GrooveTime!group - CLOSED!!! (Page 233)

Tracey,

Toll House pie is sortof a chocolate chip cookie pie - when it's warm it's gooey and is great with ice cream.  Usually have to make it yourself rather than buy it - but it's pretty simple.

Denise

Lisa,

What the heck is "lick"

Denise

I have grave concerns for the old man (Favre) in the Vikes-Saints game tonight.  He's grown on me.
I don't think he could help all that waffling about whether to play or not to play - that's just the way he is.

Denise

Denise,

I Googled it as soon as I saw the name! It's totally my kind of dessert: a giant, warm, gooey chocolate chip cookie inside a pie crust. Mmmm....

I might have to make it for the next family gathering.

Aren't you the perceptive one.     I'm sure I will get into it come Saturday.   Even more exciting than the running program is thinking about Placid.   Here we are not even running yet, and we've picked out the training plan AND the start date.   Talk about doing things backwards.  

Excited about getting my new Newton's too!   Stopping at Running Free tomorrow morning on the way to Barrie.   Hope they have my size.  

STEVE -

Sure, I'd support that as a "bridge" of sorts to increase time on the feet. For Half Vermont, a bit more of that than I wanted was walking!

When walking, i try to do it briskly and at a high cadence -- not like speed-walking, but definitely different than my down-the-sidewalk gait. I have never incorporated walks into my training, but I think we both know that many people support it. So, if it works to extend your mileage and time spent being vertical AND mobile, then do it!

As for the Malibu emphasis being more on speed, well, that makes 187% sense to me. Once Sunday rolls around, you still have lot soof time to build up your pre-Silver mileage. I think you'll be surprised how quickly that comes back to you.

Mu current plan has me olying on both the 18th and 25th, and then having five weeks before the half-iron I am considering -- Washington Half (NC) on October 30. That seems very expansive to me, five weeks of specific HIM training, so in your case, with eight weeks, it sounds immense. I really think you'll get oin the LSD groove quite quickly.

What is your plan on registering for IMAZ? Are you going to do the volunteer thing.....or show up there the day after and join the lines.....or sit at home with an itchy (and hopefully fast!) trigger finger?

I see that Muncie Endurathon has now joined the ever-expanding 70.3 universe. Jeezum. Who's next??

ANNE -

Been bit big by the bug, I see! You know, I have a very clear recollection from August 29, about 3pm, of Ken leaning over to you, putting his left hand on his right shoulder, and saying to you "I can't imagine running 21km after a 90km ride!" How quickly things change!

The timeline is not unreasonable, with about 22.5 months until IMLP '12. That's a lotta weeks, a lotta days, and as long as you can get some steady running going, you're there. You two could do the IMLP bike course, the whole 112 miles, right now. You two could probably do the 2.4-mile swim, right now. (Have you heard about the cables at the IMLP swim, which make it a fair bit easier than just swimming 2.4 miles in the middle of nowhere?)

So, that leaves running and nutrition to work out, and also just getting comfortable at the longer distances. And so my big advice would be to fit in a couple....or three....or...........half irons into the plan. It's maybe not essential, and with each passing year there are more and more and more people who either do an iron early in their "career" -- and even sometimes as the first triathlon of their career! (MY A.R.T. person hads a client who did IMLP this year as his first TRIATHLON, and finished in 12:12. Mind you, he's 27 or so, but still -- that's a very decent time for an iron, let alone iron-as-first-triathlon!)

In my case, I paid the dues. IMLP was my 27th triathlon, and had been preceded by nine half-irons, plus four half-marathons and five full marathons. Did this all help at IMLP? Almost certainly it did, but not in terms of allowing me to have a earth-shatteringly scintillating result. I think what I came out of it realizing is that on any given day at that distance, anything can happen -- that, and the bigger fact that going from 70.3 miles to 140.6 miles is NOT AT ALL as simple as "double the distance".

Having said that, though, i advocate strongly cutting on's teeth at as much long stuff as possible before the iron itself. And this doesn't have to be in an actual race setting - it could be you and Ken swimming a mile, then cycling 50, then running 12. Or, heck, do the whole half-iron, just informal and "off the record".

Knowing what it feels like to suffer as the hours wear on is very useful, a wellspring that you can draw upon so you know "I've been there, I've felt thsi before, i made it through it then and I can do so now." That certainly helped me at Half VT, as the wheels came off (well, it was more of a "wobbling", I think) my run earlier and more dramatically than I had anticipated. But I had the strategies born of experience to help me through that, and they included both mental and physcial adjustments. My first tough half-iron was my 5th one, and looking back I was quite ill-prepared at how to deal with it. My next tough HIM was the 7th, about 10 months alter, and I dealt with that a bit better than that wicked #5 ---- so the added experience helped!

But I ramble and I digress. Plan next year to include Musselman, and then maybe something further along -- maybe even Half Vermont......or Muskoka 70.3.....or Syracuse 70.3...or any of a passel of other fall half-irons. I know you are planning to volunteer at IMLP anyhow, so by then Musselman (or Peterborough, if you wanted to keep it more local) will have passed and you will have an idea what that feels like and whether you really want to do IMLP '12. (And even if you choose P'boro over Mussel as a July half, there is still Mini-Mussel, the sprint, which is a blast.)

I'm going to post this now and look it over later; I have no true idea what all I have said! Let me know if there are any kernels of usefulness in it, okay?

-----------------------------THIS SATURDAY AT THE RACES!!!!------------------------------------

SteveA gets top billing here, as even with time-zone differences, in the cosmic scheme of things he starts 15 minutes before Anne, who gets a lovely sleep-in opportunity before she begins!


STEVE - Nautica Malibu Triathlon

Herbalife International Distance (1500m - 40km - 10km)
Zuma Beach, Malibu, CA
7am start


ANNE - Wasaga Beach Triathlon

Olympic Distance Swim-Bike (1500m - 40km)
Wasaga Baech, ON
10:15am start!!!!!!!!!

STEVE,

Thanks for the long post with your thoughts on IMLP.    Have printed it off and gave it a quick read and Ken and I will reveiw again later today.  But it looks like sort of what we were thinking.   I will let you know what we have put on paper, for our tentative plans.   The wild card here, of course, is the running.    Everything will depend on on that goes over the next 8 weeks.   Hopefully, the knee thing is a thing of the past.  

Good thing I signed up for a 'program' because leave me to my own devices and I get carried away.   Was NOT a good idea to do two 6.5 km power walks this week after not running OR walking for 6 months.   Who would think that would have such an effect on the muscles and tendons after biking so much this summer.   My chiro says 'big time', and suggested it would not be a good idea to do the 1/2 marathon race walk on the 26th.   Too much, too soon.  

Heading out shortly to try on some Newtons!     

Not expecting much with Wasaga; just a nice finish to the season.   I don't want to jeaporadize my return to running.  

Back late Saturday night.  Hope you have a great weekend.   

Best of luck to STEVE A and ANNE tomorrow morning!  Good luck and have fun!!

LISA

Ha ... "lick" is what the old fisherman that we fished with called breakfast!!  They would get up so they could be on the lake by sunrise, catch their limit of sunnies, then race back to the docks to go "in to town" for "lick".  I assume it''s because they "licked" their plates cleaned!  Leaving work around 4 pm to catch my 5:55 flight to Fargo.  Spending the night in Fargo (since my flight doesn't get in until 11 pm), then getting up EARLY to head to Pequot.  I am so ready to get back up there again ... can't wait!! 

Now, where did you get that Tollhouse Pie??

LISA

DENISE, I am going to send you an e-mail (if the one on your profile is correct) so that I have it on my phone along with my phone number. 

LISA

Thanks Steve.  As I was waiting for the browser to load to read your reply, my ego chimed in with:  "Self - it's just running.  It's called a "ramp" so stop trying to make it complicated, and just "ramp"!"  LOL.  I think you are right - I suspect the first few runs over 8 miles will be tougher than I'd like, but the body will adjust again.  Just need to push through and know that 2-3 weeks later, the mileage will be more manageable.  I have the Long Beach Half Marathon in 10/17, so that will be a good gauge for me. 

As for IMAZ, yes, I'm volunteering for sure.  I'll be doing the finish line catching.  No way I want to risk missing out on registration.  I'm really looking forward to going out there, seeing the course, feeling the energy and getting psyched again for next season!

STEVE -

Oh, yeah, now I remember -- or do I? What I think I remember -- what I'd like to BELIEVE I remember correctly -- is that you have the late "catcher" shift of the day. You should see a dynamic range of emotions over the final few hours, but maybe it's not all thta more varied than any other time.

I think it was at Louisville that I saw a guy who finished in the final minute of "officialdom". Like, maybe, 16:59:27? I'll have to go back now and see if I remember THAT correctly, too. (Good grief! Is there no end to "quality-control" checks on my memory?? )

STEVE again -

Sigh. Quality control of my memory uncovered a Systems Failure. The last M60-64 at LOO was in 16:01. i then checked SG, and maybe that was what I was thinking about -- the last M60-64 there was 16:57:36. Right church, wrong pew?

Here's something for you to mull over:

SG had 27 M60-64 finishers, with Kona spots going to #2 and #7. Two spots for 27 finishers.
LP had 34 M60-64 finsihers, with only one Kona spot, grabbed by the guy who finished 1st -- by only ELEVEN seconds!
That doesn't sound quite fair to me......but what do I know?

And the guy who finished 2nd then went out and did Timberman......and missed a podium spot by four seconds! It doesn't get much suckier than those two happenings! (I paid attention to that because I have met him -- he won the M55-59 international at Mooseman '07, where I finished 3rd. He is a phemomenal swimmer.)

Good luck to the racers tomorrow!

ANNE -

Are you saying eight weeks because that's the length of the running program? And, any luck with shoes today??

Had you flaoted the idea of two power wlaks this week after etc etc, I would've gently suggested that you reconsider. Hopefully, all you did was wake up a few things and catch them grumpy --- something they'll get over soon enough!

As for what your chiro said, I'll see his comment and raise it by a power of seven!!!!!!!

I never assume that thre muscles get activated doing one discipline will have positive benefits to another discipline. Of course, "cross-training" is all about that, isn't it, but actually, my take on it is that one can cross-train and NOT run the risk of hurting themselves in other axtivities, just because the muscle groups are so differently employed and engaged. I may be all wrong on that.....but that's my story and I'm sticking to it!

Your timeline here is long, Anne. You effectively have eight or nine months to work your way back into safe and productive running, which would bring you to around Milton and Woodstock time, and then another four or five weeks until Peterborough or Musselman, if that's the route you want to take......and then 49-51 weeks until IMLP is that's also a route you want to take.

So, no need to rush things at all.......right???

And when are you heading to Wasaga? With that sweet 10:15 start, i'm guessing you'll laze around home until about 6:30 before ambling up there. La-di-da!

Yeah, the running program is an learn to run 5-km program in 8 weeks.   I'm not feeling too bad right now.   Laid the Traumeel on and was taking some homeopathic drops (Phonix C-15).   I thought I might have aggravated the sciatica, which looks like maybe that was it, because I find it hard to believe the pain I had would suddenly disappear. 

Spent quite some time at the Running Free store in Milton - LOTS of stock; not just runners but lots of triathlon gear.   Got myself a neoprene hood which I have wanted for a long time.   My head gets pretty cold when we start swimming in May.   They didn't have a great lot in my size and didn't have the Gravity in a 7 which I tried on in Placid (that felt really good); I ended up taking a pair of Distancia in size 7 but have already changed my mind and going to buy a 6.5 size at the Markham store.   They are holding them for me.  Also, believe it or not, the lugs on the left and right shoe are slightly off, and with my left foot the shorter one, I can really feel it.   The store will only give us a 2 week trial but they did agree that we could run outdoors with them as long as we don't run through mud puddles. 

I think we have a pretty good time-line for IMLP too.   I have picked out the Level 2 Ironman Plan from the Fitzgerald book, but may well do Level 3 for the bike.   It looks quite doable in terms of beginning and ending volumes as well as intensity. 

We are already thinking about Milton and Woodstock and would do the Musselman next year, but probably Peterborough, 4 weeks before Placid.   We are also going to do the 160km Centurion cycle next September in Blue Mountain.   Not sure if you checked out the link I sent, but it has 6,000+ feet of climbing.   Assuming all goes well on the running front, we will sign up for the 1/2 marathon/marathon running program and find something for next fall.

It's my birthday today so we came up to Barrie this afternoon and are spending the night in a nice 2 room suite with fireplace, 2 TVs, king size bed, etc. etc. and then heading to Wasaga (45 min drive from here) in the morning.   I am SO spoiled.        I'm grateful for the late start - should warm up a bit by then.  

Talk to you tomorrow.  

SteveB,

Hey - the #7 guy who got the Kona spot is a Minnesota guy.  He had an achilles problem and he ran it anyway and it was his slowest time.  He took the Kona spot because his son had qualified at SG also so they could do Kona together.  They were both registered for IM Wisconsin but the dad was going to cancel Wisconsin but the son was going to do both.  Dad's name is Ben Ewers.
Last year he won the M60-64 Minnesota Tri Series and I won the F60-64 in that series -  this is really funny since we are so not in the same league - haha.

Denise

DENISE -

Good for him! When I saw his name there yesterday it jumped out at me because I remembered it from the USAT rankings last year. I thought he had finished really high, and just now checked, and YES! -- he was 6th! He's up there with the real heavy-hitters, and he is the highest-ranking 63 year-old. (And now 64.) If he can stay healthy and not mangle that achilles, he has a chsance to be the top 65-69 next year.

Some people ride high in the USAT rankings on the basis of doing just obscure races that are really short. But I guess if he is attempting things like IMSG, he's not taking the easy route to rankings success. I'll have to figure out what races he did both last year and this year, just to see what he is up to. I'm not sure he's listed yet for this year, but once again the rankings are very slow to evolve. It's also possible that after SG he just needed to rest it for a while.....and I guess that has included bailing on Wisconsin. Smart move, with Kona just a month away!

Are you and Lisa meeting up this weekend? I hope so!

ANNE --

BELATED HAPPY BIRTHDAY!!!!!!

That's two in a row I've missed -- Shaun and you. (And four including Mindy and Lisa from the other group.) My bad! My VERY bad!!

Anyhow, it sounds like you had a great day as part of a fine weekend.......although arriving home a little while ago I expected some summary of the race. Well, I guess you are enjoying a nine-course feast, or watching one of the four TVs in your suite of luxury-appointed rooms, and you wil respond in due course. As for me, I guess I'm off to Sportstats* to try and ferret out the pertinent details.

More thoughts of your last night's post, later.



*Oops. No Sportstats for John Salt's races!



Edited by stevebradley 2010-09-11 4:51 PM

DENISE again -

And belated to you, my heartfelt condolences about the Vikes. Onwards to Week Two!

Here you go.  

Tougher bike course than I expected, but easier than Orillia.  Usual winds SE15ish km/hr.   Some good athletes/competition at this event!   Despite my time, I actually had a good swim but got off course NUMEROUS times.   Goggles fogged the entire time and had to stop several times to de-fog.   Coming back into the sun couldn't see anything either.   Going to have to work on this for next year.   First time with this type of swim with shallow water and having quite a long run in the water to timing mat, then to transition.   Water was 67*.   Bought a neoprene hood which served me well.   Comments from several people wishing they had it.   Did a 15' pre-swim w/u and it took me 5+ minutes to numb my face.   By noon the air was feeling warm, but by 2:00-3:00 cooling quickly with some clouds coming in. 

Briefly for now:   28km/hr bike - 2.20/100meter swim (pure swim time)  Clicked watch at sandbar when could no longer swim - water at ankles and had to run/walk the rest of the way. 

Aqua/Bike:

14/20 overall
11/20 Bike
20/23 Swim
10/23 T1

1st place 55-59 beat me by 22" but I beat her on the bike by 2 minutes.

When finding my 'place' amongst the full triathlon group for the swim and the bike:

240/309 on the bike
277/309 on the swim
6/11 on the bike with F 55-59
11/11 on the swim with F 55-59 - based on actual chip time with water running, running to T1, etc.  Ooh that was BAD!  

Race was OK considering I was going to bail on it.     

ANNE -

THE BIKE RULES!!!! You should've offered to trade jerseys with on eof the women at HVJ who were part of Team Cyclonauts --- that is very appropriate for you!

Just really fine bike results any which way you view it - aqbk overall, W55-59, everybody, and especially the 2' gap over the 1st place 55-59. That ought to do a lot to reaffirm all of yout commitment to the bike this season. Huge stuff, Anne!

As for the swim, well, mama said there'd be days like this! Sunblindness, foggles, drifting, long runs, cold water......the only thing you were missing was sturgeon attacks! Has he ever had a completely copacetic swim at Wasaga? It seems like every year there is something that makes it far less than desirable.

I did a temp check in the shallows of the Rideau near Hog's Back on Thirsday, and it was 69/70. Today in the St.L. it seemed warmer. Nevertheless, i am not at all surprised that the temp at Wasaga was 67. Maybe he ought to switch Cobourg and Wasaga. I doubt Cobourg was much below 70 today, and Wasaga a couple of weeks ago was probably above 70. Oh well.

So......Is that it for this season, then? Not tempted to sidle down to Lakeside next weekend? You know that the t-zone is very close to both the water and bike mount, yes?


And you know, the "pure" swim time is not too bad, especially given sunblindness and fogged lenses. I guess that's why you say you had a good swim, eh?

Yes, that's why and knowing the extra distance I swam compared to others.    Of course, they could have swam off course too but I don't think most of my age group did.   When I stood at the last sand bar, I walked quite slowly in the water because it was bumpy and there were drop offs, still cautious of my knee; I spent that time taking of the gear and getting the wet suit down to hips.  All this added significantly to my 'swim' time.   Had I been 'racing' I would have run like the others, and also run up from the 1st timing mat to the T1 timing mat.   My 'run up' time was about 20" slower than everyone else's because I walked fast.   I took my time in T1, again because I knew I wasn't racing, and put on my arm warmers which stuck like the dickens trying to get them on and took some time to tidy my transition area - still not a bad T1 with all that at 2.50.  

I was bad and didn't listen to the pre-race talk and missed stuff about the swim and the bike course (totally changed); they apparently said we could swim on either side of the orange bouys coming in and I didn't know that - saw they were WAY to the right of me so changed course and started to swim for them for some time until I noticed no one was swimming on the right of them so changed course again and headed left back where I was going the first time.   Lost sight of the green turn buoy on the way out - all our swim caps were green -  John apologized for that and said that wouldn't happen again.  

I just felt really good on the swim - cadence was consistent at .98 on the TT and a good finish and breathing was good and when I could see for the few minutes I had clear goggles after de-fogging sighting was good.   I was afraid to follow anyone because people were spread out over a VERY wide distance.   

More on the race and the bike later.   Going to watch the ITU Budapest women race now.   Gomez took 1st place overall yesterday -   and came in 2nd to Brownlee by 4" in yesterday's race.    Cheering for Findlay, of course.