GrooveTime!group - CLOSED!!! (Page 33)

Just thought I would confirm an earlier post by Steve

Bought a bike from bikesport michigan because of great price but it took 4 weeks to get when I was promised 1 week and could never get anyone to speak to me or return my call.  I hope I was the only one, but be careful 

STEVE -

Nope, you're not repeating yourself. And thanks for being the voice of reason

I have been thinking about switching to the sprint, so that's still in the back of my mind. I figure I'll train for the oly as much as I can/want to, and if it really gets to be too much, I can always do the sprint instead. I think that post was a momentary peak of anxiety that, like you said, reared its ugly head, but now I'm good with the oly. I think. Once it gets stressful and no longer fun, I'm definitely going to rethink this decision. After all, the whole reason I'm doing this is to get involved in a new sport and have fun, and just finish. I'm not really looking to race.

Also, I think the most worrying thing for the tri (regardless of distance) is the hills for both the bike and the run. The most recent workout I did was kind of depressing since it wasn't even that hilly and I was going very slowly because I was so tired. But it was technically the first one (and at altitude) so after looking over what I did in California (double the grade and length and I felt fine), I figured it was the altitude and me being tired from a whole day of traveling the day before. Also, Boulder is pretty hilly in places, so if I train properly, I should be alright.

Speaking of, when should I start incorporating hills into my workouts? Both running and biking? And how? Running up and down hills, or just making them part of a long run/bike?

Kasia

DWAYNE -

Wow, you were one of the lucky ones in your dealings with BSM. I read the posts here on BT after the fact, and I was floored; I mean, they just kept coming and coming and coming. I have been reading Tom Demerly for years through his prodigious posting on the Slowtwitch forum, where he really was viewed in almost exhalted status. (Which is maybe why so many loyal 'twitchers felt compelled to defend him.)

Four weeks is kind of unconscionable, especially not being able to talk to anyone about the status of your order, but at least your order was filled and the better part of a season wasn't wasted, as it was for so many others. I don't know where is BSM is at right now -- is it still in business, even? I don't spend too much time at all on Slowtwitch anymore, but the times I have been there, Demerly has not. I guess no surprise there, huh?

Bottom line (almost) -- Did you end up with a bike you're pleased with?

STEVE again -

I mentioned way back when that I'm on a 20-week plan, but instead it's a 16-week thing. My bad. I kind of slacked off the first two weeks of that and, while I did work out during that time, it wasn't consistent and not with the intensity that the plan calls for.

So...Should I start at week 3 since that's where I should be timeline-wise? Or should I chop a week off of 2 of the phases (the base phase is 6 weeks long, and the build and peak phases are each 5 weeks) to make it a 14-week plan? Or, lastly, mix and match workouts for now and eventually get back on plan?

So far, I've been mixing and matching, and the workouts don't change all that much during the build phase, but I'm curious what you would recommend.

BTW, I'm using a plan from "Triathlete Magazine's Essential Week-by-Week Training Guide" by Matt Fitzgerald that I found at the library. I like that it has different levels of training for each discipline and so I can do the basic run, and a slightly harder bike and swim workout. That, and I like structure.

Kasia

DENISE -

I just entered your name in the Clipless Confusion Database, and you are the 1,764,209th person to be flummoxed by that. (For the record, I'm #817,493.)

It's not really intuitive, is it? But there is a reason behind it.....and by god, it almost makes sense!

In the beginning, there were cage-type pedals that came with a toeclip and a strap. So, it's the toeclip that accounts for the "clip" designation.

Later on came what you just bought, which are more formally known as "clip-in" pedals --- but they are loosely known as "clipless" because they don't have toeclips.

I find it marginally useful to think of this in terms of copyright laws. That is, caged pedals with a strap and toeclip laid claim to the "clip" designation, and that's all she wrote. It doesn't matter that the actual structure of clip-in pedals operates with spring-loaded clips, and even make a noise that one would associate with clips. It all comes down to the toeCLIP.

And as Edith Ann (the Lily Tomlin character on "Laugh-In" used to say, "And that's the truth!"







Edited by stevebradley 2010-01-12 9:27 PM

Thank you all!! They finally posted the "preliminary" race results and it looks like I officially cut off another 1:04 off my PR from my December HM! I guess it's not hard to keep knocking off time when you start so slow to begin with!  My first HM was in December '08 and I finished in 2:59:53 ... Sunday I finished in 2:39:53 ... 9th out of 37 in my AG (F50-59). My legs are still a little tired today, but MUCH better than yesterday. Planning on taking it easy for the rest of the week, maybe a short easy run on Thursday ... and then hope for the best in my 5K race on Sunday.

Reading about everyone's pool workouts is making feel very GUILTY about now. I don't think I've been in the pool since training for my last tri in October ... yikes. Once I get Sunday's race over with, I've got to start making some decisions about this years schedule. Also, trying to wait until I have some idea of my son's baseball schedule ... hopefully at his this season's first practice on Thursday.

KASIA, I'm having problems deciding on whether to do my 1st olympic distance race on 4/24 or a sprint tri on 5/1. (Just can't seem to focus on that until I have my scheduled running races done next weekend and having problems making that jump from sprint to oly). Both of the races will be filling up, so I can't wait too long. I haven't decided on what plan I'm going to be using (may stick to an olympic plan even if I decide on the sprint), so maybe I'll check the one that you referenced. Maybe then we can work together towards the olympic distance.

Back to enjoying my recovery week now!

That's awesome - congratulations!

ANNE!
KASIA!
LISA!
MARK!

I owe all of you more, but I'll be hit-and-miss this evening, needing to keep things (phone line and the computer itself) free for Lynn. And tomorrow morning......

Somehow, I was nominated for the BT Triathlete of the Month, so I'm being called sometime in the morning to be interviewed for one of the podcasts. Gulp! I've never listened to one of them, mainly becasue we're on dial-up and all audios and videos seem to take frustratingly forever to download, or whetever it is they do so that one can hear/see them.

Anyhow, that's my way of saying that tomorrow morning might be dicey itself as I have top leave the phone line free.

So, what follow are some quick responses.

LISA -

Top quarter of the age group!! Woo-hoo! That's outstanding!

MARK -

Yes, I do a decent push-off, and no, I don't factor it into my spl. Even though it's decent, I don't prolong it. I aim to be streamlined coming off the wall, but I surface and get to the actual swimming as quickly as I can. It accounts for maybe 1.5 strokes? I'm just guesstimating; maybe I should try to figure it out more exactly!

Also, I don't do flip turns, so that limits the amount of force I can apply to the wall. Yeah, 1.5 strokes is about right, i think.

And, it's amazing how the effects of the hundredths of a second can work. 0.97 suits me, but 0.94 doesn't. I know that all these time things have Breaking points, but I guess what strikes me here is that the Tempo Trainer actually enables me to see those fine details in action.

That is so cool!   CONGRATULATIONS!!!!!!    Have fun with it.  

KASIA -

Oh, my, do I ever owe you lots!

I have spent a fair bit of time exploring the Rage website, initially trying to a decide the answer to your question as to when to start working on hills. So, I had fun working the interactive feature on the bike maps for both the intermediate and the sprint, and I can say without a shadow of a doubt that you will have to do hills...and hills...and hills -- especially if you do the intermediate (they call it that because the bike is a bit longer than a strict olympic).

The oly has 2394 feet of climbing, the sprint has 942. Later I will tell you some of the %grades of the climbs, which are pretty tough in a few spots. Doable -- but tough!

When you look at the course maps, and then go to the interactive bike maps, what you shopuld focus on is roughly mile 4.2-16.8, which is the part of the interm course that is NOT part of the sprint course. Another way to say that is that the sprint course is the first 4.2 miles and the last 8.2 miles (roughly) of the intermediate course.

But more on that later, and definitely more on your training plan questions (I'm going to try to find the plan you are using).

LISA again -

That's an ENORMOUS time improvement in just 13 months! It doesn't matter if your legs are a bit sore, as you must be walking on a cloud anyhow!

ANNE -

Have fun with it? Don't I wish! I think the odds are high that I will stutter and stammer and make little if no sense at all. I think the post-conversation editing will solve all problems, however, winnowing 15 minutes down to a useable 15 seconds. Remember Andy Warhol saying that everyone will have 15 minutes of fame? Well, I'm on the cusp and fully poised for my 15 seconds. Now you hear me, now you don't!

Tomorrow is my birthday, too, so I had to wait until the day I turned 61 to make a bonafide horse's patootie out of myself! Aw, so it goes.....

Steve - well deserved recognition You are extremely knowledgeable and supportive. This is my 3rd mentoring group and by far the most beneficial (this with a nod to the others in the group). Mark

Steve & Steve A, thanks for the comments on the swimming question. Steve A - especially the one about focusing on MY performance and improving that.

Steve - my birthday came early and my wife surprised me tonight with a Bike Trainer. She works with a Doc who has disposable income and likes to upgrade his equipment every couple years. He keeps his stuff in immaculate condition - so though it is used, it's like new (this is where I got my bike as well). I'm pumped. Unfortunately I'm going to ask more of you. I've never used one and would appreciate your thoughts on the most effective way to train with one - this is an open question to the entire group.

Mark

Mark - I'm glad you asked about the trainer - I recently got mine - used it twice.  I'd also like to know what to do besides just ride it.
Denise
ps - congrats on the present (my husband only buys me sweaters for my birthday)

Edited by LadyNorth 2010-01-12 8:31 PM

Edited by midlifeinsanity 2010-05-23 8:06 PM

LISA -

Congrats! 9 out of 37 is AWESOME!!!

Obviously I'm not going to pressure you into doing the oly (hint hint nudge nudge), but it'd be nice to have a training buddy in the group

As for the training plan I use, I really like it for the reasons mentioned previously: lots of flexibility as to levels of training, but also has a good structure. If I'm having a super off day, I'll drop down a level in swimming or biking. Unfortunately I'm as low as you can go with the run so there's no chickening out on that one, which I guess is good because I need it.

Enjoy the recovery week!

Steve,

Congrats on the recognition. You definitely deserve it! You are great with advice and take the time to help us out individually. Awesome.

Thanks for looking so closely into the Rage for me. The interactive maps are indeed fun, but quite intimidating. I have a huge hill I go up to work every day so I'm kind of used to it, even though I dread that (and the going to work park) most mornings. BUT, that also means there's places to train around here.

I plotted some of the grades for the run on another route mapper, and it came out to about a 4% grade for miles 1.75-2.25 (rough approximation). I haven't looked at the bike map closely yet, so I may need some help with that. When I plotted it over the whole 40k, the grades were mostly 2-3%, but up close, it seemed like they were greater. So I'm confused.

As for the training plan, I've been picking and choosing the workouts from among the first three weeks, generally trying to do the ones I feel like I'm ready for, but also not taking it easy. So far so good, but I'd like to get back on track and not have to plan this much. After all, that's why I chose this one in the first place.

And HAPPY BIRTHDAY!

How cool! Congrats! Can't wait to hear the podcast.

Mark and Ladynorth (sorry I don't know remember everybody's real names yet) -

Not sure where you all are starting but a couple sources for trainer workouts:

the BT beginner cycling articles : http://www.beginnertriathlete.com/cms/article-detail.asp?articleid=1671

Spinerval web site posts free weekly workouts - I print these out and keep them in a binder - at www.spinervals.com  here is a sample - http://www.spinervals.com/public/Spinervals_Manual_C18_rasOpt.pdf

Jorge's winter power building program has a main thread in the challenge forum.. it gets great reviews but is not necessarily for beginners.

There have been a few threads over the years where people posted bike workouts, if I can find them I'll post them or try searching the forums.

If you want to spend money you can get spinervals (& other brands)  DVDs . warning: they are tough workouts.

Hope that helps.

Steve- Happy Birthday and congratulations on the bt award (should probably be for a decade rather than a month

The bike i bought from bsm was a cervelo ps2 for my son.  Once he had the bike fitted properly he has really enjoyed it (2 sprint tri's)  The bad part is, if I would have had decent service, or just someone to talk to me I would have bought 2 more bikes from them.

I did see some where that Tom was having health issues? 

KASIA -

The group - One Million Revolutions - that does those maps has a great reputation. However, I wonder if some aspects of "resolution" get lost when putting that details onto a map. But if the maps are made from sound data, then the problem (if there is one) is in the map, and not the data.

Do i know what I'm talking about??? I think what I'm getting at is the numbers that come up in the % Grade box as you move the thingy along the elevation map. Some of the numbes are shockingly high, and I'm just not sure that those grades actually exist of that course. Some of the big grades that caught my attention were 15.5, 12.4, 14.9, 15.5......and 21.7. (21.7?!? SWeet Mother of Mercy!!) But what isn't clear is how extensive those grades go. Are they for 75 yards? 200 yards? 33 feet?

I will try to go the O.M.R. map for Musselman and see if the numbers for that course correspond to how it struck me when I did it in '08. I'm still on this case, anyhow -- this one (you and Rage) is really in my head!

It is good that you have a huge hill that you do every day, and don't diminish its importance. Every time you tackle it you are getting that much more comfortable with the feel of what your legs and lungs are having to do, and you can also play around with gearing and breathing. The latter is sneakingly important, especially for people who tend to almost hold their breath when they exert themselves and really bear down on tough climbs. So as you do your to-work climb, or any other climb, pay attention to your breathing and try to kept it as even and measured as possible.

What you said yesterday about continuing to train for the interm Rage and then move to the sprint if you feel it's necessary - that makes some sense. The advantage is that at least in some areas you will have trained beyond the requirements of the sprint (IF thta is what you end up switching to), which should make doing it that much easier on race day. The downside is that you will have missed the chance to train specifically for that race, as opposed to the longer one, but seeing as how you have nothing riding competitively on whatever race you do at Rage, that is probably not so important.

BUT, if you can pull off the training, then you WILL have done what's required for the intermediate, and right now that's your desired and stated goal. Overall, it's a gamble worth attempting, I'd say.

I still haven't figured out your plan yet, but at this stage I would say to jump into whatever week of the plan is currently on target for Rage; I think you said it was week 3? In general, missed workouts should be let go, not attempted to be fit into current training. (This is because adding workouts usually just compromises the integrity of the current workouts, and it ends up that nothing is done as well as it should be.)

The big qualifier to what I just said is if you find out that threre is an area (S? B? R?) in which you are demonstrably below the level of fitness or ability that the schedule calls for. So for the nexy week, view any of your longer workouts as "key" workouts. That is, if one of the workouts is a steady 4 mile run, take it seriously and pay close attention to how your body is feeling. Also, sleep well before it, ad make sure you are properly fueled. Same thing if the workout is an 800-yard straight swim, say, or a 15-mile bike. As soon as possible you will wnat to have a solid idea of where your current fitness possibly diverges from your training program, because you'll want to make any program changes immediately, if they are necessary.

Okey-dokey?