GrooveTime!group - CLOSED!!! (Page 57)

stevebradley - 2010-02-09 6:37 AM

MARK hasn't been here for a while, but maybe he is just reading and not writing. But he seems to have more TI experience than any of us, so I hope he sees this and comments.

TriD64 - 2010-02-09 10:39 AM Hi all Sorry I haven't been a very active participant. Unfortunately, I will probably continue to be minimally active. My mother-in-law has had some chronic health issues for the last 8-9 years and it looks like they are finally nearing an end-stage. My wife (who is a nurse and due to her own desires and the expectations of the family) is very involved in her care. Over the weekend the decision was made to end aggressive interventions and pursue hospice care. The nature of her heath issues means this could be a few weeks or several months. As a result, things are topsy-turvy (as those who have had similar experiences can attest, I'm sure) and my training time and other non-essentials time is very limited. As well, there are some work needs that are demanding a lot of time right now. I know you all understand, and some have/had similar situations. Just wanted to let you know that I have found the mentoring experience enjoyable and informative. I will participate as I can. Tracy, what guide are you using for the drills you are practicing, Is it the Easy Freestyle DVD or the book? Mark

stevebradley - 2010-02-09 7:37 AM



TRACEY -

Having had a while to think about sweet spot, I'll see what I can come up with.

As I remember it, you're on your front and using just a gentle kick to provide some propulsion -- and then you gently roll onto your side. At some point during this roll, you hope to find the sweet spot, the place where you feel in perfect balance while on your side. Is this about right so far?

If so, then are you still still gently fluttering to provide some propulsion? I think this is "allowed" - elsewise I could not have pulled off this drill. Beyond this I have two suggestions, one of which it sounds like you're doing, which is to press down on your bottom shoulder. This is the equivalent of TI's concept of "pressing the buoy", kind of leaning on your chest while swimming freestyle so as to get that "downhill" emphasis, but if you've tried this you'll know it is more effective than leaning on the bottom shoulder during sweet spot.

The second suggestion is really two parts, both of which involve "cheating". One of these is to snake out the lower arm just as you are doing your roll, and that will help to counter balnce the tendency of the feet to drop. I think TI allows this modification, as although it probably compromises the purity of the drill somewhat, it seesm to be less intrusive that way than would be sinking feet. A second cheat is to use fins in the hopes that they will keep the feet more gainfully employed and less left on their own to sink.

Getting back to the idea of sanking your lower arm forward, that would put it in a position where you could effectively rest the side of your head against it ---- and I think that is pasrt of a different drill later on. So, what I'm thinking might be acceptable for sweet spot, well, maybe it's just acceptable as part of a different drill.

MARK hasn't been here for a while, but maybe he is just reading and not writing. But he seems to have more TI experience than any of us, so I hope he sees this and comments.

My long thoughts on sweet spot is that it is great to work on it as a way of developing a sense for the water and feeling more balance OVERALL. But in actual swimming, I see very few good swimmers who incorporate that degrre of body roll into their freestyle. For me, my sweet spot is a long way "up there", and to roll to it each and every stroke would take a klot of time and effort. TI uses the barge and sailboat analogies as a way to encourage swimming on your side and reducing frontal drag, and while that is accurate to a point, it is less easy to achieve in practice, such as during races and longish swims. Some of the stuff I will post from Louis Tharp seem to actually go against this, even though he is heavily influenced by TI --- and his book was published by them!

Yes, it is a matter of practice, and I believe it is time well spent - especially early in a serious swim "career". I probably over-spent my time on them initially, but I have few if any regrets about that; it was all part of the process I undertook. Did you read the Tharpism I posted yesterday? He gives two great reasons for drilling, and I especially like the second one about getting the body and brain re-acquainted with the rules of efficient swimming. It has been a long, long time since I began a session with serious drillwork, and maybe I should start doing it again.

How much time for you to spend? If you're in for 30 minutes, how about 10 minutes for drills, and 15 minutes for the 40-minute pool sessions? I'm just kind of guessing here. Another apporach to it which I used to employ was maybe 10-15 minutes of drilling, then some freestyle, and follow that with some more drills geared towards areas that I felt were "needy", based on thre freestyle I had just done. And then I would finish with more freestyle, hoping that the drills would make a difference. So it was roughly 10' drill, 15' swim, 8' drill, 12' swim --- really, give or take a fair bit in any of those segments.

I think I have said before is that whenever your form falls apart, that's a good time to either stop the session or go on to something radically different. That can include drills, or switching to a different style, such as breast or back. But the falling-apart form aspect can also happen with drills, and so when one of them isn't working anymore it's time to switch things up -- different drill or just a straight swim.

As you get further into TI, you'll find drills you love and that work well, and others that just don't either click or work. After a while, you'll have a lot of drills at your disposal, and so drillwork can be pretty much pleasurable whenever you decide to do it. Practice will help with all of them, but don't allow them to frustrate or discourage you. That's partially why I mentioned switching things up -- good for the mind as well as the body!

So, try snaking (I used that term before, but maybe it's better to think of "sneaking" it) your arm forward to help with sweet spot balance, or using a small pair of fins, gently. I'll try to find somehting on the TI website to see if either of those are "legal", or actually strictly forbidden. ("Bad swimmer! BAD!!")

TriD64 - 2010-02-09 1:39 PM



Hi all
Sorry I haven't been a very active participant. Unfortunately, I will probably continue to be minimally active. My mother-in-law has had some chronic health issues for the last 8-9 years and it looks like they are finally nearing an end-stage. My wife (who is a nurse and due to her own desires and the expectations of the family) is very involved in her care. Over the weekend the decision was made to end aggressive interventions and pursue hospice care. The nature of her heath issues means this could be a few weeks or several months. As a result, things are topsy-turvy (as those who have had similar experiences can attest, I'm sure) and my training time and other non-essentials time is very limited. As well, there are some work needs that are demanding a lot of time right now. I know you all understand, and some have/had similar situations. Just wanted to let you know that I have found the mentoring experience enjoyable and informative. I will participate as I can.

Tracy, what guide are you using for the drills you are practicing, Is it the Easy Freestyle DVD or the book?

Mark

thall0672 - 2010-02-09 12:42 PM Not a great run today! So I have my 5 mile race coming up this Sunday and in preparation for that I did 5 miles today (that's the longest distance I've run so far). Didn't go so well. The neuroma in my right foot started bothering me at around mile 2 as it always does. I tried putting cotton balls between my toes as Anne had mentioned doing. I had to stop at mile 3 and take them out because they were chafing so much! At mile 4 I started feeling neuroma pain in my LEFT foot!! (Please gods of distance running, isn't it enough to have a neuroma in just one foot?) Shortly after that the tight hip flexor/quad in my left leg that bothers me from time to time started yelling out. I was actually limping when I finished, which never happens. So with all the stopping and slowing down and aches and pains, it took me 68 minutes, 58 seconds to do 5 miles. I checked out the results of last year's race. If they are at all the same this year, I'm at risk of being the last to finish!! I have no problem being a back-of-the-packer, but to be last?? Okay, there was one woman last year in the age 70+ category who finished in 2:05. So maybe if she comes back this year she'll be my saving grace! How embarrassing it would be to get beaten by a 75 year old... I don't mean to be self-defeating but maybe I'm just not made for this! I mean, my body seems to be fighting me every step of the way. I was really struggling to keep up a slow trot today after mile 4. I was hoping to do a HM by next January but I can't see it happening if I can't get past these challenges. This is why I admire people like SteveB, SteveA and others who can push their bodies to the limit and do IMs. To me, a marathon alone would be an enormous physical and mental challenge, and in an IM that is just a mere PORTION of the race! I think I need to borrow Diane's motto: Yes, I can. Thanks for listening to my vent! Tracey

thall0672 - 2010-02-09 3:42 PM Not a great run today! So I have my 5 mile race coming up this Sunday and in preparation for that I did 5 miles today (that's the longest distance I've run so far). Didn't go so well. The neuroma in my right foot started bothering me at around mile 2 as it always does. I tried putting cotton balls between my toes as Anne had mentioned doing. I had to stop at mile 3 and take them out because they were chafing so much! At mile 4 I started feeling neuroma pain in my LEFT foot!! (Please gods of distance running, isn't it enough to have a neuroma in just one foot?) Shortly after that the tight hip flexor/quad in my left leg that bothers me from time to time started yelling out. I was actually limping when I finished, which never happens. So with all the stopping and slowing down and aches and pains, it took me 68 minutes, 58 seconds to do 5 miles. I checked out the results of last year's race. If they are at all the same this year, I'm at risk of being the last to finish!! I have no problem being a back-of-the-packer, but to be last?? Okay, there was one woman last year in the age 70+ category who finished in 2:05. So maybe if she comes back this year she'll be my saving grace! How embarrassing it would be to get beaten by a 75 year old... I don't mean to be self-defeating but maybe I'm just not made for this! I mean, my body seems to be fighting me every step of the way. I was really struggling to keep up a slow trot today after mile 4. I was hoping to do a HM by next January but I can't see it happening if I can't get past these challenges. This is why I admire people like SteveB, SteveA and others who can push their bodies to the limit and do IMs. To me, a marathon alone would be an enormous physical and mental challenge, and in an IM that is just a mere PORTION of the race! I think I need to borrow Diane's motto: Yes, I can. Thanks for listening to my vent! Tracey

stevebradley - 2010-02-09 3:47 PM STEVE - Ahhh! The Nirvana! Now THAT'S a model I can live with for you! (That is, based on your past shoe history.) As for the recommendation for the heavier runner, the other side of that is a recommendation for someone doing >25 miles per week. So it's really an and/or, and while you miss the mark by a fair bit in terms of weight, you hit it dead-on for the mileage. The Nirvana weighs in at about 12.0 oz, and it's brethren one step down is the 11.9oz Alchemy. What you maybe possibly conceivably can expect here is that the sacrifice you make in weight will be offset by some extra miles you will get out of the Nirvana. We (well, at least I) obsess about shoe weight, but it is really a very small difference, that one ounce between the Nirvana and the Alchemy. Holy grinnin' catfish, were those workouts before work or during it? If during, you have a VERY accommodating job! Regardless, that's a fine day of athletic commitment, and the swim distance/time is excellent. I wish I had read this earlier, because knowing then what I know now, i would've gladly written you a note excusing you from work for the rest of the day. Well, maybe next time!

stevebradley - 2010-02-09 7:47 PM


TRACEY again -

Oh my, that was not the desired result from that run, was it? I mean, you scored a "hat trick" - two neuromas and a hip flexor - but that was not what the five miles was supposed to yield. It's time to start working at putting this run behind you, and preparing for the next one. We all have days similar to yours, and hopefully this will prove to be an isolated incident. And I'm guessing that maybe the hip flexor started acting up because you were altering your stride to favor your foot problems. So if we can just get those neuromae to fall in line.....

Here's some ideas on the cotton balls:
(1) Use BodyGlide (the greatest invention since strawberries!) of Vaseline between the affected toes.
(2) Tape them inplace before you start your run. Buy a small roll of fairly thin paper tape, and once you get the c.b. in place run a strip from the top of you foot over the c.b. and then stuck on the bottom of your foot just a bit forward of the ball of your foot. then take a second strip and wrap it around the two toes - not squeezing them together, but enough so that the c.b. won't move.

Those should combine to prevent chafing, I think!