GrooveTime!group - CLOSED!!! (Page 50)

ANNE again and DENISE -

Just as a follow-up to USAT rankings info: my, how the numbers drop with age! The following is for males who did the minimum of three races.

25-29: 2023
30-34: 2877
35-39: 4030
40-44: 3872
45-49: 2789
50-54: 1787
55-59: 987
60-64: 523
65-69: 234
70-74: 86
75-79: 30

Jeezum! Those of us of A Certain Age can almost feel like a vanishing breed!






Edited by stevebradley 2010-01-31 10:05 AM

Kasia,

Jealous of your snowboard...I ski'ed and snowboarded and could not give one up for the other. They really make the winter much more enjoyable/bearable. Mind you it rarely gets below 20F (-7C) so it really isn't that cold in Michigan.

Steve,

To further your discussion on tri books. I'm almost done reading 'Triathlon Training for Dummies'. I also have Joe Friel's 'Your First Triathlon', which is next on the list to read. Any others you recommend?

As for my weekend training, yesterday I did a leg workout and swam a total of 950m. Today I plan on doing an arm/shoulder workout and going for a run.

ANNE and DENISE again -

But more of us are staying in the game, it seems. For the 2008 season there were 469 in M60-64 and 954 in M55-59, so our numbers, and in 2009 it was 523 and 987, respectively, so all hail the chronologically-challenged who keep coming back for more!!

ANNE and DENISE once more -

In the spirit of gender-equity, below is the list for women. And I have also expanded the male list with three other age group numbers. (Obviously, I am in no hurry to get on the trainer! )

25-29: 1389
30-34: 1778
35-39: 1994
40-44: 1883
45-49: 1306
50-54: 793
55-59: 338
60-64: 144
65-69: 59
70-74: 14
75-79: 4

SHAUN -

When you make it through the first Friel book, you might want to tackle his "The Triathlete's Training Bible". When I'm book-browsing today I'll also try to find and scan the Friel one you have. I'm almost ashamed to say that I have seen it in stores, but have never looked through it. But that I will do (if I can find it), and I'll see how it compares with "...Bible". It'll have the same theories and tenets underlying it, to be sure, but overall the two should stand alone and complement eac other (as oppose to overlap).

Another choice for soemone new to this stuff would be "Swim, Bike, Run" by Wes Hobson. I think it is published by Human Kinetics. (This is another one I used to have in my possession, but I can't presently find. i guess my poltergeist is into triathlon!) Human Kinetics, by the way, has a fantastic catalogue of books for endurance (s/b/r) and strength training and flexibiluity, and probably other pursuits as well. They have really cornered the market on this stuff.

SHAUN again -

Smart planning with the workouts -- leg on a day you swim, and arms and shoulders on a day you run! For a while there I proved to be a slow learner (yet again...... ), combining upper-body lifting with a swim, which is okay if the swim is done first. But did I do that? Noooooooo! I did the lifting first, then swam, and wondered why I felt crappy in the water. DOH!

950m is a nice distance to knock off, too. Let me know how the run goes, and if the knee starts feeling wonky, back off.

Have fun!

Sorry I was AWOL yesterday, but I didn't go far ... just getting my weekend chores done.  Got a 6.2 mile (10K) run in yesterday morning and it felt great with negative splits each mile.  Glad to have my running legs back again.  And this morning ... da-dada-da ... I finally got back in the pool!! Swam a nice easy continous 700y (wanted to make sure I could at least swim the 500y I'll need to for my first two tris ), took a 1' rest and swam another 300y.  Still having a bit of a cough which made it a little tougher, but it felt really good.  Could have done more but figured that was enough since I hadn't been in the pool since October.

I'm using one of the Fitzgerald plans this time around ... Level 3 of the 12 week sprint plan (and yes, there are 10 levels per plan). Planning on following one of the 16 week olympic plans after that, if all goes well, for an oly in September).  My concern is if I can keep up a longer distance run on the weekends with only running two times a week ... plan calls for two days of bike, two days of swim, two days of running with the exception of some brick workouts.

Friel's book Your First Triathlon is a great beginner book, not nearly as technical and overwhelming as the "bible" appears to be.  I used one of the plans in that book to prepare for my first tri and it was more than sufficient for me, at the level I was coming into things ... ha, which was from no athletic background at all.  I don't have the book in my possession right now, funny how those things walk off, and can't recall exactly what the plans looked like.  Seems there was a basic plan, and then plans if you already had a good base in one of the disciplines.  CAn't remember if there was a more advanced balanced plan.  Just a couple of weeks ago, I picked up the Swim Bike Run book at the half price book store.  They also had Friel's "bible" but based on that since I had just bought the Fitzgerald book. 

Now it's off for some shopping and lunch with my mom and sisters.  Hope everyone is having a great weekend!

Hi,

Steve,
The event calender on the USAT website has temporarily been down for a couple days.  I was hoping it had a list of USAT sanctioned races.  Wanted to see how many in Minnesota without looking each one up.  Thinking about this for next year.  This year is devoted to getting my "5+" jacket in the Tri-Minnesota series.

I'm going to be bad today (my official trng program doesn't start for another week).  I'm going to skip my swim today and go drool over George Clooney at the movies.

Denise

DENISE -

Depending on drool intensity (aerobic or anaerobic drooling), it might qualify as a workout. If you have a HRM, wear it and see if you can get into Zone 3!

The USAT calendar is STILL down? Geez, I think it was much earlier in the week, which was the last time I tried to get on. Another option is www.trifind.com, but for that one you do have to check most of the races as the come up individually for their USATness.

LISA -

Oh, aren't you all la-di-da, mentioning ho-hum chores ---- and then dropping a great negative plitted 10km AND a very successful swim! It's isn't even February yet, and you're already in fightin' form!

Great minds must think alike, becasue my run yesterday was also solid. I had had the trudgy one mid-week, but then yesterday it was back to decent form and feeling cold; really cold, but good nevertheless.

And maybe if just one of us can find a single missing book, all the rest that we have misplaced or that have gone walking will magically re-appear.

I'm off in a bit to check out those books, but it's good to know that my mind was able to grasp onto the fact of 10 levels for each distance in the Fitzgerald book. Thank you for verifying that, and allowing me to feel modestly mentally-able for yet another day!

Enjoy shopping and lunch with the rest of the distaff side of your family!

Hi STEVE:

Hope you're having a great weekend. I've been taking it easy (okay, maybe more easy than I really needed to) the last week while I rested my neck/back/abs/everything else from skiing and have been reading "Triathlon Swimming Made Easy." I'm ready to get moving again!

What are your thoughts on cortisone shots for Morton's neuroma? I seem to recall you saying previously that it should only be done as a last resort. I'm about to try my third different anti-inflammatory (can't remember the name of it now) since the previous two haven't worked. And I'm afraid to say the metatarsal lift doesn't seem to be helping.

I'm a very low-mileage runner. (At this point probably less than 10 miles per week). And even after long periods in which I don't run, the neuroma always comes right back on the first run. Which leads me to believe that no amount of rest is going to make it better. And I'm not hopeful that this new anti-inflamm is going to help.

So I'm starting to wonder if the cortisone shot is my only option (other than just dealing with the pain). I had luck with cortisone shots in the past (although of course they were in different body parts and I know the outcomes can vary greatly depending on where they're given).

I have a 5 mile race coming up in 2 weeks but am worried that I might not be able to finish due to the pain (it really starts to kick in at about 3 1/2 miles). In fact, if it doesn't get better, the neuroma could be the thing that prevents me from ever improving my running or increasing my distance much beyond what I can do now).

Your thoughts??

Thanks!

Tracey

Steve,

Thanks for the advice on books.  Swim Bike Run looks to be available for under $5 with shipping (used but good to very good condition) on Amazon.

As for the run...Well there was some slight discomfort below (towards my feet) and to the outside of my knee. Only for a very short time period as well, which is good. The main discomfort was in my hips and glutes. All muscle discomfort, so the good kind! Leftover goodness from Saturday apparently.

Hey fellow groovers... I'm one of the MIA reporting in.  I have done absolutely nothing for the past week training wise.. spent a few days visiting with the granddaughters and worked the past four days.  I'm heading to the pool in the morning right after work and plan to run sometime later today. 

Steve... I'm really flip flopping on whether to do the IM in Nov,... aging up this year makes me think maybe I should do some shorter races and see how well I could place in my new age group.  But I'd really like to do the IM this year as a big goal.  Then again I'm already stressing about the training and whether I can really do it.

One thing I have done is requested a transfer to a different area of the hospital which might allow me more time off to do the long training.. we'll see if that works out.  I need to get a passport, and book accomodations.. and see if anyone wants to come with me... and  the list goes on and on.. so much to do and worry about !!!!

I also bought a new triathlon book.. a Gale Bernhart training plan book.. I like it. 

Hi Cathy,

I have a Gale Bernhart book as well and used it in conjunction with my Marc Evans book.   I corresponded with her re a couple of questions and after getting past a fair bit of security she responded personally - VERY nice.  

Looking at your race history, all I can say is thankfully you are not moving up into my age group!      I think you would do pretty awesome at the shorter distances.  

Thanks for those numbers.   Quite a few more men racing than women.    Funny - when I race it seems like EVERYONE is doing triathlons and SO many fit people in the world, but in reality we are very few in numbers.  

How was the show?   Did you see Up in the Air?   

Which training plan are you going to follow.   I forget what race(s) you are working towards.  

TRACEY -

The problem with cortisone shots for neuroma is that if done too frequently they can break down the fatty tissue that makes up the ball of your foot. As my sports doctor once described this to me, done too often it could make you feel that you are running on your metatarsal heads themselves. (Are you grimacing? Don't feel bad; I am, too.)

That said, he injected me twice (maybe three times) over the space of about a year; that infrequency is okay, I guess. (You should know that he is very cautious about anything that is even remotely invasive, so I trust him 100% that two or three times was okay. And, I have had no discrenible degeneration on the fat pad there.)

For me, they didn't work. They are unpleasant (a very tender place to stick a needle) at the time, and the site remains sore for up to 60 hours afterwards. I tried to imagine that they worked, but I think it was all just wishful thinking. However, they do work for some people, and trying it once or twice should not pose any problems. Were I to sprout another neuroma, I would try the injections again.

I think I have told you that I eventually had the offending neuroma removed, and that was in January of '06. I had mine done from the top, which I insisted on after I talked to a guy who had had his removed from the bottom, and faced a lengthy recovery period. My recovery was a bit gnarly, but at least not lengthy, and I was swimming within two weeks running again within about four weeks. Another guy I know had his removed from the bottom a couple of months ago, and he was stuck with a big boot and crutches for several weeks, maybe a month, and even then the site of the excision was still giving him problems. I was never on crutches, just a hard-soled bootish thing for the first week or so. And within three weeks I was down in Mexico wandering through Mayan ruins, so I can't complain. I'm NOT advocating surgery for you at this point, but if you ever decided to pursue that then please remember to ask all sorts of questions about the benefits of excision from the top versus excision from the bottom!

With the metatarsal pad/lift, try moving it around. I did many runs in which I would stop every hundred or so yards to get it protioned where I wanted it. During these periods I would tape it down with flimsy paper tape - strong enough to adhere, but weak enough to remove quickly and reposition. Those were the days! Running with a small roll of tape in the pocket of my running shorts, along with a pen so that once I found the position that worked I could draw an outline on the shoe's sockliner so that I could attach it better later (either with firmer tape, or actually sticking it as it was meant to be stuck).

Back to cortisone, if you try that make sure it is about at least a week out from the 5-miler. This is just becasue your foot will probably be sore for a day or two post-injection, but you don't want to risk it maybe being sore for longer. And as there is not a time limit on a successful injection, if it happened ten days out from the race you would still be sysmptom-free on race day. I think. This is definitely something you would want to clarify with your doctor beforehand.

Finally, I know full weel what you are saying about how this could be a limiter for you. I should go back to my logs and let you know what all I was capable of doing when the neuroma was REALLY rearing its ugly head; as I remember, it wasn't much. A mile or two here, a mile or two there.......that's pretty much how I remember it. To me the neuroma had the capability of being a deal-breaker, and I had to decide on whetehr invasive surgery was worth it for me. Turned out it was, and I honestly didn't have to think too long about it.

Again, move around the pad. At times I even tried two pads side-by-side......but at that point you are getting to the point at which a well-made orthotic might be an option. I don't have orthotics, but I was aware that ones that have a metatarsal bump, or even a metatarsal bar, built into them work for some people. So that is another option for you. I guess I declined that because I didn't want to spend ~$500 on orthotics with features that might not work. But Anne might have orthotics that have a built-in neuroma-easer; I'll ask when I get done here.

Having fun with the swimming book? Any specific things you are itching to try? And when do you hit the water again?

ANNE -

Do you have orthotics that have a built-in pad or bar for your neuroma (neuromas? neuromae?)?

Check Tracey's post towards the bottom of the previous page.

SHAUNCATHYANNEKASIA -

There's ANOTHER missing book, now that you mention it -- the Bernhardt book! Grrr! I had the original one from about '03 maybe, and I know there is a new edition......but I wnt to know where my copy of that one went to, too! Grrr X!

STEVE,

Re the beginner 20 wk HIM program, the author has a period overview chart with some explanation - It has 4 weeks of Prep; 4 wks of Base 1, 4 wks of Base 2, 4 wks of Base 3, 2 wks of Build, 2 wks of Race/taper.     He explains as follows:
Prep - train to train
Base 1 - increasing hours a bit and adding 1 hard workout per week
Base 2 - Increasing hours again - having theme weekes with increased volume in a single sport, with steep reductions in the other 2.  Will now have 2 hard workouts per week, this time in the same sport
Base 3 - Approach maximum  numbr of training hours per week but back to a balance in all 3 sports and still 2 hard workouts per week
Build - Training hrs level off while we work on specifics for the race including performing sessions back to back and transition practice
Race/taper - Drastically reduce volume but keep the same number of sessions and intensity.  These last 2 wks should be focused on efficient movement without stressing the body.  

Doesn't seem to get into any RPE 7/8 stuff until week 11/12; I think there is some RPE 5/6 around week 6.    

Does this sound like something you think will be OK?  

STEVE and TRACEY

I do have a built-in pad for the Morton's.    It seems to help at times but at others not so much.     No problem when I wear the orthotics but when I take my feet out it bothers me.

Edited by midlifeinsanity 2010-05-24 7:34 AM

------------------------- ALL BIBLIOPHILES -------------------------

In the on-going discussion of good tri books, one I don't think I have mmentioned is "Championship Triathlon Trianing" by George M. Dallam and Steven Jonas. Even though it has that title, and carries the subtitle "Advanced Training for Peak Performance", it is not just for experienced triathletes.

A good feature of it is fairly deatiled training plans in the back for each of the four major distances. These plans are NOT geared to beginners, however, unless the beginning person has some fairly aggressive goals. Just as an example, Week 1 of the Olympic Base Phase has three rides -- two of 20 miles, one of 32 miles, and in each of those should be inserted 20 minutes of Strength Endurance work, which means pushing a gear that allows only between 40 and 60 rpm. That's some tough pedalling!

But when i said above that the book is not just for advanced folks, I'm referring to their general information on techniques; there is lots of valuable stuff there.

ALL BIBLIOPHILES again -

I wasn't able to find a copy of the Friel book for beginners, so I will look at two more places today. As for the Matt Fitzgerald book, I sucked it up and sprung for another copy.

So.....

KASIA and LISA.....

I can get on the same pages as you! (I just hope I find my original within 14 days so I can return the new one!)










Edited by stevebradley 2010-02-01 8:09 AM

CATHY -

One of the great things about B2B is that you should have several months in which to reach a decision. The limit is 800, and right now there are only 148 registered. I don't think it sold out in either of the first two years (the B2B HIM is a different matter), and they even have an entry fee on the website for people who register the day before!

So even if you wanted to follow one of the larger iron-distance plans, a 26-weeker, then you wouldn't be starting that until May; that effectively gives you at least thee months from now to wrestle with the decision.

I suspect you want to get all of this firmly in your head asap, and I can certainly understand that. However, as I toy around with B2B thoughts myself, it almost seems like a second season, it is so far removed from the regular season. (And even though I regualrly race in the states in early Ocober, the B2B date of Nov 14 still separates it out from the regular season.) My approach would be to have at least one end-of-season half-iron in place, and maybe two...........and then once those are done I have 5-6 weeks to top up my training for B2B.

As an example.......
If I did The Canadian half-iron on Sept 4, I would train for that quite normal - standard HIM training, but going long on it just a bit. Then if I did MightyMan half-iron on Oct 3, I would make sure that my training for it was definitely over-long -- maybe a couple of 80 mile rides and a couple of 16-18 mile runs. And that would leave me the 5-6 weeks until B2B to add on the required training miles to get to the 112 for the bike and about 22 for the run.

All that is just my way of saying that you can still structure your regular season for now, but with some built-in "wiggle room" at the end of the regular season in the event that B2B is something you can pull off.

Have you booked accommodations yet? You might want to, just to have them and not be stuck without if you make a firm decision to go later on. I am currently holding several motel reservations for races that I am not registered for, but that I know are in high demand and so I grab the room first and decide on the actual race later. Seeing as how you mention "so much to do and worry about", booking a room now just means one less thing to stress about later!

As I am also thinking about one or the other of the B2B races, I might book a room myself. If so, I'll let you know what sounds reasonable. I suspect there is lots of stuff in that area that is pretty reasonably priced, but one can't be sure, can one?

It seemed like there was something else I wanted to say, but I can't remember it right now. Maybe later it will return!