Election 2016 (Page 26)

Originally posted by Rogillio Much of what he said is taken out of context. Hillary has a commercial that has audio of Trump saying "She is a fat pig" against a backdrop of a young girl. Totally and intentionally misleading. More recently the news was all about Trump calling PTSD suffers weak. What he said: "When you talk about the mental health problems, when people come back from war and combat, and they see things that maybe a lot of the folks in this room have seen many times over – and you're strong and you can handle it – but a lot of people can't handle it,” Trump said Monday. Soon after, BuzzFeed ran a headline that said: “Trump Suggests That Soldiers With PTSD Aren’t ‘Strong.’” If people can't see this was taken out of context and twisted they are willfully ignorant. He did not say they were not strong, he said the can't handle it. That is, by definition, 100 correct. The Marine staff sergeant who originally asked Trump the question about PTSD: “I think it’s sickening that anyone would twist Mr. Trump’s comments to me in order to pursue a political agenda,” Chad Robichaux, founder of Mighty Oaks Warrior Programs in California, said in the statement. “I took his comments to be thoughtful and understanding of the struggles many veterans have, and I believe he is committed to helping them.”

Originally posted by tuwood

The problem with the "quotes game" is that Kaine discredited himself by taking most of them "just a little bit further" then what was said.  For example the "all Mexicans are rapists and murderers" line is an out of context smear that's been used for months and completely untrue. 

Even in this video they don't do a very good job of defending the exaggerations on several. 

First accusation "Donald Trump and Mike Pence has said he (Putin) is a great leader".  Then play quotes of Trump and Pence saying Putin has been a strong leader for his country.  There's no denying Putin has been a strong leader for his country, but that's a far cry from saying he's a great leader.

"Donald Trump said he is going to have a deportation force and they want to go house to house, school to school, business to business..." then show a short clip of him saying we'll have a deportation force.  (btw, we already have a deportation force it's called ICE and the Border Patrol).

You get the idea.

Originally posted by ChineseDemocracy Governor Tony, try and successfully walk back Trump's desire to have a nuclear Japan and a nuclear Saudi Arabia. (I can see you smiling, shaking your head saying, "That's nonsense.") Governor Tony, enlighten us on how Donald Trump "knows more about ISIS than our generals." This is good practice for you when in 2020 you are tapped for a VP run by Paul Ryan.

Originally posted by tuwood

Looks like Hillary's back on vacation (er sick) for the next month.

https://hillaryspeeches.com/scheduled-events/

 

Originally posted by tuwood

I think this is a bit of where old political methods intersecting with new political realities. For as long as I've been alive politicians make woeful out of context statements to cast their opponent in the worst light possible.  Then the other side is forced to defend the accusation and spend tens of millions of dollars to get the counter point out.

However, in todays instant media culture where nobody watches TV commercials anymore it's totally different.  Take veteran statement out of context and pounce an attack.  Undecided voter does google for original quote and watches video stream to see what really was said.  Person making attack looks like more of an idiot than the person being attacked.  rinse and repeat. 

Obama did a masterful job in 2008 and 2012 of seeing the power of social media.  He still used traditional methods as well, but McCain and Romney exclusively used traditional political methods and got beat soundly in the information game.
Now we have Clinton who is doing a very traditional campaign with big TV ad buys and the likes up against Trump who is a master manipulator of both social and news media.  I haven't checked lately, but up until recently he hasn't spent a dime on radio/tv ads in comparison to Hillary spending hundreds of millions.  What has it gotten her?  A virtual tied race against what her supporters believe is the most ill-qualified opponent in the history of Presidential elections.

There are several other parallels to her and Romney.
47% of American's don't pay no income tax - (Romney in closed door donor meeting)
50% of trump supporters are deplorable, irredeemable and un-American -  (Hillary in closed door donor meeting)
Romney put the campaign into the garage leading into October because he was certain of victory.
I don't think Hillary's even gotten her campaign out of the garage at all yet and has nothing scheduled other than fundraisers for October.

Originally posted by Rogillio




She is going back into her bat cave to memorize responses to questions for the next debate.

Originally posted by ChineseDemocracy That's a good one Rogillio. She'll "memorize responses to questions..." that she (nor Trump) have ever heard before. Yet, in typical Donald Trump fashion, he'll end up criticizing the debate moderator to make it look like he was unfairly treated...kinda like when he claimed Lester Holt's a Democrat...when, in actuality, Holt's a Republican.

Originally posted by spudone

I have no doubt there was a laundry list of requirements for the debates that Clinton and Trump each had to agree to before they'd even show up.  And I'm betting the choice of moderator was one of them.

Originally posted by spudone

I have no doubt there was a laundry list of requirements for the debates that Clinton and Trump each had to agree to before they'd even show up.  And I'm betting the choice of moderator was one of them.

Originally posted by spudone

Instead of offering counterpoints, to which you will just say "laughable, nyah!!"   Let me pretend I'm an advisor to Trump on his campaign.

I would tell him the following:

- Your core strength is working class whites and therefore you MUST win the states where they are a force (e.g. Pennsylvania).  Follow them closely and make whatever adjustments are necessary to hold there.

- Your high risk point is Florida.  It has a lot of electoral votes, but it also has a lot of latinos, with whom you've been careless.  And the white population is skewed towards the old / retired / wealthy*.  Therefore, tread carefully and don't let the dems trap you on things like Medicare.

- Your ground game needs more organization.  Your core constituents do not make up a pure majority, anywhere**.  Therefore you MUST get people registered and MUST get them to the polls.  Additionally, some focus on encouraging military absentee voters to get their ballots sent in would be helpful.

- Hillary, on the other hand, has a lot of firepower on the ground.  Mainly because she was forced to develop it during the close contest in primaries with Obama, and also because Obama's door-to-door stuff was super strong and much of that has now rolled into the DNC.  This is something you want to emulate.

 

Of course he probably has lots of smart people telling him those things.  How much of it will sink in, who knows?

edit:

* old people may not do much, but there are two things they do a lot of: voting and watching TV.

** ok maybe West Virginia

Originally posted by Rogillio My suggestion to Trump would be to start making commercials.....3 dozen short positive commercial and just flood the networks.....red, white, blue, patriotic, America first, America strong, images of WWII V day, Apollo moon landing, Ronald Regan, baseball, apple pie, fireworks, civil rights marches, small town parades, etc. All that feels-good-to-be-an-American stuff. Push the Make American Great Again theme....it works!

Originally posted by tuwood

Similar to Pence last night he should just completely ignore any negative comments or quotes and immediately pivot to his plan and how it's different than Clintons.  The moderators and Clinton will go nuts, but just keep doing it over and over.  Basically he can't win defending and quite honestly he has sever indefensible comments so why even try.  :-D 

Originally posted by Rogillio



Totally agree. Bob and weave. Stick and move. Smile and answer a question that was not asked.

Most politicians learn this over time.....never directly answer a question. Hillary is great at it. "Was it a mistake to use a private email server." "First off, let me just say......BobLobla....." It was a simple yes or no question but she dodged it.

Originally posted by Rogillio Much of what he said is taken out of context. Hillary has a commercial that has audio of Trump saying "She is a fat pig" against a backdrop of a young girl. Totally and intentionally misleading. More recently the news was all about Trump calling PTSD suffers weak. What he said: "When you talk about the mental health problems, when people come back from war and combat, and they see things that maybe a lot of the folks in this room have seen many times over – and you're strong and you can handle it – but a lot of people can't handle it,” Trump said Monday. Soon after, BuzzFeed ran a headline that said: “Trump Suggests That Soldiers With PTSD Aren’t ‘Strong.’” If people can't see this was taken out of context and twisted they are willfully ignorant. He did not say they were not strong, he said the can't handle it. That is, by definition, 100 correct. The Marine staff sergeant who originally asked Trump the question about PTSD: “I think it’s sickening that anyone would twist Mr. Trump’s comments to me in order to pursue a political agenda,” Chad Robichaux, founder of Mighty Oaks Warrior Programs in California, said in the statement. “I took his comments to be thoughtful and understanding of the struggles many veterans have, and I believe he is committed to helping them.”

Originally posted by Left Brain

Look, I'm going to vote for Trump because there is no way in hell I'm voting for Hillary.  But please, don't insult me by pretending That trump hasn't said some of the most outlandish, stupid, and blatantly false statements ever made by a Presidential candidate.  I remember when he said that the Ferguson protests and the crime we had here was from Mexican street gangs.  Well......he's a complete forking idiot on that one (and many others). 

Is he sometimes misquoted?  Are his statements sometimes taken out of context?  Is he sometimes ignorant as hell and barely able to make sense?  Does he occasionally act like a 2 year old? Does he sometimes make statements that make him look like a bigot or dumb as a bag of hammers?  The answer to ALL of those questions is yes.

Like I said before....at this point it hardly matters since his supporters are so sick and tired of the standard political elite feeding us the same tired horsechit.....but that doesn't mean I'm running off into never never land with Trump. He says or does something stupid almost daily.

Originally posted by Left Brain

Look, I'm going to vote for Trump because there is no way in hell I'm voting for Hillary.  But please, don't insult me by pretending That trump hasn't said some of the most outlandish, stupid, and blatantly false statements ever made by a Presidential candidate.  I remember when he said that the Ferguson protests and the crime we had here was from Mexican street gangs.  Well......he's a complete forking idiot on that one (and many others). 

Is he sometimes misquoted?  Are his statements sometimes taken out of context?  Is he sometimes ignorant as hell and barely able to make sense?  Does he occasionally act like a 2 year old? Does he sometimes make statements that make him look like a bigot or dumb as a bag of hammers?  The answer to ALL of those questions is yes.

Like I said before....at this point it hardly matters since his supporters are so sick and tired of the standard political elite feeding us the same tired horsechit.....but that doesn't mean I'm running off into never never land with Trump. He says or does something stupid almost daily.

Originally posted by Rogillio You are doing the same thing the media does. I never said EVERTHNG is taken out of context. Just like Trump never said every Mexican is a rapist. Certainly he has made more than his fair share of cringe-worthy comments. But I am willing to overlook that. He has faults and flaws just as we all do. He shoots from the hip a lot and frequently shoots his own foot. But I don't care. I sick of Washington. I sick of being lied to by politician and I'm sick of being duped but 'nice guys I'd like to have a beer with' (like Bush and Obama). I am mostly sick of congress but I believe a strong leader in the WH will be able to bring the parties together. Trump has been accused of not being a true conservative. I don't care as long as he is effective at getting things done.

Originally posted by Left Brain

You just articulated what I said with regard to how he still has a shot.....and I agree.  But I'll tell you what.....my stock portfolio sits at an all time high.  I have ridden every storm for the past 30 years and it's served me well.  I didn't bail in 99, 08, or in the last couple of years when we had minor scares......I remember you bailing and likely missing  this last big run-up......BUT.....on Friday I'm out.  And if Trump is elected, I'll likely be out for a bit until things stabilize.  I'm betting on a 15-30% correction if he's elected based on his ridiculous unpredictability alone.  I think things need to be picked up, shook hard, and then thrown back down......and I'm good with that....but it's going to be ugly for a few years if we get this goofball in office.

Originally posted by spudone

In this election cycle, because of the type of voters that Trump is getting, he will also need to break with the typical Republican requirements.  He has done that already with his protectionist views.  But I think he missed a big opportunity to pick up support of the big unions.  AFL-CIO already endorsed Hillary if I recall.  If Trump had thrown them a bone early on, he could've stolen that away from the Democrats.  It would've been a big deal in manufacturing states.

Of course the traditional Republicans would've needed to change their Depends after hearing something like that.

Originally posted by Rogillio Yeah, I'm getting nervous too. I too am at an all time high.....up 8.09% YTD. Might miss an end of year rally....or might miss the '08 crash that started when it looked like Obama was going to win the election. Back to Trump's foot-in-mouth moments. He took a lot of flack for saying "a woman seeking an abortion should be punished". But back up and look at the context. He was asked a hypothetical question, "If abortion were made illegal should there be a punishment for woman seeking abortion?" A polished politician would have said, I'm not going to answer hypothetical questions. Or he could have said, "If a law is passed making abortion illegal then presumably the law would specify the punishment of breaking the law....otherwise it is just a suggestion." He simply answered 'yes' and the liberal media is still trying to used this gotcha question against him.

Originally posted by tuwood

I'm not 100% sure, but I believe the debate moderators are chosen by the "non-partisan" debate commission and the candidates don't have any direct say.  Obviously they are likely indirectly involved though.

Personally I'd like to see a blatant one sided moderator from both sides host a debate.  Sean Hannity one night and Chris Matthews on the other.   Then both candidates get the hard questions they don't want to answer as well as a belligerent moderator. 

Originally posted by tuwood

What do you guys think about Bill Clinton's Obamacare statements?

I do find it amusing at how much the Clinton's despise Obama, but have to pretend they like him in order to have any chance of winning.  Every once and a while though something like this slips out.