Defining FOP/MOP/BOP

Seems accurate to me since I consider myself MOPer and that's where your chart says I am so it must be TRUE. In that other triathlon forum I'm BOPer and am a disgrace to the triathlon community for daring to show up at races.

Once I looked up what FOP/MOP/BOP stood for....
It lines up for me. I'm definitely a beer leaguer with a weekend warrior heart. I am 45 after all, and have only been in shape for 4 years. I think there's a distinction in there. I'm M-MOP. Not M-BOP, that's something altogether different. I'm Mid-MOP.

Despite the fact that we, the MOPs and BOPs, subsidize probably 99% of a given race through entry fees. The local and non-gear sponsors (So and So Sports Medicine, or Drury Hotels, Gatorade) wouldn't bother if it was just the 100(?) pros and elites at a moderately large race. The gear and stuff sponsors (TYR, Bike Brand X, Wheel Brand Z) wouldn't be in business (or making tri-gear) without us nimrods thinking their stuff will turn us in to pros and willing to shell out the cash.

Funny, though. I've yet to see anyone looked down on for racing. Granted, I've only ever done 1 branded HIM race.
I know there were some pros there. They just do their thing. Pass me once on the bike and that's the last they see of me. They could care less, assuming I don't do something stupid.

I did that DSM Hy-Vee try a few years ago. I know that there were several big time pros there. Some of the women had won, or nearly won in Hawaii. I think the winner, Hunter Kemper was more than happy to have us all there. He was heading in to pick up his bike and didn't have his wristband and they wouldn't let him in. He's like, "uhm, I just won this race and don't have my wristband". Still no luck. Not until all of us standing there waiting to get in chimed in and vouched for him did they let him pass.

...and I thought I represented that sentiment well in your column. Or do you think "AGers who take themselves too seriously" is too much of a label?

However, to your other point; the folks who bowl or do no check hockey don't train 10 hrs/week, so I'd say there is a difference. To lump a top AGer with someone who bowls Thursday nights is bit a of stretch.

Thanks. I'll have to print this off and tape it over the results at my next triathlon.
This is actually about what I was expecting but I admit I did slip up and get into an brief argument with my brother when I accidentally called myself an athlete. Do we at least get that much credit? only kidding of course.

Weeeellll....if you're including prep time, the top AGers are more like 20-30. The 10 hrs/week is on the very low end of "moving time". But that's neither here nor there.

If you want to take is a step farther, and be "real world" about it. The only people that can HONESTLY have the title "Professional Triathlete" and be anything more than what you would consider beer league, are people that are good enough to MAKE A LIVING off of it and be fully self sustaining. And there aren't many. Maybe 20-50. Otherwise you aren't technically a professional. Especially if you're W2 contains $0 earned for triathlon. That's really the definition of "pro" after all. Let's be realistic, someone who does their own taxes is not a "professional accountant" a professional accountant is someone who make a self sustaining income as an accountant. A person who builds a deck, is not a "professional contractor" a professional contractor makes a living contracting. Someone with a pro card who hasn't made any money isn't a "professional". They're someone who gets to start in the first heat.

So, that's the only true definition. Now, that doesn't make much sense as there is a huge range and many people under that criteria. So we categorize. You don't get to draw the line where it happens to suit you dude.

LB.....do you post on ST? That would be a hoot to read some of those comments.

I think this is more than fair.
I don't even consider myself an athlete. By definition, I'd have to consider myself proficient.
I'm not.

I'm in it for the fun and personal satisfaction. And as I noted, I've never felt out of place or disrespected. That Hunter Kemper dude was really cool. I ended up chatting with him about his appreciation for Iowa. He knew I was a noob. I didn't even have a tri-top. And to this day, I swear that the guy who was in 3rd or maybe 4th place during the run in the HIM I did gave me a head nod and a "keep it up"....as he was coming down a hill I was walking up the other way. I read a race review of a branded Ironman where a couple MOP dudes helped the previous year's winner over the fence and ended up sharing breakfast snacks and a chat together.

I would bet any guff a guy like me would get would be from an AGer who took themselves too seriously.

Plus, I think I'm starting to swim pretty good. I beat at least 4 "elites" in the last race I did.

I have to jump in on this one. I used to be a competitive bowler and my right shoulder bears testament to the untold number of frames I've filled.

In High School I was considered the best on the team and one of the best in the League. I literally had a ball in my hands 7 days a week between HS League, Sat AM Jrs and practice. Not every practice game was a strikefest either. There were countless hours of working on approach, swing, slide, release and follow-through. Then there were the sessions where you would throw a junk ball down the lane to give yourself weird crap to try to pick up the spare. Toss in travel to different houses (bowling alleys) to experience their conditions and how they set their stuff up (trust me, a house with high ceilings feels much different than one with lower ceilings, wood lanes are different than synthetic, true synthetic is different than a synthetic sheet over wood.... Then there's the balls. Not going to go into the details there... I really just wanted to say "balls"...

Believe it or not, there's a lot of fitness involved as well. All I will say on this is to try to throw a ball the same way every time for 5 or 6 games. No, it's not elite athlete fitness, but it does play a part.

I did do a little bit of time as a PBA Regional Professional as well. It kinda sucks when something that is supposed to be fun turns into a job and you have to answer to sponsors for crappy showings.

I love this! I am totally BOP, hopefully I'll spend the next few seasons working my way up the ranks. For now, Proud Plodder, all the way.

I love our amateur-elite box, but said differently could read "AGers who think they are fast." I think most pro's (not just your money making definition, but the people that start in the first heat) are very friendly. The only arrogant people I've really met in triathlon tend to fall in the "think they are fast" camp.

LB, I agree on the time spent doing a hobby. Hell, my neighbors yard blows mine out of the water. But he spends far more time working in it than I do training for triathlon. And do the crappy shooters blame genetics every time they get beat?

Here's the other thing LB, the original post never referred to anyone as a "triathlete". You're the one that brought that up. Personally I've never referred to myself as a triathlete. If someone asks, I'm a chemical engineer. I do participate in triathlons however. The post was about categorizations of people who do triathlons. So of the people, who on the weekend, do triathlons, we typically refer to their performance in said events as being MOP/BOP or FOP. This post was about how the performances in these triathlons, by these folks, would be properly categorized into these groups. So I'm not sure exactly where your issue is with that? I threw the pro line at the top just for the sake of completeness.

The post was on how to categorize non-pros (i.e. amateurs) based on commonly used nomenclature.....so yeah....

What about people who are constantly going on about being a "completer" and how they used to weigh a metric ton?

I think I do that 50-50 for two reasons.
1. exuberance....because I don't weigh a metric ton anymore and I can actually complete these things. It's still very shocking to me and I'm proud of it.
2. overcompensation to insure that people KNOW I'm not the guy who goes around talking about qualifying for Kona, etc 100 times over 2 days. because those people are kind of annoying to everyone, including us MOP/BOPers. You'd think it'd make me a target for those people, but it doesn't. It seems to attract more people like me. Maybe they figure a guy who barely knows enough about pedal types to get by isn't going understand enough of what they're saying to be impressed.

I could probably afford to dial that back a bit. But, I've run into so many people with so many similar stories and we've become friends on FB, cheered each other on during the race/etc. It's how we find each other.

Edited by jhaack39 2016-07-18 3:37 PM

Technically anyone who participates in a triathlon is a triathlete are they not? If someone were to ask me "are you a triathlete?" I would reply, yeah, as a hobby. Or yeah, sort of, I do them for fun, to me it's just recognizing the intended question of being for fun or as a profession/professional.

but i really like the chart for goals

Edited by runtim23 2016-07-18 4:03 PM

That was really the point. It's a way to track progress as you go. Like golfers tracking their handicap or bowlers tracking their average, etc. We don't really have a number like that, so we use BOP/MOP/FOP, so I figured I'd offer a way to put some numbers behind it. I got the idea from a ST post on USAT scores and they had the "amateur elite" classification so I kept it as I figured it would add some spice to the conversation.



Edited by 3mar 2016-07-18 4:24 PM

The only time I've said "I'm a triathlete" is when I've said "I'm a triathlete which explains my terrible swimming"

Most people I've met racing or training have been fine. Definitely met more than a few who take themselves far too seriously. I don't worry about them

Omar,
I like the chart, for spice. It's one additional way of defining beyond rankings. Of course 'pack' is defined as all racing the event and for me personally, it all about me pushing myself as far as my old body can handle. (And I like to compare myself to my peers-AG contenders, as best comparison, as I'm not 30 anymore...) It is probably more helpful for people who wonder how close to 'pro' or elite they are or could be. And you have to remember, that there IS that slippery slope of aging.

The arguments that ensue from these discussions usually evolve around whether athlete's should even aspire to time goals or even bother training to become better/accomplished at it and how do they define themselves. And how annoying anyone can be when spouting off about their hobby, whatever it is, too frequently.

If you are training and completing triathlon races, you should continue to think of one's self as an 'athlete'. This is important for self esteem even if you are not pro and not competing at the highest level. According to the table, only pros can think of themselves as 'legitimate' athletes and no one else doing regular exercise can? That's ridiculous. I hate the 'LB' tables.

Others (LB in particuliar) will not give credit to the average Joe who is competing in triathlon and training at least several hours/week at it. I completely disagree with this and believe we should embrace physical activity and reward it at all levels as often as we can to keep people moving in this country. Obesity is rampant and eating habits and activity levels of people in general are just awful. Yet, if you look around at a triathlon event, so many people are fit, lean and I'm sure are very physically active. And it affects those in their lives and has an effect on their kids, which is a very positive influence. (Unlike loading 6 million cartridges-and I'm a very good marksman BTW, when practiced, but I don't think of myself as one in general. And I don't think I need to be too aerobic to hold my pistol/rifle and squeeeeeeeeeze the trigger ever so slowly)

The level of activity to complete a 5K is paltry compared to the level of training for the average guy/gal doing even sprint tri's on a regular basis, for the most part. And it's far above what I tell my patients in terms of goal weekly activity levels for heart health. The AHA currently recommends 5 days of moderate activity (ie 30 minutes/day-5 days/week), and most Americans don't even come close to that. But I'd venture a guess that MOST triathletes DO.

http://www.heart.org/HEARTORG/HealthyLiving/PhysicalActivity/Fitnes...

I think it's a real disservice to dissuade people from believing that they are accomplishing something by competing in triathlon. Belittling achievements like this just makes me shake my head and wonder. I have taken care of many accomplished athletes in my career and they usually became great due to lots of training on top of God-given genetic ability. But you can't change your genes...and you can definitely change your lifestyle. And I've seen these same athlete's who've won Olympic medals not take care of their bodies and get heart disease.

Some hobbies that involve physical activity are much better for longevity than others. That is a real benefit. Even if you don't want to live a long time, you will be able to do more when you are older if you are fit. The people who play softball or hockey twice/weekly are probably doing more activity than most Americans. Calling them 'beer-leaguers' smacks of snobbery bordering on elitism.

But to come full circle, the topic IS spicy.The table is nice, but I like the points ranking system the USAT has to compare yourself with the best of the best as well as those in your AG. (I'll have to remind myself to tell LB how great I did in my last triathlon if/when I ever meet him. And I said long ago, in another VERY controversial thread, that I would be the first to buy beers for all of us...and would enjoy a nice discussion about running/racing/triathlon etc)

And that's all I have to say about that.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Otm4RusESNU

So,,, people who go skiiing in the winter aren't "skiers" unless they race professionally? People who mountain bike aren't "mountain bikers" unless they race professionally? People who wakeboard aren't "wakeboarders" unless they have a pro card?

IMO if you do triathlons, you're a triathlete, just like if you ski you're a skier.