time to part time so I could stay with my kids more.   But I"m able to keep my benefits, etc.

I make more than my husband per hour.   But it evens out with his overtime and dive time and whatever, but....   we get by and we're fine.    the important thing is I'm there for my kids when they need it. 

IT depends on the handicapped... there are plenty of folks out there able to make a decent living and not sit on their *** collecting SSDI just 'cause they can, and I know quite a few who do just that.  

2006-02-13 8:37 AM
in reply to: #344445

Veteran
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Michigan
Subject: RE: Kids refuse to raise money by selling candies
McFuzz - 2006-02-13 8:16 AM
kimta - 2006-02-11 5:41 PM

McFuzz - 2006-02-10 8:49 PM ...Teacher recognition, fine, but I have challenged the PTO officers to think of things this way: Would it motivate the students to sell (whatever) so the proceeds can buy teacher gifts/.../.../...? If not, then don't! (Teachers were not thrilled at that question.) Too many organizations are doing too many fundraisers with no real purpose! 

One more note...the PTA is open to everyone!  We always ask people for feedback, ideas, suggestion, etc.  I found that most people love to complain but hate to help!

My wife and I have both served as officers on the PTO/PTA's. I'll step up to the challenge rather than just throw darts.

That's terrific - and very rare - to have a husband and a wife involved in PTO/PTA!  It's great that you are willing to be involved!  I don't understand why people don't want to be involved in the PTA.  It's an opportunity to learn from the guest speakers who attend the meetings, an opportunity to improve the level of education that your child is receiving by raising funds for materials, enrichment programs, etc. and an oppotunity to work with the teachers and other schools staff.  Win-win-win!  And the amount of time you put into it is totally up to you.  It can be as little as 1 hour a month or people can even just work on one fundraiser a year. 

I know I am preaching to the choir here since you already participate.  Just had to vent!  I am just a bit fed up with people complaining  about education but not taking any responsibility in solving the problems - not to mention other societial issues.  There are so many people who only care about #1 and don't look at the big picture.  If everyone picked one thing to help with in the schools and one volunteer activity or cause outside of the schools (like a food drive, blood drive, or even just donating to a cause that you care about) - can you imagine what we could get done?  Nope!  Most people would rather sit back, point fingers and make sarcastic comments about how crappy things are.  Very sad.



Edited by kimta 2006-02-13 8:39 AM
2006-02-13 11:21 AM
in reply to: #344518

Elite
2458
20001001001001002525
Livingston, MT
Subject: RE: Kids refuse to raise money by selling candies
kimta - 2006-02-13 5:37 AM

That's terrific - and very rare - to have a husband and a wife involved in PTO/PTA! It's great that you are willing to be involved! I don't understand why people don't want to be involved in the PTA. It's an opportunity to learn from the guest speakers who attend the meetings, an opportunity to improve the level of education that your child is receiving by raising funds for materials, enrichment programs, etc. and an oppotunity to work with the teachers and other schools staff. Win-win-win! And the amount of time you put into it is totally up to you. It can be as little as 1 hour a month or people can even just work on one fundraiser a year.

I know I am preaching to the choir here since you already participate. Just had to vent! I am just a bit fed up with people complaining about education but not taking any responsibility in solving the problems - not to mention other societial issues. There are so many people who only care about #1 and don't look at the big picture. If everyone picked one thing to help with in the schools and one volunteer activity or cause outside of the schools (like a food drive, blood drive, or even just donating to a cause that you care about) - can you imagine what we could get done? Nope! Most people would rather sit back, point fingers and make sarcastic comments about how crappy things are. Very sad.



I would add that those same people probably don't take an interest in their own children's education except when report cards come around and they probably accept the board of education's standard as acceptable. In other words, if their child gets an "A" on their report card, then they must be learning what they need to learn which is so often not the case.

Last year my son got a "B" in math (this was his first year in Junior High School) and couldn't do long division. To me, there was something terribly wrong with this picture. So to work we went on his math.

This year my son got an "A" in history by learning about a tribe in northern Africa (Nubia) that gave Egypt a run for its money for a short period of time. I asked him the historical significance of what he learned, no clue. When I asked him who Alexander the Great was he had no clue. So now we are learning history. He wasn't all too thrilled and even said "But Dad, I got an A..."


2006-02-13 11:44 AM
in reply to: #344708

Pro
3906
20001000500100100100100
St Charles, IL
Subject: RE: Kids refuse to raise money by selling candies

ChuckyFinster - 2006-02-13 10:21 AM
kimta - 2006-02-13 5:37 AM That's terrific - and very rare - to have a husband and a wife involved in PTO/PTA! It's great that you are willing to be involved! I don't understand why people don't want to be involved in the PTA. It's an opportunity to learn from the guest speakers who attend the meetings, an opportunity to improve the level of education that your child is receiving by raising funds for materials, enrichment programs, etc. and an oppotunity to work with the teachers and other schools staff. Win-win-win! And the amount of time you put into it is totally up to you. It can be as little as 1 hour a month or people can even just work on one fundraiser a year. I know I am preaching to the choir here since you already participate. Just had to vent! I am just a bit fed up with people complaining about education but not taking any responsibility in solving the problems - not to mention other societial issues. There are so many people who only care about #1 and don't look at the big picture. If everyone picked one thing to help with in the schools and one volunteer activity or cause outside of the schools (like a food drive, blood drive, or even just donating to a cause that you care about) - can you imagine what we could get done? Nope! Most people would rather sit back, point fingers and make sarcastic comments about how crappy things are. Very sad.
I would add that those same people probably don't take an interest in their own children's education except when report cards come around and they probably accept the board of education's standard as acceptable. In other words, if their child gets an "A" on their report card, then they must be learning what they need to learn which is so often not the case. Last year my son got a "B" in math (this was his first year in Junior High School) and couldn't do long division. To me, there was something terribly wrong with this picture. So to work we went on his math. This year my son got an "A" in history by learning about a tribe in northern Africa (Nubia) that gave Egypt a run for its money for a short period of time. I asked him the historical significance of what he learned, no clue. When I asked him who Alexander the Great was he had no clue. So now we are learning history. He wasn't all too thrilled and even said "But Dad, I got an A..."

So what are you doing to encourage him to learn more about Alexandar the Great?

 



2006-02-13 12:09 PM
in reply to: #343145

Elite
2458
20001001001001002525
Livingston, MT
Subject: RE: Kids refuse to raise money by selling candies
He and I read a chapter from a book daily. It then becomes the source of discussion over dinner. Right now we are in the middle of "The Prince". Looking for the next book now. Motivation is not always easy, often I have to appeal to his imagination. In the case of Alexander, it's pretty easy.

2006-02-13 12:40 PM
in reply to: #344769

Pro
3906
20001000500100100100100
St Charles, IL
Subject: RE: Kids refuse to raise money by selling candies

ChuckyFinster - 2006-02-13 11:09 AM He and I read a chapter from a book daily. It then becomes the source of discussion over dinner. Right now we are in the middle of "The Prince". Looking for the next book now. Motivation is not always easy, often I have to appeal to his imagination. In the case of Alexander, it's pretty easy.

Cool.

I know that reading ( up through about HS ) taught me as much or more than I learned in school.  IMHO the best thing that any parent can do is instill at an early age a love for reading.

-Chris

2006-02-13 12:52 PM
in reply to: #344769

Veteran
465
1001001001002525
Michigan
Subject: RE: Kids refuse to raise money by selling candies

ChuckyFinster - 2006-02-13 1:09 PM He and I read a chapter from a book daily. It then becomes the source of discussion over dinner. Right now we are in the middle of "The Prince". Looking for the next book now. Motivation is not always easy, often I have to appeal to his imagination. In the case of Alexander, it's pretty easy.

Ah, here is something we agree on!!!  It's a shame that more parents don't take an interest in what their children are learning (or not learning for that matter).  I actually enjoy trying to find fun ways of applying at home what my chidren are learning in school.  We read books, do experiments, field trips, research on the Internet - even cooking together can be a way to work on math and science in a fun way.  My daughter is learning about money right now and she set up a "book store" in the front room and the rest of the family went "shopping" so she could work on making change.  In some cases, I think I am learning more then they are!  I am sure your son really appreciates the interest you are taking and the time you are spending with him - way to go Dad!

2006-02-13 3:04 PM
in reply to: #343145

Got Wahoo?
5423
5000100100100100
San Antonio
Subject: RE: Kids refuse to raise money by selling candies
I don't understand - with "no child left behind", I feel completely confident that my child will have an excellent education.
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