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2010-11-17 12:17 PM
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Subject: RE: Beginner 1/2 Ironman Plan Group
Meulen - 2010-11-17 8:11 AM Crap!!!!!........ I've been scaling back on everything but running lately to make sure I get an "off season". Started computrainer 2x per week and have really scaled back swimming. I'm about a month from starting a Hal Higdon marathon plan that I will be overlapping with the 1/2 IM plan a month after that. Problem is I pulled something in my calf!!! I pulled it last week in a recovery run, the day after a tempo. I took a few days off and it felt fine so, I ran again Monday. Now it really hurts! It didn't hurt during computrainer last night, but it's soar today. I'm wondering if I should even run tomorrow? I've been keeping up 20-25 miles per week to prepare for the marathon plan. I've also got a 4 mile turkey trot run thanksgiving I want to rock hard! I've got a friend in the race I HAVE to beat!! I'm wondering if I'll even be able to do that!?


I've been having the same problem. I was a week before starting Hal Higdon's marathon plan when my calf starting tightening up and getting sharp pains in it. My 1/2 IM training plan will overlap early next year.  I've been seeing a chiro who's done some ART and other stuff which has helped a lot. I've done a lot of rolling and stretching. I added a better warm up routine before runs but the best thing I've done is take a week off completely from running. I kept up the bike, swim and TRX strength training. I've gone on 2 runs this week that felt really great. I took it a little easy and I know I have to build back up. I'm in the same boat, it's hard when your schedule says to run X amount and you don't get it in but I feel so much better taking care of it and I just have to accept that it'll take a few weeks to be completely back on track. Maybe take a few days off so you can Trot with the Turkeys


2010-11-17 12:27 PM
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Subject: RE: Beginner 1/2 Ironman Plan Group
Meulen - 2010-11-17 10:11 AM Crap!!!!!........ I've been scaling back on everything but running lately to make sure I get an "off season". Started computrainer 2x per week and have really scaled back swimming. I'm about a month from starting a Hal Higdon marathon plan that I will be overlapping with the 1/2 IM plan a month after that. Problem is I pulled something in my calf!!! I pulled it last week in a recovery run, the day after a tempo. I took a few days off and it felt fine so, I ran again Monday. Now it really hurts! It didn't hurt during computrainer last night, but it's soar today. I'm wondering if I should even run tomorrow? I've been keeping up 20-25 miles per week to prepare for the marathon plan. I've also got a 4 mile turkey trot run thanksgiving I want to rock hard! I've got a friend in the race I HAVE to beat!! I'm wondering if I'll even be able to do that!?


This IS the off-season, so be very cautious about pushing yourself too hard for races now that don't really "matter". Does a Turkey Trot matter more than your marathon? If not, then don't push yourself to do it if there is a possibility of making an injury really flare up and become a months long problem!
If you skip your run tomorrow, what is the worst thing that will happen? What if you do your run tomorrow with a sore calf? What is the worst thing that could happen? In my opinion, it's much smarter to be overly cautious right now until you figure out if this is just a temporary twinge or a real problem.
2010-11-17 12:30 PM
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Subject: RE: Beginner 1/2 Ironman Plan Group
arkmann - 2010-11-17 10:19 AM I have questions regarding the plan.

I already know I can do the full 1.2mi swim and have done it in the pool multiple times.  I have even done 2000m non-stop plus 300m WU and 200 CD.  Now my question is, should I skip the long swim workouts and focus on the days/drills that aim to develop speed?  I still plan to swim the full distance, sometimes more, every other week.  If anyone wonders how it translates to open water swims, I'm one of those persons whose OWS is just a tad bit slower than their pool swim due to sighting issues. 

When yoo do the run and bike workouts, do you also count the time you spend in warm up?  My warm ups are usually 10min long and I extend the total run workout 15mins longer than what the plan lists.


Good questions! I would not skip the long swims. You are in a great position in that you can already do them, but the point of a weekly long swim is NOT ONLY to get you up to the distance, but to get you so comfortable with the distance that you aren't tired when you finish, leaving you with way more energy for the bike.
I keep my warm up and cool down time separate from my workout time. If a workout calls for "40 minute run", I will warm up for 5 minutes, then start my timer for 40 minutes, then walk for a few minutes afterward to cool down.
2010-11-17 5:46 PM
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Subject: RE: Beginner 1/2 Ironman Plan Group
Just to clarify- I am cutting out one of the swim days for most weeks, but I am not cutting out my long swim.
2010-11-17 6:35 PM
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Subject: RE: Beginner 1/2 Ironman Plan Group
I'm three days in to the 20-week HIM program right now.  It's going pretty well so far, but my swimming has been an unmitigated disaster.  Take a look:

S:

3650.00 Yd
1h 54m
  
B: 
16.00 Mi
1h 00m

R: 
6.95 Mi
1h 06m

I went to my membership office at the gym and signed up for a package of 8,  30 minute private swim lessons.  I am REALLY hoping this helps.  Otherwise the plan has been nice.  Looking forward for sure to keep on going.  The long swims are just really brutal.
 
2010-11-17 7:15 PM
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Subject: RE: Beginner 1/2 Ironman Plan Group
Phew....thanks for getting me back on track! Felt much better in my workout today Kiss


2010-11-17 9:13 PM
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Subject: RE: Beginner 1/2 Ironman Plan Group
Tri Take Me Away - 2010-11-17 9:48 AM
Mellissa - 2010-11-16 10:54 PM so I read a thread in another section and now I'm questioning whether I'll even survive my HIM April 2...I can't really dish out any extra money for an upgraded plan, or a coach, or accessories, or master's swim...and all of my swimming and most of my biking will be indoors...


Don't worry. Follow the plan, do the time, and you WILL finish. You don't need an upgraded plan, a coach, Masters, or any toys. I promise!


This is really what I'm counting on too.  It's my first one and I just want to finish, I don't have anything fancy at all.  I want to drag myself out of the pool like 1/4 the way through these swims but just keep at it.  Maybe once I'm not so miserable at it I will enjoy it. 
2010-11-18 7:35 AM
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Subject: RE: Beginner 1/2 Ironman Plan Group
JG_GreenCoast - 2010-11-17 10:13 PM
Tri Take Me Away - 2010-11-17 9:48 AM
Mellissa - 2010-11-16 10:54 PM so I read a thread in another section and now I'm questioning whether I'll even survive my HIM April 2...I can't really dish out any extra money for an upgraded plan, or a coach, or accessories, or master's swim...and all of my swimming and most of my biking will be indoors...


Don't worry. Follow the plan, do the time, and you WILL finish. You don't need an upgraded plan, a coach, Masters, or any toys. I promise!


This is really what I'm counting on too.  It's my first one and I just want to finish, I don't have anything fancy at all.  I want to drag myself out of the pool like 1/4 the way through these swims but just keep at it.  Maybe once I'm not so miserable at it I will enjoy it. 



I find the key thing to keep me motivated with swim training is celebrating even the smallest victories.  I swim about a 2:30/100yds pace but I haven't built up the stamina to continually swim at that pace yet.  In fact, I can only do 50yd sets at that pace and then I have to take a breather.  I include my breaks in with my overall minutes/100yards pace at the end of my workout to keep track of my progress.  i.e. I swam a 5m/100yards pace on Monday but last night I swam a 4:53m/100yards pace.  I got so excited just to see SOME improvement because it was showing I was spending less time between my 50 yard sets.  Another is with my run times.  Even if I beat my last run time by 10secs I will cheer as I turn on to my street.  My girlfriend even knows if I did well on my run before I enter the house because she can usually hear me cheering outside (between gasping breaths).  Overall, it just makes it more fun for me to celebrate even the small victories while training.

Edited by mrfranks_84 2010-11-18 7:59 AM
2010-11-18 8:04 AM
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Subject: RE: Beginner 1/2 Ironman Plan Group
Back in the pool today for the first time in a couple weeks.  Felt good.  Need to work on technique and bilateral breathing.
2010-11-18 1:01 PM
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Subject: RE: Beginner 1/2 Ironman Plan Group
JG_GreenCoast - 2010-11-17 6:35 PM I'm three days in to the 20-week HIM program right now.  It's going pretty well so far, but my swimming has been an unmitigated disaster.  Take a look:

S:

3650.00 Yd
1h 54m
  
B: 
16.00 Mi
1h 00m

R: 
6.95 Mi
1h 06m

I went to my membership office at the gym and signed up for a package of 8,  30 minute private swim lessons.  I am REALLY hoping this helps.  Otherwise the plan has been nice.  Looking forward for sure to keep on going.  The long swims are just really brutal.
 


Super excited that you are doing swim lessons!!
2010-11-18 4:26 PM
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Subject: RE: Beginner 1/2 Ironman Plan Group
I rolled off 40 miles on the bike this morning... previous long was 32.  Hope my legs recover in time for my long run Saturday...


2010-11-18 4:44 PM
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Subject: RE: Beginner 1/2 Ironman Plan Group
pistuo - 2010-11-18 4:26 PM I rolled off 40 miles on the bike this morning... previous long was 32.  Hope my legs recover in time for my long run Saturday...


You'll be fine.
2010-11-18 7:27 PM
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Subject: RE: Beginner 1/2 Ironman Plan Group

I find the key thing to keep me motivated with swim training is celebrating even the smallest victories.  I swim about a 2:30/100yds pace but I haven't built up the stamina to continually swim at that pace yet.  In fact, I can only do 50yd sets at that pace and then I have to take a breather.  I include my breaks in with my overall minutes/100yards pace at the end of my workout to keep track of my progress.  i.e. I swam a 5m/100yards pace on Monday but last night I swam a 4:53m/100yards pace.  I got so excited just to see SOME improvement because it was showing I was spending less time between my 50 yard sets.  Another is with my run times.  Even if I beat my last run time by 10secs I will cheer as I turn on to my street.  My girlfriend even knows if I did well on my run before I enter the house because she can usually hear me cheering outside (between gasping breaths).  Overall, it just makes it more fun for me to celebrate even the small victories while training.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
This is pretty much how I am finding myself.  I am doing 100yd sets, however.  My time with rest in it is about 3m/100.  This is with probably 8-10 minutes of rest for catching my breath in any given hour, so once I can learn how to breathe, I should get better. Just had a great 55m 6.5mi run today.  Really hoping my swim lessons help--im excited too tri!

Edited by JG_GreenCoast 2010-11-18 7:27 PM
2010-11-18 9:35 PM
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Subject: RE: Beginner 1/2 Ironman Plan Group
Also, tri, I keep getting confused as to the terminology on the HIM training plan.  First, the kick/pull swimming I don't really understand and just did freestyle the whole time.  Second, what is 15 minutes warm up warm down?  What is descending in swimming?  What are the advantages to backstroking? I can't seem to do it at all, just really, really slowly and in a very tiring way
2010-11-18 10:05 PM
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Subject: RE: Beginner 1/2 Ironman Plan Group
JG- If you're getting swim lessons, I would think the teacher should be able to give you a set of warm up drills.  Keep putting in the work.  A lot of people seem to be able to make long strides in swim distance once they get the breathing down and fitness up.
2010-11-18 10:56 PM
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Subject: RE: Beginner 1/2 Ironman Plan Group
Mellissa - 2010-11-17 5:15 PM Phew....thanks for getting me back on track! Felt much better in my workout today Kiss


Yay!  I have to say I REALLY enjoyed having a rest day today.  Soooo nice to be sweat free and lazy. 


2010-11-18 11:01 PM
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Subject: RE: Beginner 1/2 Ironman Plan Group
Joining!Race is 10/23/11.
2010-11-18 11:08 PM
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Subject: RE: Beginner 1/2 Ironman Plan Group
pistuo - 2010-11-18 10:05 PM JG- If you're getting swim lessons, I would think the teacher should be able to give you a set of warm up drills.  Keep putting in the work.  A lot of people seem to be able to make long strides in swim distance once they get the breathing down and fitness up.


My stroke also sucks, I'm pretty sure.  There's a ten day wait between when you sign up and pay and when you can start lessons for some odd reason.  Will continue to put in the work in the coming ten days and hopefully can get just a little feedback to make some big changes.  I'm ready and willing to put in time developing, but am hoping there's something critically wrong I can change right away...hah!
 
2010-11-18 11:10 PM
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Subject: RE: Beginner 1/2 Ironman Plan Group
ijen0311 - 2010-11-18 11:01 PM Joining!Race is 10/23/11.


Nice, welcome.  I wish I had that long to train! I registered, for my first race ever, with less than 6 months to the time.  Gonna be a grind, but don't know if i'd have done it if i did any other way! 
2010-11-19 12:09 AM
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Subject: RE: Beginner 1/2 Ironman Plan Group
JG_GreenCoast - 2010-11-18 9:35 PM Also, tri, I keep getting confused as to the terminology on the HIM training plan.  First, the kick/pull swimming I don't really understand and just did freestyle the whole time.  Second, what is 15 minutes warm up warm down?  What is descending in swimming?  What are the advantages to backstroking? I can't seem to do it at all, just really, really slowly and in a very tiring way


I have the WORST backstroke, LMAO...it is hilarious...I kind of zig zag all over the place...but its good to know I can float around on my back if I need to.
2010-11-19 8:57 AM
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Subject: RE: Beginner 1/2 Ironman Plan Group
SOOO glad to know I am not the only slow swimmer in the bunch! I found a small master's class with a really good coach a couple of months ago, and she has made huge improvements in my technique. I am already at least 10% faster. I aspire to be middle of the pack some day!

I also zig-zag when I backstroke. Crash into the L lane divider, then the right; repeat! For now, I am doing something my coach taught me: swim 6 strokes FS, then flip over and do 6 BS; repeat. This way I don't have time to do much crashing, and it seems to help me 'get' body position on my back.  


2010-11-19 9:00 AM
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Subject: RE: Beginner 1/2 Ironman Plan Group
Mellissa - 2010-11-19 12:09 AM
JG_GreenCoast - 2010-11-18 9:35 PM Also, tri, I keep getting confused as to the terminology on the HIM training plan.  First, the kick/pull swimming I don't really understand and just did freestyle the whole time.  Second, what is 15 minutes warm up warm down?  What is descending in swimming?  What are the advantages to backstroking? I can't seem to do it at all, just really, really slowly and in a very tiring way


I have the WORST backstroke, LMAO...it is hilarious...I kind of zig zag all over the place...but its good to know I can float around on my back if I need to.


Sounds just like mine...except mine takes a lot of energy out.  Donno if you have that too. 
2010-11-19 10:20 AM
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Subject: RE: Beginner 1/2 Ironman Plan Group
Mellissa - 2010-11-18 10:09 PM
JG_GreenCoast - 2010-11-18 9:35 PM Also, tri, I keep getting confused as to the terminology on the HIM training plan.  First, the kick/pull swimming I don't really understand and just did freestyle the whole time.  Second, what is 15 minutes warm up warm down?  What is descending in swimming?  What are the advantages to backstroking? I can't seem to do it at all, just really, really slowly and in a very tiring way


I have the WORST backstroke, LMAO...it is hilarious...I kind of zig zag all over the place...but its good to know I can float around on my back if I need to.


Doesn't everyone zig zag? Our masters coach always puts my husband and I in the same lane because we are just about the 2 slowest swimmers at practice. My husband is a famous backstroke zig zager so it's good practice because I feel like I'm in the middle of the swim leg of a tri trying to dodge him!
2010-11-19 11:14 AM
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Subject: RE: Beginner 1/2 Ironman Plan Group

Maybe while you're waiting, you could try to make some friends at the pool and get tips, input from them.  I did that and found many people willing to help me out...

Some basic advice that I learned this year:
1. Start learning breathing on both sides.  This is beneficial for lots of reasons.
2. High elbows.  Point elbows at the ceiling.
3. When you extend your arm forward, aim your arm pit down.

2010-11-19 11:25 AM
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Subject: RE: Beginner 1/2 Ironman Plan Group
JG_GreenCoast - 2010-11-18 9:35 PM Also, tri, I keep getting confused as to the terminology on the HIM training plan.  First, the kick/pull swimming I don't really understand and just did freestyle the whole time.  Second, what is 15 minutes warm up warm down?  What is descending in swimming?  What are the advantages to backstroking? I can't seem to do it at all, just really, really slowly and in a very tiring way


Kick/pull means doing a kick set (with a kickboard) and a pull set (with a pull buoy).
Descending means each set is faster than the last. So if you have 4x50 descending, you would do each 50 at a faster pace.
Backstroke is great for flexibility, rotation, and is just different and fun! Using different strokes can help you get more comfortable in the water, too. If you absolutely hate it, skip it.
You can warm up on deck or just with some slow, easy 25s or 50s. A dynamic warm up on deck might be 5 minutes of moves like arm swings, a few squats,, jumping jacks, etc. Just to get your brain and body ready for the work ahead. 15 minutes seems a bit excessive, unless it's included in the swim time.
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