GrooveTime!group - CLOSED!!! (Page 268)

Anne - Glad your runs have been going well.

Steve - Glad you think you'll be running again without problems.
            Your attitude toward computer applications is like mine toward the bike - afraid to touch it.  Even now, when I practice changing a tire, I'm terrified I'm going to somehow destroy the bike.  Fortunately, my bike shop guys understand me and are trying to help me understand the bike better so I'm not so afraid of it.

Denise
           

Thanks, Denise.   And thanks for the feedback on the Runner's World.   I have input the Fitz plan into BT up to week 14 - does take a fair bit of time, but should save time in the end.   On the run day's I'm making notes in the comment section, showing what Runner's World wants me to do.  Interesting that they are almost identical.

I am a bit concerned though about the pace they have me running (although right now I know it is a good pace to start with).   I checked the entire 20 weeks and I'm still supposed to be running the majority of my runs at a 6.50ish pace even near the end of the program.   It does have me starting some speed work mid March and doing that once per month and then introducing tempo runs every other week at about 6:15 pace.   I find it hard to believe that I would be able to run a 1/2 distance mid July at my 6'/km race pace, based on this.     Any comments?   

They calculated my pacing based on me running my last 10km in a 6'/km pace.  

Looks like we have some warmer weather coming our way - I either have to get up and run before 9:00 tomorrow since the track is closing then or risk running outside.   Don't mind the cold - just reluctant to slip and slide given that I am barely getting back into some consistent running.  

How'd you enjoy your first ride on the new trainer?

I was afraid you might not think my new running plan was wise, especially when I didn't hear from you.      Have decided to keep the runs at 5/week with Saturday and Monday recovery days for the run.    That will keep me fresh for Sunday long run and Tues Power Bike. 

First ride outdoors for me last year was March 11 (13*) - had a few good days over the next couple of weeks.   We were lucky to get some outdoor riding in before we left for Florida.   Somehow, I don't have a good feeling about March weather this year.     

Was hoping you could comment on my post to Denise about the Runner's World plan and the pace they have me running.   Basically starting at week 1 with a 7.15 pace and only progressing to 6:53 by mid July.   It is a challenge to keep myelf to a 7.00 pace right now, but I am committed to do it for at least 2 months.  

How are YOUR legs feeling today?

Anne,
I forgot about those slow paces.  I went back and took a look.  I, for sure, did not run as slow as they told me too.  I can't remember how I figured out what my pace should be.  I think I just figured out what a moderate pace I should run for the short miles and then ran a little slower for the long run.  Maybe, it works if you follow their suggestions but I had no faith so I did my own thing.
Denise

KOHL CENTER - WHERE LEGENDS GO TO DIE

Wisconsin just beat #1 Ohio St (undefeated before today)

45F here today - fantastic - but it makes me a little sad.  When it gets to 45 and sunny, I can run in shorts and a tank top.  I used to love running thru town in shorts/tank with 3 feet of snow on the ground.  Everybody driving by would honk and wave and smile.
I'm not supposed to run on hard surfaces (except for races) anymore because of knee

Anne,
I tried to check the runnersworld forums to see what people had to say about the Smartcoach paces, but I couldn't get the "search" to work.
Denise

ANNE -

Ack!

I seem to have also dropped the ball (actually, never really picked it up....) about the pacing questions, so I will do it two parts, seeing as how you have two posts about on the last page.

More than anyone else I know, you are in touch with your body. That doesn't mean you still can't make mistakes, but I think your self-awareness is going to keep you from really serious trouble.

Soooooo.......If 7:15 pace seems too ponderous for you now, then I support you running at a pace that truly seems more comfortable for you. I also believe that running considerably slower than one is used to is a recipe for injury, just because it requires the mechanics to be altered to accommodate the slower pace. Speedwork can aggravate parts of me, slowwork can also aggravate parts of me. And FWIW, I have never been able to do long runs when the spec for them is "two minutes slower than race pace". Good grief!

Beyond that, going form 7:15 to 6:53 in five months is quite gradual, i would think. But I need to think about that a bit more.

ANNE again -

If I'm reading you correctly........

---One plan (Fitz) has you progressing to about a 6:50 pace, with some added sppedwork thrown in later at 6:15 pace.
---The Runners World calculation has you at a 6' pace, basewd on the pace of your last 10km.

Do I have that right?

For RW, is the 6' pace supposed to be for your next stand-alone 10km, or is it projected to what your might aim for in your next half-marathon (be it stand-alone or as past of a half-iron)?

With continued power outages that have obliterated a few posts already today, i will post this now. But one more to you will follow.

ANNE once more -

I dodn't kmnow if I said this here or elsewhere, but my peroneal tendon problem was lilley due to slipping and lsiding. I had never had that problem before despite many, many, many runs on suspect surfaces, but now that it has happened I am very hesutant to run on slippy stuff again.

That probably eliminates tomorrow for a run, a we are due for about 10-16cm between now and tomorrow afternoon. That'll make it Tuesday at the earliest for a run (I don't think I'll get out today), which'll be four days after the last one, which was the first in 16 days ---- but that's okay! I'm down with that! I can dig it!

The peroneal continues to feel great overall; Friday's run did nothing to set it back, I believe.

Let me know about those training pace questions in my last one to you. And, I'm sorry I was densely slow about responding to that!

I'm going to respond to each post separately, so I remember everything.   I do have a fairly good sense of self-awareness, and for the most part my injuries that have affected running have been from an incident - like going over on ankle jumping off bike; riding too hard and fast on my bike the 2nd year when I had NO base; silly stuff really.    Truly not really sure what caused the problems last March with my knee/leg.    That may have been one instance of me running too fast, too soon, with no running base - I'm sure it was cumulative, whatever it was.   The day before I woke up with my bad knee, I had done some pretty aggressive bike power intervals and I'm thinking maybe my seat was too low.   

Anyway, running 7.15 isn't killing me, but I was just surprised that there was so little of a change in pace over 5 months for the Runner's World program.   My chiro and the other chiro/triathlete both said to keep the pace slow for at least 6 weeks with me running 5x per week.   If I can get through 6 weeks and still be healthy, then I will feel more comfortable picking up the pace.  

Moving to next post now.  

Yes, you are correct - Runners World has my final pace for race day at 6' based on my last 10km.   If I follow the program, I am supposed to be able to run a stand alone 1/2 marathon at the 6' pace.    I know from my previous triathlons and stand alone runs that there isn't much difference between the 2.  I don't know why.   I know there is supposed to be.   I think I just try harder on the triathlons and am really warmed up and run faster.   I'm sure that will change with a half-iron.      In any event, I know I can run faster than that. 

Once I got the Runners World program, I went through the Fitz plan and that is when I noticed they are almost identical.  Fitz doesn't actually tell me to run at a particular pace.  It is based on time and his time and RW time is pretty much the same - the weekly progression matches and so does when the speed work and tempo work begin.  I thought that was pretty cool.  

STEVE,

SO, I am a happy girl.   My run went well today.   I'm either really committed to running or need to be committed!      I got up at 6:00 to be at the track before it closed at 9:00 today.    I haven't done a morning run in years.  Body wasn't quite as limber as the p.m. runs, but not bad.   

Don't know if you checked my log for the week, but literally every session went like this - 1st km - 7.29 - 2nd km - 7.11 - 3rd km - 7.00 - 4th km 6.56 or so.    I'm sure my 5th would have ben 6:45.   I was trying to run slower each km and it felt like I was slow.   

This was also the first week in forever that I fully executed a weekly run plan.    It kind of worked out well that it was a recovery week so adding the extra runs wasn't too big of an issue.   

I'm nowhere thinking I'm out of the woods yet.  Goal is to get through next week successfully.     

Glad Friday's run didn't cause any setbacks.   Didn't realize you were to be getting more snow.   Hope it isn't coming our way.   I think Ken said it was supposed to be 7 on Friday.  

Good luck on your next run. 

STEVEB,

First day on the new job..Glub...This is going to be interesting. Totally new area for me. Before I even had a desk or met my supervisor (well won't meet him until tomorrow as he is away today), I am told I am going to be working on the 2013 Fusion which means that I will spend most of 2012 in Mexico working on the launch.

So before I had a desk or a computer I knew I would be spending most of 2012 in Mexico. So it looks like there will be no training/racing for me in 2012.

As for 2011, got to the gym last Thursday and Sunday. Got through some easy bikes and tried to do some running and I feel way out of shape!!! The time trying to run for any length of time makes me realize I'm back to the couch to 10k plan. Tonight I plan on getting into the pool. Might even give yoga a try this evening. I know my felxibility has gone for a crap and it doesn't help I've gained a bunch of wait.

Wow, impressive race season Denise.

DENISE,

So what do you think of Top Chef Allstars?? The girlfriend and I watch every week. This season I really like Dale and Carla. Otheres I like this season are Antonia and Blais. What do you think of Fabio (doesn't this name fit him better than anything??)?

I couldn't stand Marcel or Stephen. I wonder how Stephen even got on the show in the first place. Mikey and Tiffani are two of my lesser liked.

Sooner or later I'm going to be all caught up!!

Shaun,

Great - a couple more "Top Chef" fans.

I'm really going to miss Fabio - but I don't think anyone thought he would stay much longer.
I pretty much agree with you as far as like/dislike the rest of them.
It's been fun - some of the earlier eliminations were a big surprise - so anything can happen.

Don't they have any races in Mexico?

Denise

ANNE -

Yeah, I can see why you are such a happy girl! Your run-work is going extremely well, in all reagrds - pace, lack of pain, consistency. I can go from one to the next of those and think each is better than the others......but it doesn't really matter what I think, does it? I guess I hear you being most thrilled about the conistency, executing an entire week's plan, and even though you saw it as a recovery week of sorts, you felt able to augment it with runs. Perfect!

And......it's also......probably good (i.e. healthy)......to be cautious for just a while longer. I kind of sense you are indeed out of the woods, but I know from my own history how long those fears can linger (like skunk on a dog.....?).

And big-time negative splitting! Mercy!!

The big snow that was supposed to hit us starting Sunday evening did absolutely nothing, so after some searching I found a road that had mostly bare shoulders. I ran further/longer than I should've, 32' and about 6.2km, but so far the foot feels okay. Well, my feet by and large DON'T feel okay, but at least for the right peroneal it is holding its own. I biked for 75' after we got home last night and I was wondering if it was going to be a problem again, but it settled down after about 25' or so. I will maybe run tomorrow. Maybe.

Your comments about tri-run pace and stand-alone pace got me thinking, and mostly for me they are quite close for sprints and olys. I'd say within a minute at most for sprints, and from within a minute to about four minutes for olys, if the oly course is fairly tough or I'm not having a terrific day. As it stands now, though, my H-M time is quite a bit removed from my HIM time. I think my last two HIM runs have been about 1:50-1:52, whereas the H-M I did in October was 1:37. I once did a 1:41 HIM run, at Eagleman '04, but that was when my run had a deep strong base to it, as I had trained for Boston throughout the winter.

I would love to think that my HIM run could approach my H-M standalones, but that won't happen unless I go very deep with HIM training, which would probably require making some HIM a very serious "A" race and devoting 5-8 solely to it. Someday, perhaps?

Congrats again on the breakthrough running, Anne!!

DENISE/ANNE -

Speaking of breakthroughs, I had one of my own -- setting my BT log to match my own paper-based log. Now that graphs accurately reflect what I do in my weeks! So, thank you, Denise, for posting those- easy-to-follow instructions, and also to you, Anne, for woulda-done-it had Denise not beaten you to it.

I guess you have both seen the very wide range of possibilities for Other Sports. Lynn thinks I should include all my snow-shoveling and lawn-mowing......but I can't bring myself to that quite yet. I guess if I could start thinking of those two as sports rather than jobs/chores/tasks/ordeals, I'd be a happier slave, eh?

SHAUN -

Don't get too agitated at the fitness you have lost, as it will come back faster than you think once you get some routines established again. Congrats, though, at just working to get back in the groove!

As for 2012 being a non-race year, that's where you invest in a bike box and fly back to the U.S. or Canada for a few chosen races. I have never flown to a race, but you know as well as I do how many thousands have done so and find it not too difficult at all. My fears are many, not the least of which is putting my bike back together again, but your mechanical cleverness would make that all a no-brainer.

If you choose a 2012 race in Ottawa, I'll pick you up at the airport!

SHAUN -

Good grief! You really are going back into the posts here -- that one you cite about cooking shows is from five months ago!!!!

I had completely forgotten about that, and still haven't seen one of the Top Chef ones; guess I'd better do that soon, eh? Actually, I haven't watched a cooking show in several months, mostly because I'm not watching much TV period. But I will look at one of the TC ones and report back to you and Denise about it!

Hey guys,
Saw these posts recently in a "Top Chef" forum.

------------------------
Well, looks like they are advertising Top chef Canada now. Looks like we get our own starting April 11

Yeah, but realistically... how many ways can you prepare maple syrup?

HEY! .. we got back bacon too.

'So, what I've done is an elevated take on poutine ... '

SteveB,

I'm a little confused here. SG M60-64 finishers 2 & 7 go to Kona but LP #1 went as well??

I thought there was some allotment to top finishers get the invite. Not that I anticipate ever going to Kona. This just makes no sense to me.

Yes I am way behind. Using some of these very old posts as motivation for this year. The more I get the better. I'm thinking that I can find enough reasons not to train that I need the motivation.

Speaking of cooking shoes, I picked up a smoker late in the fall. Busted it out superbowl weekend to make pulled pork. Of my word...Magnificent. No need for any bbq sauce. Such a nice smoke flavour. This weekend I am planning on another small pork butt (shoulder) and a slab or two of ribs. So far the opinion of the pork has been great. It seems that between that and my home made salsa I never need to learn how to make anything else!!

Thank you.     I had another good day today, for the most part.    Did 7x5' endurance intervals at 105-110% of FTP and actually had the highest w/kg of group which included 3 men, a couple who have power of 230+ comparied to be measley 115.    Decided to run right after biking (not immediately; about 45' by the time I stretched, dressed and drove to track) because I like how warmed up the legs are.  

It seems the only thing hindering me now is that left shin?tibialis?  that gets REALLY, REALLY, did I say REALLY tight.    Instead of doing 3 x 1km I tried 2 x 1.5km and it worked well.   Had the shin been fine, I could have run for much longer (but wouldn't of course, because I am sticking to plan, and being cautious).      My 2nd 1.5km was slightly faster than first with a lower HR.    So I have lots to be happy about, but really want to get this shin thing out of the way.   It is something has has plagued me off and on since I started running but have never had it attended to.   My chiro is looking at it now and I switched my 3:00 pm appt tomorrow to 7:50 so he can work on it before I run tomorrow and hopefully give me some reassurance that it is OK to run with it.    

I have finished inputting my HIM plan into BT and it is ready to load on Feb. 28th.   You won't be able to view it until then.   However, I'm going to put my weekly run mileage into a spreadsheet and get you to have a look at it and see what you think - maybe help me tweak it where necessary and give me any thoughts you have.   

I figured my HIM run pace will be a fair bit slower than a run-only race, especially being my first one.  I sort of plan on 'doing' Musselman and not 'racing' it.    It will be a learning experience so that I will be prepared to race my 2nd one.   Harry always told me that whenever you move up a distance, you should use that first one strictly as a learning experience.   Doesn't mean I won't try my best, though.    

Glad you were able to get a run in without a bunch of snow.   And SO happy that you were able to adjust your BT log to suit you.   Well done!      

SHAUN -

This many months after posting the SG/LP one, my memory is REALLY suffering a systems failure right now. But I will try to clear up the confusion.

The Kona spots operate on a rolldown basis. There were two spots available for M60-64 at St. George, and #1 didn't wnat it. It then rolled to #2, who took it; one down, one to go. It was offered to #3 and #4 and #5 and #6, and none of them wanted it -- but #7 did, so he grabbed it. No more spots!

The thing that confused me was that at Lake Placid, with its larger field, there was just one post for M60-64, and the guy who finished first took it. The othe thing that got me there was how close the #2 guy was, and that there wasn't a spot for him.

Roll-down is done the morning after. It may well be that at SG the #5 and #6 guys didn't figure it would roll to them, so they just went home. Or they did better than they thought and would've taken it, but their flight was an early a.m. one. I don't remember the race a few years ago, and I'm a bit sketchy on the a.g., but it was something like the 37th finsiher in one of the prime age groups (I'm thinking either 30-34 or 35-39) got a post just because he hung around. It makes sense that after about #15 in those bigger age groups that there is virtually no chance of spots lasting that long.......but this one guy stuck it out and was rewarded. Talk about a long-shot!

Nice story on the pulled pork, and may the pork butt and ribs be as yummilicious! Sound slike you're setting the stage for a post-Ford career -- that little rib shack of high repute, somewhere in North Carolina or Tennessee, perhaps!