stevebradley's Mentor Group FULL (Page 15)

2009-02-08 11:10 AM

in reply to: #1951159

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Subject: RE: stevebradley's Mentor Group FULL

Well, all is sort of right with the world now. Everything is hunky-dory when I'm at Mozilla, but likely still not on Internet Explorer. My son instructed me to click on a few things, which I di, but which I won't check on until all of my courage is back.

Remington steep-incline typewriters? Those I could understand!

2009-02-08 11:20 AM

in reply to: #1951178

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Subject: RE: stevebradley's Mentor Group FULL

ERIC -

Yes, I've had Black Fly in my sights for a while. I would love to do all three events - bike time trial Friday evening, oly Saturday, sprint Sunday - but I don't know how wisely that all fits with my plans to do Musselman 1/2 the following week, and then NYC Tri the weekend after that. If my body is willing, my addled mind will readily agree to all three B.F. plus the other two races, but....

Did you see Sam Bush? I was listening to a few things by him yesterday, including something he did with Tony Trischka in which the piece ("New York Chimes") was in the key of D, yet none of the instruments were tuned to D. Fairly weird sounds, but very compelling. I am spending these days trying to unlearn some bad mandolin habits - it's kind of amazing how quickly bad habits can be instilled in an innately untalented musician!!

2009-02-08 11:42 AM

in reply to: #1951053

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Subject: RE: stevebradley's Mentor Group FULL

SAX -

That is a TERRIFIC training/race tactic, doing the Vineman aquabike! That'll give you a great idea of how 2.4 miles of swimming and 112 miles of biking feel.......and you get to save your running legs for another day!

In '05 I came THIS CLOSE to signing up for Vineman, but money worries got to me and I decided to do the inaugural running of The Canadian Iron, in Ottawa, just 30 miles away. That had it's great advantages, of course.....but I've often wondered if I blew a great chance to do Vineman, what most people consider a first-class race. (I know I could sign up for it any year, but with each passing year I become less inclined to travel far for races. And, I've never flown to a far-away race, so it's always long drives.)

2009-02-08 11:43 AM

in reply to: #1950165

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Subject: RE: stevebradley's Mentor Group FULL

GRACE -

I haven't forgotten about your wonky knee, and I'll get back to you soon about it!

sax

2009-02-08 2:26 PM

in reply to: #1896958

Master

1547

Subject: RE: stevebradley's Mentor Group FULL

The Malibu tri is the one with the celebrities and it always sells out fast...like an IM or something. So I do not have to do that one. In fact...I have been playing around with the idea of doing this race instead with my best friend from high school who is also into tri's. After that I was thinking pure trng for IMAZ.

Knowing that my weakness is on the run I have this plan of holding back on the bike...doing aquabike I think will help me gauge exactly where I need to be on the bike with pacing.

For IMAZ I am still trying to figure out if I should train run/walk or pure run. I have read about and heard that lots of people walk the last 10miles of an IM...I figure if thats the case I should just start out run/walk and finish strong. I don't want to run 15-20 miles only to walk the last part and finish a mary in 5-6hrs.

I hear you on the travel thing...thankfully, SoCal has plenty of races nearby.

Edited by sax 2009-02-08 2:27 PM

sax

2009-02-08 2:44 PM

in reply to: #1896958

Master

1547

Subject: RE: stevebradley's Mentor Group FULL

Eric...

Yes the combat side stroke can be very effective. In fact, I used to do 500yds TT on both CSS and breast stroke in under 7min which I still can't seem to do freestyle. I train all free now, but I have really good form on those strokes so it makes me wonder with free since I am supposed to be faster...hmmm (maybe I need a swim clinic?). Of course the reasoning for those strokes then was a lot different. The 1000yd "buddy tow" comes to mind...towing someone for 1000yds, that was always fun.

2009-02-08 4:27 PM

in reply to: #1951440

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Subject: RE: stevebradley's Mentor Group FULL

SAX -

Oh-ho -- Triple-T, eh? VERY cool indeed! This is the first year for the California edition, but I guess you know that the "original", near Portsmouth, OH, has a legion of people who love it to death, just about. I had signed up for it last year, but the PF prevented me from doing it; fortunately, the RD allowed me to sell my spot to someone else. It is definitely in my plans for the future, likely in 2012.

So, when you say that you might do it with a friend, does that mean you would be registered as a team? That would be neat, the way they have it set up, where at certain (maybe all?) points in all four events, you have to stay with your teammate. Or something like that? (I would've done it solo, so I didn'y pay much attention to the team rules.)

It's fun to read some of the accounts from the Ohio one, where the consensus is that, come the third day and there is "just" the half-iron to do, people are in ABSOLUTELY NO HURRY to head into the water for the swim. There are maybe 10 people hanging around the water about 10 minutes before the race, and most of the others just straggle up moments before (and even moments after) the start. Part of this is the cold water, but even without that people are just wiped from the previous two days of exertions. Everyone is gung-ho to the extreme at Friday's prologue, but by the time the second (the bike-swim-run one) of Saturday's two olys rolls around, the fatigue factor is weighing pretty heavy. I don't know what the course is like at the CA one, but the OH one is a murderous wicked-hilly course. Too much fun!

Are there still spaces open for the CA one? I would've figured it would've filled by now.

My advice on how to train for the IMAZ run? Definitely, for you, do your training as pure run! At that point you should have a great run base, better than 90% of the age-groupers there. Seriously. You have a season with challenging long-distance stand-alone run-races, and most of the IMAZ crowd will not have focused on that at all. Right now, 9.5 months out from IMAZ, I think it's realistic to figure you will do some walking during the marathon part of it, but I wouldn't train that way. I truly believe that you are putting too much intelligent emphasis on your run to compromise it by deliberately toning things down in preparation for IMAZ.

It's true - Lots of people wlak a lot of the iron marathon, but there are many reasons for that - going olout way too fast is one culprit, with a bigger culprit being that they did the bike far too hard. (I'll say this now, and will say it again -- stay well within yourself for the first half of the bike. There will be lots of folks whipping past you --- but most of them will be ones you will pass in the second half of the bike, or if not then, then during the run. Other reasons for walking are inadequate training, poor nutrition, or some injury that rears its ugly head in the earlier stages of the run. The second one - nutrition - is one that you will have lots of time to work on and fin-tune, but even that is not infallible. To this end, start thinking about what you mmight want to pack in your special needs bag, which will be there for you halfway through the bike. (The secret treat for me at IMLP was two peanut butter and grape jelly sandwiches....and remind me to tell you about the yellow jackets sometime!)

But I digress. There are many people who surprise themselves at iron events, wherein they do the whole thing with their only walking being through aid stations (VERY wise advice for an IM run!). What works for them is that they have done the entire race up to that point on their own terms, resisting external "pressures" to push their pace too hard. And they start the run very conservatively, making sure they are about 99% comfortable with the effort they are expending.

There is a theory that one small key is to NOT sit down during T2, as doing so will make it very difficult to start up again - this will be both a physical and mental thing. I did not know about the idea of not-sitting during T2 at IMLP, and I sat, and it was hard to start up, to be sure! (I also went out a bit too fast, which is why my first stint of walking happened at about mile 6!)

For my second iron, the following year, I did not sit during either transition, and that policy worked well for me. I did that run in something like 4:21 -- but found out later that the run course was measured OVER TWO MILES LONG!!!! So, take away about 18 minutes, and I had a very decent run there, a few minutes over four hours, whereas at IMLP my run was about 4:40, and with way too much walking required! (Is 4:40 corrrect? I'll have to check that.) I am a firm proponent of not sitting during T2 - even though your besieged brain will be screaming at you to not just sit down, but LIE down!

For now, have faith in the benefits of all the intelligent training and racing you will doing between now and IMAZ!

2009-02-08 4:48 PM

in reply to: #1951454

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Subject: RE: stevebradley's Mentor Group FULL

SAX again -

The stats:

IMLP '04 -- 12:57:37
swim - 1:24:26
T1 - 8:09
bike - 6:37:35
T2 - 7:27
run - 4:40:01

The Canadian Iron '05 -- 11:54:44
swim - 1:24:53
T1 - 3:40
bike - 6:00:46
T2 - 3:39
run - 4:21:46

Notes:

IMLP T1 time reflects long run in from the swim

IMLP T2 time reflects sitting on rear end too long

TCI trans times reflect a combo of shorter in/out distances and no sitting time

Adjust TCI run time to about 4:03, for over-long course. And this is the same site where the half-iron course in '07 was measure 1.5 miles SHORT!!! This took away a PR for me, as my 5:07 time was, with the addition of about 8 minutes due to the "missing" 15 km, really abot 5:15. So, I went from ecstacy on race day to misery a few days later when the RD sent an email to all participants apologizing profusely for under-measuring the run course. GRRRRR! (And as my previous PR for HIM was 5:13, the "asterisk" time of 5:07, adjusted to 5:15, doesn't cut it. GRRRR! GRRRR!)

Edited by stevebradley 2009-02-08 6:19 PM

elindquist

2009-02-08 4:50 PM

in reply to: #1951291

Member

Subject: RE: stevebradley's Mentor Group FULL

Steve-

I didn't get over to see Sam this time. I did see him with Emmylou Harris a few years ago. He put out a great CD with Jerry Douglas on Dobro, and I think even Yo Yo Ma was playing Cello on one of the songs.

2009-02-08 6:47 PM

in reply to: #1951135

Regular

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Subject: RE: stevebradley's Mentor Group FULL

stevebradley - 2009-02-08 9:28 AM WORK WITH ME, GANG? Okay, what's there now - the old one, or the running one? I keep tinkering, and edging closer and closer to certifiable madness in the process. Until I hear back from any of you, I'm just going to curl up in the fetal psition......

STEVE - Running one!!!

2009-02-08 8:23 PM

in reply to: #1951670

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Subject: RE: stevebradley's Mentor Group FULL

GRACE -

Chase down some of the info at www.injurybegone.com. There is some germane info here, but what I really recommend is one of their products, the patellar tendon strap. I used this periodically in '98 and '99, mostly when I was in the wrong shoes and sometimes suffered from "runner's knee" (chondromalacia patella -- [sp?]). That strap got me through the Columbus Marathon '99 with no issues, and I could not have made the distance without it.

As you can see in the pictures, it fits into the groove between the bottom of your kneecap and the top of your tibia. It holds really well (much better for me than the related Patt-Strap), and its function is to artificially stabilize the kneecap, keeping it nicely aligned - or at least more nicely aligned than it would be if left to its own devices. And at times when my knee would ache during the day, I would just wear it during work, and would get a lot of relief. Eventually, as I got into the correct shoes, the condition disappeared. (Whew!)

So, this might be a route for you to follow while your running legs are developing and the v.m. exercises are kicking in. Just a thought?

2009-02-08 9:46 PM

in reply to: #1951570

Regular

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Subject: RE: stevebradley's Mentor Group FULL

stevebradley - 2009-02-08 5:48 PM SAX again - The stats: IMLP '04 -- 12:57:37 swim - 1:24:26 T1 - 8:09 bike - 6:37:35 T2 - 7:27 run - 4:40:01 The Canadian Iron '05 -- 11:54:44 swim - 1:24:53 T1 - 3:40 bike - 6:00:46 T2 - 3:39 run - 4:21:46

I am totally in awe of you Steve . It will be a while before I can spend 6 hours in a bike saddle! Or run for 4 hours. Wow...

2009-02-08 9:57 PM

in reply to: #1951769

Regular

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Subject: RE: stevebradley's Mentor Group FULL

stevebradley - 2009-02-08 9:23 PM GRACE - Chase down some of the info at www.injurybegone.com. There is some germane info here, but what I really recommend is one of their products, the patellar tendon strap. ... So, this might be a route for you to follow while your running legs are developing and the v.m. exercises are kicking in. Just a thought?

STEVE - Thanks for the lead! I've bookmarked the site and will revisit it when I have made some money selling stuff on ebay/craigslist. Thanks again, really appreciate it.

2009-02-08 10:20 PM

in reply to: #1896958

Regular

111

Subject: RE: stevebradley's Mentor Group FULL

Hi everyone,

I am wondering if I should stick to the 20 wk Sprint training plan I downloaded from here, or if there is another plan that would be better for me.

This past month I have tried to gauge where I stand in the swim, bike and run and it looks like I swim 600 m in 17 min, bike 10 miles (1% grade) in 57 min, and run 5 km (1.5% incline) in 21 min. (I recorded the times for the bike and run 'brick' this evening - my knee didn't hurt! I was able to talk during the bike-run and was in the 70-80% HR zone most of the time).

So it looks like I would probably be able to finish a Sprint. I feel I can already comfortably do the times that are stated in wk 10 of my 20 wk Sprint plan. Question is, should I: 1) work on finishing the Sprint well (improve my times), OR, 2) attempt an Olympic distance tri, OR, 3) Both. I do want to build a solid base, but I also want to go as far as I can this year because I have plenty of time now (ah the joys of being jobless), and might not have as much time to train next year.

Maybe I could skip the early part of the plan jump right into the 10th week, then take part in a Sprint early in the season, and then an Olympic late in the season?

I would really appreciate any of your thoughts on this.

Grace

Edited by gracetaBitha 2009-02-08 10:35 PM

sax

2009-02-09 12:41 AM

in reply to: #1896958

Master

1547

Subject: RE: stevebradley's Mentor Group FULL

Grace,

I haven't looked at the plan you are on but it sounds like you are wanting more...maybe to get some bigger distances in?? Most plans are built with a specific goal each week. It may be that lower intensity workouts leave you feeling like you could do more so you want to jump ahead...but if you are new to this endurance stuff try and resist. Get a solid base built. It wasn't too long ago that an 8 mile run was the longest run I had done and it was such an event I even soaked in the tub with ice for 30min afterwards. Today that was an easy run! I was actually reflecting during this run about how easy it felt when just 3 or 4 months ago it was a serious challenge.

So I recomend being patient and building the base...you will thank yourself later. There will be plenty of time to work on speed and higher intensity later.

As far as doing Oly distance...absolutely, I think you can do that in the same season, if not several.

It has been 10 months since I did my first sprint...and now I am training for IM this year, it's crazy how time flies. One day we will be like Steve with sub 12 IM under our belts and if we're lucky even:

"doing peregrine falcon surveys in the arctic, and this involved being flown in a helicopter to try to locate nests on cliffs, and then if we found one, we would land about a mile away, then I'd walk to the site and rappel down to the nest."

Steve is a renassaince man.

Edited by sax 2009-02-09 12:46 AM

elindquist

2009-02-09 6:27 AM

in reply to: #1951769

Member

Subject: RE: stevebradley's Mentor Group FULL

I had a sort of mini-break through yesterday with swimming, making it twice as far as I used to before needing a rest (my shoulders start to burn- I realize this is probably since I only swim once a week now).

What time should I be shooting for for a 600-700 meter sprint swim? 15 mins? I've never swam in any kind of race before.

I swam 35 mins, biked 30 mins, and then ran around the indoor track for a couple of laps, it was the perfect Sunday afternoon.

-Eric

2009-02-09 7:50 AM

in reply to: #1951878

Champion

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Subject: RE: stevebradley's Mentor Group FULL

GRACE -

Here are two more exercises for quadriceps-strengthening by way of aligning your kneecap and helping with your knee pain:

STANDING LEG LIFTS --
Stand with your back against the wall. Lift your leg as high as you can, holding your knee straight. Hold for a count of five. Now bend yout knee to relax for the count of five. The straighten the leg again.
Do one leg five times. The do the other leg. Start by holding your leg straight for the count of five. Increase until you can hold it to the count of ten.

FOOT PRESS --
Can be done lying down or sitting in a chair. Put your right foot on top of your left foot. Your lower foot tries to pull toward your body as your upper foot pushes it away from the body. Hold for ten seconds. Now switch feet - left on top of right, and push/pull for ten seconds. The equals one set. Do five sets.

These are from "The Runners' Repair Manual", by Dr. Murray F. Weisenfeld and Barbara Burr. I think it is long out of print, but the stuff in it is still applicable. (The cover photo includes a pair of New Balance running shoes that must date from the mid-late 80s; uh, looking now, the copyright is 1980!)

The top one can probably substitutre nicely for the vastus medialus one I TRIED to explain a few days ago, but at which I likely failed miserably!

2009-02-09 8:13 AM

in reply to: #1952004

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10618

Subject: RE: stevebradley's Mentor Group FULL

ERIC -

Yup, it does sound like a fine Sunday afternoon!

Very fine jump in the swimming scene. And it's good that you stopped when you did, seeing as how your shoulders were starting to burn. Over the years I've been terrible with the idea that if some is good, lots is better, but you had the good sense to back off and enjoy your gains. A few pages back I posted some good shouder stretches for swimming; did you see those? If not, I will retrace my steps and tell you where they are. I think I posted them to Grace...or ThatGirlJess....or Mindy. Anyhow, if you are ramping up the swim distances, keep those shoulders limber!!

For now, and with no idea of the times you're setting with your swims, I'd say that 15 minutes for 600-700 meters is a good, conservative target. Were you to do a 1500 meter race-day swim in 30 minutes, that would put you about 2/3 of the way back in the times of all the swiimers at that race. Halve that, and you get 15 minutes for 750 meters, and then for you to think 15 minutes for 600-700 meters is giving you lots of leeway to feel your way comfortably through the swim.

Is Timberman your first race? I'm thinking it is, but I might be confused. If so, though, the swim is 1/3 of a mile, which would put it at 580 yards/meters ---- and I think you can do that in 15 minutes quite easily. I will go to the race results and get some idea of the times people are doing that swim in. If you get there before me, though, find your age group and for starters llok at the swim time for the guy whose swim was at 50% for all of those in the a.g. That'll give you some idea of what might be reasonable, likely give-or-take a minute or so on either side.

As your endurance and confidence builds, try a "time trial" at the pool. If you feel comfortable going kind of all-out for 200 yards, do it and time yourself, then multiply by 3. If you can go all-out a bit further, then try that; if just 100 for now, do it and multiply by 6. That's just for starters, to give yourself a very rough idea. If nothing else, it will provide a decent baseline standard.

Race day swimming IS different, but that does not necessarily mean harder or slower; more on that topic later!!

Gotta leave now, Lynn needs the computer.

mindymcc

2009-02-09 8:25 AM

in reply to: #1951895

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Subject: RE: stevebradley's Mentor Group FULL

Grace - all I know is, with those times, you would kick my butt!

Mindy

2009-02-09 9:06 AM

in reply to: #1952095

Champion

10618

Subject: RE: stevebradley's Mentor Group FULL

ERIC -

I can't remember your age, but I'm thinking you said in the 30-34 range?

Anyhow, for T-man last year, for the .3 mile swim, the median time was about 10:53. This is out of 56 finishers in the M30-34 a.g. Of those the fastest swim was 7:28 (ZOOOMMM!!), and the slowest was 15:55.

Two Merrimack guys in that a.g. -- Richard Hostler and Nathan Fisher.

I'm being evicted from the computer again!

Edited by stevebradley 2009-02-09 3:28 PM

2009-02-09 9:24 AM

in reply to: #1951954

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Subject: RE: stevebradley's Mentor Group FULL

SAX -

Well, thanks for the "renaissance man" implication, but sadly it's not quite that pure. I HAVE lived a very interesting, unconventional life........but much of that is likely due to having the attention span of a fruit fly and foresight of a stucco brick. It was pretty easy to exit school in the 60s and 70s and "dabble around" a bit, which is what I did in spades; it wasn't until about 1988 that I entered into any sort of pension plan.
If I had it to do all over again, I might've scrapped some of the frivolous stuff I filled my early-middle years with.....but I'm not sure. It's tough to think about jettisoning a bunch of once-in-a-lifetime experiences (quasi-"careers") simply because they didn't prove to be solid career moves! And for all of the moving around we did when we were younger, that's something that is hard to think about doing differently. Anyhow, heck - we've now lived in the same place since '91, so that indicates some sort of stability, yes? (Having kids WILL exert that influence......)
I guess I've mostly landed on my feet --- but that's 94% due to Lynn's good sense and overall seriousness-of-purpose than it is to my flighty (laissez-faire? lackadaisicsal?) career and financial perspectives. And my poor, woebegone parents --- having just me, they hoped for something just a bit more conventionally successful! Oops!

Edited by stevebradley 2009-02-09 9:30 AM

2009-02-09 3:33 PM

in reply to: #1952260

Champion

10618

Subject: RE: stevebradley's Mentor Group FULL

ERIC -

In the spirit of accuracy, I went back, found your age, went to www.lin-mark.com, found the results for the M35-39 a.g.......and actually, there is not much difference between that a.g. and the M30-34 a.g. Well, there is a difference in participants, with a whopping 96 finishers in the 35-39 cohort. But median time (I actually counted; maybe too much free time on my hands??) was 10:49, and the range was from 7:27 - 16:25. And in this group were two more Merrimackians, Dino Quintero and Weston Moran. Just so you know!